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Obama and DOMA; How is he catering to his base?

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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-11 02:40 PM
Original message
Obama and DOMA; How is he catering to his base?
I'm hearing this on the left and the right. The right says, "He's catering to his base." Some on the left are saying, "He's throwing a bone to his base so we can shut up. Additionally, it's politically advantageous so we can spend money on his campaign for 2012 , and/or he's trying to divert the news to this and away from Wisconsin."


I had to sit there and go what the hell am I hearing. I mean, I understand there are critics. However, when I hear arguments as the above---I have to wonder if these are critics, perpetual pessimists, or people who just downright hate our President.

This is not a position...that I can find to be politically advantageous for any politician be it Dem or Republican. Least of all Republican. This nation is way too limited for that. Let's break down the arguments proposed by the left whom do not trust his position. I will ignore the right because I find that argument says it all. They always think all his motivations make him weak and catering to his base. Some on the left think he's just as weak.

But let's start with no.1: "He's throwing a bone to his base so we can shut up." <---How? Most people were impressed and for many who were complaining they were surprisingly impressed with his success with DADT. Not to mention his extension of medical rights to gay couples or even the Matthew Shepherd bill. All in all, I don't see this move on DOMA as really a bone. It's more of a Woah. I'm a strong advocate for gay rights and I was willing to give him another term to get DOMA out of he way, even though he said that he planned on getting DOMA and DADT repealed during his term. This is not a bone. This goes above and beyond a bone---considering the political climate, considering his own stance in the nation and what's going on in the nation at the moment.

Point no.2: "It's politically and financially advantageous to pander to us in this way." <---Yeah right! We are the Democratic base as a whole. Many Democrats are not 100% open-minded. DU or other left-wing blog sites who have members are not on board with DOMA. DOMA is still a polarizing issue. That is without a doubt. There are many Dems who do not believe gays should be married. I know many a people who think like that----they even reject civil unions. But they vote only Dem. So to say that this is in some way politically advantageous I wonder for who? I find it to be a political risk that he took without really much prodding. <---Why do I say this. I say this because for 2 years the President and DOJ went along fine and dandy (even while they had protests from LGBT groups and others) to defend DOMA, fully, in court. So for him to make this move is a bit wow. And I found it surprising. Yes, I'm sure many in the LGBT community will support him and maybe some reluctant DUers here. However, I think this could lead to a lot of WTF's by other Dems. Take for instance what happened on HP. Many people who were like---"This is great news for gay rights, but do you have to show a picture of two men kissing. Some of us are not ready for that." Direct quote from several posts on HP. To the point where a sort of flame war erupted. And it was a good number of people saying that. Sure they are not a reflection of the whole base, but neither is DU. So I find this to be fairly risky position to take politically and I appreciate that. That shows great courage.

But not only the act shows great courage. I respect anyone who does or shows two things our President did. First, he put his own personal opinion on the back-burner and looked at this issue on a national level, on a political and civil rights level to the people of the nation who are part of the LGBT. Many of us put a lot of us praise dead Presidents for this. For instance Lincoln who wasn't really all about Blacks being free but realized that this was just not sustainable in our nation and he was being prophetic. He put away his own personal bias and focused on the needs of the nation and it's future. We had people like JFK who wasn't really up for a battle for civil rights either---he ended up risking his life (some believe) and really took a political risk by supporting it in the end. So I really do appreciate anyone with the foresight and vision to look beyond their own prejudices and do the job they were hired to do.

I for instance, consider myself to be both Pro-Life and Pro-Choice----or in essence Pro-Choice (since some women who are Pro-Choice think like this). Whenever I meet friends who are pregnant and aren't sure about having the child. I never ever push an abortion. I'm against it. I advocate against it within my close relationships. However, as a woman--especially a Black woman (minority womens suffrage in regards to reproductive rights is something not many people know or talk about. It's significantly different than non-minority women), I thoroughly believe that women should have the right and the choice. Although I am personally against it and I doubt I would have an abortion even if my life was at risk. I do believe women should have the right to choose what they want to do with their bodies. Something many minority women were denied in America during the 40s-80s (this is not in relation to abortion).

The second thing I appreciate is that the President proves once again he's a man and he's human. He, and this is something I loved about Malcolm X, admit to evolve in their beliefs. To realize that growth and evolution is a constant struggle and that sometimes our beliefs may not be the right way of thinking. He admits in effect, that he is wrong and he's dealing with it. However, all I have heard is that he's a homophobe. He actually doesn't like LGBT but wants their money. This is commendable, I think. My mum even recognize that the church did a doozy on her and she has spent years working through her issues on homosexuals. She was thrust into the world due to my close friend who's like my brother and her son who happens to be gay. And his partner who are now family. She's far older from Obama and it took her a while, and she does have her moments of relapse, but she's definitely move forward. I don't expect my President to share every belief as me, especially personal things. However, I appreciate that he's taking steps to grow and he has grown. And for that I respect him greatly.

Many of us on DU must have our own prejudices and have had our moments of prejudice or bigotry; and many of us have worked passed them or try to work past them. I'm very put off that so many people are marginalizing his struggle. I would give him the benefit of the doubt instead of mocking his own journey. However, I've seen more so the latter than the former. In any event, it shows great courage from what I could see.

As for the last, "I suspect he's diverting the news on Wisconsin." Why and how is he supposed to do that? I have to wonder about people's attention span to even suggest this. I mean really. Come on now. Because he says this now, it must be some sort of weird conspiracy theory to stop the news on Wisconsin? How is that? I mean the topics are two different things. It's on a national level and not just Wisconsin and yet...he's trying to divert people's attention. I dunno. I just dunno.

_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

I believe many people in his base will be happy with this move. And I believe the more active forum/blogger leftist followers will be supportive of this. However, this is not really something that will pull independents in a large number to his side. And they are the ones who tip us over to winning the Presidential seat. I think there are some in the Democratic base---ie whole nation who do not live on political websites who may not support this. Especially if Prop 8 counts for anything. And we all know the Republicans are against it.

I'm trying to see how this is a win for him politically or him even throwing us a bone.
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craigmatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-11 02:53 PM
Response to Original message
1. It's a good move but he needs to propose a card check law and now is the time.
Edited on Thu Feb-24-11 02:53 PM by craigmatic
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-11 05:00 PM
Response to Original message
2. I'm not sure what I mean here, but I'll say it now and be done with it...
As time passes, I see him as a man trying to do the right thing in a world that has been been long neglected and purposefully confused and distracted as to what is just. It has sunk into a corruption set in concrete, falling into the depths of utter shit.

But people can only judge on what we see on the surface, at least for now.

what he did regarding DOMA is enormous. I feel it is very brave, and for that I'm grateful.

I wish somehow something like wikileaks could help in the matter of the president's predicaments, if any in that regard, and perhaps that may not help in the short run, but perhaps yet may in the long. I'm not going to discuss any of what I just wrote. I have nothing really concrete to base it on. I know almost nothing, really. Please disregard. It should be easy to do.
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-11 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Ditto!
Well said!

Look our human instinct tells us when something is right or wrong and yours is telling you something.

I won't disregard what you say because it's important to hear every voice.

He has a multitude of issues and he is deliberate about how he attacks them. Many people do not like that deliberate process because they think things should be fixed. Life doesn't work that way no matter how badly we want it to.

Keep sharing your thoughts!!

:hi:
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 04:24 AM
Response to Reply #3
7. Hi, Maddie.
:hi:
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-11 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Ain't no way I'm disregarding you.
I see Obama exactly the same way. He is trying to do the right thing. Can we ask for anything more? :hug:
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 04:23 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. In this world? Probably not.
I ragged him over this because I think a Constitutional specialist should be particularly held to task in such a matter, I will still criticize when i think it's apt, but what I wrote is what is in my heart, and I'm a strong believer that the heart should play very little part in politics and governing , which is so much about manipulation of the heart.

And here I am the liar, saying more after i said i wouldn't.

Thanks, pal. :hug:
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RichGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #2
21. I agree with you.
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Exilednight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-11 09:01 PM
Response to Original message
4. It's only a 50% measure. He will no longer defend the law in court, but he will
enforce it on the federal level.

He's half way there, now we just have to figure out to push him the rest of the way.
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justiceischeap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #4
9. As I understand it, until a court strikes the law, he HAS to defend it.
It would be considered treasonous otherwise. No? I also think his being a Constitutional lawyer plays a huge role in the way he's been dealing with LGBT issues. I get the impression that he's making sure that the changes he's making/initiating will stick.

As far as his struggling with LGBT issues... I don't buy it for a second. I think his "struggles" are so he doesn't alienate moderates. I think he could care less one way or the other. When he was freshman Senator, I do believe he said he supported gay marriage. His view only became more moderate when he was tapped to run for President.
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Exilednight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 07:57 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. "he HAS to defend it" No, he does not and he will no longer
defend it. He doesn't have to enforce it either, but he's choosing to until a court strikes it down.

I give him points for not defending the law, but like I said, it's only a half measure.

On the flip side of the coin, Congress can still defend this law in court, but the executive branch will no longer do it.

More than anyone, I think we have to thank Eric Holder for getting the president this far.

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polmaven Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #4
13. As long as the law remains in place
he is required to enforce it.
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Exilednight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. That's not true. He can choose not to defend it on constitutional grounds, but he has
to be ready to defend his actions in court if challenged. Every president picks and chooses which laws to enforce.
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 04:27 PM
Response to Reply #4
19. He can't refuse to enforce it!
Suppose some republican refused to enforce the tax laws!
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Exilednight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. He can refuse to enforce it, and in fact it was our current Chief justice who
set the precedent.
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 04:30 AM
Response to Original message
8. I also don't think he did it for political reasons, however i do believe
that it might help him with the younger voters whom Dems always need to win.

It's about creating the world young people want to live in after the rest of us are gone.

I think there is still some risk in this for Obama, as youth vote is extremely unreliable for now. As the world changes, I think that will also change.
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 08:52 AM
Response to Original message
11. Sometimes I just have to shake my head with DU.
Here vaberella has taken time to post a thoughtful post with a number of great points and questions, and not only does it languish, but it just got an unrec that took it off the greatest.

I will wager that the unrec'ing came as a reaction to the title. But that's not the point.

please, if you skip reading her post you will miss out. We need more of the quality of thought and expression that vaberella is presenting, not less.
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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 09:21 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. I've been a strong critic of President Obama, but his new stance on DOMA,
a horrible law that shocked me when Senator Wellstone of all people voted for it, is a huge stride forward. I have to respect that. K&R
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. Hmmm...
I seem to recall that you sent our Mr. Obama a Whitman sampler with a mash note attatched, just this Valentine past. This would not seem to square with what you say here. :evilgrin:

Or perhaps...love is NOT blind after all?
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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. I said I liked him, not like like. Gah. Get out of my room. MOM!
:D
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. Oh, I read that gosh damn Hello Kitty diary of yours, young lady!
And I will most certainly do it again.
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
18. You're right.
He does what someone wants done and then that person says he is just catering to get their dollars? Such a person does not want to be happy with anything.

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OhioBlue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-11 10:00 PM
Response to Original message
22. excellent and well thought out post!
I applaud the President for this decision. I support this President, and like you, I don't agree with every decision or statement he makes. I am very happy when he does change his positions to be more in line with my ideology.
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-11 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
23. Thanks vaberella, & thanks DU. (nt)
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