No Joe?

[gateley]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x6493840

[Muttocracy]

1. would have liked to see Biden or Kerry or Feingold go

but maybe he's angling for the military link. Could be a lot worse.

[gateley]

2. You may be right -- the military link.

Makes sense.

Probably choosing people with HEFT to counteract the strong military chops McCain's adviser, Lieberman, brought to his trip to Iraq. :sarcasm:

I was unfamiliar with Reed so looked him up -- impressive!

[Inuca]

12. Indeed, on military issues

Reed is better than Biden. Here is a local article from RI focusing on Reed and his credentials, quite interesting http://www.projo.com/news/content/reed_obama_iraq_14_07-14-08_12ARO00_v11.403774e.html Hagel had to be brought along, since it is a congressional delegation which is required to be bipartisan, and I doubt there were many takers on the R side of the isle. OTOH, I am not all clear whether Reed and Hagel will also accompany Obama on the European trip, I skimmed through several press reports, some say yes, some say no, so I assume they actually have no idea. If they do, then Biden would have been a good addition. Is three like the magical number on these kind of trips, just wondering...

[Muttocracy]

3. LA Times version

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/07/obama-iraq-trip.html

Perhaps inadvertently, Sen. Barack Obama tonight lifted a bit of the secrecy surrounding his upcoming trip overseas, telling reporters aboard his campaign plane that Sen. Jack Reed might accompany him to Iraq along with sometimes Republican Sen. Chuck Hagel.

When a reporter asked what might make Sen. Joe Biden and Hagel good traveling companions to Iraq, Obama made a very revealing correction:“It’s actually Sen. Hagel and Sen. Reed who may be coming with us.”

Well, now! So Biden, who says he doesn't work for anybody else, is not going with Obama? What's that do to the guessing game about the freshman Illinois senator's vice presidential pick, which had previously focused on Biden's foreign policy experience and his reported upcoming travels with Obama?

Democratic presidential nominee to be Barack Obama answering press questions on his campaign plane

And does this put Reed of Rhode Island, a three-term ex-House member, two-term senator and ex-Army Ranger, into the VP mix?

continues...

[gateley]

4. Hmm. Shall I read into that as a slap?

What do you take from this?

And I love the "... sometimes Republican Sen. Chuck Hagel."

[Muttocracy]

5. I'm not clear on whether that was how the reporter found out about Reed

from Obama's correction - or whether they're making a big deal about him correcting a reporter for slipping and saying Biden instead of Reed.

:shrug:

[gateley]

6. Okay --

Here's how I read it (this should clear up any questions :7).

I think when the reporter asked about Biden, Obama put the kibosh on that line of thinking by mentioning Reed. Like Reed and Hagel. Period.

Now that we've got that cleared up,

what I'm wondering if Obama NOT taking Joe along is a slap in Joe's face.

I THINK the reporter may be wondering the same thing, hence the reference kind of wondering if Biden was out of the VP pool (which the pundits have had him in, never mind that Joe says he hasn't been asked.)

Armchair political wisdom.

[Muttocracy]

7. seem like it's saying no to Biden as VP

though still, if I was going to Iraq, I'd take the SFRC Chairman with me over the other two? :shrug:

Not taking Biden along seems like no to VP, maybe even no to Sec. of State.

Taking Biden along could have meant either VP, Sec. of State, or just SFRC Chairman he'll be working with in the future.

For today, I'm thinking I want Biden to stay right where he is. Dodd for majority leader. Kerry for Sec of State. Someone else for VP.

[gateley]

8. But one of Joe's "people"

intimated that Joe would like SOS. I want him to have it, damn it!

I hope Obama's not ruffled because Joe was so adamant about not wanting the VP slot. I hope he (Obama) isn't one of those politicians who get their ego out of whack and jettisons the offending person from their orbit.

[Inuca]

13. I think that we

(and most definitely the media) are spliting hairs. The focus of the trip seems to be on military issues, getting feedback, information, etc. The policy making part will take place back in Washington. Have a look at the article I linked to above. Reed seems to have unique conections in Iraq and I would guess he has been there more than most (if not all). And again, Hagel had to come because he is a R (whatever the LAT article means by "sometimes Republican"). As to the VP implications/specualtions, again, splitting hairs and reading tea leaves. I am not at all sure that it means anything beyond the fact that Obama values their advice and expertise and that, as the article mentions, the three of them get along very well, which is always a plus on a trip like this.

On a side note, I heard in the news today that Obama will also be visiting the West Bank and meet with Abbas.

[gateley]

14. God -- you're so right!

We split hairs, assume that every action has a REAL, UNDISCLOSED meaning behind it, read into things, and think we know what's REALLY happening. Too funny. Oh well, but it keeps me off the streets. :)

[Inuca]

16. Yeah, but I never said that

splitting hairs is not fun! "off the streets" - you are not a teenager, right :-)?

[gateley]

17. Oh - so agree -- it's loads of fun! And we'll all continue to enthusiastically

partake!

I'm only a teenager in my mind, sadly. :(

[Inuca]

19. Hey, my teenage years

(long gone) were among my most miserable, I take things much easier now, so there advantages to graying hair :-).

[jillan]

21. That is so true.

I have definitely reached those "whatever!" years.

[Muttocracy]

22. :-)

[jillan]

9. Now that didn't bother me.

When I heard it on one of the Sunday shows, I wondered why not Joe, but than thought maybe-

*Biden didn't want to go because of some scheduling conflict.

*Obama thought if he took Joe it would be too obvious that he was going to pick him for Veep :P.

*We know Obama uses Biden and Kerry for foreign relations advice, and now he is turning to two people that he hasn't yet picked their brains.

Just some thoughts that went thru my head.



edit to add - what is Reed's position on Iraq? Kerry's and Biden's are similar.
Maybe that had something to do with it.

[jillan]

10. This is from the Boston Globe ~

Obama praises Sens. Reed, Hagel as "good guys"
Email|Print|Single Page| Text size – + July 13, 2008
SAN DIEGO—Barack Obama is praising Rhode Island Sen. Jack Reed as a good guy with foreign policy expertise.

Reed, a Democrat, and Nebraska Republican Sen. Chuck Hagel will be joining Obama on his upcoming trip to European capitals and U.S. battlefronts in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Both have been mentioned as potential Obama vice presidential running mates.

Hagel served as an Army sergeant in Vietnam and was twice wounded in 1968, earning two Purple Hearts. Reed, a West Point graduate, was a former Army Ranger and paratrooper.

Obama praised the two, calling them "good guys" and experts on foreign policy who avoid partisan politics and instead try to get the facts right and make a determination about what's best for U.S. interests.
---------------------------

On one of the Sunday shows someone said if Obama picks someone with strong foreign relations experience as VP, it will almost be an admission that Obama needs help in that area.
That really made me think.

[gateley]

11. Interesting point (about picking a strong FP person may show lack of experience.)

It's just driving me nuts.

I agree that Hagel and Reed (what little itty bit I know) are good guys.

Insight Flash! You know something? The first rule for VP is don't overshadow the Prez. If Obama took Biden to Iraq, reporters might be more inclined to ask HIM questions than ask Obama. And if they asked them BOTH, Obama's responses would sound pretty lame in comparison to Joe's (just sayin'). So maybe that's why O didn't pick Joe - ego and strategy.

I can see Hagel quietly standing in the background more easily than I can see Joe doing that.

[jillan]

15. Heard on Andrea Mitchell's show today that

Joe is working with Susan Rice as Obama's fp advisor.

[Inuca]

18. Actually, I think she said

that they both were part of a conference call that took place today and they reacted to the nonsense accusations (that Obama and the dems want to lose in Iraq in order to win politically) made earlier by Lidsay Graham and a McCain advisor with a long name that I do not remember. Which OTOH does not invalidate what you said, which is most likely true.

[jillan]

20. You are so right :)

It was one of those - I had the tv on but was doing other stuff, heard Biden's name mentioned with Susan Rice and my ears perked up.

:

Then came to DU and found out what was really going on.

[Muttocracy]

23. great picture :-)