Obama's Gallup approval rating amongst liberal Democrats for October 31st-November 6th is 83%.

[LoZoccolo]

[pintobean]

1. I don't believe it. Got a link?

[LoZoccolo]

2. You do not have to believe it.

[dtexdem]

13. Yeah, I'm an agnostic.

;-)

[SidDithers]

4. Heheh...

:spank: :spank:

Sid

[Luminous Animal]

34. Link.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/124922/Presidential-Approval-Center.aspx

I really don't know why LoZoccolo won't post it.

[LoZoccolo]

37. It's funny to see how many people take this "out" that "allows" them not to believe it.

[pintobean]

40. I was just yanking his chain

He's yanking ours by not providing a link.
:evilgrin:

[Frances]

3. I support Obama

even though I don't agree with everything he does.

The thing is: look at the GOP candidates and Obama comes out smelling like a rose.

[SidDithers]

5. K&R...nt

Sid

[badtoworse]

6. Big deal! How's he doing with Independents?

[lamp_shade]

7. +5 recs. Now don't blink.

:hi:

[LoZoccolo]

8. I wonder how many this post recieved just because it is not in secret code.

[pintobean]

9. It's not?

[bowens43]

10. bullshit.

Perhaps 83% of liberal democrats believe he is a better choice then Herman.....but no way they approve of job performance as president.

the man is an empty suit who has accomplished almost nothing.

[Avalux]

15. You must be under the impression that Obama is omnipotent. n/t

[Demonaut]

19. lol.....ye of no faith

right forum?

[TheWraith]

25. Pity for you then that you're wrong. That's exactly what the poll says.

And moreover it's what every poll has continued to say, over, and over, and over. Mostly because your view is wrong.

[rhett o rick]

36. "your view is wrong", My, my doest someone have a "open mind". Anything to tear the party apart. nm

[TheWraith]

45. Am I supposed to humor someone who says the sky is pink?

The poll reflects 83% job approval for Obama among liberal Democrats. The person I was replying to said that it didn't say that at all, which is wrong. I also don't humor people who say that the Earth is 6,000 years old, or that global warming doesn't exist.

[CoffeeCat]

11. I call foul on these Gallup polls...

They don't measure up with reality.

Most of the OWS movement is made up of liberals/Progressives.

Everywhere you turn, it's the Progressives/Liberals who are totally unhappy
with what is happening in DC, and disappointed in Obama.

Yeah, I don't have empirical data or graphs and charts. However, you'd have
to be completely out of touch to buy these polls.

They simply don't jive with reality.

All you have to do is check in with any Progressive/Liberal messageboard, group, gathering
or event--to hear that these numbers are ludicrous.

[JoePhilly]

17. Herman Cain ... "I don't have the facts to back this up ... but ... "

OWS is not an attack on Obama.

[Number23]

32. It astounds me that there are so many who are Determined not to see this bit of truth

OWS is not an attack on Obama.

Why is that so hard for some here to understand?

[TheWraith]

46. Because some people believe that no person on the left can possibly approve of Obama.

I've literally seen it said here on DU that you cannot be a "real" liberal if you approve of Obama. Therefore, anything that is perceived as "good" like OWS has to be anti-Obama. Even when facts don't bear that out.

[CoffeeCat]

58. Our OWS chapter marched to Obama's offices...

...last week in protest of his corporatist policies.

The movement isn't anti-Obama, per se. However, it is against the banksters--who
currently have Obama in their pocket. OWS is also against the corporatism that
Obama has embraced with both arms.

[phleshdef]

22. When every poll shows consistently high support among self professed liberals...

...then thats an indication that your view of what constitutes "reality" doesn't jive with the rest of the country. Just because you don't accept it doesn't make it any less true.

[Bonobo]

12. is a shit statement.

Since the poll is shit.

What is approval?

It all depends who and HOW one asks the questions, Herr Zocco Lollo.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

62. Bonobos fling shit don't they?

[fascisthunter]

14. lol

[kentuck]

16. Is that good or bad??

Almost one in five liberals do not approve of him? If we factor that into 60 million total votes, that could amount to almost 10 million votes! That seems like a lot to me. :shrug:

[JoePhilly]

18. What was it for Clinton?

[kentuck]

21. I don't know....

But Clinton never received 50% of the votes in either of his elections.

[AtomicKitten]

24. 66% of Dems wanted Bill Clinton challenged, 32% want Pres Obama challenged.

[JoePhilly]

29. I knew some one had that info on speed dial!!!

83% support is HUGE.

For comparison, which GOP candidate has 83% support?

None.

50% support ... none.

[AtomicKitten]

41. here's some nifty charts

link: http://www.people-press.org/2011/08/10/democrats-not-eager-for-an-obama-challenger/

[Number23]

42. But what does "approval" mean??! And since fewer people are now calling themselves "Democrats"

(according to polls being posted by people who don't believe polls that show that Obama has strong Dem support) how does this affect Obama's poll numbers???! :crazy: :crazy:

Some of the responses in this thread are nothing short of hilarious.

[Art_from_Ark]

65. 83% support among a small sector is not so huge

We're not talking about "support" among the entire voting public, or even among all voting Democrats, just among people who purportedly call themselves "liberal Democrats". And who knows what the term "liberal Democrats" even entails these days. If you could teletransport a group of Liberal Democrats from the late 1960s to today, they probably wouldn't recognize the party. Even "Rockefeller Republicans" from that time might be to the left of a lot of today's "liberal" Democrats.

[TheWraith]

27. It's pretty much the same as it's been since December 2008, when the number was 88%.

You're assuming that 100% of liberal Democrats ever approved of him.

[Number23]

33. If you have to ask if 83% support on ANYTHING is "good or bad"

well...

[kentuck]

75. Well...

You figure it out....Al Gore won by 500,000 votes nationwide. So, I don't think you have the proper perspective on what a million votes might mean?

[Number23]

93. Which has absolutely nothing to do with having 83% approval/support

Nothing at all.

[woo me with science]

20. Fewer people are calling themselves Democrats:

Gallup: Democratic Affiliation Falls

Gallup is out with a new profile of those Americans who identify with the Democratic Party on Monday, and one number jumps out: the number of people who consider themselves Dems is down to 43 percent from 50 percent in 2008.

http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/updates/1670

[LoZoccolo]

43. That article also says that liberals make up a greater percentage of the Democratic Party now.

[woo me with science]

48. I suspect several things are happening.

If Third Wayers are leaving, that is a good thing, but you can't conclude that only conservative dems are leaving.

I suspect that many liberals are leaving in disgust, while others who previously called themselves moderates are waking up and embracing the "liberal" label.

[Number23]

60. You're going to give yourself a migraine

I suspect that many liberals are leaving in disgust, while others who previously called themselves moderates are waking up and embracing the "liberal" label.

Not only does that comment make absolutely no sense whatsoever, the very document in your link has the answer to your "question."

"Liberals and nonwhites have come to make up a slightly greater percentage of the Democratic base since 2008"

So you can continue contorting yourself into a pretzel trying to deny what's right in front of you, or you can accept that a) the Dem party is more liberal now than it was 3 years ago and b) this more liberal party supports President Obama by an absolutely MASSIVE margin.

[woo me with science]

69. Oh please.

Designation of "liberal" is by self-report.

I have no doubt that more of those polled consider themselves liberal today than four years ago. Living in a country that funnels wealth to the rich and slashes basic programs for the ever-increasing population of poor tends to do that to people.

When there are exactly two choices and both of them suck, of course self-identified Democrats will poll that way. But at the same time, you have a decrease in Democratic affiliation, and people massing in the streets.

Probably you are right, and some Third Way types ARE leaving. Grass is greener and all that. It only makes sense that at least a few of them would find it hard to resist that smorgasbord of Republican candidates with Third Way-friendly policies.

:rofl:

[Number23]

73. I have no idea why you linked to that article since you obviously didn't read it

or maybe you just don't understand what you read.

I have no doubt that more of those polled consider themselves liberal today than four years ago. Living in a country that funnels wealth to the rich and slashes basic programs for the ever-increasing population of poor tends to do that to people.

From the article that YOU LINKED TO, the data says that it was moderates and conservatives and not liberals that are leaving the Dem party. This is what has lead to an increase in liberal numbers. To boil it down further, liberals are NOT LEAVING the party. CONSERVATIVES are.

What was the point of linking to a piece that you obviously didn't read or don't have enough political sophistication to properly understand?

[woo me with science]

74. My dear Number23,

Perhaps you should re-read the article.

You said, "...the data says that it was moderates and conservatives and not liberals that are leaving the Dem party. This is what has lead (sic) to an increase in liberal numbers."

The data do not say that at all. In fact, the article and the original Gallup source make very clear that the poll relied on self-reports obtained from Americans in 2008, and then again in 2011. In other words, you have two completely separate demographic snapshots. Gallup in no way followed those who actually left the party, and thus they have no "data" to say who left or why they did so. All they have is speculation.

And, indeed, the article SPECULATES about one possible reason the numbers might have changed. (Note their careful use of the word, "perhaps"; that was your very first clue!) However, as I have just explained to you in the other post, other reasons are also possible and even likely.

In general, it is a good idea to attempt "political sophistication" regarding polls only after mastering the basics of reading comprehension and poll design.

[Number23]

92. lol With every post, you sound more desperate and uninformed

I get it. You don't believe polls that show Obama with strong liberal support but here you are posting a poll that shows the party growing more liberal while at the same time questioning how those people "self report" or self-identify as liberal.

But if I had to choose between your absurd "analyses" and an article by a polling organization with over 70 years of experience that says FLAT OUT that the party is growing more liberal and that Obama's election seems to have pushed conservative and moderate Dems out of the party, it's really not that hard to determine which "source" I'm going to go with.

[opihimoimoi]

23. The 17% are DINO's???

[MadHound]

26. And what is Obama's support overall?

Oh, yeah, that's right, never mind. No addressing that elephant in the room for you.

[TheWraith]

28. Shooting up rapidly, actually. Up six points in two weeks to 47.

You may not like it, but he's doing better and better.

[AtomicKitten]

35. It was an amazing 12-pt swing (+6 approval, -6 disapproval) last week.

He's doing a great job moving that polling.

---> http://articles.businessinsider.com/2011-11-02/politics/30349157_1_approval-rating-job-approval-numbers-herman-cain

[FarLeftFist]

30. Epic thread. Here we go.

[lamp_shade]

31. Still +1 net recs. That's gotta be a record.

:smile:

[robertpaulsen]

53. Mark it zero!

[robertpaulsen]

54. Mark it zero!

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

63. Must be a lot of unrecs

Freeps or Emo progs?

[LoZoccolo]

83. To be fair, I think that some people do it because of my other posts, or that there's no link.

[Name removed]

38. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[sendero]

39. Don't let the fact that..

.. the number of people who identify themselves as Democrats has dropped precipitously bother you.

Lies, damned lies and then there are statistics.

[LoZoccolo]

44. See my post #43.

[TheWraith]

47. And the people who've left are the indies and conservative Dems, making the party more liberal.

Contrary to the picture that some people would push that supposedly liberals are leaving in droves, the Democratic Party is now more heavily populated by liberals than before.

[bigtree]

52. right

which leaves the question of how we expand our vote . . . would a more liberal agenda really generate enough support to overcome the loss of those middle-roaders? History says no, but, we'll see. The Obama campaign is sure pushing the populist buttons right now. I'd like to see us max out our liberal vote and come out on top, but I just don't know.

[woo me with science]

55. No, that does not necessarily follow.

It is also very possible that Democrats who previously considered themselves moderate or conservative are so horrified by what this administration has been doing that they are now embracing the "liberal" label.

But if the Third Way IS getting the hell out, that is a GOOD thing.

[SomethingFishy]

57. More liberal?

The Democratic party is more liberal? Funny I see quite the opposite. I see a party actually debating on whether seniors and the poor should "share the sacrifice". Cuts to Medicare and Social Security? Cuts to food stamps? LEAP programs? Education? Attacks on Unions? These are hardly the actions of a "liberal" party.

Sorry, not buying it. Voting for it? Yeah, because I have no choice but calling it liberal? No way.

[Number23]

59. You are exactly right. Obama's election seems to have pushed more conservative Dems

from the party. And probably a lot of racist whites as well.

So that makes his 83% approval that much more remarkable.

But you have to tip your hat to the folks who are coming up with everything under the sun to try to deny, dismiss and minimize the president's approval amongst Dems. As I said upthread, the cries of "what EXACTLY does approval mean??!" and "there are now fewer people identifying as Dems" (totally ignorant or ignoring the fact that it was CONSERVATIVE dems that have left the party) have made for some truly comic reading.

Edit: And my new favorite post which says that if fewer Americans are identifying as Democrats, it's because "real" liberals have left in disgust and moderates are now embracing the liberal label. I had to read that idiocy four times just to paraphrase it here, it makes that little sense.

[bigtree]

50. Gallup Finds Democrats “More Liberal, Less White” Than 2008

. . . that could explain the drop in self-identified Dems. Dinos dropped off . . .

PRINCETON, NJ -- In many respects, the demographic profile of Democrats nationwide is similar to what it was in 2008, although Democrats have become somewhat less white and more liberal than the party that nominated Barack Obama as its presidential candidate that year. As a group, Democrats are more likely than average to be women and nonwhite, less likely to be religious or married, much less likely to be conservative, and much more likely to be liberal than the U.S. population as a whole.

These results are based on a special Gallup analysis of the demographic and ideological composition of the U.S. population today (based on Gallup Daily tracking from June-August 2011) versus the start of 2008 presidential election campaign (from January-March). This is a follow-up to Gallup's earlier piece on the composition of the Republican rank-and-file.

For this analysis, the Democratic population is defined as those who either identify as Democrats or who identify as independents but say they lean toward the Democratic Party. Between the start of 2008 and today, the percentage of Americans identifying as Democrats or leaning Democratic has fallen from 50% to 43%. The percentage identifying as Republicans has risen from 37% to 40%, while the percentage of "pure" independents who do not lean toward either party has gone from 12% to 15%. The years 2006-2009 were recent high points in net Democratic affiliation, whereas the current figures showing a close split between Democrats (43%) and Republicans (40%) are more in line with the pattern that was in place between 2001 and 2004.

Key differences between Democrats and U.S. adults nationally, and changes since 2008, include:

1. Perhaps the most significant change in the composition of Democrats between 2008 and today is the two-point increase, from 35% to 37%, in the percentage describing their political views as "liberal." This occurred at a time when the country as a whole became slightly more conservative, thus expanding the political gap between Democrats and the rest of the U.S.

The change coincides with the decline in Democratic affiliation in recent years, and it may be that moderate or conservative Americans were less well-attached to the Democratic Party and were the first to shift their allegiance -- thus leaving a higher concentration of political liberals among those who continue to align with the party.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/150611/Democrats-Liberal-Less-White-2008.aspx

[TheKentuckian]

49. 83% of liberal Democrats approve of traditional Republican positions or are deep in denial

or will approve of anybody with a D next to their name or are grading on a sliding scale dependent on what new levels of batshit the opposition can come up with.

[woo me with science]

56. LOL nt

[rapturedbyrobots]

72. isn't it funny how these 'liberal' democrats

were defending a REPUBLICAN health plan from the 90's as soon as it was called Obama Care?

[LWolf]

51. neo-liberal democrats. nt

[rapturedbyrobots]

71. they're everywhere n/t

[Fumesucker]

61. Argumentum ad populum is a classic logical fallacy from the ancient Greeks..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum

[LoZoccolo]

64. I am not arguing that Obama is good because a lot of people approve of the job he's doing.

[Fumesucker]

66. No, you're arguing that Obama is good because a lot of liberal Democrats approve of him..

It's still a logical fallacy, one of the more often abused ones in fact.

[LoZoccolo]

67. I am not arguing that Obama is good because a lot of liberal Democrats approve of him.

[Fumesucker]

68. You're every bit as convincing as Gil Kerlikowske when he talks about pot..

:eyes:

[LoZoccolo]

76. There is a specific misconception that I am trying to dispel.

[Fumesucker]

77. Then you're failing spectacularly..

No one believes that what you're doing isn't argumentem ad populum.

[LoZoccolo]

78. That's not my problem.

[Fumesucker]

79. Not your problem that you are failing at your stated purpose?

Odd attitude to take..

[LoZoccolo]

80. It's not my problem that people make an assumption that I specifically disclaim.

[Fumesucker]

81. When a large percentage of your audience does so then perhaps your message is ambiguous?

[LoZoccolo]

82. I think you're the only one.

[Fumesucker]

84. Yes, that's why your posts are uniformly on the greatest page.

[LoZoccolo]

85. That sounds like argumentum ad populum.

[Fumesucker]

86. You said I was the only one.. I was providing contrary evidence..

[LoZoccolo]

87. I'm not sure that even my intended point would be popular.

[Fumesucker]

89. Why?

[LoZoccolo]

90. Because people make an effort to stay in denial about it.

[Fumesucker]

91. Would you say that DUers are better or worse informed than the electorate at large?

[LoZoccolo]

94. It's hard to say when you've seen that a lot of them have less than a hundred posts.

[rapturedbyrobots]

70. The Problem

With self-identifying 'political' affiliation is that it is completely circular. If 1) you support Obama and 2) most people consider him to be 'liberal' (who the hell knows what that even means anymore)...then you are also likely to identify as a liberal democrat by association...ergo...liberal democrats support him. See, magic! This is all absolutely meaningless. If you're still buying into the representative democracy, then what matters is NOT what labels people attach to themselves, but what policies they support and who those policies benefit. So, instead of asking people to self-identify, a short survey on POLICY POSITIONS would be much more informative on what types of people are supporting Obama. It could turn out that most people really do align with him policy-wise. But who knows.

[Renew Deal]

88. I really don't want to see these polls every week.

Because it's a sign that campaigns are coming and I'd like to pretend that's not happening. :hide: