On a Presidential Exercise in Rhetorical Delusion...

[xocet]

Excerpts from the Obama Iowa Speech - August 15, 2011 - Part 2 - (See www.youtube.com/watch?v=LX4aGqRg8zg to watch the speech.):

President Obama (time indices 1:51 to 3:09):

"Now that...that doesn't mean that we defend every single government program. Everybody's gotta make sacrifices. There are programs that aren't workin' well. And sometimes there are those in my party who...will defend everything...even if it is not workin'.... What we...we do have to make some...some cuts on things that we don't need...and...and that allows us to invest in the things that we do..., but there's gotta be balance... and there's gotta be fairness...and that's not just my view: the majority of Republicans agree with that view. Although I have to tell you when I saw the other day...uhh...(unclear)...my...uhh...friends in the Republican presidential primary...uhh....They...they were asked - "Would you take a deal...in which for every one dollar of tax increases we cut ten dollars in government spending?" ...ten-to-one ratio... And nobody was willing to take that deal. And what that tells me is - okay, you...you've gotten to the point where you're just thinkin' about politics, you're not thinkin' about common sense. (applause) (stridently) You've got to be willing to compromise...(applause)...in order to move the country forward...(applause)."

Commentary:

• How about defending something and forcing the other side to accept that they do not control the government?
  
• Why the FoxNews branding?
  
• Haven't the Republicans repeatedly stated in conjunction with their intransigence that the current president is to be a one-term president?
  
• How about not compromising before negotiation begins?

President Obama (time indices 3:35 to 3:53):

"And until we have fixed the problems that caused me to run for president in the first place...so that we're growin' a middle class and people have basic security and they know if they're followin' the rules...if they're workin' hard...if they're lookin' after their families and meeting their responsibilities...that they've got a chance at the American Dream."

Commentary:

• Which problems are those exactly? Would Wall Street's behavior happen to be included amongst them? How about illegal war? How about torture?

President Obama (time indices 4:41 to 4:46):

"I...I understand that..uhh...after this last midterm you voted for divided government...."

Commentary:

• Can a party win an election without understanding that - in order to win the election - it must attempt to control the message that is presented to the public?

President Obama (time indices 5:11 to 5:19):

"And what I've said is...the last thing the people need for confidence right now...is to...watch folks on Capitol Hill arguin' all over again."

Commentary:

• Is it necessary to invoke the frames that Wall Street would like to have in the public discourse?

President Obama (time indices 5:48 to 6:55):

"I want you...to help hold all of us accountable - me included. I am enlisting you in this fight, because if you are...i.if you're makin' your voices heard...if you're letting people know that...enough is enough - it is time to move forward. It is time for us to win the future. If...if your voices are heard, then sooner or later these guys have to start paying attention. And if they don't start paying attention then they're not gonna be in office. And we'll have a new Congress in there that will start paying attention to what is going on all across America. I am confident in the power of your voice. I am confident in your values. Those are the values that we share. I don't care whether you are a Democrat, a Republican or an Independent...all of us here are patriots and everybody here cares about our country and puts it first. And if...if we can have that kind of politics then nothing can stop us. Thank you very much everybody. God bless you....(applause)"

Commentary:

• Why are the voters being enlisted now? Why was this not done at the very beginning of the term?
  
• WTF? Still? Why is the particular speechwriter or aide who dreamt up this malformed slogan not presently unemployed?
  
• Who exactly needs to pay attention? Is the irony intentional?
  
• Why is confidence being brought up again? Does Wall Street count the number of times that that word in particular is intoned - regardless of context?
  
• Is it remotely possible that the other side does not come close to believing that liberals are patriots? How many times were liberals called traitors for opposing the policies of President Bush? Is it so hard to see that the opposition is not concerned with anything but winning the election?

[Lasher]

1. Good questions, all.

[newfie11]

2. KnR

[Enthusiast]

3. It was the single worst speech

ever given by this President. I will no longer even listen to him. Why doesn't he just change parties?

[Life Long Dem]

4. What speech was this in particular?

[Enthusiast]

5. This one.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=LX4aGqRg8zg

[Tarheel_Dem]

6. "Why doesn't he just change parties?" Why don't you?

I mean, that is, if you're really a Democrat. You know how the internet is, you can never tell. ;)

[Enthusiast]

7. You should go back to the time running up

to the election and read my posts. Maybe you should read any of my posts.

Democrats support organized labor and Democrats would NEVER dismantle the New Deal. They would especially never allow the New Deal to be watered down while taxes on the wealthy and corporations are as low as they are.

And a Democratic President would never put social security and medicare on the table while we spend more on the U.S. military than the rest of the world combined.

No, this is my Democratic Party and I won't stand silent while it is turned into the party of Reagan.

[Tarheel_Dem]

10. This party is made up of many parts. You know, "the big tent"?

HL Mencken said: "Liberals have many tails, and chase them all". ;)

[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ClarkUSA]

23. Not surprising, considering you have already said you "will vote AGAINST Pres. Obama in 2012."

Enthusiast (1000+ posts) Tue Aug-16-11 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #10

17. I simply disagree

and I will vote AGAINST Obama in 2012.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=747605&mesg_id=747794

Why are you here, if you're not going to support the Democratic President for re-election at Democratic Underground?

[Name removed]

42. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Autumn]

8. Rhetorical Delusion. That is about right.

Running to lose.

[Tarheel_Dem]

11. Yeah, but you also thought Hillary would beat him in '08. Sorry you haven't gotten over it.

:rofl:

[Autumn]

15. Hi Tarheel

no I am so over that.:hi: You have a good day.

[Tarheel_Dem]

22. Uh. Mmmmkay?

:rofl:

[Sheepshank]

9. Bold, italics and underlining?

this looks like those religious zealot, conspiracy, pamphlet hand outs.

[Armstead]

13. Sure, attack the form and ignore the content

[Sheepshank]

35. Form?...I'm supposed applaud parsed information and quotes that look like this......

"Now that...that doesn't mean that we defend every single government program. Everybody's gotta make sacrifices. There are programs that aren't workin' well. And sometimes there are those in my party who...will defend everything...even if it is not workin'.... What we...we do have to make some...some cuts on things that we don't need...and...and that allows us to invest in the things that we do..., but there's gotta be balance...and there's gotta be fairness...and that's not just my view: the majority of Republicans agree with that view.... Although I have to tell you when I saw the other day...uhh...(unclear)...my...uhh...friends in the Republican presidential primary...uhh....They...they were asked - "Would you take a deal...in which for every one dollar of tax increases we cut ten dollars in government spending?" ...ten-to-one ratio... And nobody was willing to take that deal. And what that tells me is - okay, you...you've gotten to the point where you're just thinkin' about politics, you're not thinkin' about common sense. (applause) (stridently) You've got to be willing to compromise...(applause)...in order to move the country forward...(applause)."


perhaps the OP should realize there is more to presenting information than a post that looks like a John Bircher hand out, with parsed and partial sentences.

That you defend this type of crap is telling....

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Armstead]

14. This is obvious bullshit if you have been paying any attemtion at all

President Obama:

"but there's gotta be balance... and there's gotta be fairness...and that's not just my view: the majority of Republicans agree with that view."

You actually think the majority of Republicans in 2011 actually believe that? Maybe in 1965, but there has been a systematic attempt by the GOP to toss out all balance since the 1970's. The GOP is not working for compromise or balance, and President Obama should stop pretending they are.

[ClarkUSA]

16. That was aimed at independent & moderate Republican voters who may indeed feel that way.

Your POV is obviously different than theirs.

During this bus tour, President Obama has attacked Republicans IN WASHINGTON DC for being too partisan, BTW.

[Armstead]

18. They are the ones who need to be persuaded that today's GOP is not working in their interest

[ClarkUSA]

19. Sure. During this bus tour, Pres. Obama has attacked Republicans in Congress for being too partisan.

President Obama has been doing a good job already. Why do you think Congressional Republicans' approval ratings are in the toilet?

Furthermore, President Obama will be telling people exactly what the choice between Republicans and Democrats comes down to when he starts campaigning in earnest.

This is only the second day of his bus tour and tomorrow he goes back to being POTUS while his GOP opponents and his other bilious critics are free to attack him 24/7. But I wouldn't bet against him once he starts politicking in earnest in Iowa...

[Armstead]

20. I heard him and he attacked CONGRESS not the GOP

The average non-partisan independent is going to hear that as also blaming Congressional Democrats as being equally responsible for the mess.

What has been happening in Congress has been POLITICAL BY THE GOP, not by democrats and not some systemic failure.

THAT's what Obama should be saying.

[ClarkUSA]

21. So you want Pres. Obama to attack all Republicans and alienate independent voters. Gotcha.

Not going to happen. That is a dumb idea, given he is trying to win independent and moderate Republican voters, not alienate them with partisan attacks.

[Armstead]

25. You have identified the fatal flaw in the Democratic Party strategy for years

Republicans are not afraid to alienate a certain percentage of the population who they know will always disagree with them. Ans, more important, they make it a point to actively go out and SELL their own right wing philosophy to "independents" by stating their case in clear terms -- and which also includes attacking the principle of liberalism and the individual Denmocratic politicians on a personal level.

As a result THEY have advanced their awful agenda for 30 years, while Democrats are afraid to even defend liberalism with equal fervor, much less actively work to advance the liberal ideology.

[ClarkUSA]

28. Name one Republican presidential candidate who has recently and publicly attacked all Democrats.

Even Sarah Palin wasn't dumb enough to do that during her campaigning in 2008.

[Armstead]

31. "Earth to ClarkUSA, Earth to ClarkUSA ...What is your present location?"

Bzzzzzzt....I'm somewhere in the outer solar system and have not been receiving and radio or TV transmissions.."

[ClarkUSA]

36. Red herring to Armstead: Why don't you answer my question?

[Armstead]

37. I don't need to....Just turn on your TV whenever a Republican politician or spinner is speaking

Tghere's an excellent chance you'll hear either direct or indirect bashing of Democrats.

[ClarkUSA]

39. Do you have a single quoted example of a GOP presidential candidate attacking all Democrats? Hmm?

Didn't think so.

Like I said, even Sarah Palin wasn't dumb enough to do that in 2008 when she was campaigning.

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[xocet]

24. It is good to see that you are out today backfilling this thread with empty rhetoric....

What percentage of a thread needs to be occupied before one is allowed to stop?

At last glance, 5 of 23 replies or approximately 22% are yours, and none of them respond to points in the OP.

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ClarkUSA]

29. That describes your OP well. I'm sure there'll be more inane rhetoric to come.

[woo me with science]

38. Well observed. nt

[Beacool]

30. Give it up already, Clark!!!

Your last post on this subject was locked. You know that you're being as disingenuous as The Huff was with that headline. Clinton was criticizing Perry's hypocrisy and you well know it.

:crazy:

[ClarkUSA]

32. Why should I give up facts? Is it an inconvenient truth that Bubba complimented Perry? PROOF -->

Bonus Quote of the Day
Yesterday, 02:55 PM

"I got tickled by watching Governor Perry announce for governor, for president. He's a good looking rascal."

-- Bill Clinton, quoted by the New York Observer.

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2011/08/15/bonus_quote_of_the_day.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+PoliticalWire+%28Political+Wire%29

[Beacool]

33. Whatever Clark, keep playing your games.

No one but a few sycophants listen anymore.

:eyes:

[ClarkUSA]

34. Does that mean you're one of those "sycophants"? You (and many others) sure seem to "listen" to me.

Good. I've got a lot to say.

Nice to know you're such a fan of my every utterance.

[Jakes Progress]

44. There's a difference between

between listening and keeping you off the threads. Hang in there. No one, but no one is reading your shit here. So if you are kept down sub-thread, the better off DU is.

[Puglover]

41. Self delete.

Ick not worth it.

[Jakes Progress]

43. How about a little real truth?

It's nice and tricky to just pull a quote (from the Observer no less) and hang your whole Raison d'etre from it, but you know that you are stretching to once again pull your favorite subject into the thread. You also know how untrue the quote is to what was going on.

As a standing joke, your posts light up our lives.

[ClarkUSA]

40. On the contrary, “It looks like President Obama really has found his inner Harry Truman." (link) -->

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=433x747991