I Don't Usually Cotton to Republican Pundits but. . .

[dynasaw]

in this instance David Brooks seems to have hit upon something.

The problem is that over the past 40 years or so we have gone from a culture that reminds people of their own limitations to a culture that encourages people to think highly of themselves. The nation’s founders had a modest but realistic opinion of themselves and of the voters. They erected all sorts of institutional and social restraints to protect Americans from themselves. They admired George Washington because of the way he kept himself in check.

But over the past few decades, people have lost a sense of their own sinfulness. Children are raised amid a chorus of applause. Politics has become less about institutional restraint and more about giving voters whatever they want at that second. Joe DiMaggio didn’t ostentatiously admire his own home runs, but now athletes routinely celebrate themselves as part of the self-branding process.

So, of course, you get narcissists who believe they or members of their party possess direct access to the truth. Of course you get people who prefer monologue to dialogue. Of course you get people who detest politics because it frustrates their ability to get 100 percent of what they want. Of course you get people who gravitate toward the like-minded and loathe their political opponents. They feel no need for balance and correction.

Beneath all the other things that have contributed to polarization and the loss of civility, the most important is this: The roots of modesty have been carved away.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/14/opinion/14brooks.html?src=me&ref=homepage

[Hello_Kitty]

1. I agree with him but the biggest narcissists are not ordinary Americans and politicians

It's the wealthy elite who believe themselves to be more worthy and entitled to everything and under no obligation to sacrifice for the greater good.

[knowbody0]

2. I'm trying to become modest of my modesty

[unblock]

7. i'm the most modest person IN THE ENTIRE UNIVERSE!!!!

:rofl:

[astroBspacedog]

10. No you aren't !

When I was in the third grade i had a dream that I'd accidentally walked to school naked and I'm still blushing.

[RandomKoolzip]

3. A guy with access to pundit power platforms like the NYT and the Sunday talk shows

lecturing us on the virtues of modesty?! That's like Ted Nugent lecturing us on the virtues of veganism.

[MindandSoul]

4. Agreed! It is a good statement. There is only one word that I would replace:

"Sinfulness!"

How about just "arrogance" or "limitations" or "realistic self-esteem."

I don't think this has anything to do with "sin!" Unless all fundamental Christians believe that they have their "special gifts" directly from God!!!!

[AllyCat]

5. I agree with some of it. The idea that voters should get what they want

actually seems reasonable. Not everything they want, but I feel he is implying that we shouldn't get what we want and it worries me that that is exactly what corporations who run the country think too.

[Politicub]

6. Founders founders founders founders founders founders. Let's sort out today

by romanticizing the imperfect men who founded our country. Really?

If the founders thought it or wrote it down, it's okay for all of eternity. They were deities among men.

Our constitution is wonderful, but interpretation must, and has, to evolve with the times.

I believe Brooks is right about people thinking too highly of themselves, but he's tarring Americans with a broad brush. It's not everyone. It was born of a disgraceful movement to discredit the role of government and continues with the narcissistic modern GOP and its tea party offshoot.

It's strange really. They venerate our founding documents, yet despise where these guide posts have gotten us. They are shackled by the chains of time.

[unblock]

8. it's strange but it's consistent. they venerate the founders and the constitution the same way

they venerate god/jesus and the bible.

the glorify the founders/god/jesus and the constitution/bible but they don't try to abide by what they say or even recognize the delicate balance of often conflicting ideals in each. they simply pick and choose whatever is useful, ignoring anything else, to justify their current thinking and trumpet loudly that they got it from an indisputable source.

[Enrique]

11. neocons lecture Americans: be more like the mythical George Washington

and less like Martin Luther King Jr., that troublemaker who made Americans narcissistic.

[Enrique]

9. this is the same old conservative critique

"over the past 40 years or so"...

That would be 1970 "or so." That would be the same bad-old 1960's "or so" that the conservatives are always bemoaning.

Brooks isn't blaming Martin Luther King Jr., he's "just saying..."

[handmade34]

12. don't think so

talks the talk... but. Also, our social attitudes have everything to do with economy and class structure

[snagglepuss]

13. I think it's pure BS. The only people this would apply aren't mentioned namely CEOs

pulling in multi-million dollar salaries, banksters and the very well off. They are the ones without shame. As for politians giving voters what they want that is unadulterated bullshit. Politicans cater to corporations, period.

[DCKit]

14. Nice catch, except I think he was talking about US, not THEM.

Inadvertent truth in projection.

[annabanana]

15. This is why bizarre creatures like Snookie and The Situation can

be famous.

[fishwax]

16. I think Brooks is as full of it there as he usually is

[Exultant Democracy]

17. I don't believe that his anecdotal evidence paints the whole picture.

Conservatives are obsessed with the ideal that man is fallen, flawed and getting worse. They always point out how much better the olden days were when people held onto traditional values.

Unfortunately for them, and for anyone looking for simple answers, reality paints a very different picture. If we take the long view then the modern human is undoubtedly smarter and more moral then his progenitors. Even when we take the short view over the last 50-60 years we still see clear signs of rapid improvement. The world isn't perfect and it never will be, but as MLK said "the arc of history is long but it bends towards justice."

[dynasaw]

18. I Disagree Entirely

with your statement that "the modern human is undoubtedly smarter and more moral then his progenitors. Even when we take the short view over the last 50-60 years we still see clear signs of rapid improvement. " So how do you account for all the stupid conservatives all of us DU' ers are so upset about who run around broadcasting their stupidity. In another thread, Bill Maher pointed out some traits of the founding fathers:

"Ben Franklin studied scientific phenomena like lightning and the aurora borealis, and were he alive today, he could probably explain to Bill O'Reilly why the tides go in and out.

James Madison was fluent in Greek and Latin, and could translate Virgil and Cicero. John Boehner can't translate Fareed Zakaria. And Thomas Jefferson was an astronomer and a physicist who founded the University of Virginia, played the violin, and spoke six languages. " So where is the "improvement" when would be leaders today don't know history, can't speak coherently and subscribe to questionable information.

[Exultant Democracy]

19. The Flynn Effect is pretty well established. Just like the OP your anecdotal evidence isn't

convincing when there is actual scientific evidence that contradicts it. The scientist that study intelligence have found a substantial increase across the board in the average intelligence of each generation when compared to the previous one. (probably for the same reason people are getting taller, better nutrition)

Obviously there have always been polymaths at the high end of the bell curve, but these outliers can't be used as the basis for an argument about the human condition in general.

[affrayer]

20. I Hope You Do Realize That....

You're referring to the pablum the right wing politicians have been selling the country starting with Reagan...