Bernie is on FB now. He pretty much sounds as always.

[nolabear]

The chat line scares me a little. Very anti-Kennedy.

[Kali]

1. I couldn't find it do you ahve a link?

[nolabear]

2. Let me see. Hes doing okay really.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

28. Yes, same as always... phenominal. Bernie gave the best rebuttal speech

I've heard in a very long time.

[diva77]

30. It was powerful - with no fat added.

Everything he said cannot be stated often enough -- needs to reach the wingnut media hostages.

SNIP "Over the last year, after adjusting for inflation, the average worker in America saw a wage increase of, are you ready for this, 4 cents an hour, or 0.17%. Or, to put it in a different way, that worker received a raise of a little more than $1.60 a week. And, as is often the case, that tiny wage increase disappeared as a result of soaring health care costs.

Meanwhile, at a time of massive wealth and income inequality, the rich continue to get much richer while millions of American workers are working two or three jobs just to keep their heads above water. Since March of last year, the three richest people in America saw their wealth increase by more than $68 billion. Three people. A $68 billion increase in wealth. Meanwhile, the average worker saw an increase of 4 cents an hour. " SNIP

https://www.vox.com/2018/1/30/16950614/bernie-sanders-response-sotu-trump
-----------

I thought Kennedy's speech was powerful as well -- had an entirely different vibe.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

32. Exactly! Bernie was his usual awesome self. And Joe was effective

in his messaging too! Good to see Democrats on the offensive, taking on the lies and bigotry of the Nazi-in-Chief.

[Weed Man]

86. That is where the Dems made a mistake this week.

They should have given a unified rebuttal to Bernie, and leave out the other 4 because they offer conflicting views.

Bernie is right, and he will be consistently right because he knows it's the right thing to do!

Bernie 2020!

[ehrnst]

96. Well, we'll see.

There are people here on DU who know the right thing to do, and have been talking about it for years. One expects legislation from a legislator.

Do you have issues with Democrats giving the Democratic rebuttal? Why?

And how does one "leave out" Maxine Waters and the woman who was able to give the Democratic rebuttal in Spanish? Can you explain how one would would do that, and why? How would you have silenced them?

[nolabear]

3. Try this

https://www.facebook.com/senatorsanders/videos/10156718140462908/

[Kali]

8. Thanks!

[BannonsLiver]

4. His more ardent supporters here are quite busy tonight

Bleating about Kennedy III and dynasties.

[nolabear]

5. Well Im not striving to divide DU. But it worries me.

[BannonsLiver]

12. Worried that he stole Bernie's thunder?

[nolabear]

16. Nah. Im not a Bernie fan. Or do you mean the comments?

I have real problems with Bernie myself but I don’t care to get into the usual round and round here.

[BannonsLiver]

17. Yes, the comments.

[Weed Man]

88. Kennedy's rebuttal is lackadascial

He does not support:

Medicare for All (single payer) (HR 676)
College for All (HR 1880)
Tax Wall Street (Hr 1144)
Voting Rights (HR 2480)

What also interests me that he has $500,000 in stock in Gilead Sciences, where they have a cure for Hep C, but costs $1000 per pill in the U.S., but $4 in India. What gives?

Nope, I'm not worried that he stole Bernie's thunder. Kennedy, instead, failed a trial run for 2020.

[BannonsLiver]

90. LOL. Pass that shit over here, bruh.

[George II]

9. Sad that the legacy of the Kennedy Family has to be sullied for that.

[Eliot Rosewater]

47. It will get WAY worse.

I think it might all be moot though, Putin and the GOP are working feverishly to make certain we cant win back power, they will see to it somehow.

Hard to be a liberal these days, having to fight the right AND some on the left at the same time. Allegedly on the left, that is.

[Quixote1818]

25. Interesting, I am one of Sanders biggest supporters and I just posted Kennedy's

wonderful response in DU's Video and Multimedia section.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1017477836

[NCTraveler]

40. That doesnt negate the point. Nt

[Weed Man]

87. I don't care for Kennedy

All I know he's a trust fund baby and has no idea what being a part of 99% is like.

[Kirk Lover]

6. At this point I think I can give Bernie's speech for him. n/t

[CentralMass]

7. I have praise for both men.

[MaryMagdaline]

21. Yes- they both speak to Democratic values

And small "d" democratic values.

[Sophia4]

22. I also thought both Bernie and Joe Kennedy were great!

Bernie speaks with the wisdom and knowledge gleaned from years in the Senate.

Joe Kennedy speaks with the energy and will of a fairly young man.

Both good.

Now if anyone has a link to Maxine Waters' speech, I'll listen to that! Looking forward to it!

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

29. Fair analysis... I do think Bernie did a better job addressing specific issues

and defending progressive values. Joe did just fine, especially for someone with not much political experience, showing a lot of enthusiasm and passion. He's definitely an "up-and-comer."

[Weed Man]

89. He'll go the way of Kamala Harris

Trust me. He failed.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

92. Keep dreamin'!

[StuckInTexas]

23. Thumbs up for all liberals!

I thought both responses were excellent. I think Joe came hit home messages we should be rallying around both in 2018 and 2020. I think Bernie's response was great as he went after very specific Drumph lies one by one.

[GoCubsGo]

10. The Russian bots are active tonight.

[nini]

15. Yep.. all over the internets

[StuckInTexas]

20. Really?

Really? I've lurked here for years, I have no idea why this post was the straw that broke the camel's back and I feel the urge to post, but leave this crap to the reich wing. Bernie Sanders is a Trump supporter? Posts like these are harming not just the quality of the site, but this resentment and continuous refighting of the primary do great harm to our cause. Cut this crap out.

[argyl]

24. Welcome to DU.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

31. Yeah, that claim was absurd... Bernie tore the Fascist-in-Chief apart tonight

lie by lie. It was awesome to watch. Joe Kennedy III also did a credible job and deserves high praise.

[Trueblue Texan]

44. I like Bernie and any other Progressive just fine...

...but I agree. We shouldn't be fighting about them or running any of them down. We might be privileged to vote for them in the general election some day. I do think thoughtful discussion is important though and that shouldn't be discouraged. Fact checking and respect for other opinions goes a long way to build the Progressive cause IMHO.

[gopiscrap]

82. welcome to DU

[MaryMagdaline]

14. JFK had to defeat Humphrey; Bobby had to defeat

Humphrey and McCarthy; Ted tried to defeat Carter. Democrats will always have to fight for the soul of the Party.

[Cha]

19. Yeah, Democrats

[peggysue2]

59. LOL!!

ON the money as usual, Cha.

[Cha]

60. Mahalo, peggysue

[Demsrule86]

46. Sen. Sanders is not a Democrat.

[Eliot Rosewater]

48. Who voted against Russian sanctions?

[Demsrule86]

62. Also the last immigration bill.

[Eliot Rosewater]

64. Really? WTF?

sigh

We will never learn.

[samnsara]

53. yes!..thank you for that. why do we have to keep reminding others?

[VOX]

18. Pretty much done with the *Wall Shtreet millionahs and billionahs and the one puh-cent.*

And “free college.” All pie in the sky.
I’ve heard this shtick enough.

ON EDIT TO ADD: My post above was NOT meant to diminish Bernie himself, or his core ideas: income inequality, lack of affordable education, etc. I voted for him in the 2016 primary. Rather, I wish he would refresh his message— keeping the points, obviously, but at least shuffling the wording and phrasing. He is in danger of self-parody otherwise.

However, I do take issue with Bernie when he siphons time and energy away from Democrats by inserting himself into the Party’s agenda. If he were a member of the Democratic Party, there would be no potential for dividing allegiances.

[vsrazdem]

26. Really, I didn't know we were were not allowed to wish for a better life. Pie in the sky?

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

33. I hear ya... glad someone is thinkin big and takin it to the 1%ers!!

[ehrnst]

95. That's why it's good to see that Bernie

got on board Hillary's plan to make the 1% and other wealthy parents pay tuition to subsidize those who aren't wealthy.

[David__77]

34. Some people dont support free education.

I suppose free high school at one time may have seemed unattainable to some.

[ehrnst]

94. I think you are confusing "free" with "subsidized"

Professors and teachers don't work for "free," so the money to pay them must come from an alternate source if not tuition.

I was pleased to see Bernie adopt Hillary's policy to have the 1% and those who are wealthy pay tuition to help subsidize the costs into his plan.

Even public school isn't "free" - ask any public school teacher how much it costs.

[David__77]

97. No, Im not.

I understand that resources are expended in educating people. By “free,” I’m referring to the direct cost faced by the recipient of education services.

One can certainly argue that “nothing is free” - I get that.

[ehrnst]

98. Then you mean "subsidized" there is a very significant difference, especially when

talking about taxpayer funded programs.

[David__77]

99. That is your understanding.

I mean free of cost to recipients of education services. Commonly, people refer to the direct cost faced by consumers.

[ehrnst]

100. Anti-choicers call a fetus a "child," because they have a marketing aim

Words have meanings, and those meanings matter.

The term "free of charge" is more accurate than "free" when talking about taxpayer and public programs.

[David__77]

101. So, no free tampons either?

https://www.democraticunderground.com/10141994178

Just curious if you would also argue that this article should refer to "subsidized tampons" or "free or charge" tampons? Do you think so?

[ehrnst]

102. Actually, "free of charge" would be more accurate.

Clearly if they were being charged previously, and now they are not.

And a quick perusal of the actual statement quote shows this:

"As a result of this review, the department will continue to provide sanitary napkins free of charge to all of its female inmates, regardless of need. Effective immediately, the department will increase the minimum baseline quantity that inmates receive each month, from 12 to 36. As is the current practice, an inmate may request and, without charge, receive additional pads, if necessary. Additional product options will continue to be available through the inmate store."

"Free of charge" means that the payment has been made by someone, just not the recipient.

I'm going to guess that the editor of the newspaper shortened it.

Does that answer your question?

[David__77]

104. Yes, "free of charge" tampons, not "free tampons."

I'll add: some people dont support free of charge education.

I suppose free of charge high school at one time may have seemed unattainable to some.

[ehrnst]

105. Yes, you said that.

I'm one of those who think that those who can pay should. I'm glad to see that Bernie has come around on that since the election.

We all pay in for public elementary and secondary school, and public colleges/universities whether or not we have kids enrolled. Makes sense for those with the means to chip in when their kids do attend.

"Free college" does very well in focus groups with young people - far better than "debt free college" or "affordable tuition."

Marketing is everything nowadays in politics.

I'm not sure when in the last 175 years US public high school was ever tuition based, but I trust your repeating that sentence to that effect indicates it has some relevance.

Perhaps you're talking about Haiti?

I suppose free of charge wifi at one time may have seemed unattainable to some, too. Is that relevant?

[David__77]

106. I don't want to means test everything.

I don't want to means test tampons in public schools, for instance - or Social Security.

I understand that not everyone agrees with that position.

[ehrnst]

107. Who said anything about means testing tampons or Social Security?

But by all means, attack that straw man.

[David__77]

108. I don't support means testing higher education.

Not everyone agrees with that, certainly.

[ehrnst]

109. Good to see you lay off the strawman.

I'm with Bernie's evolved position on this: if you are wealthy, you pay more in for education.

I am of the opinion that the wealthy should pay more. Not everyone agrees with that, certainly.

[David__77]

110. I agree that the wealthy should pay more taxes.

...

[ehrnst]

111. I went on a full scholarship - full ride- at a state university

Partly for grades, and partly because of my parents income.

And I was very aware that was made possible by other people paying full tuition - wealthy kids or kids from overseas.

And that was a good thing for them, because a couple didn't have the grades to maintain a scholarship.

Without them paying full tuition, my subsidy would have been much smaller, if any.

I'm with Hillary, and now Bernie on this. Let the privileged pay their share for college, and not spread the cost of their kids tuition to the vast majority of the rest of us.

[markpkessinger]

37. Mocking someone's regional accent? Seriously? n.t

[RandiFan1290]

43. I find it anti-Semitic

Right wingers mock that accent to make fun of Jewish people.

[Arazi]

75. Yup. The anti-Semitism is horrifying, now and during the primary

[markpkessinger]

38. Thank you

What a lot of people seem to forget is that you always need to aim much higher than you expect you'll actually achieve, because in a Democracy, you never get everything you want. We have a right wing that is so far right, and pushing ever further to the right. Democrats need to push equally hard in the opposite direction if we even have any hope of maintaining the status quo, let alone improving things.

[Bluepinky]

41. Good point and well said.

[ehrnst]

93. I missed that memo.

Can you share a link to the one you got that says we're "not allowed?"

You're on Democratic Underground. I understand you're new, but Democrats are indeed the party that accomplishes the things that make life better - for all of us, not just white straight cis men. I think you won't any such prohibitions on this list:

RAISE INCOMES AND RESTORE ECONOMIC SECURITY FOR THE MIDDLE CLASS
Raising Workers’ Wages
Protecting Workers’ Fundamental Rights
Supporting Working Families
Helping More Workers Share in Near-Record Corporate Profits
Expanding Access to Affordable Housing and Homeownership
Protecting and Expanding Social Security
Ensuring a Secure and Dignified Retirement
Revitalizing Our Nation’s Postal Service

CREATE GOOD-PAYING JOBS
Building 21st Century Infrastructure
Fostering a Manufacturing Renaissance
Creating Good-Paying Clean Energy Jobs
Pursuing Our Innovation Agenda: Science, Research, Education, and Technology
Supporting America’s Small Businesses
Creating Jobs for America’s Young People

FIGHT FOR ECONOMIC FAIRNESS AND AGAINST INEQUALITY
Reining in Wall Street and Fixing our Financial System
Promoting Competition by Stopping Corporate Concentration
Making the Wealthy Pay Their Fair Share of Taxes
Promoting Trade That is Fair and Benefits American Workers

BRING AMERICANS TOGETHER AND REMOVE BARRIERS TO OPPORTUNITIES
Ending Systemic Racism
Closing the Racial Wealth Gap
Reforming our Criminal Justice System
Fixing our Broken Immigration System
Guaranteeing Civil Rights
Guaranteeing Women’s Rights
Guaranteeing Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgender Rights
Guaranteeing Rights for People with Disabilities
Respecting Faith and Service
Investing in Rural America
Ending Poverty and Investing in Communities Left Behind
Building Strong Cities and Metro Areas
Promoting Arts and Culture
Honoring Indigenous Tribal Nations
Fighting for the People of Puerto Rico
Honoring the People of the Territories

PROTECT VOTING RIGHTS, FIX OUR CAMPAIGN FINANCE SYSTEM, AND RESTORE OUR DEMOCRACY
Protecting Voting Rights
Fixing Our Broken Campaign Finance System
Appointing Judges
Securing Statehood for Washington, DC
Strengthening Management of Federal Government

COMBAT CLIMATE CHANGE, BUILD A CLEAN ENERGY ECONOMY, AND SECURE ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE
Building a Clean Energy Economy
Securing Environmental and Climate Justice
Protecting Our Public Lands and Waters

PROVIDE QUALITY AND AFFORDABLE EDUCATION
Making Debt-Free College a Reality
Providing Relief from Crushing Student Debt
Supporting Historically Black Colleges and Universities and Minority-Serving Institutions
Cracking Down on Predatory For-Profit Schools
Guaranteeing Universal Preschool and Good Schools for Every Child

ENSURE THE HEALTH AND SAFETY OF ALL AMERICANS
Securing Universal Health Care
Supporting Community Health Centers
Reducing Prescription Drug Costs
Enabling Cutting-Edge Medical Research
Combating Drug and Alcohol Addiction
Treating Mental Health
Supporting Those Living with Autism and their Families
Securing Reproductive Health, Rights, and Justice
Ensuring Long-Term Care, Services, and Supports
Protecting and Promoting Public Health
Ending Violence Against Women
Preventing Gun Violence

PRINCIPLED LEADERSHIP

SUPPORT OUR TROOPS AND KEEP FAITH WITH OUR VETERANS
Defense Spending
Veterans and Service Members
Military Families
A Strong Military

CONFRONT GLOBAL THREATS
Terrorism
Syria
Afghanistan
Iran
North Korea
Russia
Cybersecurity and Online Privacy
Non-Proliferation of Nuclear, Chemical, and Biological Weapons
Global Climate Leadership

PROTECT OUR VALUES
Women and Girls
Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgender People
Trafficking and Modern Slavery
Young People
Religious Minorities
Refugees
Civil Society
Anti-Corruption
Torture
Closing Guantánamo Bay
Development Assistance
Global Health
HIV and AIDS
International Labor

A LEADER IN THE WORLD
Asia-Pacific
Middle East
Europe
Americas
Africa
Global Economy and Institutions

https://www.democrats.org/party-platform

[lapucelle]

42. He needs to edit the stump speech to "billionaires" only.

$1,000,000 income in 2016 and a $2,000,000 retirement nest egg.

Awkward.

http://time.com/money/4805379/bernie-sanders-2016-income/

http://time.com/money/4235986/bernie-sanders-millionaire-finances/

[JCanete]

58. that isn't awkward. This is so dumb and it needs to stop, but won't. Its not like he's calling for

us to pull millionaires and billionaires out of their beds and tar and feather them. He's trying to get millionaires and billionaires to pay their fair share of taxes and to have less influence on political campaigns. Fucking a, how hard is this to comprehend that you want to undercut it because he might now be tipping into millionaire status. Do you remember the limousine liberal line from back in the day? Do you really want to go down that road with your criticism?

[lapucelle]

66. It is awkward, it is dumb, and it is extremely problematic

when the doctrinaire selectively exempt those they select from the standards they impose on everyone else.

And it does need to stop

[JCanete]

67. and where does he do that or are you just making shit up? nt

[lapucelle]

69. My statement concerns the doctrinaire in general,

rather than any specific person or community.

Assumptions can be very telling.

[JCanete]

70. so why would it be relevant in a conversation specific to one person if it isn't actually relevant?

[lapucelle]

71. I'm not engaging in a "conversation" with anyone specific to anyone.

My responses are general observations.

[JCanete]

73. either you are talking about Sanders here or your post was an entire non-sequitur. The assumption

I made had everything to do with context. If you want to back away from that and make what you are talking about more general because you can't defend it on a specific basis, by all means, I won't press.

[lapucelle]

76. I don't accept the assumption that you are an authority on or the arbiter of my meaning.

[JCanete]

77. by all means, be intentionally obtuse. Then you don't have to back up anything. Just muse freely.

[lapucelle]

79. Not everyone is easily baited.

[JCanete]

80. nor debated, clearly.

[lapucelle]

81. Thank you. I take it as a compliment.

And with that I'll sign off on this "conversation".

[JNelson6563]

78. Woah, woah, woah, hang on a second there!

All the Bernie folks on the tubes are telling me about Kennedy's negatives: Rich and *gasp* white! OMG. Has anyone told them about this Bernie bombshell???

[ehrnst]

103. I believe all references he uses to that effect are now "billionaire class"

Because, well, you know.

[oberliner]

50. Wow - what's with mocking the way he talks?

And since when is income inequality not a primary issue?

[VOX]

83. My bad, actually. Parroting is a gift/curse of mine

I’ve done it since childhood, and with the use of my voice in particular. I have an uncanny ear for speech patterns, dialects, accents, tone, timbre, even nuances of an individual’s laughter. As I said, it’s a gift and a curse— while amusing to friends and family, over the years it has ruffled a few feathers as well.

On second read, I can see where it looks like mockery. I can assure you it isn’t. It’s merely a parroting of Bernie’s stock-stump speech, which has been heard dozens of times. I do wish he’d modulate his message to refresh the same points.

As for Bernie himself, I voted for him in the 2016 primary, and, should events place him on a ballot against ANYONE other than a viable Democrat, I’d vote for him again.

[underthematrix]

27. it's FB so it could be bots and not

eligible registered voters. The most important thing is not to respond to them.

[LexVegas]

35. ...

[JNelson6563]

36. Any perceived threat to their hero.

Pathetic, really.

[lapucelle]

39. I missed the event.

Did he call Trump out over not enforcing the Russia sanctions?

[R B Garr]

65. That's a great question. It would be out of touch for him to neglect

the very real FBI Russia investigation and Trump ignoring the sanctions.

[Demsrule86]

45. Of course...he is a threat to Sanders...the Russian bots are out in force with a few BOBer's

thrown in. Sanders is the past (in terms of winning the presidency) and Kennedy is the future...and the GOP are terrified of Joe Kennedy III as are their Russian buddies.

[workinclasszero]

49. Agreed

"the GOP are terrified of Joe Kennedy III as are their Russian buddies."

[brush]

54. They aren't the only ones terrified of Kennedy. He's Sanders 2.0 and 40 years younger.

[pandr32]

55. Quite right

The Kennedy family has a long history of taking on corruption and championing working people, minorities, and progress. They have the best interests of America as a family tradition taught from an early age. They have also paid a staggering family cost that should allow them to enter the political arena any damn time they like without criticism. The fact that some are saying "enough already" makes my blood boil over.

[Demsrule86]

61. The Russians don't want this guy...he is a straight arrow...so the attacks will commence...I do hope

Sanders doesn't run.

[pandr32]

84. I hope he doesn't run, too.

I will refrain from posting what I really think is going on with Sanders and what his reasons are but I would probably get reported.

[jalan48]

51. Great to hear Bernie and others responses. United we stand!

[samnsara]

52. ive heard all the others before..nothing new..kennedy is the rising star now..

[JCanete]

68. So maybe all the others should upgrade their message...rebrand...stop talking about the shit

they think ails the country because they and the issues they champion suffer from overexposure to those of us who simply want to be entertained...

not a knock on Kennedy by the way. I haven't heard his speech yet, and I'm not familiar with his politics...but when systemic problems in society persist, the fact that you've been trying to draw attention to them forever should not be a detractor...it shouldn't be ..."oh here we go....nothing new here." Sure if you aren't on that page and you think its the wrong page, that's a reason to find new blood that is more suitable to your principles and your perspective.

[stonecutter357]

57. Bernie is on FB lol .

[aikoaiko]

63. Bernie's consistency is his superpower.

[Raine]

72. Thumbs up to Bernie

Thumbs up to Kennedy!

[jalan48]

74. Thank you Bernie.

[Weed Man]

85. Wanna know why it's anti-Kennedy

That's because Joe Kennedy is no Kennedy. He's a trust fund baby with too much money in the bank and not understanding what the 99% is about. He's a part of the problem. Bernie understands this and that's why he's a frontrunner for the 2020 Democratic nominations, whether the Dems like him or not.

I'm fully backing Bernie in this one. I will not be refighting the 2016 primaries. Bernie has proven who he is, and he is the far most popular Senator today, because he's consistently right!

[Blue_true]

91. I saw some of the anti Kennedy behavior from some on DU.

They attacked the "family dynasty" angle, or used that to justify their attack. They ignore the guy's competence and apparent decency.