In order for the vehement critics of health care reform to be vindicated

[ProSense]

the health care bill will have to fail miserbably. It would have to fail to

• cover any of the 32 million uninsured
  
  
• save thousands of lives annually
  
  
• lower premiums for a majority of Americans
  
  
• increase competition among insurers
  
  
• offer Americans more choices, including a non-profit plan
  
  
• bring down cost
  
  
• regulate insurers
  
  
• serve as a foundation for even more significant reform

We'll see.

[phleshdef]

1. At the end of the day, the bill sets a predecent of giving government the power to regulate coverage

So even with all those great items you mentioned, this power in and of itself, if used correctly, will likely deny the critics any merited vindication.

[grantcart]

2. So they are going to campaign on the issue that 'some people shouldn't be insured'

When the fall campaign comes they are not going to want to run on this.

It will be about deficits all day all of the time.

[HillGal]

3. You guys can't seriously be happy about this bill? My friend

has a friend who is on medicaid, medicaid patients are going to have to start paying for medicaid in a few years, how is that progress? My aunt has been going to her doctor for 14 years, she's retired now and on medicare with a supplement, as of April 1 her doctor will now have a new program in effect, basically patients pay $2,000 per year in cash just for having him be their doctor, and he'll limit his practice to 600 patients only, she can't afford that, so now she has to go looking for a doctor that will take her medicare, and that's becoming less and less, heck even Justice Sotomayor's own brother doesn't take medicare patients. You may think we're going to see equality in healthcare now, but we won't, there's going to be a 2 tiered system now, 1 tier are the rich who can afford good insurance and then the rest of us, the rich if they need a new hip will get a good quality hip while the rest of us will get a semi-decent hip.

I don't see why any celebration is going on at all. I guess I'm being a realist instead of living in delusional land. Nothing is free and this most certainly won't be either. I just got another increase for my health insurance that is renewed next month, no way is my health insurance going to go down like Obama says. My only hope right now? Hillary jumps ship and challenges Obama in 2012. You may think he's done a great job and this is a good thing, well progressives weren't the ones responsible for electing Obama, the independents were, and they're overwhelmingly against it, and their voice will be heard during the mid-terms, you have no idea the anger that's out there and it isn't just the right that's angry, the moderates will turn out, and we could lose the majority from this 1 issue alone.

So celebrate now because when reality hits it's going to be short termed happiness.

[ProSense]

4. "My only hope right now? Hillary jumps ship and challenges Obama in 2012. "

:rofl:

[HillGal]

6. Scare you huh? who will the moderates vote for? Obama or Hillary? I say Hillary and if she isn't on

the ballot then they'll go with the republicans.

[ProSense]

9. "if she isn't on the ballot then they'll go with the republicans. "

:rofl:

[damntexdem]

11. My hope: after Hillary's election as prez in 2016, she names Obama to the SCOTUS.

Hey, Barack or Michelle, either one -- I'm not picky. ;-)

[Cha]

20. Thanks for saving me the trouble

of reading that crap.

[FrenchieCat]

5. Are you lost? GD is thata way ------->

as for all that you said, I disagree with all of it.

There is a 3 tier system now, the ones who can afford insurance, the ones that can't but get it anyway, and the ones that we pay for cause they don't have any money.

Now there will continue to be such a system, but the poor woman who is pregnant
now can get prenatal care, instead of us paying for a premature baby and the costs
associated with that.

As for you speaking for Independents, you can't, because that is a big ass category....

Lastly, too bad that you don't have a clue of what is in the bill....
But you can always ask this guy, if you don't like reading: http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2010/03/a_bill_becomes_a_law.html

[HillGal]

8. Oh I saw some things in the bill, did you see where medicaid patients will be forced to pay? NT

[freddie mertz]

16. What, you decide who gets to post in here now too? nt.

[donco6]

22. More intimidation, Frenchie?

I could just as easily say something equally inappropriate, like "The BOG is THATAWAY" ----->

[damntexdem]

10. I am seriously happy about the passage of the bill.

And I will remain so; but I wish to become ecstatic, which I could become if the Senate passes the House 'fixes' and if the pressure remains on for further reform, particularly for the adoption of a PO. Even better, I could become totally blissful should there be a serious move toward Medicare for all.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

21. So a friend of a friend has a situation....

that is not related to healthcare reform (Medicaid is run by states) and your aunt has a situation that is not related to healthcare reform (her current doctor is a private practice phyisician), and so the both of these situations have caused you to be opposed to healthcare reform. Actually, your aunt will benefit from healthcare reform because it increases Medicare payments to providers -- any provider will tell you that Medicare doesn't cover the cost of services, which is why providers are loathe to take on new Medicare patients. Healthcare Reform should acually help her to find a new provider.

You're not a realist. You're just ill-informed.

And if you think Hillary will "jump ship" and challenge Obama in 2012, yo're beyond merely ill-informed.

[damntexdem]

7. It would have to do even more:

1) promote a complete government takeover of all healthcare;
2) create death panels that would immediately start sending older Americans to death camps;
3) establish publicly-paid mandatory-abortion practices nationally;
4) deny health coverage to all "real" Christians; and
5) institute the reign of the Antichrist.

Have I left anything out?

;-)

[Lautremont]

12. Are you currently fighting for universal, single-payer health care?

[ProSense]

13. Do you think that single payer will be initiated state by state given the provision in the bill? n/t

[Lautremont]

14. Do you always answer a question with a question?

[ProSense]

18. Do you always pose litmus test questions to mask that you have no rebuttal to the OP? n/t

[Lautremont]

19. I guess the answer to my second question is yes.

My, you're touchy.

[freddie mertz]

15. I guess the answer is no then?

How about a public option?

Do we still need or want that now?

Or is the great victory enough for you for the rest of your life?

[ProSense]

17. delete n/t