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IronLionZion

(45,550 posts)
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 10:04 AM Jan 2018

A pastor admitted a past sexual incident with a teen. His congregation gave him a standing ovation

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2018/01/10/a-pastor-admitted-a-past-sexual-incident-with-a-teen-his-congregation-gave-him-a-standing-ovation/?hpid=hp_rhp-morning-mix_mm-pastor%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.fecf80d5b965

On Dec. 1, as headlines across the country blared with news about Matt Lauer’s surprise firing from the “Today” show for sexual misconduct, a woman named Jules Woodson tapped out a short email. It ran only about 80 words but was nearly 20 years in the making. “Do you remember?” the subject line read.

“Do you remember that night that you were supposed to drive me home from church and instead drove me to a deserted back road and sexually assaulted me?” Woodson wrote. “Do you remember how you acted like you loved me and cared about me in order for me to cooperate in such acts, only to run out of the vehicle later and fall to your knees begging for forgiveness and for me not to tell anyone what had just happened?”

She closed with three words and a hashtag. “Well I REMEMBER,” the email said. “#me-too.”

The message landed in the inbox of Andy Savage, a pastor at Highpoint Church, an evangelical Memphis mega-congregation that draws more than 2,000 Sunday worshipers. The 42-year-old checked all the right boxes for a rising minister: biblically trained, handsome and CrossFit-cut; an attractive wife and five young sons; social media savvy and unafraid of speaking on topics such as sex. Savage’s career had begun as a college student working at a church outside Houston, a congregation Woodson attended as a high school student.

When Savage failed to respond to Woodson’s December email, she took her allegations public on Jan. 5, posting a detailed account of the alleged sexual assault on a blog for abuse survivors. Evangelical circles started spinning with reports of a then-college student forcing a sexual encounter with a student.

Yet instead of following the course of so many recent sexual harassment scandals — reports that have toppled careers in Hollywood, media and politics — Savage’s public outing seems to have failed to upset his position. In a message on the church’s website, he admitted to a “sexual incident” with a high school student at the time. Highpoint’s main pastor, Chris Conlee, also released a statement supporting Savage. And last Sunday, the pastor addressed his congregation about the allegations, but provided little detail.


For those who are wondering how anyone could still support Roy Moore after what he did. Some wingnuts actually support this behavior and may even envy it.
22 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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A pastor admitted a past sexual incident with a teen. His congregation gave him a standing ovation (Original Post) IronLionZion Jan 2018 OP
I won't pretend to understand the minds of the religiously insane, wing nuts or just . . . . . Stinky The Clown Jan 2018 #1
Who are they to forgive him? IronLionZion Jan 2018 #2
Boom. Orrex Jan 2018 #11
You're right, but what does what you think matter to them? Stinky The Clown Jan 2018 #17
What does what anyone thinks matter to anyone ever? IronLionZion Jan 2018 #19
And who says liberals don't? Stinky The Clown Jan 2018 #21
That is a cult., CentralMass Jan 2018 #3
Yeah, and . . . . ? Stinky The Clown Jan 2018 #18
Too bad Charles Manson is dead. Girard442 Jan 2018 #4
His congregation forgives him.. how about the victim? mountain grammy Jan 2018 #5
Reminds me of a bumpersticker I've seen ... left-of-center2012 Jan 2018 #6
Yes. In there eyes. Lochloosa Jan 2018 #9
My understanding they can do all this kind of stuff then 'find grace' and they get a clean slate lunasun Jan 2018 #14
Or tacit encouragement to sin IronLionZion Jan 2018 #20
One of the better things about atheism is the realization... Girard442 Jan 2018 #22
Huh, I don't remember that passage in the Bible. Initech Jan 2018 #7
For a certain type of evangelical Christian, if a person has truly repented and asked forgiveness WhiskeyGrinder Jan 2018 #8
That type of evangelical Christian can go fuck itself Orrex Jan 2018 #10
Agreed. I've found it helpful to understand, but I haven't figured out how to outflank them yet. WhiskeyGrinder Jan 2018 #13
True salvation is supposed to be transformative. dawg Jan 2018 #16
Like many things, that can be used and abused IronLionZion Jan 2018 #15
What's not to like about a religion that allows you to do anything you want HAB911 Jan 2018 #12

Stinky The Clown

(67,824 posts)
1. I won't pretend to understand the minds of the religiously insane, wing nuts or just . . . . .
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 10:06 AM
Jan 2018

. . . . . garden variety Christians, but I took the standing O as a sign of forgiveness, not endorsement of the act.

IronLionZion

(45,550 posts)
19. What does what anyone thinks matter to anyone ever?
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 11:25 AM
Jan 2018

It's not just an opinion, it's a crime with legal consequences. Liberals generally support the victims in these cases.

Stinky The Clown

(67,824 posts)
21. And who says liberals don't?
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 12:16 PM
Jan 2018

Wait a minute. Are you staying I support this guy's "apology"? Cuz that's what it sounds like.

Answer, please.

Girard442

(6,086 posts)
4. Too bad Charles Manson is dead.
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 10:13 AM
Jan 2018

They could have forgiven him too and then made him assistant pastor. He was very charismatic, I've heard.

mountain grammy

(26,656 posts)
5. His congregation forgives him.. how about the victim?
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 10:19 AM
Jan 2018

He apologizes to his benefactors. It's all about the $$$$ No god intended.

lunasun

(21,646 posts)
14. My understanding they can do all this kind of stuff then 'find grace' and they get a clean slate
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 11:05 AM
Jan 2018

Do it again? Repent and rinse clean slate again. They have no shame or remorse they are renewed

Call someone else a sinner or a couple's sincere gay loving relationship a sin ? That's ok and being judgy is just good Christian work

IronLionZion

(45,550 posts)
20. Or tacit encouragement to sin
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 11:26 AM
Jan 2018

consequence free. These are the same people who think draconian law and order punishments will deter crime somehow.

Girard442

(6,086 posts)
22. One of the better things about atheism is the realization...
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 12:36 PM
Jan 2018

...that it is quite possible to f*** things up so badly they can never be set straight. That puts a damper on some kinds of behavior. Pity we can't transplant that into Evangelicalism somehow.

Initech

(100,107 posts)
7. Huh, I don't remember that passage in the Bible.
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 10:25 AM
Jan 2018

"And Jesus said that it's ok to grabeth thine bosom and thine pussy."

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,455 posts)
8. For a certain type of evangelical Christian, if a person has truly repented and asked forgiveness
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 10:29 AM
Jan 2018

from Jesus, that ends the issue. They can go on in their lives secure in the knowledge that they've been forgiven, and any pain and suffering the other person feels could be alleviated if only they'd accept Jesus, too. It's a nifty little mind trick. A person in the town I live nearish to was elected to a leadership position even after it came out he had molested a young child when he was a teenager. The justifications from his supporters -- but he's got a family now! and is so Christian! I'm sure he's forgiven! Who are any of us, really, to judge? -- made me fucking sick.

Orrex

(63,228 posts)
10. That type of evangelical Christian can go fuck itself
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 10:55 AM
Jan 2018

I have no respect for cults, and cults with a built-in get-out-of-jail-free card are inexcusable.

dawg

(10,624 posts)
16. True salvation is supposed to be transformative.
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 11:14 AM
Jan 2018

If someone really believes that Jesus willingly suffered and died for their sins, it should mean enough to them to make them want to be as worthy of that sacrifice as they can possibly be.

Such a person would never just continue to sin, and say, "Ooops, well I'm forgiven so it doesn't matter anyway."

And I know people will scream "No True Scotsman" fallacy. That's an internet favorite.

But I posit that someone doesn't really "believe" a thing, if none of the actions they take in their personal lives are consistent with it being true.

They are, instead, just following the cultural norms that are convenient for them to follow.

IronLionZion

(45,550 posts)
15. Like many things, that can be used and abused
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 11:12 AM
Jan 2018

Because guilt over something can ruin a person's life and cause worse behavior in the future. Addiction treatment programs often involve apologizing to people and seeking their forgiveness.

But this kind of blanket forgiveness from completely unaffected people is often abused. The lesson is that one can get away with bad things without consequences, it encourages more people to do bad things in the future and normalizes it.

I also get the people who feel that we should all leave the judging to God, but we also have a legal system with legal consequences. I just feel like this forgiveness is often fake and the person doesn't really believe they did anything wrong.

HAB911

(8,919 posts)
12. What's not to like about a religion that allows you to do anything you want
Wed Jan 10, 2018, 10:56 AM
Jan 2018

and then write it off to forgiveness?

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