I'm so sick of these 'She's a terrible mother' threads

[Debi]

I think the choice of Sarah Palin to be McCain's VP is a joke and she is being used as a pawn and a thumb to the nose w/fingers waving at voters who supported Hillary Clinton. BUT....

I can't believe some of the 'progressive' posters who think that a woman's place is at home doting over their child...especially if the child is special needs. Somedays going OUT THERE isn't worth the strokes on my keyboard.

Joe will eat her lunch at the debates and she will probably be relegated to standing three steps back and two steps to the right of McCain (Cindy's spot is two steps to the left for photo ops). They'll have her speak when women's issues are the topic and she'll take the 'women aren't people, the are pets attitude the GOP has.

[XanaDUer]

1. I am over getting shocked at some of the sexist shit I see

on a so-called "progressive" website. My absolute fave was a post here, re H. Clinton, that said bros before hos.

Yup. On a liberal message board. Women, all women, who step out of line or do anything extraordinary compared to the majority of women, always get slammed on three things; motherhood or lack of it, their looks, and the biggee-the sexual "smear" ( she's a whore, slut, lesbian, c***).

It is disgusting. Let Palin's husband stay home with the special-needs' kid. As an unmarried, non-mother myself, I've learned to ignore it, but it does get difficult at times. And many times, women are harder on other women than even men are. Oppressed groups do tend to turn on each other b/c they cannot turn on their oppressors. Better to slam safe targets with misdirected bile.

Anyway, don't let it get you down. :hi:

[Debi]

3. Thanks and you are right - It probably stings me b/c I am the mother

of a wonderful disabled adult child. I questioned each and every move I made in his 19 years and hoped it was the right one and wondered how it would affect him later in his life. I also divorced his biological father when he was 2 1/2 and didn't have the choice to stay home 24/7 to provide for him. I don't know that doing so would have been best for him but don't question the mothers who made that choice (through the Spina Bifida Association we met other families of children with the same disability and saw how their family choices affected their children). When I married Debi Jr's now father I kept working and Debi Jr. went to school/child care/after school extra curricular activities. If I'd been a stay at home mom would he have had those real life experiences? I won't ever know.

I just think that parents who aren't harming their children have the right to raise them in the manner they believe is best for their child and their family. Even crazy-assed fundies who I whole heartedly disagree with on many many subjects.

There are many other reasons to attack Gov. Palin. Her choice to campaign for and maybe (ha ha no way) serve as Vice President of the United States while also being the mother of a child with special needs is not one of them.

If we progressives continue down that path only post-menopausal women or those who cannot have children will be allowed to serve as President/VP. We'll resort to forcing a physical examination of women before the campaign season to ensure that no babies will show up during her tenure. After all WHAT would America do with a woman who got pregnant and had a baby WHILE serving :wow: Oh my dear heavens!!!

[gateley]

2. I posted "who could leave such a special child at only three days old

to return to work? To whom could you entrust such a precious little person?

A DUer told me "You don't know. Don't go there." And s/he was right.

I'm always a big proponent of "walk a mile in my shoes", that we can't judge others on how WE would act because we don't know how we would act until we are in that very situation.

So I stand corrected, and chagrined.

As Joe and I have said so many times in Confession -- Bless me, Father, for I have sinned.

I hope I've learned a lesson.

[Debi]

4. It will make you feel better that she too Jr. to work with her

Yes, three days sounds like a quick return...but maybe for a woman who had been through it four times before and was in top physical condition it wasn't an issue. AND we don't know how strenuous of a day-to-day job being Governor of Alaska is (or how many hours she works at the office/at home).

:hug: We are all making judgments right now - and I know I'm knee jerking about THIS issue b/c it hits SO close to home. I keep thining I'll stay out of those bat-shit-insane threads and then a post will just get me all riled up. *sigh* 66 days to go.

[PatSeg]

5. I have feelings about the subject

and the whole thing makes me very uncomfortable as a woman and a mother, but its best to express my feelings privately as it sets so many people off.

[Debi]

7. I wish I had your will power

:hug:

[PatSeg]

8. Its just my opinions on parenting and children are very strong

and could rub some people the wrong way. I learned long ago to avoid certain confrontations as they are pointless.

I can, however, question her judgment about getting on a plane after her water started to leak at 8 months. That is just a basic common sense issue and she jeopardized her life and the life of her child.

[Debi]

9. I'm totally uneducated on that b/c I only had one child and

never actually went into labor. I figured that by #5 she knew her body. :shrug: I've stayed out of those threads b/c I had no idea about water breaking and labor, So I'll defer to you. (P.S. It doesn't break my heart that I never through the pain of labor....Debi Jr. and I bonded just fine w/out the whole experience :7)

[PatSeg]

10. Aw, you don't miss going into labor?

Well, can't blame you there!

I wonder if we're getting the whole story about this. She had already given birth to four children, she surely knew that once the water broke, she was in early stages of labor. Maybe the story was exaggerated.

I have to say this is the strangest VP choice I've ever seen. It should be interesting.

[Eurobabe]

6. My posts have been on message, just wait until Biden

debates her, she won't have a thread of credibility to stand on.

[jillan]

11. Debi - I have to disagree.

Unless Mr. Palin, or a close family member is going to step into the role of advocate for their child.

As a mother of two beautiful daughters, the oldest having multiple handicaps, and the younger born without handicaps, there is a difference. There is a difference from day one.

I tried to continue my life as it was. I had a fancy title and was making excellent money.
But - that meant missing out on therapies, early intervention programs and so on.
Doctors appointments always needed to be made. What about daddy? Daddy was at work as well.
So when I got pregnant again, I looked at my husband and said "I am a half-assed manager and a half-assed mother. After the baby is born, I'm going to work part-time". I am so fortunate that I was able to, even if it meant giving up alot. I looked at my priorities in a totally different light and realized what was most important to me.

My daughter with special needs is awesome, she is the sunshine of my life, a day doesn't go by where she doesn't make me laugh...but there have been health problems. I refused to let anything come in the way of her needs. She turned 21 yesterday, and every one of her birthdays is a celebration because she almost didn't make it several times throughout the years. You are damn right that I never left her side, except to sleep, during her illnesses. So don't insinuate that parents of special needs kids don't have to give up a thing, even if you never had to for your son.
And the benefit of my decision to put family first paid off for my second daughter, as she graduated with highest honors and received a full scholarship for an in-state university.

If women want to thumb their noses at women like me, so be it.
If Palin wants to let other people raise her children for her, fine.
If she doesn't want to be there for all the happy and sad times - her choice. I just hope she has a Valerie Biden-Owens type of person in her life. Because a child with Down's needs alot of care.


You are entitled to your own opinion, but please don't criticize other people whose priorities are different and who question Sarah Palin's character because she is willing to take on such an important job with a newborn with Down's Syndrome at home. Women like me give up alot less important jobs to care for their special child. And yes, I hope this comes up one day and some reporter with some balls asks her about this very thing. All we are hearing now is that she is so pro-life, she didn't abort her baby with Downs. Well hallelujah. But being pro-life also means that you are there for that child, even after they're born. As I said above, I just hope and pray for the sake of that baby, that she has a Valerie in her life, cuz I sure as hell don't think her hubby is going to give up his job working for a foreign oil company.(BP) Ha - here we go - another oilman in the Whitehouse.....


I posted a thread about this very topic yesterday and the responses I got ran the whole spectrum.
But the only responses I cared about were two. From a mother of a special kid, and another from a father of a special kid. The mom questioned my feminism (which is hysterically funny) - until I questioned her as to whether she has had to make any changes in her life for her child. Then all I got were crickets. The dad on the other hand agreed with me and thanked me for my thread. The rest of the people that insulted me for my lack of feminism just made me laugh. How could they possibly judge me when they have never walked a day in my shoes.

Aren't we lucky to live in a country where we not only can have this debate, but where are special kiddos have the right to an education? I thank god for the later every day of my life. And have watched this administration try to take some of those rights away.

The best thing that could come out of this whole topic is the discussion of healthcare.
What about the parents of special needs kids that don't have healthcare? Or any kids for that matter. In Arizona, they fall under SChip. You remember S-Chip? The bill that McCain voted against...

End of rant -

And I still love ya - even if we disagree ;)

[Debi]

12. I don't question a parent who chooses to stay home for their child

but what none of us know is how much Gov. Palin is actually missing in her child's life. She doesn't have a boss to say 'no you can't go to that appointment or class or therapy session', she takes her child to work with her, and we don't know how much her husband is home (we know he has time to sit in on her meetings and hang around in her office regularly and interfere in her ability to govern at times as well).

What I do know about commercial fishing in Alaska comes from the boys back home (Montana) that would road trip to AK for the summer and work on the boats for three months. They'd work on the boats for three days never going back on shore and then come in and be off for four days. I have no idea what Todd Palin's responsibilities are for BP - but again he has time to hang around when the Governor is at the capitol so he must not be in a high hours demand position. (and she does have other children at home that I would hope held lighten the household management load).

I have trouble with the word 'priority' and the words 'family first' as if a mother of a child with special needs who earns a living outside of the home has slacked off or belittled her 'priority' of her child or her family. As well as any question of Gov. Palin's morals (we can attack those w/in her idiotic political positions) because she chose to work w/her son so young. At the same time I cringe at her bullshit talk about God choosing her family to give this special gift. I don't know about you but when Debi Jr. was born my first thoughts were not 'Oh God, thank you for thinking I'm so damn wonderful that I can take this on'...they were more "What the HELL am I supposed to do NOW???" As for 'never' giving anything up for my son...that's a bit of a stretch...however if Debi Jr. had no disabilities whatsoever I would have missed work/social/political activities if he were ill or in the hospital & we don't know that Gov. Palin wouldn't do the same. We don't know so who are we to judge?

Just look at us...we have two wonderful kids with special needs...and we took different paths and both our kids turned out wonderful and as successful as they could be. And I agree, we can be on the opposite side of this issue and still have a great deal in common (and it pains me to even try to think good thoughts about Gov. Palin). After all - There just aren't that many women out in DUland that understand how absolutely YUMMY Hunter Biden is.

:hug: Thanks, P

Oh, and if you want to hit the 'google' there is a post out there w/McCain's shameful voting record and stances on healthcare/education/disability rights. If Gov. Palin (God Forbid) ends up being VP Palin I would hope that she bends the ear of the President about those issues...but I won't hold my breath. Maybe you and me can double-team and go out there and talk about what JRB has done and will do for people with disabilities compared to the GOP odd-couple! (After all, our cupcake voted for - and I think co-sponsored - IDEA back when the law was created! - we can be VERY proud of his record on taking care of our kids).

On edit:

I went back and forth with one poster who let me know how much help there was 'out there' for parents of children with special needs and that a mother of a special needs child should stay home. I kept asking if they were a disability advocate - they kept going round and round and finally just called me petty and never really answered what I asked. I wish I could have found out more about all that help 'out there'....do you know of any? I hate to keep people who don't have kids w/special needs out of this conversation but I also think you and me and the few others out there are the only ones who KNOW. (you know?). And obvioulsy even we can't agree! :crazy:

[jillan]

13. Do you get services thru Title 19? Like respite, habilitation, and all that?

We do, altho I don't use respite that much right now since I'm not working.
I just found out that I can become my daughter's habilitation worker.
:) I just have to take some classes, and I will get paid from the state.

But even with those services, we only get 720 hrs per year, which is nothing.

When I was working, I would use up those hours quite easily, and that wasn't even for what it was intended for - a break!

About the back and forth - I'm just staying out of it out there.
There is no right answer except what works for each person. I just have strong feelings about someone who is a heartbeat away from the President to have a child that might need alot of medical care. Down's kids can have alot of problems with their heart.

How old is your son? He is definitely higher functioning than my daughter. The most she ever got involved in this campaign was one time when I had the tv on, must've been set to C-Span, and I wasn't in the room. Biden came on, and she ran and got me....saying "Biden! Biden!Biden!" It was great. Other than that, she thinks it's hysterically funny to tell me that she's going to vote for John McCain. She'll get on her bus in the morning and look at me and say "I'm a republican" and start cracking up just to piss me off.
I don't know about your son, but Jenny is the sweetest, most loving, funniest person there is.
Lot's of these kids are like that. So innocent, so lovable.

[Debi]

14. He's on SSI now and was on the HCBWP before that

and we used both respite and home health services and now also use SCL so that Mom and Dad aren't doing everything (he didn't want us at school or there during speech team/play practice). Now that he's focusing on physical independence (as much as he can reach) we are trying to NOT help him as much as possible. The more he either learns to do himself or learns to direct his care giver to assist him the sooner he can go into either a group home or independent living situation.

I'll PM you all the particulars of his disabilities. He's 19 (20 in November) and was able to audit college classes for two semesters. We're trying to find a kind professor who will let him do it for another semester or two before we start looking at voc rehab. I hate to think that he's headed toward doing what he'll do the rest of his life - all young people deserve to have some social growth time before they enter the workforce full time and that's what college is for (at least I think).

So Yeah...I received services (Iowa is an incredible state to have a child with special needs...thank you Tom Harkin!) but the poster who was letting me know about all the services 'out there' couldn't provide any specific information on services, only that they were 'out there'. And you know that no amount of services 'out there' make up for what you put physically/financially/emotionally into making your child's life as 'normal' as possible.

Are you looking a CDAC for your daughter? Although SSI/Title XIX will only provide a limited number of hours you should be eligible for more hours under the HCBW programs (either MR/BR or Ill & Handicapped). Let's talk by PM. Since you are already providing the care there is no reason why you shouldn't be receiving the maximum amount of pay you can get for it (no matter what you receive - it will still be less than the government would pay if you even were to institutionalize her.....I shudder at that word and at the thought!)

Oh, and a classmate of Debi Jr.'s (who is up at a independent living school in MN) told me she was voting for McCain - I told her to look up his record on healthcare/disability assistance and look around her campus. Under President McCain I'm betting that school would not even exist!