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Stargazer99 Donating Member (943 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 03:57 PM
Original message
What is your excuse America
I'm 70 years old, work two jobs at $10 per hr (no benes) to pay the living expenses. I have diabetes and cardiovascular problems along with fighting depression almost every week. $100 is taken from my monthly $803.00 and $100 is taken from Mr's 940 social security. Rent is $890.00 and we live with broken windows,rotting tile,rotting deck. The city of Puyallup charges us $100 per month for its services, garbage $80 and electricity varies from $100 to $400 in the winter. You brilliant conservative jerks are perfectly happy with cutting heating assistance. Mr is ill with heart problems and freezes in the winter. I do not know how I'm going to pay for the heat/electricity this winter. Now why in the hell do you think I would become depressed? Must be a chemical imbalance right?

Last year the mattress sprung a spring. We slept on it until it was totally unbearable. I bought a used matteress and had a neighbor deliver it to the house. Guess what, it had bed bugs! there is not enough money to have someone come and haul it away nor is there enough money to buy a new mattress that would be sure not to have bed bugs. That is only one reason I detest this country.

Mr. crawled under houses doing plumbing work most of his life at low wages with no retirement. Why didn't we save for retirement you say? Just how clueless are you. After paying the rent,utilities, car repairs, food, doctor bills you REALLY think there is some left over for the luxury of saving for retirement? Much less doctor and dentist bills! Just how clueless can you get?

Two years ago my daughter died from a condition that is preventable from death by proper medical attention. Do you have any idea how I resent having to work with and pay rent/utilites to those who have medical care? What makes you more valuable than her life? Money? Oh I see you had money or health insurance for which you got a tax deduction. I get a tax deduction for nothing and yes I so pay taxes. My land lord gets the tax deduction while I pay for it.

I kindest thing the poor can do for its children is not to have any. That way their soul and spirit would not be damaged. You anti abortionist are damned liars, you think life is so precious, you're not kidding the poor. The well to do can go to Canada or Europe and get an abortion, but not the poor. I think it is because you asshats need cannon fodder for your wars. We know the well to do and powerful do not put their children on the front line to die, but you put our children in the front lines to die protecting your damned corporations.

Do I sound a little angry? Geeze I wonder why. I'm sick of this country, especially when I see the medical needs of developed Europe do not let people needlessly die. doctors and dentist will not let the government train others in these skills in our government to serve the low income people because they might not get every nickel out of those needing their services.

Don't give me this crap about emergency rooms and state dental care. After the emergency room gets through taking you to a collection agency and the state is willing to pull your teeth but not repair the damage done by years of dental damage. Wonderful choices!

Capitalism works? For who? just like slavery worked fine except for the slaves. The poor are one of the most hated groups in this country. Pledge of Allegiance? Forget it, its your country not mine, I just live here. Wait until more jobs are lost. I guess that is what its going to take before we start looking like England and of course we know only the "criminally minded" riot? Just how stupid, compassionless and ignorant can a nation get?
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. Wow. Brilliant - and heartbreaking.
You should e-mail this to Obama, it MAY be one of the letters he reads and he needs a nudge.

:hug:
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DJ13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 04:16 PM
Response to Original message
2. A big K&R
You speak for many here.
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Waiting For Everyman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 04:21 PM
Response to Original message
3. The predator-state has taken out 50% of our population
but the other 50% only votes to keep its 401(k)s earning unrealistic profits. It's a machine, and it will chew up everyone going up the ladder. This has been going on for decades, but nobody cared. It's worked its way up to the secure "middle class" now and will soon get to the upper-middle. Expect the howls of indignation any time now. (This can't be happening to meeeeeee!)

The poor today used to be middle class or used to at least reasonably "get by" too. Then the Rethugs started chipping away at the New Deal, and our way of life has been crumbling worse than our infrastructure - but it's somebody else's life collapsing, so so what. A bill for that attitude is coming due. The water is rising people, it's a simple fact.

I'm living it too, Stargazer99. :hug:
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woo me with science Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:11 AM
Response to Reply #3
28. "The Predator State."
Aptly named.
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patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 04:46 PM
Response to Original message
4. K&R
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handmade34 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
5. justified anger...
yes, I understand and I'm angry too... for you and me and so many others. I fully expect I also will be working 2 jobs (if there are any) when I'm 70 and it ain't right and it's no way to function as a society...

there is no justifiable excuse for America to function like this...
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Hydra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 04:56 PM
Response to Original message
6. Tell it like it is, Stargazer
I'm in my 30's, and your reality is mine. If I make it as long as you did, I suspect I'll be in the same place.

The dirty secret of Slavery was what you pointed out: keeping someone as a wage slave is cheaper and more efficient than actual slavery. You even get the added bonus of the slaves fighting each other in order to be their slave.

K&R for a refreshing breath of truth when everyone screaming at the top of their lungs has been comfortable with our suffering for decades.
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liberal N proud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
7. K&R
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dickthegrouch Donating Member (838 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 06:28 PM
Response to Original message
8. I don't understand how anyone can save for retirement
It's a mathematical impossibility for most of the work force. The poverty level is set way too low, taxes are imposed at an insanely low level of income. And to make matters worse, the idle rich who earn most of their money off interest on their trust savings, pay even less in tax than those who earn it the hard way. I am profoundly respectful of my father who managed on one salary to put 4 kids through college and take us on vacation every year. I still don't know how he did achieved it. Sadly he's passed and I'll never be able to ask.
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susanwy Donating Member (461 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #8
36. bingo
CNN the other day had some talking head who said we needed to save AN EXTRA $200,000 - $250,000 to cover medial and living costs in our retirement that would not be covered with Medicare and SS cuts. It isn't just politicians that are out of touch...jez. I do ok and I save, but I'll never be able to save that amount EXTRA....

Susan
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #36
50. $200,000 saved over 50 working years is $4,000 saved per year.
On an average income of $38,000 per year over those years, you have got to be joking.

Maybe if you stay single and live with your parents all your life. But if you have your own apartment, drive a car, get married, have a couple of kids, need health insurance -- no way can you save that money.

And if you are now ready to retire after working 50 years, you've probably had a few years in which you couldn't work or maybe couldn't even get a job, and your average earnings are well below $38,000 per year.

Back in the 1960s, $13,000 per year was a very good income.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #8
40. My dad did the same thing as a mechanic for the State of NY
Edited on Mon Aug-15-11 10:04 AM by Javaman
He did it because he was part of a Union.

Back then, he had cost of living raises on top of his regular raise. He had a pension. He had full health benefits as part of his Union. He had full health benefits in retirement because of his Union.

NAFTA and the normalization of trade with china back in 2000 is what is killing this nation. Until we get rid of that POS NAFTA and reimpose tariffs on imports, we are fucked.

Plain and simple. The repukes and many Dems have made the race to the bottom an art form.

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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #40
51. You are so right, Javaman.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #8
67. I've always been able to save for retirement
and the most I ever made was $24,120 in 2005. In fact, I semi-retired in 2006 before I even turned 45. I guess it helps to be childless and cheap, but it seems to me that I waste and give away lots of money too. I have been a Kiwanian since 2002 and that costs me at least $400 a year. So there's $3,600 I could have put into my retirement but sorta gave away instead. There are other things too. I have three dogs (which is crazy). I spent about $900 when my young Blake was dying and then the next year spent about $500 when his mother died. I have spent at least $2,000 on pop over the last ten years.

What I do not understand is why anybody would pay $890 a month in rent. To me, that is the problem right there. Not that they don't make enough money or have enough money, but that the rent is too damned high. That's almost $11,000 a year in rent. Over ten years that is over $105,000!!! My last three houses I bought were all only $35,000.
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ohheckyeah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #67
77. Do you have no concept of the difference in living costs in different areas?
Median gross rent in Puyallup, WA in 2009: $939.

Hiawatha, Kansas Median gross rent in 2009: $442.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #77
94. nah, I guess that would be beyond me
:eyes:

Sounds to me like a very good reason to not live in Puyallup, especially if one has retirement income.

But I prefer a small town anyway.
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ohheckyeah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #94
95. Most people pick where they live
based on many factors, not just median rent.

:eyes:
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #95
98. I always choose my residence based on affordability
It does not make sense to me to move into an expensive area and then complain "I cannot afford to live".

But maybe there is nothing cheaper in all of Tacoma.
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ohheckyeah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #98
99. I live near family because I have elderly
parents. Affordability wasn't a factor compared to that.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:43 PM
Response to Reply #67
82. The median rent price for a two bedroom in my neighborhood is $1,200.00
It's $1,500.00 in Denver (my neighbors just came back from an apartment hunt there-and that's a SMALL two bedroom). Just what kind of home does one get-in what kind of neighborhood-for 35k?
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 05:04 PM
Response to Reply #82
97. my first building was on the main street
Actually the one next door would have been better. For $39,000 it had an apartment upstairs. I ended up living in the basement of mine.

My next building was on the mainstreet of a small village (about 1,500). For $35,000 I got three apartments and a laundromat. Of course, that did end up being a financial disaster as I sold it about six years later for about $8,000 ($9,000 less commission). That might not have been so bad if I had been able to find a job. For three years I worked as a factory temp and was sick of it. Got a job in Missouri and moved south, losing lots of money in the process, but sort of becoming better off. In 2000, I made $16,153 as a temp working about 2,200 hours a year. In 2009, I made $14,482 working about 1,200 hours including 11 paid holidays, two weeks of vacation and perhaps five days of paid sick leave. This year though, I seem to be on pace to make a mere $11,400.

Oh, and now I have health insurance too, which has covered about $24,000 in medical bills.

My house was built in 1887, and it is one block from the library, across the street from a funeral home, with a church in the back yard, a business on the two corners and a couple more churchs and the Carnegie Arts center nearby. I'd say it's a pretty good neighborhood even if it is mostly renters.
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susanwy Donating Member (461 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #67
107. You do understand also....
that people have to go where the jobs are? Small towns are inexpensive to live in because there are few jobs. Many have to migrate to the city to find a job and with that the cost of living goes up.

My brother-in-law was childless (until 50) and cheap (still is) and he saved a ton an is not retired, but he is a tea bagger son-of-a-bitch. I'm glad you've been able to live frugally and save and that you are still a compassionate person.

I know so many who's retirement funds have been cut in half or wiped out by wall street...and I get tired of the meme that Americans don't invest in savings. Most who can afford to do and many like you live frugally on modest incomes and save. What sucks is we get gouged with interest rates on loans and credit cards, but we get less than 5% on safe savings accounts like money markets and CD's.

Susan

:toast:
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Juche Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 07:53 PM
Response to Original message
9. It is a shame
Edited on Sun Aug-14-11 07:54 PM by Juche
But I don't know what to do. Too many people enjoy this 'meritocracy' because they aren't aware or don't care that it is an aristocracy, not a meritocracy.

It isn't getting better, and I don't think it will. Even now that 51%+ of the country is feeling the trauma of living in a plutocracy, it really doesn't change how our country is run.

I wonder what happens next. I still think we are somewhat like Iran in the early 90s. After years of abuse and mistreatment, Iranians tried to change their fate via politics. So they voted in reformers in by the busload. When they all proved impotent, they just buried their frustration until it exploded into daily protests. Right now the US is kindof doing the same thing, throwing itself into politics looking for a solution. But just like in Iran, the politicians are handcuffed and bribed by higher forces. In Iran it was the mullahs, in the US it is the plutocrats. Maybe a better analogy is what happened in Europe early in the 20th century, a growth of both right and left wing movements.

But sadly in the US so many people who want reform want reform that comes from abusing and depriving their neighbors. But not themselves. Their social security and medicare aren't welfare. Only other people's programs are entitlements. Will that ever change? I don't know. It is a shame this is what we've turned into.
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tpsbmam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 08:37 PM
Response to Original message
10. Such a heartfelt & brilliant rant!
I think more and more people are waking up to this reality and it's my hunch that the US will soon explode like other countries have. If the new budget makes lots of cuts to programs people desperately need and fails to raise taxes on the wealthy & corporations, I think all hell will break loose. Good. It needs to happen!

A hearty K&R!

Hugs to you and Mr. Stargazer :grouphug: I think there are lots of people here in the same or similar boats.





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SalviaBlue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 08:53 PM
Response to Original message
11. K&R
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larwdem Donating Member (203 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 09:56 PM
Response to Original message
12. K&R
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
13. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Shagbark Hickory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 10:19 PM
Response to Original message
14. $100 a month by the city? And that doesn't include trash pickup?
What on earth is that for? That's insanely expensive.
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Stargazer99 Donating Member (943 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-14-11 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. providing water and sewer services
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KT2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 02:44 AM
Response to Original message
16. Well said
please send this to someone at the Seattle Times. Pick someone liberal (I have lost touch with who that might be) Send it to Laurie Matsukawa or Dennis Bounds at KING 5

I can't even watch political shows ON TV anymore. Psychopaths are regarded now as having a side in the debate. They are winning.
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Mosaic Donating Member (851 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 07:48 AM
Response to Original message
17. Touching and real, thanks for posting
Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

The Gilded Age http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilded_age

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Joe Fields Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:13 AM
Response to Original message
18. I'm 55, and find myself in a similar situation and mindset.
I will probably die on the job from a heat attack, working for just over minimum wage, that is, if I don't have my job jerked out from under me and end up living under some unoccupied bridge.
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BiggJawn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #18
27. Me too.
Things aren't bad yet, but my health is not going to let me work forever.
I'm one of those "Overpaid, Underworked, Lazy" public employees that the Teabaggers would dearly love to see living on the street so they can save 1/974th of one CENT on their taxes...
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MedicalAdmin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #18
88. Joe, by the time that comes (about 2 years I figure)...
There won't be any unoccupied bridges.
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Joe Fields Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:16 AM
Response to Original message
19. dupe
Edited on Mon Aug-15-11 08:17 AM by Joe Fields
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piratefish08 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:27 AM
Response to Original message
20. this is fucking heartbreaking. the neediest in our country need an advocate in the WH.
I am DONE with this status quo, better than the alternative, why do you love President Bachmann bullshit.......

We can get fucked slow and easy by the Left or hard and fast by the Right.


We need true change, NOT the fucking Hope-y kind..........


we are a sick, sick society....
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:45 AM
Response to Reply #20
23. Right now, the neediest in the country DO NOT have an advocate in the White House, you are CORRECT.
We NEED someone who wants, like FDR did, to DO SOMETHING to help those who are suffering.

I'm so sick and tired of this shit.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #23
31. Right now the neediest have no representation save a handful
in Congress.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #23
43. Right there with you..
sadly, I think anyone hoping to be an advocate for the poor in this nation have the sinking feeling of waking up one day with a horses head in their bed.

Anyone pointing out our nations massive failings to the people, on the national stage, will probably end up dead.

I can't help but thing of MLK and Robert Kennedy.
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #43
46. Maybe I'm totally insane, because I don't give a sh*t. I tell anyone what I think.
And yes, I realize how F evil the mega-rich, corporations and their lackeys are.
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:34 AM
Response to Original message
21. With your permission, may I please post this elsewhere?
It sums up what is wrong with America.
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:38 AM
Response to Original message
22. And by the way, I agree 100%. Capitalism does NOT work for those who aren't mega-rich
The end result of capitalism is the mega-wealthy living off the rest.
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Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #22
53. As my 2010 signature said,
"Anyone worth billions never earned that wealth themselves. Someone else earned it for them."
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #53
58. EXACTLY RIGHT! nt
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whathehell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:46 AM
Response to Original message
24. Your anger and disgust are totally justified -- This is all so wrong !!
Edited on Mon Aug-15-11 08:46 AM by whathehell
My husband and I aren't your age yet, but we're close to

retirement and we've vowed that if we find ourselves

in a situation like yours, we're moving to Vermont where they

have just enacted Single Payer Health Care.


I am SO sorry for the loss of your daughter.:hug:
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:47 AM
Response to Original message
25. Maybe for the time being we need a solution, some city-style communes or something...
the mega-rich sons of bitches who have redistributed the wealth of this country from us to themselves, are going to continue doing this.

Meantime, to survive we MUST do something.

Does anyone have any kind of commune-style solution for the interim, until we get a Democratic president that WANTS to DO SOMETHING to help the suffering?

'Cause right now NOTHING IS BEING DONE.
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Bragi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #25
30. Two books that are relevant and worth reading
The Op is very powerful. Thanks for your thoughts.

On what to do now, both of the books listed below begin from different starting points, but end up talking about the need for community-level action and organization to protect people from the corporate greedsters.

The first is an assessment of what the sixties generation can do now that we are in our sixties. It's written by the author of the now-classic book: "Making of a Counter-culture."

The Making of an Elder Culture: Reflections on the Future of America's Most Audacious Generation
http://www.amazon.com/Making-Elder-Culture-Reflections-Generation/dp/0865716617

This second book (below) proceeds from an environmental viewpoint to make a similar case about the need for self-protection through local action:

Eaarth: Making a Life on a Tough New Planet
http://www.amazon.com/Eaarth-Making-Life-Tough-Planet/dp/0312541198/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1313417286&sr=1-1

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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:41 AM
Response to Reply #30
35. Thank you. nt
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cyberpj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #30
41. I understand your book recs but spekaing for myself, I'M TIRED! Where's today's US. youth outrage?
I'm really not seeing it.
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Bragi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #41
47. You have a right to be tired
Edited on Mon Aug-15-11 10:24 AM by Bragi
If you are tired, then you are excused from having to do anything. I mean that seriously. I am a believer that people wear out and that dignified retirement is a human right.

As for "youth outrage" I have many reasons that explain to me why they are so complacent. The political system they are asked to participate in is demonstrably rigged, the information channels that are supposed to inform them are corrupted, their schools are now instruments to harness them with a stultifying consumerist ideology and political paralysis-inducing debt, the economy they are supposed to enter is designed to give them lifelong insecurity and create greater inequality, their social isolation from each other and their communities is near total (with a lot of help from corporatist-promoted social media), etc. etc.

So I don't have trouble understanding why there is no apparent youth outrage in America.

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cyberpj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #47
105. Thanks. I meant to include the fact that I was involved in the late 60's and stayed involved
through Watergate and while I may have been absent while working and raising my own kids I got back into the fray in a huge way during all of Bush Jrs years and during Obama's campaigning.

I think if Obama had come through for the people he promised to come through for I might have been able to stay energized but after trying to defend him and finally accepting that he's been a huge disappointment and a blatant symbol of just how wrong it's all gone I had to admit I'm just too tired to do it anymore.

You're right about the increased amount of covering up, lying and brain-washing that's been foisted on our kids. And the stultifying consumerist ideology you refer to has most of them very well inducted into 'greed is good' attitude. Unfortunately I fear that means a situation more like London has just experienced may well be in our own future in place of any peaceful and non-violent resistance movements taken on by the masses this time.

Yep. I'm tired. AND I'm getting too old for this crap.

Sigh.............................
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MedicalAdmin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #41
89. To answer your question...
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cyberpj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #89
106. SO sad. But true. n/t.
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Dragonfli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 02:33 PM
Response to Reply #25
74. It has been done succesfully and still exists
The Gaskins started this up in the sixties and it has flourished, if I did not have a serious illness and was well enough to start over I would start there.
For more information:
http://www.thefarm.org/

I have spoken to Stephen and Inna May many times over the years, they are real people, also Inna May is a well known mid-wife.

The farm community does more than isolate itself with better values than the heartless larger community we live in, they reach out and actively help the suffering of others outside of their community, They are well known for that as well.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:52 AM
Response to Original message
26. Kicked and recommended!
Great post!
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woo me with science Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:11 AM
Response to Original message
29. K&R You speak for many. nt
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Tuesday Afternoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:18 AM
Response to Original message
32. thank you for this. k&r
bravo. :applause:
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Lugnut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:28 AM
Response to Original message
33. A big K&R! n/t
:kick:
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greytdemocrat Donating Member (614 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:34 AM
Response to Original message
34. Terrible story!!
I can't believe how bad it is.
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:45 AM
Response to Original message
37. k&r
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crazyjoe Donating Member (921 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:47 AM
Response to Original message
38. Sorry for you, but I'm not going to hate my country.
At least you have a job, and a place to live.
Try looking at the bright side, there are people all over the world who would love to be in your position.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:58 AM
Response to Reply #38
39. Really?
:eyes:
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 10:10 AM
Response to Reply #38
44. Must be nice to be you...
wait till you are 70. See how you feel then.
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Bragi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #38
45. There is no "bright side"
Edited on Mon Aug-15-11 10:27 AM by Bragi
Your comments about a 70-year-old having a fine time because they have a roof and a job are pathetic. About the only people who still believe that the whole world looks to the U.S with envy are right-wing Americans. Yes, there are still immigrants who come to the U.S from nations in turmoil abroad, but polls show that few people abroad actually would like to live in the U.S.

I'm NOT saying YOU are right wing, only that you are expressing a right wing view. I think your comments are insensitive and stupid. If you are under the age of 16, then all is forgiven, but you should school yourself a bit on reality in America. If you are an adult, then shame on you.
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MedicalAdmin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:57 PM
Response to Reply #45
92. The trend has reversed itself.
The number one destination for latin american immigrants is not longer the US but Brazil and has been since about 2003 (CIA factbook). That's right - a 2nd world country with rampant street violence is a more choice destination...
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crazyjoe Donating Member (921 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #45
100. right wing? because I don't hate my country? The OP is obviously
bitter and unhappy, and most on this tread just eat it right up! "Great Post" ! "Brilliant"!! Please....
Oh, and i wasn't aware that not hating your country and blaming it because you don't have everything you want was a right wing view.
Anyway, I ain't buying it, she is eligible for medicare, she has 2 jobs at $10 an hour, and she and the Mr collect social security, sounds to me like she's doing fine.
Why so pissed, because she hasn't been provided a nice condo in florida? Ya, America sucks!!
Whatever....
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BiggJawn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #38
48. (splutter)
Words fail me.
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LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #38
49. I imagine that for many individuals
"there are people all over the world who would love to be in your position..."

I imagine that for many individuals, rationalizing how bad it isn't is effectively the same as justifying how bad it is...
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Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #38
54. A U.S. slave master, ca. 1850: "You slaves have it SO much better than your cousins back in Africa."
:eyes:
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krabigirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 11:40 AM
Response to Reply #38
56. ......
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Arugula Latte Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #38
59. This country could and should be so much better.
It had incredible potential, but it is being squandered. Why? The upper two percent have everyone by the shorthairs.
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codjh9 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #38
70. I don't 'hate' my country, BUT...
For the past 30 years, I've thought that this country is like your 16-year-old son who scores super-high on achievement tests, yet is making B-minuses and C-pluses, is doing some drugs with his friends, and basically doesn't give a crap, or at least not much. Another way to put it is this: the gap between what we are today, and what we could and should be, is big and getting bigger. And I don't need to start listing all the reasons why those of us on here think this has happened ...
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MedicalAdmin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #38
90. Name one. n/t
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TomClash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:55 PM
Original message
Are you fuckin' kidding me?
"Try looking at the bright side, there are people all over the world who would love to be in your position."
Except few of them happen to live in her town or state or country.

The American Dream. You have to be asleep to believe it.

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bengalherder Donating Member (718 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
42. K&R n/t
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mckara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 11:22 AM
Response to Original message
52. Neoliberal Economics are Destroying Capitalism and Hurting Billions of People
We live in a sick, misguided economic system that is callously destroying the livelihood and lives of people around the world as oligarchs flood our political systems with money corrupting governmental decision-making while disregarding the Public Interest. We must reform our political system and protect our most vulnerable friends and citizens. Your voice must be joined by the masses to return common decency to our society.
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krabigirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 11:40 AM
Response to Original message
55. :( K&R. What is wrong with our country????
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codjh9 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
57. Augh
Even only skimming your post (sorry, I have little free time today), I am appalled and can empathize. It fits in with what I was just thinking yesterday - a-holes like Rick Perry and others can say that we need to 'get rid of' Social Security, Medicare, etc. because THEY are rich, but can't seem to grasp the very, very simple fact that *everyone is not rich*. Unbelievable. I worked with a dickhead in Dallas who had sold his house for a mega-profit (yes, this was several years ago), plus inherited some from his parents, so therefore he thought SS should be abolished. That's like having a big plate of food sitting in front of you and instantly dismissing anyone anywhere who's hungry. Hello?!?!
Sorry, but one more point that fits: I read 'The European Dream', by Jeremy Rifkin, several years ago, and the general premise of the book - but he wasn't presenting Europeans OR Americans as all this or all that, only *generally speaking* - was that Europeans tend to care more about the greater good, and Americans tend to be more self-centered. May we add 'particularly the Right'? Or how about 'almost exclusively the Right'. 'I got mine' is their bullshit mantra.
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JNelson6563 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
60. Lots of us out here.
I sure wish I could give you a hug.

The best I can do is send hugs and encouragement and let you know YOU ARE NOT ALONE.

Julie
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Citizen Worker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
61. Well said Stargazer. There is no excuse at all why this happens in the "richest country the world
has ever seen." But we have to spend our wealth on wars of empire.
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alp227 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
62. your hometown shouldn't sound like "pull y'all up" but rather
Edited on Mon Aug-15-11 12:24 PM by alp227
"pull yourself up by your own bootstraps"
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DaveJ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
63. K&R
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blkmusclmachine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
64. +1
:rant:
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DaveJ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
65. The rent struck me
In addition to the health care issue, it is appalling to have to pay rent at age 70. If an average of 890/mo has been paid for 45 years that is like $480K paid to housing, so how is it one still does not own their residence? Half a million dollars just given to someone else. I said in my last post, renting should be illegal, or at least supplemented with some kind of legislated equity fund for renters.
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RyanPsych Donating Member (354 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:44 PM
Response to Original message
66. America lied to you
We've all heard the promise of the "American Dream" People like you show that it is just another lie we've been taught to believe.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #66
85. "The thing about the American Dream is that you have to be asleep to believe it"
-George Carlin
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yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
68. Republicans want us to start looking like Dickens' England.
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bluethruandthru Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
69. It used to be that people would read something like this and
think "Well, that's too bad, but it's not me". Now, I think more and more people realize that this is exactly what's happening to their neighbors, family and soon..themselves.
We need to wake up as a country and stop voting against ourselves. Our worship of the rich has gotten out of control.
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Lunabelle Donating Member (344 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 01:18 PM
Response to Original message
71. Capitalism works for those at the top.
It is just one huge pyramid scheme.
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emilyg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 01:26 PM
Response to Original message
72. Heartbreaking.
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tilsammans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 01:38 PM
Response to Original message
73. K & R
Your scenario is being played out all over the country, unfortunately. Heartbreaking.
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unionworks Donating Member (967 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:13 PM
Response to Original message
75. The ranks
of the disenfranchised are swelling rapidly. Sorry to hear of your loss, wish I had some encouraging words.
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MedicalAdmin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:15 PM
Response to Original message
76. I think the poor should have lots of kids and send all of them to the army.
And then when those kids are grown up and trained in military tactics and have the keys to the weapon lockers, then the poor can bring justice to this country.

I am tired of those who rob you with the point of the pen getting off scott free while the rest of us get bent over. I feel for ya and I stand with you, for what that is worth.

As for Cameron, arrogant is as arrogant does.
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ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:28 PM
Response to Original message
78. Well put and may the Gods bless you.
Edited on Mon Aug-15-11 03:34 PM by ooglymoogly
Redux the Joads. And may the gods help us all..... as if that is any succor. We are officially an oppressed people and fascism has taken strong root to keep us oppressed.
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russspeakeasy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:37 PM
Response to Original message
79. K&R....Cormac McCarthy wrote your story...and it is a dark and
scary story....good luck stargazer..
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ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #79
93. And among others, so did Steinbeck. Yet we never learn.
History is repeating itself.
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Uncle Joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:41 PM
Response to Original message
80. Kicked and recommended.
Thanks for sharing, Stargazer99.
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ashleyforachange Donating Member (91 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:42 PM
Response to Original message
81. I feel the same way....
I am no where near your age(I am 22) but I feel the same way. I am currently looking for a second job because at the end of every payday I have no money. (I get paid around 370 every two weeks.) I want to go back to school but cannot afford to. I need to get a car but cannot afford it.

It pains me to see anyone over the age of 60 working. Our country to be taking care the needy not corperations. I have been preparing myself because when this corruption bubble finally burst and the needy/poor/angry rise up, I will be ready.
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totodeinhere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:44 PM
Response to Original message
83. The Koch bothers don't care about you or anyone else who is not rich.
Welcome to the new world order. The poor suffer while the rich get richer.
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SoapBox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:45 PM
Response to Original message
84. k & r
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:47 PM
Response to Original message
86. I am so sorry. And I relate
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DemReadingDU Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:51 PM
Response to Original message
87. +++
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BigD_95 Donating Member (728 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 03:55 PM
Response to Original message
91. Something about this story doesnt make sense
If your 70 you get medicare so there is your Ins. ????

If your working 2 jobs at $10 plus your bring home SS $803 & $940 you can afford a mattress.

Also you must have internet to post this and a computer. You can afford that but not a mattress?


Dont get me wrong things are seriously screwed up but Im not buying this post.
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BiggJawn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #91
96. Oh, yes, he has access to a computer, so he's RICH...
Ever hear of using the computer down at the public library?
I have. Been there. Done that.
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DaveJ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 06:39 PM
Response to Reply #91
101. I totally believe this post
This scenario seems typical. I'm sure a few things were left out like (10 hr/week) jobs and ($500 for a decent) mattress and (comprehensive) medical care. I was able to fill in those blanks without assistance. It is typical to have stuff but the stuff is low quality and diluted it is next to nothing.
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anarch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:15 PM
Response to Reply #91
104. Fuuuuuuuuuuu....
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fishbulb703 Donating Member (492 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #91
108. I think the rent ~900, plus all util and energy is crazy high...
Edited on Mon Aug-15-11 09:54 PM by fishbulb703
where does this person live, a brownstone in nyc?

I get rent on a really nice loft with a view and free garbage, plus util and internet for ~750 in a major college town (UF). I couldn't pay for it w/o the help of my guy, of course, but between us both we can pay for netflix and beer/weed when we want, too.

Something is off.

on edit: i may be underestimating the burden of a mortgage... if that is the case i can see the problem.
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krhines Donating Member (5 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:01 PM
Response to Original message
102. Great post
Your last paragraph sums up how I feel about whats happening. I will not pledge allegiance to the current state of this country. As a country the working class and the poor better start fighting back before everything is taken.
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anarch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-15-11 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
103. just...fucking A. You and a vast number of us all, in the same boat. But hey, you're "lucky"
b/c you have a job. Two jobs...you're doubly blessed. What a fucking crock of shit! Our "society" is fucked.
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