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RadiationTherapy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-23-11 10:07 AM
Original message
The Fairness Doctrine Debate
Can a media outlet be forced to air both sides of an issue? Can it ever be done in a 'Fair and Balanced' way? Can we have a successful democracy without equal time/access for opposing ideas? How is it enforced and what are the first amendment implications of enforcement? What are your questions on the issue?

I have little information and experience with the details of the Fairness Doctrine, but DU is amazing for merging the historic with the anecdotal and I am interested in any points, views, and points of view.
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AndyTiedye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-23-11 12:09 PM
Response to Original message
1. The Fairness Doctrine Worked
People actually did get to hear both sides. They were much better informed in those days.
Now it's all Repiglickins All the Time.

Yes, we have the Internet, but so do they, and people gravitate to the websites that
reinforce what they already believe.



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RadiationTherapy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-23-11 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Why is it dying with such a whimper?
Does it have a bad reputation?
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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-23-11 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Dying? I thought it was dead and buried at this point
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-23-11 10:58 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Today the FCC finally got rid of it in the books
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-23-11 10:57 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Reagan got rid of it
and Clinton put the nail on it. This is the final nail and hail the fatherland... err homeland. That was the reason for it by the way.
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KharmaTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-24-11 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #1
8. No It Didn't...
Firstly, the "Fairness Doctrine" only applied to News and public affairs programming...mandates that were also eliminated by the FCC in the 80s. It never pertained to the content of talk shows and wouldn't have prevented the right wing sliming of the public airwaves. The problem wasn't fairness it was access when Clinton signed Dereg '96 that turned those airwaves into a corporate plantation.

As the OP notes...the term "fairness" is extremely suggestive and open to many interpretations. The intentions were to give access to other voices as opposed to "fairness".
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-23-11 11:12 PM
Response to Original message
6. There are no first amendment implications, the public owns the airwaves...
And has the right to regulate them however they choose.

My issue with the demise of the fairness doctrine has less to do with right wing radio and more to do with the degradation of our public debate in general.

Under the fairness doctrine, the networks were required to devote a certain amount of time to presenting both sides of issues of public importance. They were required to do this, even if doing so would mean that they would not be as profitable as something else they could be showing during that time.

I think it's important that the networks should be required to present actual news rather than the infotainment crap that we have today. Even if that means that the actual news won't get the ratings of the infotainment crap.

Rush can have his three hours a day to spew hatred and bullshit, as far as I'm concerned. Most Americans work for a living and don't have time to listen to that garbage anyway.
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RadiationTherapy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-24-11 07:22 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. Were there issues when the doctrine was enforced?
How could it be enforced and who was the judge?
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craigmatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-23-11 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
7. The fairness doctorine was for a more civilized age. I think they should bring it back.
At the very least it would expose people who only watch one channel like fox to whole different points of view.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-24-11 08:07 AM
Response to Original message
10. Some call corporate control of information with limited rebuttal
Edited on Wed Aug-24-11 08:08 AM by mmonk
freedom and any attempts to even the playing field as governmental interference in the expression of ideas. All I know is I used to watch the evening news and do not anymore since it has a deliberate slant or omission of critical information for an informed opinion.
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RadiationTherapy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-24-11 09:58 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. I agree with the fundamental notion of defending democracy
against unbridled propaganda, but what are the guidelines and how is it enforced? Notions such as 'intellectual honesty' cannot be easy to 'define'.
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dairydog91 Donating Member (520 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-24-11 03:32 PM
Response to Original message
12. Counterpoint: The Fairness Doctrine is overrated and a bad idea.
Edited on Wed Aug-24-11 03:34 PM by dairydog91
The Fairness Doctrine was/is overrated and and a very dubious idea from a standpoint of free speech. The Doctrine was upheld by SCOTUS in Red Lion, but that decision made clear that the government may only engage in such regulatory activity in certain areas of media activity. The decision did not uphold the idea that the government has a general right to enforce fairness on all forms of media, and just 5 years after that decision, SCOTUS held in Miami Herald v. Tornillo that the state of Florida was Constitutionally prohibited from enforcing a fairness standard on newspapers (Their editorials, to be specific). The main difference between newspapers and radio waves, in the court's logic, was that radio waves are inherently limited and are owned by the public. Other, less limited forms of media are not subject to the same level of control.

I'm befuddled by all the wailing about how Fox should be subject to the Doctrine; their content is shite, but they're a cable/satellite channel which transmits all their content through cables and satellites. Since this medium is not particularly limited (Just add more cables and satellites when you want more channels), it's hard to see SCOTUS allowing Fairness Doctrine regulation of Fox. Now, Rush Limbaugh might be targeted by the doctrine, but he could simply migrate to internet/satellite radio and avoid such regulations.

Moreover, the principle that media should be subjected to "fairness" is, IMO, dubious at best. Whose sense of fairness are we talking about? Are we simply talking about a Red/Blue divide, where case the fairness standard completely ignores a wide variety of third-party opinions? Or, if I state something objectionable on my radio station, should I be obligated to provide free time for the perspectives of a conservative, libertarian, statist, environmentalist, and a constitutional monarchist? "Fairness" implies the midpoint between two opposing sides. What if one side is much closer to the truth than the other, in which case imposing the midpoint is a skew in and of itself?

Furthermore, what if I as a media consumer don't want everything to be "balanced"? Maybe I'm happier with some media sources that essentially parrot back my worldview, some sources that provide extremely dry factual reporting, and some sources that get me angry enough to scream at the TV. In my eyes, there is a "conservatism" (By which I mean "pining for the past") in many people who support this doctrine, a sort of wistful remembering of the good ol' days when there were a couple big broadcast TV stations and some radio stations offering theoretically balanced content. But we, living in the 21st century, have access to sums of news astronomically larger than what was available just a few decades ago. Sitting on my ass in my bedroom, I have access to the official wires of every country that has one, newspapers, government archives, internet radio, blogs from all over the world, and a whole bunch of other media. I don't need the FCC to create its own idea of a balanced news diet when I, as an adult who can read and use a mouse, can create my own custom media diet from scratch.
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RadiationTherapy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-24-11 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Thank you for this reply. It is truly a complex topic.
I appreciate your post as more realistic than the ones that support the doctrine. It seems a pain in the ass to manage.
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-24-11 10:25 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Lots of people in rural areas have no internet or cable/satellite TV
Edited on Wed Aug-24-11 10:25 PM by Hippo_Tron
And they certainly don't sell the New York Times on the street corner there, either.
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dairydog91 Donating Member (520 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-11 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. A couple points.
First off, access to the internet is available in most areas of the country, especially once you factor in dial-up and satellite connections. Dial-up isn't adequate for video, but it can still bring you news in text format. Judging from data, more than 75% of Americans are internet users and that number continues to trend upward (http://www.internetworldstats.com/am/us.htm).

Second, I noticed that a lot of pro-Doctrine posters appeared to be under the impression that it allowed the FCC to descend like a hawk on any partisan media outlet and enforce fairness. The Doctrine, at most, applied to broadcast TV and broadcast radio. Cable TV, such as Fox, is outside the scope of the doctrine. If we were to re-institute the Doctrine as it was applied, then the only area where we'd see major change would be in broadcast radio, where the Doctrine would probably trigger a mass exodus to satellite radio.
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robcon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-11 09:26 AM
Response to Original message
16. The Fairness Doctrine is unAmerican and a unconstitutional
Edited on Thu Aug-25-11 09:28 AM by robcon
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

I would hate it for someone having to go on Rachel Maddow's program to offer 'opposing viewpoints.'

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melm00se Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-11 09:34 AM
Response to Original message
17. The Fairness Doctrine
made (sort of) sense back in the day when the only electronic media outlets were radio stations and a finite # of those and, in most places, 3 TV stations (ABC, NBC and CBS).

today the world is different. The average person has access to, literally, 100's of channels on the TV which include not only packaged news outlets from wide ranging POV (Fox News to CNN to Al jezeera to the BBC and on and on) but also raw sources (C-SPAN 1, 2 and 3).

Also, let us not forget that the internet increases the available sources by at least 1 order of magnitude.

So, as I said in another thread: from a micro-view of the media landscape, there are biased sources but from a macro view there are wide ranging points of view that do what the Fairness Doctrine was designed to do.

So why have a regulation that is now outdated, unnecessary and, if left in place, open for abuse by those with an ideological axe to grind?
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Blue_Tires Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-25-11 09:42 AM
Response to Original message
18. some parts of it could be applied and updated to improve things
I'd love to see the "editorial" disclaimer when these cable news shows merge their personal opinion in reporting, along with more transparency with these faux 'grasroots' and 'nonpartisan' groups...If they are getting major airtime, their biases need to be out in the open, too

The rise of the teabaggers is due mostly to the gullibility of media and voters who think they are "independent" just because they say so...
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