Vatican To Beatify Pope John Paul II

[WillParkinson]

Vatican To Beatify Pope John Paul II

The pope on Friday signed off on the miracle needed to beatify Pope John Paul II, and set May 1 as the date to honor one of the most beloved popes of all times as a model of saintliness for the church. Pope Benedict XVI said in a decree that a French nun's recovery from Parkinson's disease was miraculous, the last step needed for beatification. A second miracle is needed for the Polish-born John Paul to be made a saint. The May 1 ceremony, which Benedict himself will celebrate, is expected to draw hundreds of thousands of pilgrims to Rome — a major morale boost for a church reeling from a wave of violence against Christians and fallout from the clerical sex abuse scandal.

Victims of abuse at the hands of Catholic clergy are denouncing the beatification, noting that thousands of incidents of child molestation were covered up by Catholic authorities during John Paul's reign.

http://joemygod.blogspot.com/2011/01/vatican-to-beatify-pope-john-paul-ii.html

[gratuitous]

1. They're sure rushing this through, aren't they?

As unseemly as the rush to get Louis IX made a saint.

[Lucian]

2. Parkinson's Disease is incurable.

The nun must've been misdiagnosed. Or she lied about having the disease. Or modern medicine should be beautified. But saying prayers healed her Parkinson's is asinine.

[no_hypocrisy]

3. And why didn't he cure himself of Parkinson's Disease while he was at it?

My guess is the Vatican was scrambling to find "a Miracle" and this was the best it could come up with.

[Lucian]

4. Agreed.

Hell, if he "cured" it, why stop at the nun? Why didn't heal Michael J. Fox? Why didn't he cure Billy Graham? Isn't he a Christian and devout follower of God?

That's because this is bullshit.

[truebrit71]

5. +1

...

[Zoeisright]

13. LOL! Exactly.

I'll believe in "miracles" when I see someone regrow a severed limb. Everything else can be faked. And has been, since man started peddling miracle cures.

[Renew Deal]

19. Prove it.

:D

[Lucian]

20. You're not serious, are you?

[Renew Deal]

23. Only half serious.

:evilgrin:

[Motown_Johnny]

27. +1

[Old and In the Way]

6. John Paull II was a very admirable man who had an impact on the politics of Eastaern Europe

But this sure seems like a rush job. Is the Church setting a precedent for quick tracking future deceased Popes to similar sainthood? I wonder if Ratzo is thinking of his own beatification when he exits the mortal coil?

[Gman]

8. No, JPII was so beloved

that I believe he was put on a fast track. He was as good a man as I've ever witnessed in my lifetime. This is very, very rare for the church to do. Remember, this church is very slow to change anything so for them to make this exception with JPII is testimony to the impact he had on the world.

[Goblinmonger]

16. Except for the pedophile coverups

and the promotion of Cardinal Law who did his own coverups.

But, hey, if you're willing to overlook that, sure, probably a great guy.

Well, he made Ratzy his right hand man and appointed Cardinals that would make Ratzy pope, but other than those two things...great guy.

[Lucian]

21. +1

His cover-up of pedophilia in the Catholic church is unforgivable. Why people like him, I don't know.

[Gman]

25. Spare us the hate

thank you very much.

[Goblinmonger]

28. Why?

And why, exactly, is it hate? Is it some how untrue? exaggerated?

[Gman]

32. I'll give you the benefit of a doubt

and believe you don't understand why that is hate. This is hate because it's directed at a specific weakness of the church and of the men that run it. You, much less the rest of DU, completely disregard the good work the church does all over the world helping the poor and fighting for social justice among many other things, or the fact that people get a great deal of joy, comfort and peace, regardless of how irrational it may seem to an unbeliever. If they want to believe, so be it. I know a great many Catholics that are great Democrats and good liberals too. To focus on this specific weakness in a way that denigrates this church and overlooking everything else that is good makes it nothing but hate speech.

[Goblinmonger]

35. I will let you know

that I grew up very conservative Catholic and graduated from a high school seminary. I know about the church at a level that I would guess very few Catholics do. And I know that the Pope is the church. I also know that to say that the pope is a shitbag reflects not one iota on my 3 close friends from high school that are now priests and very close friends and wonderful people that I would give my life for.

To criticize the church for this is warranted. The church did it in a very systematic way. This is not the errant actions of a few people but the actions of the people at the very top. And the RCC is a very hierarchal organization.

[Gman]

36. Surely your 3 close friends are not pedaphiles

as that is actually a very rare condition. So there clearly are wonderful men who are priests. There is a reason your friends are priests and that is THE reason for the Church. Yes, covering up was institutionally wrong and was made possible because of the very old, very human, very rigid, very layered bureaucracy. Those that covered it up were wrong and should prosecuted. But the actions of human men do not reflect on what the Church is about as they have nothing to do with why the Church was first established. There have been lots of wrongs over the last 2000 years. But the message of the Church is what should not be lost in it all, in spite of dirt-bag humans that lied their asses off in confession and got ordained.

[Goblinmonger]

37. Which is why my response

which you replied with "save me the hate" was about JPII and not every priest nor every Catholic.

[BlueMTexpat]

24. IMO, John XXIII was the only Pope in my lifetime anywhere close to sainthood.

But the Church and I have gone our separate ways since then.
I, for one, am much happier.

[Cleita]

26. Yes, and there is some suspicion that the Vatican

bureaucrats helped along his demise because he was too liberal. :tinfoilhat:

[BlueMTexpat]

29. Whatever did happen, it is "interesting" that it is almost always

those who are liberal who are lost very quickly after they rise to positions of power.
Benny XVI will likely live forever. Sigh.

[Ilsa]

31. I'm staying open-minded on this... Can you direct me

To something I could read on this?

[Cleita]

33. Google honey is your best friend. Try newspaper archives

from that time. Unfortunately many of them want you to pay to access their archives so if you are interested, you are on your own with this one. It happened a long time ago so there are no current articles on it. It's like speculation on 9-11. There is a lot a funny stuff but no intrepid reporter wants to go in there and dig up the skeletons. There is a lot of suspicion though.

[UTUSN]

38. Funny, I just Googled this on John XXIII for an e-mail to my sister:

So my question was, Where is John XXIII, has he been “left behind”? Google is wonderful, here are a bunch articles, but so much information that I’m confused: So he is at the “Blessed” step, but now are JP II and Pius XII ALSO at the next to last stage? Somebody below says that Pius is still “a step away from beatification.” So how “close” is “close”? --Oh, now I see another news item saying JP II will be beatified on May 1, 2011. Hmmm, so then Pius is behind, and XXIII and II will be neck and neck?

******************QUOTE***********

Stages of Canonization in the Catholic Church
Servant of God → Venerable → Blessed → Saint


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_John_XXIII
Known affectionately as "Good Pope John" and "the most beloved Pope in history" to many people, on September 3, 2000, John was declared "Blessed" by Pope John Paul II, the penultimate step on the road to sainthood. He was the first pope since Pope Pius X to receive this honor. Following his beatification, his body was moved from its original burial place in the grottoes below St Peter's Basilica to the Altar of St. Jerome and displayed for the veneration of the faithful. At the time, the body was observed to be extremely well-preserved—a condition which the Church ascribes to embalming<11> and the lack of air flow in his sealed triple coffin rather than to a miracle. When John was moved, the original vault above the floor was removed. A new vault was built beneath the ground, and Pope John Paul II was later buried in this vault.


http://www.americancatholic.org/messenger/nov1996/feature1.asp

ALMOST A SAINT: POPE JOHN XXIII (November, 1996)

But now the processes of John XXIII and Pius XII are under way and that for Paul VI is beginning. It seems almost that election to the papacy eventually entails sainthood. Creation of pope-saints leads almost inevitably to invidious comparisons. Why is Pius X, whose purge against modernism created an anti-intellectual climate and many victims, recognized as a saint but not Leo XIII (1878-1903), who with Rerum Novarum established the modern papal tradition of social justice teaching? And why not Benedict XV (1914-1922), who courageously denounced the horror of World War I?

One indication that the cause began under the old dispensation is that two alleged miracles have been thoroughly checked. Under the newer rules only one miracle is required before beatification. A miracle which must take place after beatification is required before canonization.

Father De Rosa reports that the voluminous positio will soon be published. It will then be examined by theological consultants. If they approve, it goes before a board of cardinals and bishops.

As with all sainthood causes, the final decision on Angelo Roncalli, Pope John XXIII, lies with the man who sits in the Chair of Peter. Pope John Paul II could be tempted to proclaim John XXIII a saint for the Great Jubilee of the Year 2000. But history has proven saint-making predictions to be speculative at best.



http://articles.latimes.com/1999/may/01/local/me-32882

Pope John XXIII Closer to Sainthood
May 01, 1999


http://ncronline.org/news/vatican/vatican-moves-john-paul-ii-and-pius-xii-closer-sainthood

Vatican moves John Paul II and Pius XII closer to sainthood
'Two-for-one' strategy unveiled.
Dec. 21, 2009
When you’re going to move a controversial pope along the path to sainthood, bundle him with a more popular pontiff – the PR calculation apparently being that acclaim for the latter may drown out negative reaction to the former.

Call it a “two-for-one” strategy, one that appears especially probable when the controversy concerns Jewish/Catholic relations.

The obvious parallel is to September 2000, when Popes Pius IX and John XXIII were beatified in the same ceremony. Among other things, Pius IX was known for corralling the Jews of Rome back into their ghetto and for the famous case of a Jewish child forcibly removed from his family and raised in the Vatican. John XXIII, on the other hand, was the popular “Good Pope John” of the Second Vatican Council (1962-65). He was known for gestures of outreach to Jews, including removal of a reference to the “perfidious Jews” from the church’s Good Friday liturgy.

The similarity with Saturday’s announcement is striking.

For all of you asking, "what about John XXIII?" I suggest that you sit back, take a deep breath, and look at the facts! He is already beatified! He is ahead of these 2 on the ladder, so to speak! So, he was not "skipped over." In fact, if you understand how time works he came after Pius XII and was beatified way before him--in fact Pius XII is still a step away from beatification.

Pius XII, of course, was the pontiff during the Second World War, whose alleged “silence” on the Holocaust has long been the subject of fierce historical debate. Whether one regards Pius as a hero or a villain, the progress of his cause will produce new tensions in Jewish/Catholic relations – even if the result has seemed a foregone conclusion, since Benedict XVI has repeatedly insisted that Pius XII did everything possible under the dramatic circumstances of the war to save Jews and other victims of the Nazi regime.

**************UNQUOTE************

[virgogal]

7. Sainthood is as meaningless as knighthood.

Symbolic,that's it.

[emilyg]

9. This makes me very happy.

[NightWatcher]

10. It's a miracle dozens of priests stayed out of prison. Does that count

[badtoworse]

12. About as crass a comment as I've seen on DU

[Zoeisright]

15. Really. As crass as the thousands of children who have been permanently

scarred by priest molestation?

Grow up.

[Goblinmonger]

17. You need to get out more.

Do you not think those priests should have gone to jail? Or do you support the cover-up shell game that was played?

[Lucian]

22. It's true though.

[Zoeisright]

14. Good point.

I don't know if it counts or not, but it certainly is remarkable.

[TlalocW]

11. Well, I think it's wrong

He's dead - let him rest in peace and stop all these calls for beatifying him. Going to dig up his corpse or something?

(Someone whispers something)

Oh, Bee-aht-ify. Not Beet-ify.

Never mind.

TlalocW

[nc4bo]

18. All those dead birds and sea creatures should account for something, right?

Sorry for the snark. F the Catholic church.

Signed, former Catholic.

[Ilsa]

30. The French Nun's recovery sounds more like an incorrect diagnosis to me. nt

[Cleita]

34. Also, it would be more convincing if the miracle didn't

happened to a nun and even better if the recipient of the miracle were a non-Catholic.