It's Sad So Many Are Heavily Invested In Seeing Obama As A Sellout >

[KittyWampus]

a stupid weak coward who is incapable of strategic maneuvering against an intransigent and ruthless opposition.

It's sad so many are so wedded to their prejudice.

[Gamow]

1. Yes, Obama is a strong unwavering liberal who has fought the machine, instead of becoming a cog

... where is that sarcasm emoticon?

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[woo me with science]

70. He could put Medicare and Social Security on the table and some people would still defend him!

Oh wait...That hyperbole doesn't work anymore, does it?

[NightWatcher]

2. he put SS and Medicare spending cuts on the table. What if the pukes had taken it?

he would not be able to withdraw the offer.

He put $3 of cuts on the poor for every $1 of tax increase on the wealthy. That's downright unacceptable. He should be glad that Boner walked out

[KittyWampus]

7. #1. You have no idea what he "put on the table". All you ever heard were rumors. #2. Republicans

refuse to raise taxes.

[kentuck]

39. Then the only sin is failure to communicate?

...to the people, just as he did this evening?

There were a lot of rumors, I agree.

[woo me with science]

71. ROFL!

Good grief.

[Angry Dragon]

75. Then is there any reason these talks should be behind closed doors

Let the sunshine in

[ThomWV]

79. Did you not listen to his speech? He said, within the first 2 minutes, that he had put them on

He said quite clearly that he had put 650 Billion of cuts in Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid on the table. What on earth makes you think he didn't say it? Did you not listen to him when he opened his mouth and spoke?

[Doctor_J]

87. then why doesn't he refuse to cut benefits for needy & old folks?

[leeroysphitz]

55. Lord knows I am. n/t

[Fumesucker]

3. And there are those who are invested in seeing Obama as a Machiavellian 11 D chess player..

An equally prejudiced view, IMO.

[SwampG8r]

60. and equally unlikely

[a kennedy]

4. Not me, love the POTUS......

talk about the bully pulpit..... GOBAMA, GOBAMA, GOBAMA. :applause: :patriot:

[Creideiki]

52. And his sexy, sexy abs!

[markpkessinger]

5. I don't see him as a "stupid weak coward..."

I see him as intentionally serving the interests of his Wall Street paymasters.

[KittyWampus]

8. Or a sellout. Despite his progress moving us slowly to the Left.

[inna]

38. "Despite his progress moving us slowly to the Left." - OMFG.

jaw-drop


Ahem, massive, massive disconnect there, dude.

[SwampG8r]

61. ......... omfg is right

[Raine]

64. Delussional to put it mildly.

:crazy:

[Raine]

63. Heh

:spray: funniest thing I've heard in ages. :rofl: unfortunately the reality is sad because he is just the opposite. :-(

[woo me with science]

67. ...

:wow:

[Angry Dragon]

76. Left of what??

Examples??

Facts??

[gateley]

15. It's that viewpoint that I disagree most strongly with. Just my

take, but you'll not convince me otherwise. I get mad at him for a myriad of reasons, but I NEVER think he's helping Wall Street further their greedy agenda. Like the Republicans.

[KittyWampus]

18. And yet, you still disagree with Obama from time to time. Am I right? It's possible

to disagree and get pissed without outright defaming the man.

[gateley]

30. Oh yeah, I disagree with him a LOT, but I don't think he's kowtowing to

Wall Street. I honestly don't understand why he does what he does sometimes (but then I'm not the one making the decisions), but again, I don't think it's because he has the same agenda as the Republicans, which is screw the masses, we want money.

[woo me with science]

57. Yup. nt

[originalpckelly]

6. Really, I think when he accidentally signed the tax cuts for the rich into law...

he showed himself for who he is.

"Look in the sky, it's universal healthcare. NO! It's a public option. No, it's mandatory private insurance. Romneycare, the Republican proposal from the '90s."

In 2004 he received 107 corporate PAC donations. In 2008 he implied that these kinds of donations tainted campaigns, so he wouldn't take them. So, I guess that means his campaign was tainted by them in 2004? So he went to D.C. and became less corrupt?

[KittyWampus]

11. Health Care Reform is a HUGE step forward towards Single Payer. Just because we didn't get there

in one step doesn't make it any less a step forward.

And he no longer takes PAC donations. Good for him. But that doesn't stop the liars saying X corporation donated X amount.

[originalpckelly]

13. Yeah, but he did.

Why?

That's my point. He said it taints campaigns, so did it taint his 2004 campaign?

And I like how you miss the tax cuts.

[robinlynne]

17. I read this week that one third of his current donations are from banks.

[KittyWampus]

19. That would be, if true, from employees at banks. Just like a third of teachers might donate.

Or a third of fishermen. Or a third of Greenpeace.

[robinlynne]

43. Did you miss Citizens vs United?

[originalpckelly]

20. You get what you pay for.

Too bad we're too poor to really buy a candidate. I wonder where all of our money went?

Ooooh yeah...banksters.

[Fumesucker]

22. I disagree..

Now that the insurance companies have mandated private customers that's where reform is going to stop, the pressure from the companies to go no further is going to be immense and they'll have a never ending Niagara of mandated money to buy all the politicians they need.

[SwampG8r]

62. yup

[sendero]

47. No..

... it is not. Now you are just making stuff up, which is in essence the gist of your OP. The affordable care act has zero to do with single payer, not anything at all.

[woo me with science]

72. Bullshit. The for-profit system has been entrenched. Now they are moving on to destroy Medicare.

[Doctor_J]

81. Health Insurance REform was a HUGE step away from Single Payer

seriously, Kitty, you've gone completely nuts

[liberalmuse]

9. This appears to be true.

But you will likely be ripped to pieces by those same people in the comments. After all, these same ones are used to ripping good, honorable people to shreds on a daily basis without sound facts, which are optional. They just need some left wing fanatic to throw them another daily 'I hate Obama' bone and they're on it.

[DainBramaged]

12. I disagree, but still luv ya.

I think he put too much on the table KNOWING they would refuse to eat dinner.


I hate my future being gambled with.


:loveya:

[KittyWampus]

16. Happy to bicker with you. I just today read you feed feral cats.

:)

[Kahuna]

21. Buck up! Be brave! This is war. Total war.

:patriot:

[robinlynne]

14. Its really sad that he is a sellout.

[RetroLounge]

23. Irony Impairment Syndrome

:rofl:

RL

[rury]

24. Absolutely...

The first African-American president is being held to an unrealistically high standard.

[L0oniX]

25. Has Obama been saying that SS and Medicare cuts are off the table?

If he did I sure as hell didn't see or hear that.

[xchrom]

26. He is a sell out - too many in the democratic party are -

But he's got the wheel.

[rbnyc]

27. I'm only going to speak for myself.

I still have a kind of PTSD after the health care fiasco. I don't have confidence. I feel that he allowed people in a weaker position than he to set the terms of the debate. I feel that we could have ended up with a better deal if he had been less conciliatory. I also don't see Guantanamo closed or troops home from Afghanistan. I know he can't just wave a magic wand and he has to work within a system that is pretty much totally corrupt. But when I hear that our social safety net is part of the debt ceiling negotiations, I don't have confidence.

I like what he said in his press conference today. I usually like what he says. But I don't see policies improving.

I think most folks here who have been vocal about protecting social security and medicare aren't actually invested in Obama's failure. I think they are just not full of trust and not willing to wait to see how it all shakes out before exclaiming what is important to them.

[hay rick]

28. Either some are "Heavily Invested" or others...

are deep in denial.

Cleaning up your characterizations:
I don't think he's stupid. In his own sphere he's brilliant. Unfortunately, I don't think that sphere includes the economy. In economic policy I think he readily buys into supply side fantasies.

"Weak" and "coward" are contemptuous words and I wouldn't use either to describe the President. I do think he is risk-averse. He needs to be willing to get into a fight on principle, even if he expects to lose.

[readmoreoften]

It's sad he's so heavily invested in being one.

And that you're so heavily invested in defending him against all rationality.

[StarsInHerHair]

29. unrec

[Edweird]

31. I don't see him that way at all. He's fighting hard for RW policy. That's actually much worse.

[rbnyc]

32. Net recommendation: 0 votes (Your vote: -1)

It's not sexist when we criticize women and it's not racist when we criticize people of color. Why do you jump to prejudice? If I have any prejudice it's that I tend to believe that old joke, "How can you tell when a politician is lying?"

I know I already posted once in this thread. But I couldn't let that sit.

[cali]

33. lol. invested? Not at all, I've come to the conclusion that Obama is weak

very reluctantly. And it is funny to see YOU lecturing anyone about being wedded to their prejudices. YOU are the invested one. You countenance absolutely NO criticism of anything Obama says or does, no matter how mild said criticism is.

Sad, really.

[WinkyDink]

34. Who spoke his words to USA Today, if not him?

[Luminous Animal]

37. You first have to frighten the crap out of poor old folks before you lead them to the promised land.

[frylock]

35. right. it's his critics that have an emotional investment..

fucking unreal.

[demmiblue]

36. Unrec. n/t

[Safetykitten]

40. If I was invested in him as a sellout as you say, I would have a credit default swap.

[Marr]

41. I think he's a master of political maneuvering. In fact, you know why I think he was angry today?

I think today was supposed to be the big unveiling of the 'grand bargain', which would essentially be a massive cave-in to the right, accompanied by a repeal of DADT to divert a bit of criticism from the left. That would've left the next week to handle the votes, and the whole thing would be done.

But the Republicans didn't go along for whatever reason, and screwed the whole thing up.

I still think Obama will get his "bargain", personally-- even if he has to postpone it for a month or two. But he missed his perfect launch window which they've been lining up since the "Deficit Commission" was set up, and that had to be frustrating.

[StarburstClock]

42. Unrec. You should pity yourself for blind partisanship.

Issues matter, petty prejudices are a waste of time.

[Creideiki]

44. Flypaper!

[JTFrog]

45. Fuck em.

After all they are trying to fuck us by handing the keys back to the repukes. They'll either come to their senses or render themselves irrelevant. :shrug:

[bluestate10]

51. Exactly. nt

[Stinky The Clown]

46. Why do you think that is?

[SidDithers]

48. K&R..nt

Sid

[Fearless]

49. Not everything is about race. This is one of those times.

But I can't expect your prejudicial views of people to change, so I'll leave it at that.

[grahamhgreen]

50. Wedded to reality, not prejudice.

[TheKentuckian]

53. Who the hell donates their hard to come by money, time, and votes to

someone they desire to see as a sellout.

President Obama is seen as such because he leaves little choice but to believe one's lying eyes.

This is a far from good place to be. You might see for yourself one day.

What are these prejudices folks are invested in? Sounds like a heavy charge to toss out.

[loyalsister]

54. I wonder how many harsh critics supported him in the primary?

Maybe had low expectations from the start and are delighted to see them validated. It can be rewarding to find some kind of confirmation for having been "right" from the start.
The other preconceptions come in having mistaken expectations. The sense of betrayal leads to extreme reactions.

I think many people are invested in being "right" about Obama after having made a decision based on an assessment of the health reform bill.

[frustrated_lefty]

56. My fiancee and I had ear-to-ear grins election night.

We stayed up well into the wee hours sharing relief that the Bush era was finally over and hope for the future. We were thrilled at the notion we would finally have a president who could form a complete sentence, one who wasn't an embarrassment. We expected difficult times ahead, but felt confident in the knowledge that our national leadership would now be moving the country in a direction which was ultimately better.

There is now a sense of betrayal. It isn't over any one thing, but is rather something which has grown over time. Because of the choices the president has made, the fights he has chosen to fight and those he has chosen to ignore, be it the health care debate, increasing military action, a bailout for Wallstreet with barely a nod at regulation, the extension of the Bush tax cuts, or his piss poor effort to promote job creation, I no longer trust this president to make the right decision. I don't trust republicans to make the right decision either. But, I do think at times, if the country is going to hell for a decade or more, maybe we're better off if they get the blame for it.

[Raine]

66. My feelings ... EXACTLY. nt

[loyalsister]

73. I understand being disappointed

I certainly have my own, however I knew I would be because he said so.
He talked about these things in the Audacity of Hope. He also identified his primary goal as one to restore rule of law and the traditions of American democracy. Idealistically and with a more friendly congress details in policy would have matched my ideals better. Also more authoritarian governance may have made a difference as well. But, that would be * all over again. He listens to congress and the results suck. He admitted that as a possibility in his book. Especially with a sharply divided congress. He praised the three branch government and divided functions of legislative executive and judicial branch.
The filibuster abuses and other abuses of procedure that the republicans have perpetrated have made it much harder for him. But I respect that he has been sticking to his guns with restoration as a goal.
I have complaints about messaging and choices, but I feel like he is operating as advertised and is doing his best with extreme opposition.

[Bobbie Jo]

58. Two words.

Confirmation Bias.

[Odin2005]

86. I was an almost rabid Obama supporter from the very begining, then came the Healthcare crap.

I feel betrayed.

[Name removed]

59. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Safetykitten]

65. No he is not really a sellout. He is apparently a very bad President overall. Our last

Democratic President probably for a very, very long time.

[cherokeeprogressive]

68. Dog Whistle. This is another thread calling DU'ers RACISTS.

Prejudice?

[woo me with science]

69. Yeah, it's all personal.

We know. :eyes:

[Blue_In_AK]

74. It's sad so many are so heavily invested

in seeing Obama as the answer to all our problems that they refuse to acknowledge his right-leaning tendencies.

[MadHound]

77. It is sad so many people are invested in seeing Obama as perfect,

A god come down to Earth, whose every action, no matter how odeous if performed by a 'Pug, is considered a zephyr of lilac and roses when performed by Obama.

It is sad so many are wedded to their blind hero worship.

[ScreamingMeemie]

82. oops... wrong spot

[Liberal_in_LA]

78. k&r

[JoePhilly]

80. He's rolling a boulder up a hill.

With all of the GOP pushing it backwards, and a portion of the left hitting him with a stick for not going faster, or for not taking a different path.

And God forbid that the boulder, at any time, move sideways, or even slide backwards some.

The screams are deafening.

[Doctor_J]

83. You forgot the part about how we

don't like him because he's black.

[ScreamingMeemie]

84. I am only invested in my children.

President Obama is not. The only thing I was "invested" in when it comes to our football team...er Democratic politicians was seeing them act like Democrats.

[Odin2005]

85. I'm not "invested" in anything. I WAS invested in Obama being a great Progressive president...

...then he stabbed his base in the back.

He is either a coward, a naive fool who trusts establishment gasbags, or is a Corporatist tool himself.

[we can do it]

88. I Am Sick To My Stomach Watching the Man Who Promised Change

sell out those who need it most. Sickening. Disgusting. Beyond defence.

[Bluenorthwest]

89. I love the DU community's reaction to this tripe.

A great thread.

[rucky]

90. Well this was a productive discussion.

[oldlib]

91. I hope that you are right.

I was concerned, earlier, that Obama had sold the left out. I am willing to give him the time to correct my earlier impression and to not give the GOOP, the concessions, that we perceived at that time.

[hairyHans]

92. Americans need courage to Rally and Rant with Rage!

Why do Americans not insist(RALLY, RANT & RAGE) that the
first cuts to ANY taxpayer-supported wages/benefits are those
of ALL the politicians... President, congressmen,senators,
upper political civil servants!
If this were to happens you would have NO problem coming up
with PRAGMATIC not rhetorical solutions.
WHY do AMERICANS NOT JOIN TOGETHER EN MASSE AND INSIST
" POLITICIANS FIRST!" .
Don't forget: they put themselves first on EVERYTHING ELSE:
Best benefits, best expense accounts, best health care, best
working environment .... all at taxpayers' expense.`

Will you allow them, by dithering, to further reduce your
common American's well-being?

[Raine]

93. Yeah sure

just dismiss real concerns in two ridiculous sentances. :puke: Way to have an intellectual discourse. :sarcasm: