The ignorance, bigotry and hatred of far too many Americans, might destroy us all

[Cyrano]

The Republican Party and their all-powerful corporate overlords are busy figuring out who should “win” the 2012 presidential election.

Oh, I’m sorry. Did you think that your vote mattered? If you haven’t figured it out yet, it’s all about greed, power and, most importantly, control. And you can bet that any election close enough to steal will be stolen by Republican operatives. (We can only win when the votes are so incredibly overwhelming that a stolen election would end in revolt.)

The preferred candidate of the powers that be is Mitt Romney because he fits the Hollywood casting image of what a president should look like. It doesn’t matter whether or not he’s an “empty suit.” The guy just LOOKS presidential.

But their problem is winning the nomination for Mitt. And those who vote in Republican primaries are far, far to the right of Attila the Hun and the corporate “owners” of the Republican Party.

It’s more than just possible that Bachmann or Perry could end up as the Republican nominee. The powers that be seem to have lost control of their own Tea Party/Know-Nothing creation.

Mitt’s big problem is that he’s a Mormon and there are countless Christian-fundie-wingnuts who would never vote for a Mormon. They consider The Church of the Later Day Saints (Mormons) to be some kind of demented cult.

So if Romney can’t win the Republican nomination, and Bachmann, Perry, or someone exactly like them ends up winning it, could they win the general election? I think one of them could. And here’s why.

As incredible as it seems, Bachmann won the Iowa straw poll. That, in and of itself, should tell us a lot about the present state of mind of far too many people. But for some inexplicable reason, they just can’t see the danger to themselves, and all the rest of the civilized world, of a Bachmann presidency. (Nor can they see the dangers of a Perry presidency, or the presidency of any other knuckle-dragging throw back.)

But here’s the worst part. President Obama has lost the confidence of too many of his supporters. We wanted/needed another FDR, but it didn’t happen. The reality is that any and all of the things that Obama accomplished in the face of overwhelming odds, will seem puny against what the Republicans will throw at him. Not to mention the disillusionment/resentment/disgust of Obama by far too many liberals/progressives.

Let me be as clear as possible. The Republican Party and their owners are the enemy of everything decent and humane. They are nothing new in history. They are thugs, criminals and robber barons, driven by greed and out to own it all. And the ignorance, bigotry and hatred they are selling to the masses to accomplish their ends, might end up destroying us all.

[RKP5637]

1. I don't have much faith that my vote/interests count much in the "new" America. I look

at wall street, the banksters, over-the-top corporations, congress, SCOTUS, all of it, and who in their right mind can say this is working well, your vote/country and all will be well. Truthfully, anymore, I have no idea where the US is headed.

Now, that doesn't mean I'm not voting, all that, but what it does mean is that I have little faith in fair elections in the US and I think the corruption in this county is growing by leaps and bounds. I also think religion is getting dragged far too much into US politics, and I also think religion has moved to a very dark place.

I don't know what the future holds, but it sure is very hard to be very optimistic in the "new" US. I also am extremely disappointed in Obama. Sadly, I think 2012 is going to be a major wakeup call to the democratic party, yet again.

Your last paragraph really sums it all up quite well IMO:

"Let me be as clear as possible. The Republican Party and their owners are the enemy of everything decent and humane. They are nothing new in history. They are thugs, criminals and robber barons, driven by greed and out to own it all. And the ignorance, bigotry and hatred they are selling to the masses to accomplish their ends, might end up destroying us all."

[Cyrano]

5. Yep, RKP5637, I read you.

But here's what really gets me. I don't have a clue as to what to do about it or how to change it.

Most of the history of the world seems to indicate that the bad guys win most of the time. And for the life of me, I can't figure out how to make a differnce.

Then again, I guess I'm living in some delusion that I can change the momentum of history and obviously, that's not going to happen.

Yet, I haven't totally lost hope in the concept that the momentum of history can be altered into a more sane and humane path. Perhaps I'm a fool for believing this. Yet, although I am an agnostic, I can't help but believe that there are some mathematical constants and not-yet understood scientific principles that may drive us into the direction of an orderly universe.

[duhneece]

2. It was hard realizing that many of my neighbors could have been KKK

My community is really kind and caring at times, so it was hard for me to realize over the past 10 years, that many are racists, ignorant, easily manipulated....they remind me of house slaves, supporting their 'masters' and looking down on field slaves.

[kelly1mm]

3. That's the blessing and the curse of democracy. nt

[RZM]

4. Either would find the presidency a tough row to hoe

The idea that they could sail their agendas through Congress just isn't plausible. Probably they'd find themselves entangled in the same kind of base problems Obama has now, if not even more, because either would have to make any number of unfulfillable promises to get a strong enough bloc of Tea Party people behind them to win the nomination in the first place.

Once they were done, you'd see a Democrat win back the White House (and probably strong Dem gains in the midterms before that). This would be politics as usual, not the end of the world.

Bachmann has only a slim chance at the nomination and virtually no chance at becoming president. Perry's odds are a little better, but he has quite an uphill battle ahead of him.

[Cyrano]

6. I believed the same about Bush Jr. that you believe about Bachmann and Perry

Nonetheless ...

[RZM]

7. Bush was in office for eight years, yet here we are

He pursued quite an array of unsuccessful policies, but the system didn't come close to collapsing. Before the end of his presidency his party was totally shellacked in the 2006 midterms and he all but guaranteed he would be succeeded by a Democrat. It wasn't a great time, but it wasn't the end of the world by any stretch of the imagination.

If Perry or Bachmann became president, they would have their time and then their time would be over and the country would move on. They wouldn't pursue policies I like very much, but that's how it works. That's not to say it isn't important to fight hard for people and policies that will make the country a better place, but it's also important not to lose the larger perspective. Pinning the success or failure of the entire system on one person or even one (or two) election cycle(s) doesn't make sense to me. If anything, I think it's harmful because it encourages the impression that some sort of serious political calamity is more likely than it really is and thus undermines basic confidence in the foundations of the system, which an important aspect of its durability.

That's my main beef with the argument that all is lost if so and so gains power. Some things WOULD be lost (as they were in the last decade), but certainly not forever.

[Cyrano]

8. Yep, "Bush was in office for eight years, yet here we are."

We're broke, we're jobless, we're suffering, we're owned and controlled by uber wealthy barbarians, we're being led by a president whose only concern seems to be reelection, and we've lost our "faith" in capitalism -- and perhaps even our belief in a self-governing democracy.

And yet, you seem to believe that a Bachmann/Perry/Whoever-knuckle-dragging presidency wouldn't amount to the final destruction of America?

Bush took us to the very edge of the cliff. And the Tea Baggers have pushed us over. A wingnut/tea-bagger/lunatic presidency would drop a boulder on us to make sure we could never rise again.

I don't know what planet you're living on, but I sure wish that our current reality is as you view it.

[RZM]

9. LOL. Well lucky for me I get to view reality this way :)

I guess we just don't see eye to eye on this.

Our system is a human one and it's very flawed, but preaching gloom and doom and predicting the death of Democracy is not how I would go about encouraging folks to work for a brighter future. The more you present the image of an impossible future, the more people are inclined to say 'fuck it,' which is exactly what we don't need. I prefer keeping it positive. But we all have our own styles, I guess.

It's pretty difficult to construct a democracy from nothing overnight. But what's mentioned less often is that it's also quite difficult to destroy a strong democracy overnight too (one that is built upon a long history of smooth transitions of power and the rule of law). A lot of Democracies died in the last century, but very few had the strong underpinnings that the US has today (I'm discounting the cases where democracy was done in by foreign aggression or foreign-backed aggression, since we aren't really vulnerable to that).

A generation from now some of today's issues will be forgotten and other issues that we haven't even thought about yet will be important. But I have little doubt that our system will still be functioning as it is now, warts and all.

[Cyrano]

11. Sorry, RZM. I didn't mean to dis your views

Unfortunately, the political/social hell we're currently in is due to the election of the amiable imbecile, Ronald Reagan. And that makes 31 years that this country has been on a downhill slide.

I really wish I could find something positive in our current situation. But between our national politicians, most of our media, and too many states suffering under Republican governors and legislatures, I find little to sustain any confidence that our democracy will "bounce back."

Much of our democracy has literally been stolen from us by the Republican Party with the help of blue dog Democrats. But whatever happened and how it happened is history. We are where we are and it may be a very long time, if ever, that we see a return of some form of democracy to America.

History has always run in cycles, but if an American Renaissance comes about, I don't think that any of us will be here to see it. But this time around, we have the added dilemma of global warming. My ecological knowledge is lacking, however, I do understand that many of us may not survive any natural disasters that occur, or see any Renaissance that might come to be.

Having said all this brings me back to my OP. I really don't think this country could survive or bounce back from another four or eight years of barbaric rule. It's always been easier to destroy than to build. And assuming nature doesn't wipe us out first, it could be hundreds of years before we once again become a "civilized" society.

[txlibdem]

10. Disillusionment, resentment, disgust

of Obama from not only liberals/progressives but also independents and "regular" Democrats.

All that ire is not reserved for Obama alone, however. Congress (with so few exceptions you can count them on one hand) is also equally to blame. Incompetent, corrupted, cowering, appeasing, and corporate Democrats in congress have enabled evil to triumph as well.