How many here believe that if a Repub were to win in 2012, there would be either no more elections,

[Cal33]

or elections a la Stalin -- for show purposes only. Many people, even here at DU,
don't yet seem to realize how close we are to an oligarchy or a dictatorship.

The following is one of my reasons: We all know that the Repubs are doing away with
the middle-class Americans, correct? We also know that the middle-class people are the
ones who spend the most money in proportion to their earnings. They need to spend most
of the money they bring home just to cover the rent, food, clothing, health insurance
and some entertainment -- for themselves and their families. Right now, a large number
of them are not making enough to adequately do even that.

So, the more the middle-class makes, the more money will be spent in general, and the
better will our American economy become for EVERYBODY. On the other hand, the poorer
and fewer the middle-class becomes, the less money will there be going around, and the
worse off will our national economy be -- which is the condition we are in RIGHT NOW.

And the Repubs are the ones who are killing off middle-class America. Don't they know
what they are doing? Perhaps large numbers of the Neocon and Teabagger masses don't.
Perhaps they have been brain-washed into believing what they are told. But the TOP
EXECUTIVES of the corporate world DO KNOW!

It looks like the top executives of the corporate world have been planning for this for
a long, long time. They don't want a prosperous, healthy and growing America where
democracy reigns. They hate democracy! It only stands in their way! They prefer to
have a poor, demoralized and shrinking America, as long as the corporatists can make
all the profits by hook and by crook, because a weakened and demoralized America would
be easier for them to control and made to do their bidding. Yes, they want to become
the masters of the nation -- and permanently.

Our present national problem is a self-made one, and with a deadly purpose in mind. It
has been deliberately thought up, planned and created by many corporate world executives.
. And they are still working hard at it. I've
got to give credit where credit is due. These swine do work hard and non-stop to make
their evil schemes come true.

These sons of satan could bring our economy back to the way it was in 2000 with a surplus
within a relatively short period of time, if they so chose. But they won't. They choose
instead to bring America down to her knees!

If the Repubs win in 2012, there may never be real elections again. The greedy and
power-mad sickos will have taken over. They are not interested in a healthy, vibrant
and growing America. They are only interested in becoming the masters of an America
groveling in poverty, and with the masses of her people made into their obedient servants.

Not too long ago someone in this forum had written that today, it is no longer blue vs. red,
Dem vs Repub. Today, it's corporations vs. you and me. It is true, isn't it!

Those of you who are still not convinced that things could be this bad had better wake
up. 2012 could be our last (relatively) free election, for a long, long time to come.
I use the word "relatively" because I know the Repubs will continue in their well-known
practice of fraud -- as always.

[TwilightGardener]

1. A little paranoid, but Mitch Turtlehead McConnell DID say "elections don't work".

[Marsala]

32. He's right, they don't

The American political system has a couple more decades tops before it fails due to manufactured crises like that lovely debt ceiling nonsense we just went through.

[awoke_in_2003]

36. well, they really don't seem to work...

we are given two bad candidates to vote for, and both are already owned by wall street.

[sudopod]

2. What, don't you like the idea of President Scudder? nt

[RaleighNCDUer]

21. Scudder? Isn't that the name of the Governor of Texas? nt

[sudopod]

23. He's an upright Gosh-Fearing man, he is.

Has the look of a prophet about him.

[Mz Pip]

3. No

People had the same speculations when Bush became president.

We'll have elections and we will muddle through. Our history is littered with corrupt politicians.

[Enrique]

7. and the freepers say it about Obama

and they said it about Clinton.

[louis-t]

17. Clinton was gunna "declare Marshall Law and cancel the election"

according to my crazy cousin.

[Cal33]

10. But this is more than corrupt politicians. This is the "corrupter of the politicians" - the boss

man himself.

About Bush. He tried, but failed. Then again, has Bush ever done
anything well? If they elect an efficient Repub president the next
time, s/he might very well continue where Bush left off, and this
time not fail.

Then also, just think of the further damage to our nation!

[FrenchieCat]

4. My hubby said that if the Republicans take 2012,

hope folks are prepared....because everything we hold dear will be done with.
He also said that in the end, we will end up with the government we worked hardest to
deserve.

[AndyTiedye]

6. Deserve?

The good guys don't always win.
Lots of bad guys continue to win big.

Deserving hasn't got a lot to do with it.


And yes, we're screwed forever if any of these Repiglickins win.

[FrenchieCat]

13. When you get many folks saying they "may" voted for this President,

but they won't work for or donate, that's fighting with hands tied behind the back,
when it comes to elections in this era, understanding that Citizen United, and a
Republican leaning media as the new normals.

Sorry, but I believe that for some, they see politics more as a game than as their survival...
and their uncompromising righteousness as their golden guiding light will be to their own detriment.
I suggest that whatever we end up with, will be what they actively "worked" for.
Sure, the rest of us will also be made to suffer; that's a given.

[golfguru]

35. If unemployment is north of 9.5%

prior to election day, the Repiglickins could win. People vote
pocketbooks more often than not.

[AndyTiedye]

38. The Repiglickins are Counting On That

They are doing everything in their power to wreck the economy,
and relying on their minions in the media to blame Obama for it.

[Cal33]

11. I think your hubby might be correct. I think the corporatists are the hardest workest.

[AndyTiedye]

19. They Can Work at it Full Time Because They are Being PAID

Mostly our side relies on volunteers, because we don't have unlimited corporate funding like they do.

[Cal33]

12. I think your hubby might be correct. I think the corporatists are the hardest workers.

[Enrique]

5. they'll cut taxes

start some stupid wars, appoint some assholes to the Supreme Court. But we'll still have elections.

[Cal33]

15. Bush won only because of election fraud. If we do have elections with a

Repub president in 2013, it will be definitely elections a la Stalin.

[great white snark]

39. Can you imagine if their snafu of woman's right to choose in Oklahoma went national?

Collapsed unions and no jobs...elections would be the least of our worries.

[Cosmocat]

45. Yep ...

that pretty much sums it up ...

[tritsofme]

8. These people are like a broken record

This post could have been written in 2003 or 2007, and the hysteria would have been just as ridiculous.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

18. PLUS ONE

.

[Recovered Repug]

49. Why stop there?

The '02 and '06 elections were going to be cancelled and Bush wasn't going to leave office after the '08 election.

[izquierdista]

9. That's what we have now

The elections of 2000 and 2004 were just for show. Since the first one didn't go as planned, they had to have the Supreme Court announce the correct result. The second time, they managed to steal it fair and square. I get the idea that the only reason that Obama was allowed to win in 2008 is so that the Repubs would have something to blame the horrible economy on. You'll notice that mandated health insurance and shitcanning Medicare and Social Security has gotten more traction since they gave up the White House.

[Cal33]

16. Correct! It's the corporations that are running the show. Presidents come

and go, but the corporations are here to stay.

[AndyTiedye]

14. We Could be Even Closer Than That

Teabaggers control governorships and legislatures in 27 states with a total of 270 electoral votes.

They could call off the Presidential elections in their states and award the votes by legislative act.
That would effectively hand the Presidency to the Republican candidate, no matter who it is, and no
matter how badly they were trailing in the polls.

I think large-scale systematic voter suppression and fraud are more likely however.
Even Stalin held elections.

[silverweb]

20. Agreed.

The federal courts, especially the Supreme Court, are another major concern.

If the reTHUGs win in 2012, all hope of recovery for this nation will die. Any hope of saving it from the plutarchy will be gone for at least a generation and the repercussions will be felt for decades (if humanity even lasts that long).

[treestar]

22. I did not believe this extremism during Bushco

And don't now. This stuff is just insane.

[Cal33]

25. Okay. So you try to come up with a better attempt at explaining why the

Repubs are trying to bring America down to her knees by deliberately
destroying the middle-class, which is the back-bone of the nation.

[Douglas Carpenter]

28. they are not intentionally trying to destroy the middle class they are not guided by concsious

intentional evil. Very, very few people are. Even the Nazis thought they were doing good. Destroying the middle class is the byproduct of neoliberal economics which to varying degrees is supported by both major parties. The Republicans embrace a much more extreme version of it. The financial interest that supports neoliberal economics cares about making money. If it could be done in a way that made the middle class thrive - that would be fine with them - maybe even preferred. But their concern is to make money as quickly as possible with as few impediments and restrictions as possible. If the result is that the middle class becomes smaller and less prosperous - or if the middle class becomes larger and more prosperous - they simply don't care very much. They care about the bottom line. Like most everyone else, they see what they want to see and disregard the rest.

[Cal33]

31. Yes. They are conscienceless. They are greedy, they lie, cheat, steal,

corrupt others, are power-mad ... etc ... all of which fits the description
of the psychopath - as do Hitler, Stalin, Bush, Rove, Cheney. Hitler and
Stalin made it as dictators. Bush, Cheney and Rove were on their way,
but didn't quite make it. The next Neocon, Teabagger, or corporatist
president will continue where Bush left off, and if s/he also doesn't
make it, it will be a step still closer. The following one might
succeed.

Psychopaths want the power to have control over others. It's part of
their psychological make-up. They can't be blamed for being sick, but
they can sure do a lot of damage of the most horrible kind, and to whole
nations of people, can't they? They also make up between 2 and 4% of the
general population.

The Weimar Republic of Germany had been in existence for about 12 years
before Hitler seized power. The German people didn't have much
exerience with a democratic form of government. America has had more
than two centuries of experience with democracy, so it's more difficult
for a would-be dictator to take over. And that could be a good reason
why Bush didn't succeed, plus the fact that he wasn't a very capable man
to begin with.

Many people's ideas about dictatorships include the sentimental "It could
never happen over here." I think it's a big mistake. Psychopaths are
psychopaths. And they do what comes naturally to them, just as we all do
what comes naturally to us. We have to be watchful. The fact that it
hasn't happened here yet doesn't mean it never will.

[treestar]

54. Agree and they are temporarily embarrassed millionaires if they

are middle class themselves. They think they are all going to get rich so if there's no middle class it's because everyone is rich.

[treestar]

53. Bad as the Republicans are, and I hate them

I do not think they want to end our system, that is, no elections. I would also say they do not want to destroy the middle class. The middle class buying power makes them rich. I disagree with their way of doing things, which does not mean their motives are to destroy the system. They think it successfully runs another way. They are wrong.

[RaleighNCDUer]

29. Because, after all, nobody in history ever voted away their own democracy. nt

[treestar]

55. Where?

The Nazis - I wouldn't say Germany had a strong democracy right before that.

[Douglas Carpenter]

24. no that is an absolutely preposterous conspiracy theory - down right nutty - but

what is true is that specifically both Michele Bachmann and Ricky Perry are both part of religious movements that believe that America is commanded by God to push for the destruction of the Al Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem so the Temple of Soloman can be rebuilt and a catastrophic world war will be provoked against the Arab and Islamic world - resulting according to their belief systems in the mass conversion of Jews to Christianity and the ushering in of the second coming of Jesus Christ. I really would not want someone with that belief system to be the commander and chief.

[Cal33]

27. And you really believe Bachmann and Perry are backed by the

religious fundamentalists only. You don't think the corporatists
are the real king-makers? The religious fundamentalists alone are
powerful enough?

[Douglas Carpenter]

30. no the corporate interest which are major financiers of both parties care about making money with as

few obstructions and restrictions as possible. If Rick Perry and Michele Bachmann promote policies more favorable to that end than the Democrats and they appear in a position to possibly win - they will receive a lot of support from them. If it starts to appear that they cannot win - the support from the corporate interest will dramatically decrease and more money will flow to their opponents - be it Republican or Democratic opponents.

[Cal33]

33. Yes, they do want to make as much money as possible. It's a proven

fact that they make more money with a Repub. administration than with a Democratic one.
But money is only a part of it. The other part is the power that comes with money.
And these guys are power mad. They can have more power in a dictatorship than a
democracy - if they can swing it. It's in their nature. These are psychopaths.

[bemildred]

26. Not unless they attempt to impose a new Constitution by force.

Which would be disputed by force.

[Cal33]

34. They might not even bother with any constitution at all. Remember Bush saying,

It's only a sheet of paper?"

[bemildred]

46. Bush left office willingly though, which is contrary to the suggestion in the OP? nt

[Cal33]

47. Yes, Bush did leave office without any fuss, although I, as well as

several others I knew, were half-way expecting that he might not.
I breathed a sigh of relief when he did.

Among other various possibilities, the Neocons and corporatists
had probably surmised that the timing would have been bad.
Resistance from the American people would have been too strong.
It would be wiser to wait for another day.

Today, with the addition of the Teabaggers, their position could
be a little bit stronger -- unreliable and crazy as the Teabaggers
are.

[bemildred]

50. Presidents in the USA are weak, by design, the Founding Fathers were worried about Kings.

As Ms Pelosi correctly pointed out WRT Mr Bush.

FDR got elected 4 times, and an amendment was immediately passed to make damn sure it didn't happen again. So TPTB don't really need to obsess about who is President, and it looks better if the parties trade back & forth rather than having one rule the roost. If we had one dominant party, it would be harder to make excuses for not doing much, and both of them really hate having to do much, they both like it fine the way things are, despite what they say.

[Hippo_Tron]

37. I believed that we'd get the draft and martial law if Bush won again in '04

That was back when I was a young hotheaded teenager. Instead of all of that, we got another set of horrors in the form of Bush's response to Hurricane Katrina. Now that I'm a little more wise and mature, I don't presume that the Republicans will end all liberty as they know it if they take power. I just assume that they will fuck up the country in ways I haven't even imagined.

[pscot]

40. I was afraid of that back in '88

I didn't think GHW Bush would leave office. Turned out they didn't need a coup because they had it wired all the way around. The program went forward under BC just like nothing had happened.

[brooklynite]

41. So then, you DON'T believe Republicans rig the elections...

...since, if they did, they could keep holding elections for show and win them anyway.

Some conspiracy theories are mutually exclusive.

[harun]

42. We've never had free elections.

[blkmusclmachine]

43. Elections for show only, don't we have those already?

n/t

[midnight armadillo]

61. Congress is less competitive than the Soviet Politburo

or something like that, too lazy to find the numbers. The turnover rate is amazingly low.

[Mr Deltoid]

44. One need only look at the actions of Republican governors

They will try to establish a dictatorship by permanently fixing our election process. It will blow up in their faces.

[Llewlladdwr]

48. This is so scary!!!!

I think Obama should cancel the 2012 elections and declare himself President-for-Life in order to make sure this doesn't happen!!!!

[Ter]

51. Exactly how could any president go about doing this?

The only legal way is by a Constitutional Amendment, or better yet, a Con-Con. Neither are possible. So the only other way is illegally, and he would immediately be impeached and convicted for that.

[Llewlladdwr]

57. They couldn't.

I was just having a bit of a laugh.

Any President who refused to leave after his term was up would simply be ignored. The Secret Service would throw their stuff out on the White House lawn and that would pretty much be the end of it.

[Dreamer Tatum]

52. This is the same as doomsdayers.

"The world will end next week."

:eyes:

[Philippine expat]

56. Paranoia is treatable

[robcon]

58. Stupid thread. Stupid premise.

n/t

[Honeyporter735]

59. agreed.

idiotic thread.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

60. probably no more Earth!