Qaddafi Forces Capture 3 Dutch Aircrew

[cali]

By MARLISE SIMONS and ALAN COWELL
Published: March 3, 2011


THE HAGUE — Libyan forces loyal to Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi have captured three crew members of a Dutch naval helicopter who were rescuing European citizens, last Sunday, the Dutch Defense Ministry said on Thursday, the first report of foreigners being by held in Libya’s bloody and unfolding uprising.

Otte Beeksma, a spokesman for the Defense Ministry, said the pro-Qaddafi forces also captured two civilians being rescued — one Dutch, the other from an unspecified European country — who had since been released. Dutch officials decline to give personal details of the crew members while confidential negotiations for their release were underway.

The authorities had kept word of the capture a secret until a Dutch newspaper broke the story.

Mr. Beeksma, said the crew of a Lynx helicopter had landed in the coastal city of Sirte — a pro-Qaddafi stronghold — after flying from a navy ship, the HMS Tromp, anchored offshore. The helicopter was “surrounded by armed Libyan forces late on Sunday afternoon.”

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http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/04/world/africa/04netherlands.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

[msongs]

1. meddling in someone else's civil war has consequences nt

[cali]

2. so rescuing your nationals is meddling?

[ProgressiveProfessor]

3. Western troops in uniform in an Arab nation without permission...yes that is meddling

[Hosnon]

5. That's absurd. Nations have an obligation to protect foreign visitors.

If they fail to do so, being rescued by your own country isn't meddling, it's doing what the host country failed to do.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

8. Actually they don't

[Hosnon]

9. Nations clearly have a responsibility to protect their own citizens:

http://www.responsibilitytoprotect.org/index.php/component/content/article/35-r2pcs-topics/398-general-assembly-r2p-excerpt-from-outcome-document

"The greater includes the lesser." If nations have a responsibility to protect their own citizens, they have a responsibility to protect visitors whom they are hosting.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

10. That is a particular NGO position. It is not international nor US law

In a US context, the government does not have the specific duty to protect a person, but the people as a whole. Visitors are not guests and are not being hosted. There is no greater duty to them than anyone else. Pointing this out since "failure to adequate protect" is not a crime and should the Gaddifi regime survive, they can not be prosecuted for that.

[Hosnon]

13. The U.N. General Assembly adopted it on October 24, 2005.

http://unpan1.un.org/intradoc/groups/public/documents/un/unpan021752.pdf

As far as U.S. law is concerned, the U.N. Treaty is part of the supreme law of the land pursuant to Article VI, at least to the extent that it does not conflict with any other constitutional provision.

[Cali_Democrat]

12. I wouldn't say it's meddling, but they definitely should have sought permission

[Adsos Letter]

4. No, it's trying to get your own people the heck out of a dangerous situation.

The fact that they are in a (potentially) more dangerous situation isn't the Dutch government's fault. Gaddafi could have allowed them out.

[dionysus]

6. yeah, fuck trying to get your own citizens out of danger...

:crazy:

[Hosnon]

7. Failing to protect your citizens and foreign citizens has consequences.

He's meddling in a justified response to that failure.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

11. From whom, by whom, and under what authority

Being pedantic on this since international law is not what many think it is.

[Hosnon]

14. The U.N. General Assembly.

Just a heads up - I studied international law at the Sorbonne in Paris. (I only bring that up in response to this: "Being pedantic on this since international law is not what many think it is.")