Question for people who have made sexual harassment complaints:

[pnwmom]

If you don't mind sharing.

In general terms, what happened; which decade did the incident occur; and what action, if any, was taken against your harasser?

My harasser, in the 80's, was mostly a disgusting verbal harasser, like Clarence Thomas. I was young and didn't know what to do except put up with it and dodge him as much as I could. After a promotion, I told my new boss, the Exec V.P., who learned that other women had similar complaints, and he chewed the guy out.

The guy, a V.P., stopped.

I'm curious about how common it was to get someone fired over any kind of harassment, even physical harassment.

[thbobby]

1. I worked at Motorola in Austin during the 1980's

We had seminars about harassment. A minor verbal harassment may have only resulted in counseling and permanent documentation on your work record. Repeated minor offenses would result in termination. "Minor" is, of course, subjective. My understanding was that unwanted discussion of a person's sex life was beyond minor. Asking someone working under you on a date was not an offense, but would result in counseling. Repeated asking after rejection was beyond minor. Any coercion, like "you may get a promotion if" was cause for immediate termination. Of course, any physical harassment was cause for immediate termination.

Motorola was an excellent company to work for with a very progressive personnel department.

[pnwmom]

2. Yes -- Motorola's policy does sound very progressive. Thanks for sharing!

[mcar]

3. Great OP!

I never had to get to a complaint, my gender discrimination was mostly salary based.

I appreciate this discussion.

[LakeArenal]

4. One of the most flagrant...

My boss took me to lunch at Howard Johnson (Johnson may be apropos ) It never occurred to me when asked that HJ's has a hotel attached. During lunch, he proceeded to bring out all this literature about a penis pump he had just had put in. Described how it worked and when he had the procedure. I laughed and said no way... I like this guy. He was/is married. It was never mentioned again and work resumed. This was 1990.

I have been propositioned, harassed, toyed with, even pinched. Each time I clearly said not interested. To my knowledge, there were no repercussions in my employment.

I guess I'm lucky (?)

[pnwmom]

10. So you didn't file a complaint against your boss -- but you certainly had grounds! Yuk! n/t

[LakeArenal]

23. Oh absolutely...

I could go back and file against most of them. Even a lesbian.

Times were different and I guess I never took it very personally. Maybe I should have. But I didn't.

[Raven]

5. 1969. Graduate School Professor told me I'd flunk

his course if I didn't spent the weekend with him. I went to the Dean. I was the 3rd complaint. He was fired.

[DURHAM D]

6. Nothing happened.

Two incidents. First time my father helped me bring the complaint as the perp was a city employee. Nothing happened. It was suggested that I quit.

Second time I made a noisy stink and walked out. He was the boss. I did make sure that another employee who was having an affair with him knew about it. Pissed her off but she was overpaid for a job she was not good at so she stuck around just for the money. Later he replaced her with a younger woman. He probably did that a few more times. Let me put it another way...the assistant bookkeeper position was actually just his mistress position.

[pnwmom]

11. Wow. So you brought a complaint to the city and there was no action except to say you could quit.

Was this a long time ago?

[DURHAM D]

22. Yes.

The first incident was in 1959-60. The second incident was in the mid-70s.

jftr - The first perp was a serial sexual harasser. Got away with it for decades. He not only was a harasser he provided alcohol to under age teenagers. The thing that is really disgusting is that today the city park and zoo is named after him. I no longer have any ties back to the town but just typing this pisses me off.

[pnwmom]

24. Did the truth about him ever get out, or did you just hear through the grapevine about

other women he had harassed?

[DURHAM D]

25. The truth was squashed.

Fairly small town, population under 30K. The grapevine was all of the girls/women who taught swimming lessons and lifeguarded. I know dozens of stories.

[moriah]

7. I wasn't the one harassed, but I was drawn in...

... when guys who witnessed extremely inappropriate comments made to a female temp told me about them -- she suddenly didn't show up one night and I asked, and they wondered if she might have quit because of it escalating to a head the shift prior.

I had them elucidate what was said, and determined why she finally walked off -- I had spoken to her on smoke breaks and knew she'd been a prior victim of domestic violence. The comment the guy made while looking directly at her was that he wanted to perform a sexual act that involved violence -- stated the Urban Dictionary name for it, of course someone asked him for the definition, and he was explicit in describing it.

I said that someone had to report it, and it'd be best done by the people who were witnesses, and ASAP. He'd never been inappropriate to me, but if you gathered from the witnesses telling me about it with a sense of "what should I do?" that I had seniority, you are correct. Therefore I think he knew better than to fuck with me. I had worked alone with him a few nights training him, so he came into the organization seeing me as "authority". A project temp, on the other hand, when he was permanent...

That was a time I worked weekend nights. Actually, I remember exactly which weekend I had just finished -- the one prior to Barack Obama's 2008 election. So it hit boiling point sometime that weekend, and made my recommendation in-room in front of others that Sunday night/Monday morning at the latest. I'd had Election Day off because of my schedule, and was an on-call poll worker. A different precinct than my own in my county had a cancellation and so I was blissfully insulated from news and predictions for the entire day, and had my cell phone off.

When I got done (we had people still voting for an hour and a half after official poll close because they were able to get in line before the closing) and turned on my car radio to hear it was pretty much a gimme that Barack was going to win, I turned on my cell and had a voicemail from my boss to call back ASAP.

Someone did speak up. I don't know if it was one of the witnesses or potentially one other person who was there who was hearing about it along with me, and more senior to me. But I was asked if the individual had been inappropriate ever with me, then asked if I'd heard about any impropriety. I stated no to the first and second to the yes, but said I didn't want to repeat hearsay unless it was required, and identified the people who claimed to me to have witnessed things.

By Thursday night when I got back onshift, he was terminated. The temp didn't come back, either, and I don't know if she ever knew that anyone did anything or what -- at that time we weren't the only company hiring for project work through that agency so she could have already been in another assignment. We hadn't shared contact information so I couldn't reach her.

[pnwmom]

12. What a story! Thanks for sharing. I was so relieved to get to the end

and read that he was terminated. You gave some excellent advice!

[crazycatlady]

8. I did and it just got me in trouble

I was in 6th grade (early 90s). A classmate had done to me what Trump would make (in)famous years later.

I was told that boys will be boys and given detention for speaking out. No teacher believed me and my parents didn't come to my defense. He didn't even get a slap on the wrist.

[pnwmom]

13. You were very brave for speaking out. The adults behaved very badly -- worse than the boy,

because it was their job to protect you, and they were adults. How could a teacher not believe you??? Much less punish YOU for speaking.

When I was groped by boys in school I was too embarrassed to tell anyone, not even my parents.

Again -- good for your young self! I'm disappointed in the adults around you, though.

[sarah FAILIN]

9. I've had it happen a couple of times.

The first time I was not believed because the person that touched me was another woman. She had been asking me to come hang out with her and her "sugar daddy" at his lake house for several weeks, but I hadn't because it sounded like a lot of drinking and he gave her money so I though she was pretty much a hooker. Later she says she is bi and her sugar daddy was wanting her to have a 3 way with another woman. I was literally cornered at work, young and shocked. She "caressed " for lack of a better word my arm and hand then I told her I was fine with her door swinging that way but mine only went one direction and I wasn't interested. She later did the same thing to my arm.. I told my bosses and they did not believe me. They asked her if she was bi and she said said she was. I think that she had did that to me wasn't even important to them, but I felt really awkward. She quit work the next day. That was 1990.

About 5 years ago a new kid at work that I was training tells me all about how he likes older chubby women like me sexually. He was trying to touch me by getting in my space and touching his arms to me as we worked which was totally unnecessary. I made him move then he tries to rub his butt on me and I went off yelling at him. He thought that because I wasn't wearing my wedding ring I must not be married and that it was ok to act like that at work. I can't wear jewelry because it makes my bones ache, but he still had no right to act like that. I told my supervisor and he did not believe me since I'm old and chubby, lol.. (who knew some guys are into that?) I refused to work with the kid and should have went to hr, but eventually after me refusing over and over to work near him, the supervisor transferred him to another shift.. He did the same thing to another woman, she was believed and he was fired.

Last week some men I work with said a whole bunch of crap that is way over the line to me. I do NOT want to tell hr, mainly because I like these people as coworkers because they do their jobs and they have families that depend on them. They just have a really wrong idea of what is ok to say at work and horrible views on women. Basically according to them, women wear make up to attract men, women that wear bike shorts and tank tops to the gym are asking for men to look at them and it is perfectly ok to ogle them then go up and ask for their numbers without getting told off. Good women like one of their wives wear leggings and her husbands big baggy t shirts that cover her butt because she gets a better work out all covered up. Last but not least, lesbians have ruined women's sports since straight women can't go in the locker room without seeing them all over each other, BUT they think that is hot and would like to see 2 lesbians making out. This was all in 1 day and before lunch. I told them that none of it is ok. They were literally leaning over yelling at me that they could say what they want to say to women and I was telling them off myself because it was all offensive to me and none of that is ok imo. It is still ongoing. I told 2 of our co-workers and I'm hoping next week is better. I wish we had some ongoing training about what is ok to talk about at work and things that are not ok to say.

[pnwmom]

14. Blegh! What is WRONG with people???

How can they not get how wrong it is to act/behave like this in a work place?

I had an incident like your first one occur but not at work. I'd made friends with a woman through my job (but not at my particular workplace) and she invited me over for dinner. When I got there she and her husband basically propositioned me. THANKS BUT NO THANKS. LOL.

But any of the things you describe happening AT WORK -- Gross. No excuse.

[sarah FAILIN]

17. More awkward than we need

This place is really on top of things when it comes to racism and will fire even a 20 year employee for a racist joke. Sexual stuff seems overlooked though.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

15. Would they want someone to talk to their mothers like that?q

Their sisters? Their daughters?

And you need to make it crystal clear to those co-workers that their comments stop, or you will go to HR.

[sarah FAILIN]

16. That wouldn't happen

The one that is married has a decent and good woman that covers herself up when she goes to the gym since she doesn't want men looking at her. I asked him if it would be better for her to wear a burqua since men are unable to control themselves. He has sons.. probably teaching them the same attitudes

I think it was pretty clear I wasn't putting up with it.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

19. Good. I am VERY glad you are making it clear you won't put up with that crap.

The underlying message that men can't control themselves so women have to make sure they do NOTHING to make men out of control is so wrong that I never know where to begin.

There's a story, no doubt apocryphal, that when Golda Meier was President (or whatever, I honestly don't know her exact title) of Israel, there was a problem with women being raped in one of the big cities. She proposed a curfew. For men. When asked why not a curfew for all, she said, "It's the men who are committing the crime."

I have always remembered that.

In recent days I've had discussions with both my ex husband and my 35 year old son (and honestly, I cannot begin to believe that that little tiny baby is a middle aged man, but I digress) about the recent stuff about harassment. My ex was never the kind of guy who treated women like objects. And I recall his being VERY aware, as he moved into middle age, that he did find young women attractive and that he must NEVER act on that. That he needed to be circumspect, polite, and treat them with dignity and respect.

My son is on the spectrum (Asperger's). I also always stressed various things about treating women well. I did tell him that I belonged to #Me Too, and did not go into details, because he didn't need any. And I also told him, truthfully, that I was never assaulted or traumatized in any way.

I am no longer in the work force and so I'm not out there in the way you are. But I want to thank you for what you are doing to try to educate men.

Thank you.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

20. Thank you.

That was incredibly brave, and losing a career is why so many are unwilling to come forward.

Thank you.

[pnwmom]

21. I am so sorry that happened to you, withoutapaddle.

[CatMor]

27. I admire you for reporting it when it happened...

you did the right thing even though it meant your career. You saved other women from being assaulted as you were and for that you are a example others should follow.

[bettyellen]

26. Didnt get a chance to when the boss fired me for not dating him- small privately owned company...

And if I went to the labor board I’d likely have been blackballed. He did try to apologize a year later, but didn’t have the chance since he was limping from the stroke he’d had, and I walked out as soon as I saw him approaching me.

[Bayard]

28. In the '80's

When I moved back to Louisville, I went to work in Quality Control for a large manufacturer there. In the first department I worked, one of the union guys was always making disgusting remarks to me. Then he started following me home, and bringing gossip back into work about who I was dating and so forth. I finally went to upper management. They threatened to fire him, and said they would also file charges if he didn't knock it off. He did.

Same company, I was moving to another department, so I could go back to school while working. The big department Superintendent over all of that shift kept making excuses as to why he was putting off my transfer. One night, we all went out together after work. After a few drinks, the Super pulled me down in his lap and started licking my ears. Huge guy, looked like Clark Kent. Yack. After that, one of the other supervisors, friend of mine, went to the Super and said, if you don't let her transfer, I'm going to testify in a sexual harassment case against you. I was transferred the next week.

Several more, but I'm making dinner.

[pnwmom]

29. YUK!!! I can imagine the look you must have had on your face, when he started on your ears.

I'm glad that your company responded effectively in those cases at least.

[3catwoman3]

30. No complaint filed, but I did stand up to a...

...jerk once. A very long time ago.

My last name is Ball. Lots of jokes growing up. The athletic ones were just sort of lame and predictable - "How's your brother, Golf? Where's your sister, Tennis?" Not very original.

The anatomic ones, however, were a major pain in the ass. When I was in 7th grade, there was this jackass in my homeroom class who thought it was ever so funny to greet me every morning with, "Hiya, Ball. How're they hangin'?" His buddies would laugh loudly at his cleverness. I used to dread walking into that room.

After weeks and weeks of this (maybe longer), and much rehearsing in my head, one morning I looked him straight in the eye and said, "Fine, thanks. How are yours?" His buddies laughed even harder at that, and he never said it again.

It never occurred to me to tell the teacher, who was a man. This would have been 1963-64, and I'm sure nothing would have been done. I'd have been told to ignore him. If the teacher had said anything to this dumbass, he'd probably have ramped up his efforts.

When I was 25, I joined the Air Force nurse corp. I was stationed in San Antonio, TX. I was a first lieutenant. The military was making efforts to address racial discrimination and sexual harassment at that time, and there were mandatory "training" sessions that everyone had to go to. The one I attended was run by a lieutenant colonel, and was very well done. We spoke after the class. He asked me to join him for a cup of coffee, and then tried to hit on me. It didn't go anywhere, and I made no report, but I remember thinking, "Seriously? After the subject matter you just taught?"

[pnwmom]

32. I read a book once called "You just don't understand," which was by a linguist,

and it talked about differences in the way males and females use language.

It made me realize how wrong my father's standard advice "just ignore it" was -- at least for dealing with many boys. The book talked about how boys and men practically made a game of insulting each other -- competing with insults.

And then one day I heard my sweet, kind, young son with some of his friends. And one of them said something so mean to him. I cringed. And then my son instantly responded back IN KIND, and everyone laughed.

I didn't know to do that! But you figured it out, and you didn't have to read a book and live a few more decades. Good for you!

[sarisataka]

31. I was a witness, not the target of

Quid pro quo harassment.

Back in the mid-90s I witnessed one Marine tell a young female Marine she needed to meet with him after hours if she wanted paperwork important for her career to be processed. Myself and two other male Marines stepped in to put a stop and told the female Marine we would support her if she wished to press charges.

She did and a special court-martial found her Superior guilty. He received reduction in rank, forfeiture of pay and allowances, and was denied reenlistment.

[pnwmom]

33. Amazing that he had the nerve to do that in front of two witnesses.

Good for you for standing up for her!

[sarisataka]

34. Frankly we were shocked

And looked at each other with "did he just say what I think he said" expressions. Apparently he thought guys would stick together; he was very wrong.