10 year old boy who shot Neo-Nazi father was tired of he and stepmom being beaten

[RamboLiberal]

The 10-year-old Riverside boy accused in the shooting death of his neo-Nazi activist father gave police a chilling account of how he carried out the early morning attack on May 1, officials said in a court document.

The boy, who told authorities said he was tired of his father, Jeffrey R. Hall, beating him and his stepmother, grabbed the family's Rossi .357 revolver from a closet and then "he went downstairs with the gun, pulled the hammer back, aimed the gun at his dad’s ear while he was asleep and shot him,"’ Riverside Police Department Det. Greg Rowe wrote in a court declaration filed on Tuesday. The boy "then went upstairs and hid the gun under his bed," Rowe wrote.

The declaration was filed to support allegations against the boy's stepmother, Krista F. McCary, 26, who was charged Tuesday with child endangerment and failure to properly store a firearm.

McCary told detectives that her stepson "knew how to shoot guns" and that her husband took the 10-year-old target-shooting while the two were patrolling the Mexican border with the National Socialist Movement, a neo-Nazi group, according to the declaration. Hall was the leader of the group in the western United States.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2011/05/boy-shot-neo-nazi-father-as-he-slept-then-hid-gun-under-bed.html

A neo-Nazi allegedly killed by his 10-year-old son was accused by the boy and his stepmother of beating them and the couple's other children, according to a court declaration released Wednesday.

The Riverside boy facing charges in the case said during an interview with detectives that "he was tired of his dad hitting him and his mom," according to an arrest warrant declaration filed Tuesday in Riverside County Superior Court.

"He thought his dad was cheating on his mom and thought he might have to choose which person he would live with," according to the affidavit filed by an investigator.

Detectives described the home of the victim, Jeffrey R. Hall, as filthy, with dirty clothing strewn on floors throughout the house and bedrooms smelling like urine. Empty beer bottles were found downstairs, as was a National Socialist Movement flag hanging in the living room, they said.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2011/05/boy-accused-of-killing-neo-nazi-father-says-dad-beat-him-stepmom.html?lanow

Police report: https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/96248-court-declaration.html

IMHO this could be justifiable homicide.

[Brickbat]

1. No shit.

That poor kid. To make that decision. I hope he gets the help he'll need.

[The Magistrate]

2. This Is A Clean Kill, Ma'am

There should be social services intervention, but no crimnal charges whatever.

[Zorra]

41. +1

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

59. Self-defense. It doesn't get cleaner than that. -nt

[Mojorabbit]

88. + a gazillion. nt

[peace frog]

89. Right on

[Mopar151]

101. Not in your terms, sir, but appropriate nonetheless

Filter - Nice Shot http://youtu.be/bpWlatljaI0

an expression of guts and determination of a person standing up for what they believe is right.

Hey Man, Nice Shot" was the first song from 1990s industrial rock band Filter to garner airplay and fame. The song became notorious, as it was believed to be honoring the January 22, 1987, public suicide of Pennsylvania state treasurer Budd Dwyer, who shot himself during a press conference with a .357 magnum. A May 1996 interview with Filter in Addicted to Noise magazine and an official statement by the band confirmed this. Filter gave a contradictory statement in which they denied glorifying suicide but condone the horrific act as a way of standing up for oneself. The band explains in an official statement: The song 'Hey Man Nice Shot' is a reaction to a well-documented public suicide. It is not a celebration or glorification of taking one's own life. The phrase 'hey man, nice shot' is a reference to the final act itself, an expression of guts and determination of a person standing up for what they believe is right. We are extremely sensitive and respectful to the family and friends of Mr. Dwyer. We have both lost friends to suicide and felt nothing but sympathy and loss for the victims, and those involved in such a

[readmoreoften]

111. +1

[backscatter712]

3. The boy performed a great public service! n/t

[Snoutport]

20. I hate

that i agree with you.

I hope they get the kid counseling.

[TBF]

4. How sad -

hope he gets some caring folks assigned to help him through this. Wow.

[BlueCaliDem]

93. This is heart-wrenching. He's only 10 years young and he already felt threatened

to the point he felt he had not choice but to kill the abuser. This is very, very sad, and I have to say, my heart really does go out to this little boy. Jeezus. How I'd love to hug him to me right now.

[earcandle]

5. Sad he had to go that far to stop the insanity. Wake up, Dads...

[lumberjack_jeff]

10. "Dads"? Surely you mean that subset who are violent Nazis, right?

A brush that broad must be equipped with a wide load sign.

[Maru Kitteh]

40. agreed.

[CreekDog]

62. no, the subset who are violent

Nazis notwithstanding.

[lumberjack_jeff]

82. Well yeah.

We all know you're in the broad brush column.

[CreekDog]

86. so only the violent dad's who are Nazi's are a problem for you?

saying otherwise is "broad brush".

[Manifestor_of_Light]

95. The violent dads I know are Christian rightwing fundamentalists.

[lumberjack_jeff]

103. And what better place to admonish them than DU? n/t

[yella_dawg]

84. Jesus

You are completely insane.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

92. Women can be pricks too...

just sayin'...

[earcandle]

107. Couple of Dads, not all Nazi, have been slain by their own young boys... is all I am saying.

The children are feeling like they somehow need to step in
with all this knowledge they now have at a way too  young age.

BTW, the ability to deal with ambiguity is a sign of mental
health.  It is worth the work.  

Don't be mean to your children, if you wield guns and power
like you are some kinda superman, because these kids being
brought in now are a new breed. They need to be, to deal with
what we are leaving behind for them to manage.  Violence is
the new norm.  Death is the new dance. Horror is the
attraction.... like this is a game or something, they are too
young to really understand the consequences. 

Just be good to your kids.  Show them some respect.  Mothers
as well.  Be good to the mothers, and mothers..do your job.

Respect is simply "care and attention".  Like they
matter.  They do.   

And stop feeding them "end times" crap.  And Rapture
crap.  They might get confused and think they are doing you a
favor.  

[postulater]

6. Boy pleads sanity. Judge thanks him. Case closed.

[rfranklin]

13. Except that this kid is a murderer who may do it again...

then what?

[REP]

15. He was defending himself and his stepmother against a larger, more dangerous abuser

A 10- year old can't win a face-to-face conflict with an adult, especially an out-of-control one. He defended himself and another victim the best way he knew how. He's not really a murderer. A kid who needs a lot of therapy, yes; but what he did doesn't meet the standard for murder in my opinion. Voluntary manslaughter at worst; self-defense at best; but not murder.

My opinion is predicated on reports that children and wife were abused and stats that I don't have right on hand that show that the majority of children that age who kill a parent do it to end abuse.

[rfranklin]

17. Stats that I don't have right at hand show...

this kid is so fucked up he will do it again.

[REP]

21. One quick source

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,977079-1,00.html

[REP]

23. BOJ: recidivism rate for homicide 1.2%

So, no.

[CreekDog]

42. tell me Mister Expert did Richard Janke who killed his abusive father do it again?

(He's been out for over 20 years)

Two years earlier, in Wyoming, 16-year-old Richard Jahnke had killed his violent, abusive father. The boy's long history of battery led to a conviction for voluntary manslaughter, not murder, and a sentence of five to 15 years. The case was reported on "60 Minutes" and became the TV movie "Right To Kill?" Jahnke spent a year at the Wyoming Boys School. His sentence was commuted to confinement and treatment until age 21. He was released at 19.

http://www.mailtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080817/NEWS/808170322/-1/special30

On a Windswept Wyoming Prairie An Abused Son Kills a Father to Bring Peace to a Family

By Leo Janos

Suddenly the world exploded. A shattering burst of shotgun fire from inside the garage tore slug holes the size of quarters through the glass-and-wood-paneled garage door and ripped into her husband's body, killing him instantly. Shrieking in horror, Maria leaped from the car. Inside the dark garage, the couple's slight, tormented 16-year-old son hugged the 12-gauge shotgun to his chest. "I heard a ringing in my ears," he would later say, "only it wasn't a ringing, but my mother's shrieks. I couldn't bear to have her see me, to point her finger at me."

...

It was Richie, not his mother, who provided the most shattering testimony..."He used to beat my mother; sit on her, pounding away, her mouth foaming with blood, calling her 'slut' and 'a fat spic.' Last year when my sister got acne, my dad accused her of not washing. He dragged her into the bathroom and scrubbed her face so hard she began to bleed. He showed her how to brush her teeth. He scraped her gums so hard, they bled. He pushed my sister against the wall and to discipline her, he'd grope her breasts. I once saw him reach into my sister's pants and feel around. My mother saw it too, but pretended she didn't. Dad would tuck Deborah into bed; once I looked into the room and saw him lying on top of my sister. I told my mother about it. She got mad at my sister and said it was her fault for wearing shorts. When I was very young I had terrible asthma. Dad got mad at me if I coughed, so I'd run into my room and cough into a pillow. One time, when I was 6, he filled my plate with so much food and forced me to eat it until I threw up.

...

On the sixth day of the trial Richie's lawyer, James Barrett, summed up the case for the jury by declaring that the murdered father "had murdered his son by inches, bits and pieces, day by day, week by week. That's the crime—slow torture. The father was the aggressor for 14 years against his son, daughter and wife; for the first time, hear what happened to this boy and believe what he said. He did tell the truth." The judge instructed the panel that to be acquitted for self-defense, the youth "must have had reasonable grounds to believe he was in imminent danger of serious bodily harm for which he could save himself only by using deadly force against his assailant."

Maria Jahnke sat in the front row of the court at 9:30 on a blustery Saturday night when the seven-woman, five-man jury announced its verdict after seven hours of deliberation. Several women jurors wept, an indication that their hearts had been overruled by their minds. A human life, no matter how vile, had been taken. Maria heard her son convicted of manslaughter but acquitted of conspiracy charges. She saw him slip off his gold ID bracelet and hand it to his lawyer, bury his face in his hands, then quickly whisper to Jim Barrett: "They did the best they could." She saw two sheriff's deputies approach the defense table. Before Richie was led from the courtroom, he paused to hug his mother. "Stay strong," he whispered. Maria collapsed in grief. Cradled in the arms of her friends, she hurled an impotent curse against her dead husband. "May he roast in hell forever. That man always won out against us. He won this time, too."

http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20084430,00.html



a 10 year old kid who has been beaten and kills to stop it from happening again is not a murderer.

[Maru Kitteh]

55. That is a POWERFUL article. n/t

[Name removed]

57. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[renate]

60. I wish I'd been on that jury

:cry:

[CreekDog]

63. me too

:(

[CreekDog]

43. You want to know why you don't have the stats?

Because you don't know what you're talking about.

Dr. Frist.

[LadyHawkAZ]

45. You know...

my deceased best friend had a father who molested him and beat his mother, and he wound up doing exactly what this kid did. Only he was a year younger.

He never killed again.

The kid will need counseling and will probably get it, if his story is true. It doesn't automatically follow that he will repeat.

[LiberalAndProud]

53. What was the legal outcome for him?

I really do think that repeated abuse over a lifetime should count as prepunished. I'm hoping for the most lenient outcome for this kid.

[LadyHawkAZ]

56. No charges were brought

of course, they had to peel his badly beaten mother off the floor, and that was probably a factor. If they mandated counseling he never said anything about it.

[LiberalAndProud]

67. Good.

I hope for a similar outcome in this case. A ten year old child should never have to face what this child has. It is good to know that there is mercy somewhere. Is it too bad for him that his mother didn't need scraping? I hope not.

[JTFrog]

77. Let us know when you're done pulling them out of your ass.

:shrug:

[LanternWaste]

85. I imagine we often base our conjecture and prognostications on

I imagine we often base our biased conjecture and subjective prognostications on "stats that I don't have right at hand..."

[Wait Wut]

91. You're so right.

With or without stats, the kid should get the chair. A 10 year old should be able to suffer abuse and watch his family beaten without feeling the need to protect them or himself. Kid's do it all the time. At least they can bury it deep enough so that it only surfaces after they have a family, become Nazis and beat their kids. That's much more responsible.

Totally the kid's fault. No hope for him. Fry him.








If anyone expects me to put that damned sarcasm thing on this you need to burn in hell. :loveya:

[mopinko]

78. probably more prone to murder if he HADN'T killed

that asshole. sadism and chaos like that breed all manner of problems.

[Rage for Order]

16. +1

As cute as this sounds on an anonymous internet forum, do we really want society to tell people it's okay to commit premeditated murder if someone beats you up a few times?

[LAGC]

22. What do you think an appropriate punishment would be then?

A few years in juvy? Detention until he turns 21 perhaps?

[Rage for Order]

35. Yes, detention until he turns 18 / 21

Premeditated murder is a pretty serious offense, even if his dad was a scumbag

[LAGC]

36. I tend to agree...

But a jury might be more sympathetic than you or I, especially once all the details of the abuse come out.

[CreekDog]

47. you guys love your jails

:eyes:

[LAGC]

49. Well, what do you think is an appropriate punishment?

Just a slap on the wrist? For what appears to be premeditated murder?

I'll admit, if I was sitting on the jury I might have a hard time convicting depending on the severity of the abuse... perhaps if a psychologist examined him and testified that the likelihood of him murdering someone else again in cold blood was very low, that might factor in some...

But we can't ignore the fact that he's not just an innocent victim here, he consciously chose to commit a vicious crime, and needs to be taught in no uncertain terms that society does NOT approve of his methods!

The real shame here is that Child Protective Services was never called...

[CreekDog]

51. for a 10 year old, for doing it for the reason he did, for doing it while in that awful situation?

not nothing, but not jail.

10 year old in jail?

you're sick.

[LAGC]

54. You know what? You're right, I'm wrong.

Free him immediately and give him a medal while we're at it.

Good kill indeed. Sheesh.

[CreekDog]

61. have you seen the movie or know the story about Richard Jahnke?

He was 16 when he killed his psychotic father, trying other avenues to stop the beatings he and his family suffered.

Nobody would help him or them.

The kid said he had to kill his father or his father would kill them. The mother corroborated all the abuse.

The "system" put them in prison, but commuted her sentence not long after and put him on parole not too long after that. The jury would only convict him of manslaughter.

What does that tell you about this type of conviction and issue?

You have a kid shoot his father and the shameless prosecutors can only get a jury to convict of manslaughter, for an intentional shooting?

That was a travesty. Putting a 10 year old in jail would be even worse. This is not a kid who joined on a gang hit for status with his peers. :wtf:

You think there are so many ways out for all these victims well when you're 10, are there really?

----------------------------


From Publishers Weekly
Prendergast, who for Rolling Stone covered the trials of teenagers Richard and Deborah Jahnke in Wyoming for the 1982 murder of their father, has produced an objective, affecting account of the case. A borderline psychotic, Jahnke senior subjected his wife and children to abuse both physical and psychological and, for a time, made sexual advances toward his daughter. Their residence became a house of terror, with the mother the most terrified of all, according to Prendergast. The children's feeble and intermittent attempts to acquaint outsiders with their situation were of no avail. Finally, with his sister's semiconnivance, Richard shot his father. The trials of the two, held separately, showed American justice at its worst: a prosecutor more interested in convictions than in finding the truth, and two inept and hidebound judges, one of whom would not admit evidence of child abuse. Deborah's sentence has now been commuted to one year of probation and Richard has been released on parole. A searing, convincing indictment. Literary Guild alternate.
Copyright 1986 Reed Business Information, Inc.

From Library Journal
After suffering years of paternal abuse, 16-year-old Richard Jahnke, aided by his sister, Deborah, shot his father to death at their Cheyenne, Wyoming home. This case received national attention as a segment on 60 Minutes and as a TV movie, Right To Kill? The Jahnke children won the sympathy of many, including the author. They were both convicted of voluntary manslaughter but are now free. Prendergast had the full cooperation of the Jahnkes in writing this thorough account. Essentially, it is a story of a brutal father who drove his son to murder and of the failure of the community to respond to cries for help. This readable book should be a popular choice for most libraries. Literary Guild alternate selection. Gregor A. Preston, Univ. of California Lib., Davis
Copyright 1986 Reed Business Information, Inc.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080521094120AAdEXFY

and no, the brother and sister didn't kill anybody afterwards (as one other poster alleges would follow.

[reggie the dog]

75. sounds good to me

if the kid shows that he and mom were abused to the point they thought dad would kill them if they tried to call the cops on him then the kid was driven crazy by dad and should get no jail. counseling on an out patient basis yes, for mom too, and mom is not negligent, she is battered and was scared shitless by the husband too. the husband was likely "the boss" so he stored the gun poorly, not the mother.

[underseasurveyor]

52. Apparently routine beatings weren't punishment enough.

Sure let's add to this poor boys misery, uh?
You are cold souled.

This boy is a complete victim on so many levels.

[Maru Kitteh]

44. Yeah. Throw those little 10-year-old beating victims into jail! Yeah! That'l learn 'em.

Besides, they need to serve as an example to all those other murdering 10-year-old beating victims.

:applause:

[reggie the dog]

74. the kid is only 10

he was scared shitless by dad and he deserves jail? seeing as his dad raised him to use guns to shoot at "illegals" dont you think that this kid is a victim of his father?

[backscatter712]

83. Exactly. HE'S TEN!!!

There's a reason why the law cuts children slack on these sorts of things.

[CreekDog]

64. 11 years of detention?

:wtf:

travesty.

[frylock]

24. -1

the stats don't back up what you're plussing there.

[Capitalocracy]

69. Things are different when you're a kid.

That's why children are supposed to be dealt with as such in the legal system. He needs counseling and psychiatric care, and serious scrutiny of his family situation, but not punishment. When you are a child of that age in that situation, you are in a situation that has to stop, and you do not have the resources to come up with a better way to stop it than that. He needs help to make sure that he doesn't grow up thinking killing people is how you solve problems, but when even abused adults often have serious difficulty taking appropriate steps to improve their situation, you can't actually blame this kid for what happened.

It's a tragedy, but let's put the blame where it belongs... on the head of the adult that caused this situation.

[Le Taz Hot]

79. "someone beats you up a few times?"

Um, I don't have the facts and neither do you. I grew up in a "home" that was full of terror perpetrated by one parent and several serial step parents. I assure you that the physical abuse is the LEAST form of abuse. This is a 10-year-old boy, whose brain isn't even near finished developing, who has been terrorized by his father. You're regarding him and his situation from a "normal" point of view. There is nothing on goddess's green earth that is anywhere near normal here. Maybe you could consider that. And try to find a heart, huh?

[renate]

87. how awful... I'm so sorry

You make a really good point that I think might not come immediately to the mind of those who were fortunate enough to grow up in a stable and safe environment--there is no "normal" here (and the fault of that is the person's who ended up being killed because of that environment, so the father did it to himself).

This poor kid grew up in survival mode--never knowing what fresh hell the next minute would bring--and I hope he's judged by people who understand that and show him some compassion.

I'm sorry beyond expression for what you went through. The fact that you used the word "terror" breaks my heart. :hug:

[fascisthunter]

97. he probably learned that from his own dad

hatred breeds hatred.

"a few times" - don't play this down.

[CreekDog]

37. he's 10 and being beaten and watching his family get beaten by an out of control dad

i don't know how you can say that he's a culpable murderer.

perhaps you'd like him in jail for life.

that would certainly reduce the amount of thinking you'd have to do about it. :eyes:

[Renew Deal]

50. Do it again to who?

The kid needs serious therapy, but at 10, jail won't do much good.

[phleshdef]

99. Bullshit. The kid spent all 10 years of his life being brainwashed and beaten by a psychotic racist.

Killing his father was definately the wrong way out. But there is no way you can make a solid argument that this kid has ever been taught any notion of right and wrong.

[Raksha]

34. +1000

[Jefferson23]

7. What a freakin mess. An unhealthy home with crazy parents, each

of the children, one as young as three, knew where a gun was kept.

A nightmare for innocent children and no intervention by social services took place in the past?

[Gregorian]

8. It's pretty hard to blame the boy, although killing wasn't the answer.

I blame society as much as the child for this. And I seriously doubt there would have been any alternative that would have worked, in this stupid society we have set up. Counseling, on some bs basis, and the father comes home to beat on them until they get a restraining order, after which the father beats on them again. Then jail. Who knows. I just think we can do better. Much of this stuff boils down to our society. His parents parents. Poor education, poor health care, taxes that pay for bombs and not books. And then there are horrible humans. But I often feel that there would be far fewer if we cared for out people. Health care. It's a big one. Education is another.

[RamboLiberal]

109. I don't blame society as much for this case as the father

Probably a vile boatload of hatred and vileness in that house. Kid probably thought that was his only way out.

Society couldn't overcome the hatred being spewed in that house. I doubt if that father even trusted anything like education or health care that was government provided.

[wtbymark]

9. Karma's a bitch ain't it

:)

[tanyev]

28. Or blowback.

Hope that kid gets the help he's gonna need.

[lumberjack_jeff]

11. It is a shame that the kids weren't put in foster care sooner. n/t

[texshelters]

12. California, like so many other states, has cut funding for domestic

violence prevention and services. http://www.recorderonline.com/news/held-46866-crisis-vigil.html

http://www.canow.org/canoworg/2009/10/protest-california-domestic-violence-budget-cuts.html

Perhaps they, and the rest of the nation, needs to rethink these cuts and cuts to other mental health and social service agencies.

http://www.alternativestodv.org/

Riverside DV shelter: http://www.cdph.ca.gov/HealthInfo/injviosaf/Documents/Riverside.pdf

Peace,
Tex Shelters

[blasto]

14. good for him

he deserves a medal.

[Name removed]

18. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[CTyankee]

27. wow. you must have interesting fantasies...good lord....

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[CTyankee]

30. well, ok, if you think watching somebody dying a horrible death is a good thing...

I think it is a sad thing...people dying do suffer, the question is whether anyone celebrates the suffering...get the point?

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

58. Well, since the kid seems not to be a psychopath, he went for a quick kill.

Disappointed?

[CreekDog]

48. don't you know who you're dealing with?

:eyes:

[bluedigger]

19. As rational decision as one could expect by a child that age.

If you beat your kids and leave firearms around, the consequences are easily predictable. And tragic.

[backscatter712]

25. I don't know about tragic...

The "person" that died was a neo-Nazi. Can't say his demise was much of a tragedy.

[bluedigger]

31. Tragic for the son.

[StarburstClock]

26. Why do people hate neo-Nazi wife beaters so much?

Is it OK if I dance on his grave or is there a grave-dancing committee headed up by some Bin Laden grave dancers that will have to approve my dancing? Just wondering when the ole grave dance is acceptable.

[provis99]

32. It is acceptable. Have fun dancing on the grave!

[Capitalocracy]

70. It's like in Indiana Jones.

If they're Nazis, it's all good. Shoot them, crush them with tanks, chop them up in airplane motors... all good, clean family fun!

[Maru Kitteh]

71. I have a box full of Nazi officer's fuck-waste ribbons, medals, etc. My dad killed the fuckers who

wore them and I will be proud of that till the day I die.

Nazis killed multitudes of my family. May all Nazis burn in hell.

[reggie the dog]

76. my grand dad has knives he got off of nazi officers he killed

he passed them on to dad, and they will be mine one day. i too am happy that grandpa killed some of those fuckers.

[Raksha]

33. Yikes...this happened practically in my backyard (I'm in San Bernardino)

and I didn't know about it until just now. This isn't the first I've heard of Nazis in Riverside, though. About a year or so ago, I got invited to a counter-demonstration by a member of the local Reform temple, who said another synagogue in Riverside was being picketed by the local neo-Nazis. Their target wasn't Jews per se--not on that occasion anyway--but illegal immigrants. I guess they thought the synagogues were too tolerant of immigrants (or something).

This loser was probably one of the demonstrators. "Good riddance" is all I have to say on the subject.

[LetTimmySmoke]

38. May 1st, 2011 was not a good day for terrorists.

[Maru Kitteh]

39. I hope the whole family gets intensive counseling and a NEW START. Poor kid.

[LiberalLoner]

105. Me too. n/t

[MyrnaLoy]

46. and if this had been in Florida

and a health care provider had learned of this abuse from the child or mother and asked about weapons in the house then said health care provider would be breaking the law now. Thanks NRA/idiot Florida lawmakers.

[CreekDog]

65. i wish you'd post this in the gun forum

and then cover your eyes and duck because they will freak out and act like huge victims for you even saying what is verifiably true.

because their only strength comes from their guns.

[Straw Man]

66. I see a herring, and it is red...

If the health care provider HAD asked about weapons, what would the next step have been? Advise the family on safe storage? "Yeah, thanks, Doc, I'll secure that weapon -- wouldn't want the little bugger to blow me away in my sleep!" Why else ask?

If abuse has been established, wouldn't it make a whole lot more sense to take steps to have the children removed from the home, firearms or no firearms?

[barbtries]

73. that is so crazy

the NRA has way too much power in this country.

[gejohnston]

113. an over reaction to a refusal to provide services issue, has no place

here. Good thing he is not in Florida, because DCF actually loses kids that are later found as murder victims. That was before Rick Scott.

[Capitalocracy]

68. I am precisely 0% surprised.

I figured this was the reason.

That, or he told his son, "Pick up a gun and shoot me if you ever see me cheerin' for that President Obama feller," and then when Osama bin Laden was killed...

[Imagevision]

72. This is the only time I'll say I'm glad this Dad taught his son how to shoot

[WhiteTara]

80. I hope the boy has a good therapist who can help him

overcome the trauma of what he was forced to do to survive.

[Katya Mullethov]

81. Righteous shoot bro !!

What flaming hypocrisy .

[abelenkpe]

90. Hope the kid gets psychological help

and can turn his life around.

[Mopar151]

96. A+ 100%

Is there anyplace that takes whole families in this situation? All of them are as traumatized as POW's - It will be a long haul to get them so that they are safe on their own - for themselves, or others.

[Liberal_in_LA]

94. sounds like an abused kid

[fascisthunter]

98. I Hope the Kid gets Counciling and therapy

he will live with that moment for the rest of his life. I truly have sympathy for this kid.

[HankyDubs]

100. beause the only option here

is to shoot someone to death.

Brainless gun culture mindset.

[Mopar151]

102. In this case

As far as the kid could see, if Nazi-Dad lived, none of the family was long for the world.

Get over yourself - Social services intervention and restraining orders would only move the level of violence up a couple notches.

[HankyDubs]

104. I don't fault the little boy

for thinking like a little boy. I fault the gun culture for thinking like little boys.

EDIT: And why exactly is it relevant that the guy was a Nazi? Make it a bit easier to demonize him and pronounce him worthy of death, but otherwise not really pertinent.

[Mopar151]

106. Ever met a supremacist?

Vile, nasty, cowardly people.....

Even William Pierce (authour of "The Turner Diaries") lamented on his deathbed that the "movement" had too many "Defective People" - which set the defectives to fighting with each other even more than usual.

[HankyDubs]

108. sure

Vile, nasty, cowardly people.....

agreed, but I still don't advocate shooting all of them.

[Katya Mullethov]

110. He only shot one

They dont seem to mind that so much .

[gejohnston]

114. What on earth does the gun culture have to do with it?

Spend five minutes reading Nazi propaganda and see how easy it is to demonize them.

[Taverner]

112. Shit, I'd donate to his legal fund

Two birds, one stone - takes out a wifebeater AND a neo-nazi