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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:18 AM
Original message
Libyan Revolution Tweets, Day 10, Part 1 (The Mother of all Intifada continues)
Edited on Sat Feb-26-11 01:30 AM by Catherina
Libyan Revolution Tweets, Day 10, Part 1 (The Mother of all Intifada continues)

"We have Plan A, Plan B, Plan C. Plan A is to live and die in Libya. Plan B is to live and die in Libya. Plan C is to live and die in Libya." - Saif Islam Qaddafi during interview

Video evidence of clean ups: Gaddafi's men picking up dead bodies in #Tripoli

Previous Day 9 threads: Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7, Part 8, Part 9, Part 10, Part 11, Part 12, , Part 14, Part 15

Previous Day 8 threads: Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7, Part 8, Part 9, Part 10, http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x502125">Part 11

The world’s 100 largest arms dealers, excluding Chinese vendors, sold weapons for $401 billion in 2009, with US vendors remaining in first place

Threads for previous days are in my journal

To make sure the Army doesn't swing the revolution to the people, with the silent complicity of world leaders more concerned about the stability of oil prices than people's lives, Qaddafi has brought in more than 35,000 North African mercenaries specifically from Chad, Nigeria, Guinea and Darfur. There's a Facebook video of a captured mercenary from Chad (Youtube here). Captured mercenaries confessed they were paid between $12,000 - $30,000 each. Today pamphlet ads were found in Nigeria offering them $2000/day for their savage work.

Is Qaddafi the only one paying these mercenaries? Or are EU governments, with their long history of hiring mercenaries, chipping in? I demand to know.
LibyanThinker The Libyan Thinker
Remains of Soldiers Burned to Death for Not Shooting Protesters in #Libya http://www.twitvid.com/YXKOT & http://tinyurl.com/4d6a57n

MAP of Protests across the Middle East





Please rec if you read these so I know if the effort here is worth it.
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:19 AM
Response to Original message
1. K&R
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Tx4obama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:19 AM
Response to Original message
2. K & R n/t
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Desertrose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:22 AM
Response to Original message
3. Late nite US/early morning Libya K & R nt
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:25 AM
Response to Original message
4. Saif Gaddafi's interview … 3 part youtube video. No Comment
Edited on Sat Feb-26-11 01:29 AM by Catherina
HafedAlGhwell Hafed Al Ghwell
#libya #feb17 Saif Gaddafi's interview … No Comment -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mNyIhg_png&feature=player_embedded
22 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply


part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mNyIhg_png&feature=player_embedded


part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yyVklCjdoE


part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlC5vTtpfMI

End of part 3 video: "We have Plan A, Plan B, Plan C. Plan A is to live and die in Libya. Plan B is to live and die in Libya. Plan C is to live and die in Libya." - Saif Islam Qaddafi
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:47 AM
Response to Reply #4
19. Thanks for this, good to see their spin.
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:08 AM
Response to Reply #4
28. Great interview. Saif is trembling in his shoes. He will in fact do plan D.
Fly to Venezuela and join his brother and their family and pray to fuck that he makes it out of their alive.
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drm604 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:28 AM
Response to Original message
5. K&R
And thank you Catherina. I don't know how you do it.
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Hardrada Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:29 AM
Response to Original message
6. Wow! I didn't know Tubruq (Tobruk in WWII) was that close
to Egypt. No wonder Rommel had a shot at winning in North Africa. Of course if he had it would be Deutches Nord Afrika!!
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:39 AM
Response to Reply #6
11. Learn some geography!
Just teasing. I will ashamedly admit I didn't even know the locations of these countries until the Tunisia uprising. I was home-schooled and hated geography.
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Hardrada Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:58 AM
Response to Reply #11
25. My only notion of North Africa was old WWII flicks!
One good one had James Mason as Rommel.
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pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:12 AM
Response to Reply #25
30. ...and the Marine Corps Hymn
"From the halls of Montezuma, to the shores of Tripoli...." :)
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Hardrada Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:14 AM
Response to Reply #30
31. Yep, Tripoli's right there! Good point!
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:18 AM
Response to Reply #30
33. Nice. :)
:hi:
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pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:35 AM
Original message
People make fun of "jarheads," but that's one thing they know
That's something the USMC does well--they teach their recruits the history of their service.

When I was in the Army, decades ago, we had absolutely NO training on military history.

The Marine Corps even makes them SING it! :rofl:

:hi:
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steve2470 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:30 AM
Response to Original message
7. k&r nt
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:36 AM
Response to Original message
8. LPC woman in #Tripoli: "We are afraid. Every house armed only w/knives. I will give myself 2 #Libya.
Edited on Sat Feb-26-11 01:41 AM by Catherina
feb17voices Feb 17 voices
Audioboo: LPC woman in #Tripoli: "We are afraid. Every house armed only w/knives. I will give myself 2 #Libya." #feb17 http://boo.fm/b288412
36 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply


Audio in very clear English: http://audioboo.fm/boos/288412-lpc-woman-in-tripoli-we-are-afraid-every-house-armed-only-w-knives-i-will-give-myself-2-libya-feb17

Please listen. " I will give all my sons. I will give all my brothers. I will give myself to Libya."... "International community just waiting, gathering, having meetings... If you can help, please do it now."
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highplainsdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:37 AM
Response to Original message
9. K&R
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:39 AM
Response to Original message
10. Let this be clear: the US&UK knew abt gaddafi long ago. freeing ourselves
Cyrenaican Libyana Americana
Let this be clear: the US and the UK knew abt #gaddafi long ago. He might be news to some, but he has been no secret. They have NEVER cared
39 minutes ago


Cyrenaican Libyana Americana
The Libyan people are freeing themselves.
38 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:42 AM
Response to Reply #10
15. LIBYA HURRA --
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:39 AM
Response to Original message
12. current time in Tripoli is 8:39 AM on Saturday, 26 Feb
TimeInLibya Time In Libya
#Libya The current time in Tripoli is 8:30 AM on Saturday, 26 February 2011
9 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:40 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Any idea when the Battle of Tripoli is to begin?
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:53 AM
Response to Reply #13
21. No. And not too many tweets coming in now. When is morning prayer time? n/t
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:56 AM
Response to Reply #21
23. Pre-dawn is the morning prayer, then again at noon. So perhaps after noon.
They will then have 6+ hours before dawn prayers.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:05 AM
Response to Reply #23
27. It's past predawn now. Too quiet for my tastes. Thanks n/t
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pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:40 AM
Response to Original message
14. K&R
You go, girl!
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:44 AM
Response to Original message
16. San Fransisco Rally in support for Libya Saturday Febraury 26th, 2011 UN Plaza Market & 8th 1:00pm-4
ShababLibya LibyanYouthMovement
SOLIDARITY: San Fransisco Rally in support for Libya Saturday Febraury 26th, 2011 UN Plaza Market & 8th 1:00pm-4:00pm BE THERE #libya #feb17
4 hours ago Favorite Retweet Reply
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pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:48 AM
Response to Reply #16
20. I hope the reactions around the world are reaching the people in Libya
If only for the moral support to help sustain them.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:11 AM
Response to Reply #20
29. They're reaching the FB and twitter crowds
and also I'm sure Libyans who have family overseas to relay the news. I don't think there are enough of those out in the provinces to really get the news out but overall, I think they know.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:45 AM
Response to Original message
17. @UN you must not authorize foreign military intervention in Libya. impose a no fly zone
ShababLibya LibyanYouthMovement
@UN you must not authorize foreign military intervention in Libya, you must first impose a no fly zone over Libya #Libya #Feb177
6 hours ago Favorite Undo Retweet Reply
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:45 AM
Response to Original message
18. BTW: Libya placed billions of dollars at U.S. banks: WikiLeaks
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/02/24/us-libya-wealth-idUSTRE71N2AT20110224

Freezing their accounts = good. The battle for reparations will be long and hard, unfortunately. But the assets are frozen now.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:29 AM
Response to Reply #18
40. k --
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:54 AM
Response to Original message
22. THIS is what #Gaddafi is doing to the ppl, Protester shot in head by Gaddafi’s forces
Shnesh Sarah Hnesh
THIS is what #Gaddafi is doing to the ppl of #Libya...GRAPHIC feb17.info/videos/warning… via @Feb17Libya
8 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

Tripoli Protester shot in head by Gaddafi’s forces **GRAPHIC**
Posted on February 25, 2011 by v1d

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i14BXO-hFQE
http://feb17.info/videos/warning-graphic-protester-in-tripoli-shot-in-head-by-mercenaries/
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 01:58 AM
Response to Reply #22
24. Each of these deaths is fomenting more and more anger toward Gaddafi and his regime.
They will pay for this.

Did you hear the voice of the young man who saw the bullet wound (and brain coming out of it)? He was completely shaken. That is a lifetime of anger in one moment.

I am fucking livid. Down with Gaddafi!
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:04 AM
Response to Original message
26. Video: Captured Mercenary in Libya, 21.02.11, "They told us we will come with planes for free >>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ku0qFVLebp4
This video was taken 21.02.11 in the Djerba Street area Of Tripoli

English subtitles: "They told us we will come with planes for free... we were around 50"

This video needs a translator.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:15 AM
Response to Original message
32. Protests continue in Libya
feb17libya Feb17Libya
#feb17 Protests continue in Libya http://f.ast.ly/qY9m4 #@shabablibya
1 minute ago Favorite Retweet Reply


Protests continue in Libya
Posted on February 26, 2011 by v1d

Al Jazeera English

In Libya people are waking up to a twelfth day of turmoil. But longtime ruler Muammar Gaddafi and his son Saif al-Islam say they are going nowhere. Despite growing support for anti-government demonstrators, both at home and abroad, there’s been a call for “concrete action” by Ban Ki-moon, the UN secretary-general. And its most powerful body votes on fresh sanctions against Gaddafi and his entourage.

This after the Libyan leader joined his supporters in the capital – again vowing not to step down from office – and to fight to the end. And these are the implications – protesters fired upon in Tripoli, where another crackdown began after Friday prayers. We’ll hear from someone who was there. But just 50km away in the town of Zawiya there is a different picture. Amateur video appears to show more soldiers switching sides. Al Jazeera’s Tarek Bazley reports.


VIDEO (also at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpArCqYnMho)

http://feb17.info/videos/protests-continue-in-libya/
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rabs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:19 AM
Response to Original message
34. Late night (in my part of the world) kick and rec.



And another thank you for your amazing chronicling of Egyptian and Libyan history as it has unfolded and is unfolding.

There is a saying in South America"

"Donde esta el coronel cuando se necesita."
"Where is the colonel when he is needed."

The implication is that a military officer must either take out Qaddafi by assassination or by arresting him and his cronies.

Cheers. Be well.




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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:24 AM
Response to Reply #34
37. Do you have a clear read on what Chavez really said?
I don't for a single moment trust the snippets and slanted translations in US articles. I want his statements in Spanish, straight from his mouth and not someone else's. I looked briefly last night but couldn't keep my eyes open.

For sure, "Donde esta el coronel cuando se necesita?"
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:19 AM
Response to Original message
35. I called this Day 10 because... but today is really day 12.
I called this Day 10 because the protests were scheduled to start 10 days ago (#Feb17) but they really started 12 days ago. Today is really day 12.
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:23 AM
Response to Reply #35
36. That's true, they started two days early.
What do you make of Gaddafi's big speech in front of the large crowd (1k people?)?
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:28 AM
Response to Reply #36
39. Technicolor dramatics. Hitler's last stand. I wonder just how *real* that was
and if it wasn't clever editing. If it were real, imo, they would have given journalists front page seats to cover it. I think it was old footage recycled and mounted next to a speech he filmed to his imaginary crowds in the backyard of his compound. None of the people normally around him were anywhere to be seen in that video.

Those are just initial thought. I can't bear to even have him in my thoughts right now. I hate him that much.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:34 AM
Response to Reply #39
44. It did look strange -- after someone points it out to you ... !!
Edited on Sat Feb-26-11 02:46 AM by defendandprotect
Gaddafi wanted it to appear as if he had the courage to come before the

people in Green Square -- he didn't --

This is a much smaller population than Egypt -- less than 7 million?

Egypt is near 80 million? Tremendous loss of life because of this monster!


Lybia has been a much harder situation with no press cover until very late.

They didn't have the comfort and confidence of Tahrir Square and full time AJ.

Plus -- in the end -- was it 50,000 mercenaries?



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pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:38 AM
Response to Reply #44
63. Real or not, he definitely needs a shrink!
How out of touch with reality is he?

Forget the shrink--he needs to be taken OUT.

Society holds that killing is justifiable to prevent imminent harm to oneself or others. This situation qualifies--in spades!
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pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:27 AM
Response to Original message
38. HOW TO TELL WHAT TIME IT IS IN LIBYA:
It's usually expressed in relation to GMT (Greenwich Mean Time), with which most Americans are unfamiliar.

The EASY WAY to calculate: Libya (all one time zone) is EST + 7, or PST + 10. In between, adjust accordingly.

The calculation will change when the U.S. goes to Daylight Savings Time because Libya doesn't have DST.
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:30 AM
Response to Reply #38
41. Hopefully this will be long over before that happens (switch to DST).
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pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:42 AM
Response to Reply #41
46. That's the hope of all of us
In church, when I went to church as a boy, they used to say something like "devoutly to be wished."

I suspect we here would all be Catholic for one moment in joining that hope...
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:05 AM
Response to Reply #46
52. Thanks for the heads up on the time zone, btw.
Appreciate it, I was going to hit worldtimezones or whatever that site is but now it's already committed to memory.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:32 AM
Response to Original message
42. Latin America's sudden silence on Gaddafi
Edited on Sat Feb-26-11 02:33 AM by Catherina
feb17libya Feb17Libya
#feb17 Latin America's sudden silence on Gaddafi http://f.ast.ly/q4mXY #@shabablibya
14 minutes ago


Latin America’s sudden silence on Gaddafi
Posted on February 26, 2011 by v1d



By: Gabriel Elizondo

Feb. 25, 2011

Both geographically and culturally Latin America is a world away from Libya. However, examining the record shows how Libya’s leader, Muammar Gaddafi, in recent years has quietly built political and economic alliances with Latin America that are mutually beneficial. Those new alliances might now be working to Gaddafi’s advantage, earning him support by some of president’s of the region, and forcing others to think twice before openly criticising him this past week.

With conservative estimates of hundreds killed in the past week, mass defections of Gaddafi loyalists, and reports the Libyan leader is employing foreign mercenaries to kill his own people who rise up against him, many of Latin America’s presidents have refused to condemn Gaddafi in the harshest of terms. Perhaps the reason why is because many of these same Latin American leaders were up until last week building cozy relations with Gaddafi; some on ideological grounds, others for trade and economic purposes; or both.

Below a snapshot of a few countries:

...

VENEZUELA

No leader in Latin America is a more unapologetic friend of Gaddafi than Venezuelan president Hugo Chavez, who has visited Libya over 4 times in recent years. Both leaders are vocal anti-imperialists that have been the target of the U.S. intelligence agencies over the years. Both men naturally gravitate to one another, and they have know to regularly shower each other with praise and symbolic gifts. In 2009, Libya’s Football Federation inaugurated an 11,000 seat stadium named ‘Hugo Chavez Stadium’ in a suburb of Benghazi, of all places. According to Venezuela’s El Universal newspaper, at the end of last year alone there were more than 100 conventions signed between the two countries.

Response now: Venezuela has officially condemned the violence in Libya, but late on Thursday Chavez said via Twitter “…viva Libya and its independence! Kadafi is facing a civil war!!” Chaves is standing by his friend.

...

Read more HERE

http://feb17.info/written/latin-americas-sudden-silence-on-gaddafi/


If true, if that was really Chavez who tweeted that, then to hell with him and wake the fuck up. I'll stick to the French Communist Party which got this one right.
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:34 AM
Response to Reply #42
43. He did you were sleeping I think when the drama was on DU.
There were a lot of people saying he didn't mean what he said etc.

I'm tired of even thinking about Chavez.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:43 AM
Response to Reply #43
47. Link to that please? I know there's been controversy
and I've seen twisted slant on things Chavez said in the past. I'm looking for original spanish straight from his mouth and in context. I couldn't find anything but like I said, I didn't spend much time looking. It's kind of secondary to me at this point but still important.

I understand Castro's statements and have no problems with them. What Chavez is purported to have said is a different matter altogether.

I say purported because of the way the UK Foreign Secretary William Hague immediately tried to paint Chavez as a demon by deliberately lying that Gaddafi was fleeing to Venezuela.

It's secondary now but I really need to find the information and analyze it so I know what my relationship to certain people is going to be after following this stuff 24/7.
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:49 AM
Response to Reply #47
49. Here ya go:
Someone posted that Chavez supported Gaddafi on twitter: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=503235&mesg_id=503235

(the third post from the top I translate it and explain it very clearly)

Someone misunderstood who "Nicolas" was and posted that it was in fact the opposite: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=503615&mesg_id=503615

(it has question marks because he got caught and he edited it)

Twitter is not loading for me but this is the link: http://twitter.com/chavezcandanga/status/40943330179284992
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:10 AM
Response to Reply #49
53. The twitter thing is wrongly interpreted. I looked at it the first day it was tweeted
Edited on Sat Feb-26-11 03:11 AM by Catherina
My major was Russian studies. When Chavez called Gaddafi Tsar Nicholas, that was no compliment and said it all. It meant Gaddafi is facing civil war from his own people and will lose just as Tsar Nicholas lost.


The other thing about Chavez' twitter account is that he doesn't tweet. There are 200 people who have access to it and can tweet in his name.

Chavez tops Twitter in Venezuela


The Twitter account of Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has become the most popular in Venezuela, with more than a quarter of a million followers.

Mr Chavez says he has hired 200 people to read through the many messages he receives on the social networking site.

He says more than 18% of the messages he receives are hostile.

He deals with the negative messages by laughing them off or sending back jokes. "I don't care," he said, "It's a form of contact with the world."

...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8671581.stm


I really need a spanish article about anything he said in a speech, a letter...

Twitter is down. I'm full of anxiety right now because we're so cut off now, out in the cold. Can't stand it. I guess I can look for Chavez + Libya news in the meantime. This is painful. Bring twitter back up!
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:16 AM
Response to Reply #53
54. Here is the webcache:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:Np61yhaCiM8J:twitter.com/chavezcandanga+chavez+twitter&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=opera&source=www.google.com

Here is a Spanish article discussing it:

http://www.correodelorinoco.gob.ve/debate-parlamentario/canciller-nicolas-maduro-abogamos-por-paz-y-unidad-libia

I assure you that Tsar Nicolas is in fact not true. You're more thorough than that Catherina! He was talking directly to Nicolás Maduro, Venezuela's foreign minister.

Here is the video of Maduro's statements: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3j0Z-VL1dRE

(I think you understand Spanish? It's not translated.)
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:32 AM
Response to Reply #54
60. Makes no sense Josh. Hugo wouldn't be tweeting to Maduro
The other thing I showed you is that he doesn't do his own tweeting, 200 people were hired to tweet with Venezuelans for him.

This is why I want something a little more substantial.

Whether you agree with Canciller Nicolás being Tsar (which was how I read it), he

Yea, I speak Spanish. I live in Central America. I'm not too keen on quotes taken out of context from a statement made to Chavez and not by him. Even in the context the article reported those partial quotes, I see nothing wrong. The West is going to try to seize that oil. It's been that way for decades, nothing's going to change now. Without control of that oil, the EU's machinery comes to a grinding halt and a serious crimp is put in US operations, not to mention angry people tossing out incumbents because they're furious about paying $5 or $6 a gallon and the price of everything shoots up due to transportation costs.

France, Germany, the UK are not going to allow their industries to be affected without a good fight. Nor will we.

I'm doing cold turkey now. Serious cold turkey. Twitter, come back up!
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:37 AM
Response to Reply #60
61. When it was early you could say he didn't say it, but Al Jazeera and half the world confirmed it.
It's his official twitter, that's what he means to say.

w/e no sweat off my back, you wouldn't be the first to disbelieve Chavez said that even in light of the evidence.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:43 AM
Response to Reply #61
65. that's not evidence of anything Josh. I've read what Castro had to say
and it lines up with what Maduro was telling Chavez.

I'm kind of confounded right now and don't want to discuss it further in this thread. I'll meet you in another thread about that after things with Libya calm down. I'm going off to look into this twitter problem.
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:46 AM
Response to Reply #65
66. I'm tired of discussing it, tbh. Anyway, I can't find any news about why twitter is down.
I hope there's not some censoring going on.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:35 AM
Response to Reply #42
45. AJE Video: Latin America divided over Gaddafi
Edited on Sat Feb-26-11 02:35 AM by Catherina
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:46 AM
Response to Original message
48. "The United Nations is the most useless international body on the planet. Ban Ki Moon is a coward"
Edited on Sat Feb-26-11 02:50 AM by Catherina
AliLePointe Jibreel
The United Nations is the most useless international body on the planet. Ban Ki Moon is a coward.
13 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply


Not a coward, but a servant of the G5. It's time to abolish the security council and give each country's vote equal weight with none of this veto bs.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 02:50 AM
Response to Reply #48
50. Agree -- and US isn't part of any thing it can't control --
Edited on Sat Feb-26-11 02:52 AM by defendandprotect
The destiny of the UN was quickly changed way back with the murder of

Dag Hammarskjold -- and has purposefully been kept from its mission.

The Human Rights Manifesto should trump any concept of corporations/MIC running our lives --

but elites need this cover in order to control us.

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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:04 AM
Response to Reply #50
51. Binding equal vote with no veto power would be awesome.
But I assure you that a one state government is not something other nations would want at all, because that also means one state police.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:18 AM
Response to Reply #51
56. No one is surrendering their sovereignity -- but US regularly ignores other nation's sovereignity!
Agree with Howard Zinn re having all the barriers - borders -- drop.

And the Libyans seem to be saying that same thing -- at least in regard

to uniting the Arab states -- no documents necessary to cross from one to the other.

If I understood them correctly!

They're a brilliant people!

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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:21 AM
Response to Reply #56
57. That would be amazing. I hope it happens.
Also I agree with Howard Zinn.

This will not come with the inept UN. Countries need to change and then they can change the UN or make a better one.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:24 AM
Response to Reply #57
58. The UN isn't "inept" any more than Obama is "inept" -- the conroling forces are elite --
always have been - at least since they murdered Hammarskjold --
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:39 AM
Response to Reply #58
64. Takes my take 2. Look who created the UN and when
It was neutered from the start for a reason. Dismantle the Security Council and eliminate veto power, otherwise it's just a charade. I remember Hammarskjold vaguely. My mom bought me one of his books when I was too young to appreciate it. Poor man.
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LeafyGeneva Donating Member (6 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 04:07 AM
Response to Reply #64
72. I know this is off topic
But since the topic of the death of Dag Hammarskjöld came up, I think it's useful to remember Harry Truman's comment about that.
"Dag Hammarskjöld was on the point of getting something done when they killed him. Notice that I said, 'when they killed him'."

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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #72
74. Noted --
Peaceful leadership always has to be targeted --

but that's the age old question of the world --

how to deal with the violent few among us --

Think Egypt and Libya are beginning to answer that question for us --

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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #64
73. There's only one way the elites/right wing come to power ...
assassination, stolen elections, lies --

and the wealth they have to pull all of that off!!

Imagine that the Vatican is still recognized as a sovereign nation at UN!

A one square mile nation of men -- at a UN which should be honoring separation of

church & state!

Good morning Catherina -- my heart aches for Libya!

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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:18 AM
Response to Original message
55. WAPO: At al-Jazeera, we saw the Arab revolutions coming. Why didn't the West?
At al-Jazeera, we saw the Arab revolutions coming. Why didn't the West?

By Wadah Khanfar
Friday, February 25, 2011; 5:00 PM
DOHA, QATAR

...

It is now clear to all that the modern, post-colonial Arab state has failed miserably, even in what it believed it was best at: maintaining security and stability. Over the decades, Arab interior ministers and police chiefs devoted enormous resources and expertise to monitoring and spying on their own people. Yet now, the security machineries in Tunisia, Egypt and Libya have disintegrated in short order, while the rest of the authoritarian and repressive regimes in the region can see the writing on the wall.

These revolutions have exposed not just the failure of traditional politicians but also the moral, political and economic bankruptcy of the old Arab elites. Those elites not only attempted to control their own people, but also sought to shape and taint the views of news media in the region and across the world.

Indeed, it should surprise no one that so many Western analysts, researchers, journalists and government experts failed to recognize the obvious signs of Arab youth movements that would soon erupt into revolutions capable of bringing down some of the most pro-Western regimes in the Middle East. That failure has exposed a profound lack of understanding in the West of Arab reality.

...

These unfolding transformations have been less of a surprise for us at al-Jazeera. Since our launch nearly 15 years ago, we have chosen to keep close to the Arab street, gauging its pulse and reflecting its aspirations. It was clear to us that a revolution was in the making, and it was happening far from the gaze of a tame and superficial establishment media that allied itself with the powerful center - on the assumption that the center is always safer and more important. Many media outlets in the region failed to recognize what was happening among the Arab grass roots. Keen to conduct interviews with high-level officials and ever willing to cover repetitious news conferences, they remained oblivious to what was happening on the ground.

...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/02/25/AR2011022503177.html
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:26 AM
Response to Reply #55
59. Al-Jazeera leads the information flow, they are beacons in a shitpile of global media.
It also shows that lifetime regimes cannot survive, you have to replace them if there is to be any change or progress.
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:38 AM
Response to Original message
62. How come Twitter is down? This is really really REALLY odd.
Censoring the Battle of Tripoli?
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:48 AM
Response to Reply #62
68. People are wondering if Libya attacked Twitter.
It's been over 45 minutes now, almost an hour. And like a fool I shut mine down thinking the problem was on my end.

There's almost nothing at all, even about idiocies, coming out of twitter according to google feed.

I'm going to FB now but that's a LOT harder.
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:50 AM
Response to Reply #68
69. Yeah, their status is "Currently experiencing elevated error rates"
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:47 AM
Response to Original message
67. Twitter status:
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:53 AM
Response to Reply #67
70. Just came back up. Very strange. Anonymous, on a different server,
had issues also

Anony_Ops Anonymous Operations
Were having some DNS issues of our own: please use *.anonops.net to visit site/irc (irc.anonops.net) #Anonymous
1 minute ago



Very, very strange.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 03:55 AM
Response to Original message
71. Part 2 here
www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x512883
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