We have lost the wars in Aghanistan and Iraq

[Harmony Blue]

So, why are we still in both countries? And why as Americans are we afraid of admitting defeat?

[w8liftinglady]

1. I think they got exact;ly what they wanted out of Iraq and afghanistan

The MIC won, big time.

..yeah,we lost a few troops and goodwill. They won they almighty dollar!

[Raksha]

6. I think you're absolutely right. That's what the MIC is all about:

the world's most ghastly wealth redistribution machine.

[bemildred]

2. Everybody is still getting paid, what's the problem? nt

[LeftinOH]

4. +1000. That's the correct answer.

[backscatter712]

3. If we find a way to depart from Iraq and Afghanistan, we can frame it differently.

For Iraq: We verified there are no functional WMDs in Iraq, we changed the regime, MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!

For Afghanistan: We destroyed Al Qaeda, Osama Bin Laden is dead, MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!!!

I say we declare victory and go home!

[GSLevel9]

11. My thoughts exactly... +1000 nt

[The Wizard]

5. Just anotrher Defense Department sink hole

where our money disappears.

[dtexdem]

7. Did that years ago. And the proof is:

we are still there.

[Gregorian]

8. They're not wars. They're invasions.

I just had to point that out. If we don't get that part correct, then the rest doesn't follow properly.

And yes, we need to get the hell out of the Middle East.

[rms013]

9. Invasion and occupation is not war

Public Relations premise vs. reality. Democracy, Bin Laden, WMD's this is propaganda. The reason we are still occupying two soverign nations is simple...oil and gas.
The oil reserves in Iraq and the Trans Afghan Natural Gas pipeline. simple
The military is the taxpayer paid for division of US multinational corporations. Their presence in Afghanistan is to protect the construction and operation of the TransAfghan Natural Gas Pipeline (prior to 2001 this was a project of Unocal). The purpose of this pipeline is to transport natural gas to India for transport to China.
In Iraq it is the oil fields and reserves our military is protecting.
Everything else is fluff and pr.

[bemildred]

10. Very true.

This is "theatrical micro-militarism", is what it is.

[Sinistrous]

12. True. The main objectives are both unattainable:

They aren't getting all the oil in Iraq and probably won't get the pipeline through Afghanistan.

[raouldukelives]

13. Perpetual war is great for profits

As well as Wall St. Just think how poorly 401k's would be performing without it? I see many happy people fat off the wealth from death in my neighborhood. You can afford that little sports car you always wanted and all it took was a million ended lives.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

14. Losing wars is something the "World's Mightiest (and most expensive) Military is getting good at.

Perhaps chasing mosquitoes with gold plated sledgehammers isn't such a great tactic after all.

[Arugula Latte]

15. Oh, U.S. corporations won handily.

And that was the point, now, wasn't it?

[GoneOffShore]

16. We lost on the day we invaded Afghanistan.

[gratuitous]

17. Blasphemer!

Our Great God of Redemptive Violence does not, can not fail. If there has been a failure anywhere, it's in us, and our insufficient faith and application of violence to the problem. The Answer is to wage more war, inflict more violence, and our deliverance will be assured! In the name of the Missile, the Bomb and the Holy Rifle, amen.

Oh, and we need a few more heroes to go to Iraq and Afghanistan, too. They will be laudably remembered and showered with praise by the Transmitters of the Faith on the teevee and radio and in the newspapers. Hallelujah.

[AntiFascist]

18. Why are both parties afraid to discuss...

significantly cutting war spending? Instead we are being asked to sacrifice everything else.

[Terry in Austin]

19. "War" doesn't quite frame it

The US is in the empire business, and this is what empires do -- they project power beyond their national borders.

Empires use their military to police their spheres of influence, which in the US case, includes Iraq and Afghanistan. Harry Truman's term "police action," which he applied to the Korean conflict, applies here very well -- probably more than the term "war."

War implies an event with a beginning, a middle and an end -- an end that comes with a "defeat" or a "victory." Police action is different, it's a process -- just as civil police never expect to "win" once and for all against crime, our imperial policing is ongoing and endless.

So the lamentable thing here, IMO, is not so much that the US is engaging in failed wars, but that the US is caught up in the folly of empire.

[awoke_in_2003]

20. Afghanistan, graveyard of empires...

we lost before we had one boot on the ground.