The odd history of the use of Geronimo as a war cry...

[MineralMan]

In 1939, a popular movie, with the title "Geronimo," starring Preston Foster, Andy Devine, and Chief Thundercloud (Tonto in the 1938 film, The Lone Ranger) as Geronimo, was the inspiration for WWII paratroopers who yelled "Geronimo!" as they jumped out of their airplanes. It began with Private Aubrey Eberhart, who saw the film while in training with three other paratroopers. While discussing their training, and their fears of their first jump, they decided to yell "Geronimo!" as they left the plane.

It caught on, and became the cry for their entire unit. It spread, as they spread out in Europe and the Pacific during the war, until it became universal.

That's another side to the use of the word by the military.

It even inspired a song in tribute to the bravery of the paratroopers:

Down from Heaven comes ELEVEN
and there's HELL to pay below
shout "GERONIMO" "GERONIMO".

Hit the silk and check your canopy
and take a look around
The air is full of troopers
set for battle on the ground

Till we join the stick of ANGELS
killed on Leyte and Luzon
shout "GERONIMO" "GERONIMO".

It's a gory road to glory
but we're ready here we go
shout "GERONIMO" "GERONIMO".

Here's a website that tells the story:

http://www.b-westerns.com/geronimo.htm

Maybe we should take another look at this...you think?

[MineralMan]

1. For more information, Google Geronimo paratroopers.

There's a book and much much more. It has a long history in the US military, and an honorable one.

[pinboy3niner]

23. In the 501st Infantry in Vietnam, WE were the "Geronimos"

It was our regimental motto, as shown in the regimental crest (which also featured a stylized thunderbird):




In WWII, in addition to the Geronimo crest, the patch of the 501st Parachute Infantry Regiment depicted Geronimo with a thunderbolt:




Although the Army had mostly abandoned the regimental system by the Vietnam era, two battalions of the 501st Infantry remained in the 101st Airborne Division in Vietnam. I never saw the old regimental patch used at that time, but the Geronimo crest with thunderbird remained the crest of the 1/501 and 2/501 Infantry, and was displayed on the HQ walls at our rear basecamp, LZ Sally.


The OP link explains that Chief Geronimo's descendants were contacted about the use of the name when the WWII units were formed:

.... Maj. Miley even had sergeant major locate relatives of the real chief Geronimo to ask their permission for use of the chief's name in the unit insignia. He located them with the help of the Bureau of Indian Affairs and they granted permission with pride.

[MineralMan]

27. Thanks for that additional information.

Apparently, it was the bravery of the warrior chief that was the inspiration. No wonder it was approved. I appreciate this additional knowledge.

[bbinacan]

2. Excellent post! n/t

[MineralMan]

3. Thanks! I thought there was a WWII origin to it.

When I was a kid growing up in the 50s, we used to shout it when we'd charge in a dirt clod war. I didn't know it's origins, so I Googled "geronimo WWII" and found the story. There was even a book written about WWII paratroopers with the title, "Geronimo!"

It signified bravery, and nothing else.

[bbinacan]

5. Yep

I did the same thing as a kid.

[MineralMan]

6. I think we all did. I didn't have any idea why we did it, but I suppose

some kid heard his dad talking about it and it just spread among the kids. We often didn't know why we did things, but later, if you think about it, there was a reason for everything.

This has nothing to do with disrespect for Native Americans, and everything to do with respect for the bravery of those who risk their lives in wartime.

[Brickbat]

7. If American Indians say they feel disrespected by the use of the name, I think that objection should

carry some weight.

[MineralMan]

8. Then that's how they feel. I'm just telling the story of how it

came into use in the military. It's not really about how anyone feels. It's what happened and what's behind the use of the word.

Geronimo was a very brave warrior. There's no question about that. Maybe that is the reference that was meant by its use in WWII by some other very brave warriors.

I do not know the answer to that question, since I was not old enough then to have experienced that war. It may just be that that old movie portrayed Geronimo as a brave warrior and that captured the imagination of those four paratroopers in training. I'll have to see if I can find the film and watch it.

I just thought it was an interesting bit of military history. Your viewpoint may differ. :shrug:

[Karenina]

22. The white power structure of the military co-opts what it wants at will...

http://www.democracynow.org/2011/5/6/native_american_activist_winona_laduke_on

The Obama administration has sparked outrage in the Native American community following the revelation it used the name of the legendary Apache leader Geronimo as a secret code word during the raid that killed Osama bin Laden. Geronimo was an Apache leader who fought to preserve tribal lands against U.S. and Mexican forces in the 19th century. We get reaction from Native American activist and writer, Winona LaDuke. "The reality is that the military is full of native nomenclature,” says LaDuke. "You’ve got Black Hawk helicopters, Apache Longbow helicopters. You’ve got Tomahawk missiles. The term used when you leave a military base in a foreign country is to go 'off the reservation, into Indian Country.' So what is that messaging that is passed on? It is basically the continuation of the wars against indigenous people."
Native American Activist, Author Winona LaDuke on "The Militarization of Indian Country" and Obama Admin’s "Lip Service" to Indigenous Rights


http://www.democracynow.org/2011/5/6/native_american_activist_author_winona_laduke

Native American activist and writer Winona LaDuke joins us to discuss her new book, The Militarization of Indian Country. LaDuke covers the legacy of the seizure of Native American lands by the U.S. government—which became sites for industrial and military use, including army bases, nuclear testing sites, coal and uranium mining—and how the military-industrial complex is encroaching on native communities. LaDuke lives and works on the White Earth Nation in northern Minnesota and is executive director of the group Honor the Earth. "Indian country is not to be assaulted by the U.S. military," says LaDuke.

[MineralMan]

28. OK. I was just posting the history of the use of the word.

How that is interpreted is up to the individual doing the interpretation.

[Karenina]

31. What you posted was the point of view of the white power structure.

Did you watch the alternative narrative "Democracy Now" presented? Does that point of view inform you in any way? :shrug:

[MineralMan]

32. How silly.

I posted a historical note. You read it incorrectly. That's the answer.

As for your question - no I did not watch that Democracy Now narrative. So, it did not inform me of anything.

I researched the use of Geronimo as a military term during WWII. Did I get something wrong? Please point it out to me.

[Obamanaut]

4. G*******! n*

[MineralMan]

9. Here's a plot summary of the 1993 version of the film: Geronimo

"Plot Summary for
Geronimo: An American Legend (1993) More at IMDbPro »

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The Apache Indians have reluctantly agreed to settle on a US Government approved reservation. Not all the Apaches are able to adapt to the life of corn farmers. One in particular, Geronimo, is restless. Pushed over the edge by broken promises and necessary actions by the government, Geronimo and thirty or so other warriors form an attack team which humiliates the government by evading capture, while reclaiming what is rightfully theirs.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0107004/plotsummary

It looks to me like the warrior chief was the hero of this old movie, and inspired those young paratroopers with his bravery. Not an insulting thing at all, it seems to me. It sounds like they took Geronimo's bravery to heart and used his name as inspiration. Who knew?

There's also a 1962 version of the film, along with the 1939 release. Geronimo is an icon of the bravery of the Native Americans in their battle with the usurpers, it seems to me.

[Bluenorthwest]

14. Geronimo most certainly was not the hero of this film

The film centers on the soldiers sent by President Grant to stop Geronimo. He was the enemy of the United States. The heroes of the film are the white men who capture him, which is the climax of the movie. The film ends with Geronimo as prisoner of war, his status for many, many years to come.

[Bluenorthwest]

15. You have linked to and cited the 1993 film Geronimo: An

American Legend which has a point of view far more evolved than the 1939 film with which you have it confused. The correct link to the 1939 film http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0031365/
Quote from that synopsis: The army's effort to capture Apache chief Geronimo, who is leading a band of warriors on a rampage of raiding and murder, is hampered by a feud between two officers--who are father and son.
A bit different.

[marybourg]

19. I attended the "premiere" of the '93 film, which was held in

Albuquerque. Geronimo (pronounced "Heronimo")'s grandson was there, so I assumed he was not unhappy with the interpretation. He looks just like his grandfather.

[MineralMan]

26. Interesting. Thanks! (nt)

[MineralMan]

29. Yes, as indicated in the title of my post, and in the thread.

I do not have the two confused.

[jberryhill]

10. I knew it as a battle cry long before I had heard of the Native American

I figured he must have been known for bravery since that's what everyone yells when they jump out of the plane.

[MineralMan]

13. Well, I know it made us kids feel brave when facing

the dirt clods of the enemy team, anyway. I just thought the background was interesting.

[xchrom]

11. Unrec

[MineralMan]

12. Thanks for your opinion.

:shrug:

[Bluenorthwest]

16. Chris Rock has a routine about why he should be allowed to

call people faggot. I do not agree with him either.

[flpab]

17. my Dad was a World War 11 paratrooper

They also yelled Geronimo when they were in bars and needed assistance from other paratroopers. They spent sometime in Paris before the Battle of the Bulge and it got so bad they wouldn't let paratroopers into bars. It was their yell when they jumped and when they needed help.

[EFerrari]

20. To which I add, "who is this we you speak of, kimosabe?"

lol

[demwing]

21. Yeah, but there's a considerable difference

The Geronimo yell is made in honor of bravery, the term faggot is derogatory and viscous. Not even an Apples to Oranges comparison, more like Apples to Buicks.

[left is right]

18. It is Doctor Who number 11’s catch word

While I don’t think I have ever used it I am sure that my brothers did

[pipi_k]

24. It's just way easier...

to remember than "John Jacob Jingleheimerschmidt"

[MineralMan]

30. Ha! My father-in-law was forever singing that.

May he rest in peace.

[MineralMan]

25. OK, this thread was interesting.

I posted the OP because I thought the information was interesting. It was just factual information on the origin of the use of "Geronimo" by the military.

For some reason, a few people took offense that I posted the information. It's just information, not a value judgment. It happened. What it means is something else, altogether. It's simply history.

:shrug: