I am really bothered by our national obsession with moral failings, but our easy acceptance of . . .

[Stinky The Clown]

. . . . criminal and near-criminal activity that has thousands, hundreds of thousands, even millions of victims.

The news that's heating up these days is the tale of John Edwards.

Yesterday it was Arnold and the maid.

Newt and his series of dalliances and denials.

Jesse Jackson.

Eliot Spitzer

Kennedy

Eisenhower

ETC.




As a nation, it seems we go looking, and looking *hard*, to find this sort of shit. Meanwhile, someone fucked with the mortgage system and lots of people today are essentially ruined as a result. Yet the gangsters who did this are about to embark on a this year's "season" in the Hamptons. War is a racket and the racketeers keep on keeping on, with virtually no oversight. Yet there we go, creating reason to build more war devices. In the middle of it all, people die to keep the racket alive.

But stray and errant penises get our national attention.

Stray and errant penises have brought down governments. Google "Profumo" to read about one such event from half a century ago.




And yet, real thugs, thugs who break kneecaps (more figuratively than actually), continue their activities unabated and unmolested.





I do not give a fat fuck about who is fucking (in the sexual sense) who.

[msongs]

1. cheat on your wife = bad, murder women and kids with drones = patriotic nt

[Capitalocracy]

62. oh, but those are terrorists!!1!

Or "possibly terrorist-adjacent", which is also a crime punishable by death without trial.

[ejpoeta]

2. i agree. who cares who had an affair. that is a personal matter between that person and their

spouse. if they covered it up using campaign funds that matters, but does it deserve all the time they are giving it? yet when are the prosecutions coming for the crimes in the bank bs and the mortgage liar loans (besides of course the homeowners). what about the lenders who falsified those documents! their bosses who pushed them to lie on the loans!! CEOs should be in jail. but no one except that one homeowner is in jail.

[InvisibleTouch]

3. I think the problem is a matter of scale.

People can easily picture a single person having done something that they themselves would find objectionable, something they could relate to in their own lives.

But when a whole corporation or industry creates vast ruin, there isn't a single target to blame, at least not one that becomes a sustained focus for the public. Which one person is to blame for the ruin of the Gulf of Mexico, for instance? The president of BP? Or all the company officers? Or the whole industry? Or the political insiders who granted them drilling permits and skimped on safety requirements? Where does one focus one's anger?

I can hold an entire industry in contempt (but what about the regular people who work for those industries, who are just trying to get by and make a living?), but for many it's easier to feel outrage against one person who has done something clearly definable, on a small enough scale that they could imagine it happening to them.

For the monsters that do the real damage, there is safety in numbers and they disappear into anonymity.

[Stinky The Clown]

5. That makes sense . . . . but . . . . .

. . . . how many federal resources are engaged in going after John Edwards (as but one example). If it is even one DoJ guy and his assistant, that is two people too many, as far as I'm concerned. I would far more prefer those two people track down some mortgage manipulator.

[InvisibleTouch]

46. I agree that it's stupid, wasteful, and a completely skewed set of priorities.

Just trying to make sense of *why* the public's reaction is as it is, not that I in any way agree with it. I don't care who's sleeping with whom either, and I think it's artificially blown out of proportion. There's some hard-wired evolutionary explanations as to why so many people seem to care, just as there's hard-wired evolutionary programming for mating outside of the pair-bond - but it has been artificially hyped into a much bigger deal than it should be, IMO. Especially in the face of criminal acts that do in fact ruin countless lives in one fell swoop.

[AuntPatsy]

4. I could not recommend this thread enough

[obxhead]

6. Money.

We're happy to destroy a reputation in this country over even a minor sexual act, but if someone is raking in bushels of money with a real crime it must either be covered up or "made legal" by ignoring it completely.

[Bluenorthwest]

13. When a man like Edwards declares that his marriage is

sanctified and that other groups should not have the right to marry because they are not worthy of his moral standards, that is not a 'minor sexual act' that is an ongoing aggressive attack on a minority group designed to distract the public from his own actions.
Edwards went on and on about how he was against GLBT equality because of his Baptist values and his traditional view of marriage for - get this- 'one man and one woman'. As if he can not even count to two! One woman! Please! This slander monger claimed he held tight to strict Biblical rules about marriage, and all of his supporters nodded along. When the truth came out, John Edwards, Elizabeth Edwards, and their supporters all failed to step up and make amends for the attacks on gay people made by this adulterer in the name of his fidelity. He did not apologize for calling himself all good things while trashing Gay people, for claiming to honor a marriage that he was clearly sick of and not honoring at all.
This man attacked and slandered gay people for the sake of the lie he was telling. He never made any effort to undo the damage.
Such liars are what they are.

[Stinky The Clown]

16. Your off-point blatherings are bordering on spam.

Please stop posing in this thread. If you have something to say, please start your own thread and say it. The kind of posting you are doing in MY thread is what gets things off track.

[Bluenorthwest]

21. Not your board, and I am not off topic at all.

You just do not like my point of view. Arnold and the maid, again, he vetoed equal rights more than once chattering about the Sacrament of marriage. A liar. His corruption in that area did harm to others, political harm.
How that is off-point I do not know. I happen to care who hate mongering sexual hypocrites are fucking, sorry about that. I think it matters. Because of the hate mongering hypocrisy.

[Stinky The Clown]

23. Well, you can post all you wish.

The more you post, the crazier you might appear.

The sad part is that you're alienating an ally in the fight for marriage equality - me. I now find you, individually and singularly, as unsympathetic.

[obxhead]

31. I would like you to point out

where I have EVER said on any posting, on any blog, in any thread that anything Edwards did was a "minor act"

Go ahead, show us all.

[Uncle Joe]

34. It's not just about Edwards, it's about any and all of them and the corporate media's; obsession

with keeping the American People's focus on an individual oak tree; that may have a knothole or termites while at the same time, the entire forest is burning.

[defendandprotect]

71. Yikes! I supported Edwards and had no idea he took an anti-GLBT stand--!!

Wow -- !!

[Saturday]

7. We're too stupid to understand....

bank dealings and the starting of wars but adultery we understand.

[whathehell]

54. Who is this "we"?...You may be too stupid to understand, but don't drag the rest of us into it..

[Le Taz Hot]

60. Who's we? n/t

[JVS]

8. Sorry but you're forgetting that we live in a political culture that is profoundly stupid.

Any commitment, obligation, conflict of interest, or infidelity that doesn't involve the trouser parts is not able to register.

[whathehell]

55. Painting with that broad "stupid" brush again, bro?....Lefty blogs and broadcasting= Culture too.

Stop with the knee-jerk self-hate, already.

[Name removed]

9. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[asjr]

10. Good folks, it is the media.

[Snoutport]

11. It's not the sex...it is the cover up and lying.

If you'll lie to your kids and spouse you'll lie to everyone.

[Stinky The Clown]

14. George Bush never had a sexual daliance. Was he honest all the time?

**Every** politician lies. Every damned one of them.

[undeterred]

18. Good grief. Who was Jeff Gannon?

How on earth are you qualified to speak on Bush's purity?

[Stinky The Clown]

30. Please show me the proof that Bush had a dalliance with Jeff Gannon

Lots of hints and suggestions and innuendo. Not a lot of actual proof, as I recall.

But then, I really didn't pay attention to that.

Because I Don't Care Who Fucks Who. I didn't then. I don't now.

[undeterred]

33. Yeah, you keep telling us over and over.

[Stinky The Clown]

36. I'm sorry. I didn't understand the meaning of your post.

What do I tell you over and over?

[undeterred]

39. You act like the fact that you don't care

who is having sex with who is some kind of moral virtue on your part.

[Stinky The Clown]

42. Okay, I'll answer that one directly

I do NOT care who is having sex with whom - unless it affects me directly.

I think the world would be a better place if more people felt the same way.

[undeterred]

43. Well, I think a lot of people do care if the people they elect

are faithful to their spouses or if they treat them like crap. Especially a lot of women.

[Stinky The Clown]

44. I find that attitude too Calvinist for my personal sensibilities

But I understand many people feel as you do

[undeterred]

45. Yeah, right.

[Stinky The Clown]

50. you seem really bothered by this

[whathehell]

76. I agree....I don't think one needs to be a saint, but a pattern of lying and cheating= Not Good,

at least to me.

[Snoutport]

40. I expect them to lie to us....it is the backstabbing of the wives and kids

that show how low they sink.

[defendandprotect]

69. Wasn't his mistress, Jennifer Fitzgerald -- but Bush Family cover-ups continue to work ...

Poppy Bush's MISTRESS Jennifer Fitzgerald - Democratic ...
If, following ReaganWeek, we must now spend this week rehashing Clinton's affair, I demand equal time for another former president. Why was George H.W. Bush allowed to ...
www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=... - Cached


-- and gather that she was one of a few -- not necessarily simultaneously.

[undeterred]

17. +1000000

That's usually the way it works. People whose marriages are a sham often turn out to be a phony about everything else. Is Edwards still fighting the good fight for poverty?

[closeupready]

28. "Still"? Do you know how little pro bono he did?

Very very very little. (Not that you didn't know that, I'm just saying, for those who didn't...)

[undeterred]

29. No, I didn't know that.

Well, haircuts aren't cheap, you know.

[izquierdista]

12. But baboons care greatly.

The most egregious violation a baboon can commit is to mate outside of the sexual hierarchy. That will cause all sorts of long lasting problems, lead to fights, and if they go on long enough, split the troop. However, stealing another baboon's sweet potato, however rude it may seem, is merely survival of the fittest.

[blindpig]

15. Distraction is the primary purpose of the the mass media.

Unless you want sports scores, look elsewhere.

[spooked911]

59. Indeed-- the mass media is a criminal enterprise whose purpose is to cover up the real crimes

So, that is why I avoid them at all costs.

[libodem]

19. Shame

Some feel it some don't.

[Scuba]

20. Character matters, but only for Democratic candidates....

...Republicans love the likes of Rick Scott, Rick Santorum, Paul Ryan, Rusty Boner, KKKarl Rove, etc.

[JDPriestly]

22. Thanks, Stinky. Your post is a breath of fresh air.

It's all a matter of priorities.

Our press seems to prioritize the sex stories. Reporters would rather giggle about who is in bed with whom and why they shouldn't be there than about the serious social and economic problems we face.

Giggling while America is falling apart. That is what the news medias is doing.

[Blue Owl]

24. it's the new "Brietbart" standard of journalism

JMO.

[JackRiddler]

48. What was it during the Clinton impeachment? The Drudge standard?

[spanone]

25. war is immoral yet we celebrate it as if it were a good thing...go figure

[Hannah Bell]

26. [phone]. It is still surprising how many threads/comments sex scandals provoke, and how outraged

some people get.

[closeupready]

27. K&R - there is absolutely no hyperbole in your OP. Just a straightforward description

of reality. A sad reality that we live in, day after day.

[LanternWaste]

32. Not simply one or the other, but both...

I imagine many people believe that they themselves have absolute knowledge on what's fit for news, and what's not.

Odd thing is, I see stories on politician's sexual dalliances in addition to stories on mortgage meltdowns. Not simply one or the other, but both. Not simply both, but additional stories on additional topics too.

Some I find relevant, other I do not. But as I'm not an Absolute Authority on What Is News, I simply affect my direct surrounding (i.e., changing a channel) rather than allowing my surroundings to directly affect me (becoming petulant).

[defendandprotect]

35. Agree re our corporate criminals and banksters -- however ....

Why isn't Clarence Thomas on this list ?

Or Bill Clinton who gave us NAFTA and CAFTA and undid 60 years of welfare guarantees?

Or Nixon who so corrupted politics in America -- who sold himself to Prescott Bush and

other wealthy Repugs for $50,000 slush fund over his Congressional salary every year?

A Nixon free from sexual scandal? Hardly, very clearly he was involved with Bebe Rebozo.

How about J. Edgar Hoover -- should we not know and understand his lifelong involvement

with Clyde Tolson?

The GOP "devil with a blue dress on" was provided by Bill Clinton and it serverely weakened

his administration and Democratic Party. Should we have known about his problems sooner?

And, what if we had -- ? What of the other corporate choices we were being given?


John Edwards was one of the rare candidates from whom we heard truly populist messages.

That was invaluable, imo, in those elections to provide the electorate with some challenge

to rightwing messages.



These sexual scandals certainly make clear that too many of our politicians have

"zipper problems" which can be used to influence them politically --

That's why it was of some value that candidates were at one time selected by the party

itself -- people who KNEW those who had problems of various kinds --

We are now permitting corporations to chose who leads our political parties -- while

the parties have also colluded on putting a private corporation in charge of our

presidential debates.


The news that's heating up these days is the tale of John Edwards.

Yesterday it was Arnold and the maid.

Newt and his series of dalliances and denials.

Jesse Jackson.

Eliot Spitzer

Kennedy

Eisenhower

ETC.


Let's also keep in mind that sexual scandals are away to control politicians --

when they cooperate, as Clarence Thomas does, the evidence remains protected --

when they fail to cooperate, there is a way for those in power to dump them.



And should we have known about this and how it's effected the Democratic Party for

more than 20 years . . . ?


The Rightwing Koch Bros. Funded the DLC --

http://www.democrats.com/node/7789

http://upload.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x498414

[Stinky The Clown]

38. I hope you didn't assume my intent was for my list to be definitive, all inclusive, or complete.

They were simply examples.

There was a logic to them, by the way. Edwards' story is back again in the news. Arnold was very recent and very splashy. When Newt announced recent;y, there was a fair amount of talk about his sexual peccadilloes.

In the middle distant past were Spitzer and Jackson, bot selected for the unlikeliness of them being on such a list.

Then, way into the long past, but contemporaneous to each other, more or less, JFK and Ike.

[defendandprotect]

47. Apologies ....

I just reread my post and it's a rant -- and sounds like it's directed at you!!

Should have made clear that my level of frustration with all of this is pretty high

right now --

A :) at least would have helped !!

Again -- my apologies -- !!

:)

[Stinky The Clown]

51. Not to worry

I wasn't sure it was directed at me. You just confirmed it wasn't. Not to worry. :hi:

[defendandprotect]

68. Thank you --

Somewhere in my rant I lost the idea that while there is sometimes a bit of new

understanding that comes from these scandals -- it is pitiful that we are making

our way "scandal by scandal" for even the feeblest of insight into what's going on!

[Lydia Leftcoast]

37. It's all a distraction

Don't look over there where innocent people are being blown to bits.

Look at the bedroom farce over here.

[krabigirl]

41. I completely agree with you. Great post, k & r.

I also do not care who is sleeping with who. I do very much care about the fact that the people who created this financial mess are not only walking feee, but are receiving huge bonuses while their victims suffer.

Don't even get me started on the military-industrial complex. Our society is very sick right now.

[Zoeisright]

49. Too many Americans are still Puritans.

And too many Americans are gullible and would rather gossip than face hard facts and actually work to get us out of these huge messes we're in.

[lonestarnot]

52. K & R!

[BEZERKO]

53. Yeah.

I don't understand why so many people can't take a step back and see the big picture.

[barbtries]

56. i think it's kind of like american idol.

distraction for the masses. i share your distress.

[madlefty]

58. You can almost predict when some shit is going to hit the fan.

When something positive happens or is about to happen for the left the MSM and those who control them seem to always cook up some shit and make sure everyone and there dog knows...............

[barbtries]

65. yep.

and look at all the press palin gets. jeezus it's disgusting.

[spooked911]

57. but... but... WEINER!

overall, though, it's disgusting how the media puts out these sex scandal distractions. They are literally criminals.

[TheKentuckian]

61. I do find it shocking that so many give a shit and even find it important.

I think with the problems we have and the real hardships faced by many people that this stuff would cause eyes to roll rather than become catnip.

How can it be defined other than a distraction?

[defendandprotect]

73. Even when most of the public would dismiss a scandal --

and the public certainly didn't want Clinton impeached --

the swiftboating by the right makes it impossible to ignore.

I'm not saying that anyone wanted Clinton's sexual problems repressed --

but rather that we should have known about them at the outset and not

when it became so damaging to the nation.

[Stumbler]

63. "I don't give a fuck who they're screwing in private, I wanna know who they're screwing in public...

Robbing, cheating, stealing, white-collar-criminal you deserve a beating."

Paraphrasing Spearhead

[defendandprotect]

72. Unfortunately, oftimes these things are connected --- intertwined --

especially because opposition can use it to control them --

as we saw with Clinton and the GOP's "devil with a blue dress on" -- !!


Presumably, Nixon's homosexuality was key to controling him --

Same with J. Edgar Hoover which led him to proclaim there was no such thing

as "Mafia."

And, again -- if Clarence Thomas gets tired of being the 5th wheel in the

rightwing machinery doing harm to his own race -- imagine his perversions

would be all over the front pages.

[Atypical Liberal]

64. Here's why.

People generally don't have the capability or will to deeply think things through. So they tend to have a very simple set of metrics that they use for judging character.

Most people cannot explain to you what a collateralized debt obligation is. Most people don't understand how massively concentrated wealth is in this country in the hands of so few.

Sexual impropriety is easy to understand.

Then, of course, there is the schadenfreude that people enjoy when the mighty fall victim to that which many of the plebes have fallen for themselves.

[drm604]

66. K&R

Good post!

[bertman]

67. Puritanical christian hypocrisy coupled with an insatiable desire to control others' lives

allows those who pull the levers of power to use their prudish faux moral code to distract and subvert the work of representative government.

[GSLevel9]

70. oh you mean like 12 kids having a bomb dropped on their house in Afghanistan? nt

[Stinky The Clown]

74. You couldn't leave it alone, could you, fwankie?

That loneliness that is your life must be so unbearable that you can't even honor your own words. (Hint: shun) (Hint: substituting Xes for names is so f**king silly. As if no one gets it.) You poor, sad, little man.

I see the morons who follow you have taken up your role in obsessing about other people's lives. That whole sad lot of you over there. Really?

And the smoker girl. Does she have kids that she smokes around?

Do you smoke, fwank?

[Dawson Leery]

75. Profumo had an affair with a Soviet spy.

That is why a big deal was made of the matter.

For many Americans:
war = patriotism, sexual innuendo = evil,
the ruling class (ceo's, billionaires, politicians, etc) = admirable
working class = lazy