The answer to an inevitable Bush legislative victory is MAKE IT A BIGGER VICTORY FOR BUSH?

[Proud2BAmurkin]

by trashing Democrats for not putting up a fake fight they would not only lose but would damage themselves in the process?

Cool!

[nadinbrzezinski]

1. Hate to tell you this, but talking gun and aiming at your foot

and pulling trigger because a two year old is pulling a tenter tantrum is not the fault of the two year old, but the irresponsible parent that pulls that trigger

[Proud2BAmurkin]

5. Who's the two year old and parent and gun in this scenario

:shrug:

[nadinbrzezinski]

8. Two year old is George, obviouly

he held his breath until he was blue in the face

The parent was the US Congress.

Need I explain this one?

Mommy, mommy I want a new bike! (funding)


No (First bill)

But (hold breath, blue in face... aka VETO)

Ok junior, here you go, new bike... enjoy junior

[Proud2BAmurkin]

15. Except Bush doesn't have to hold his breath, he already has the new bike in the bag

so putting up a fight only to get defeated only makes the mommy look weak in the end

[nadinbrzezinski]

18. My point

the dems look extremely weak right now

The made a cardinal mistake of warfare (and politics is a form of warfare) they let the other side choose the terrain for the battle, and the time too. that sun is behind the Republicans, and is blinding our troops

[azurnoir]

Hate to tell you

The presedent is not a two year old and over simplifying only proved the posters point, but if trashing Dems make4s you feel better go for it the pukes are luvvin every minute of it.

[nadinbrzezinski]

12. Hate to tell you this but if you need complexity I will give it to you

people are pissed, they see this as a neville chamberlain moment, enabling the current wrong headed policy

Did you listen to Hartman Today?

if you did you caught Ratner from DC.

She stated what I feel right now, this vote might have lost the 2008 election

It is called a STRATEGIC MISTAKE

To paraphrase Tzun Tsu, you do not let the enemy choose the terrain you shall fight your battles on. We just did

[azurnoir]

17. The terrain was choosen in 2000 and again in 2004

[nadinbrzezinski]

19. We just surrendered it

that vote will be transformed into the Achilles heal of 2008

Mark my words

Oh and back in November, we retook it

[annabanana]

2. This isn't that hard.

The people aren't as stupid as they seem..
FIRST.. Don't let the media play fast & loose with the "fund the troops" vs "fund the escalation" dodge.. Make sure no one is saying our kids will be left without food & water in the desert

THEN get out there and tell them "We know he's going to veto it. .and we know the Repugs are still rubberstamping his bloody murderous agenda and they have enough votes to sustain the veto.. But we want everyone to go on record as to whether or not they think the war should go on forever."

They watch enough "Law & Order" to know what "sustain" means.

[Proud2BAmurkin]

6. "don't let the media play fast and loose with "fund the troops"? How exactly

do you not "let" them do that?

[annabanana]

7. By correcting them when they conflate as if they were the same thing.

[azurnoir]

20. You do understand that

the funds for troops in Iraq are separate from the general military budget? And that this bill is what the pukes would not pass last year, just to create this situation?

[nadinbrzezinski]

23. Another principle of warfare

to be able to tell when or where the enemy shall attack...and the dems walked into the ambush

[annabanana]

24. Are you saying that NOT passing the supplemental

WOULD strand them without food & water in the desert wtih no way home?

[nadinbrzezinski]

25. Taht is the republican talking point

DOD would have had to move money and fast, but those needs would have been met, at least the minimal ones

And in the end they might have had to pull out

[annabanana]

26. THAT'S what I'm saying.. This is a fact that is NEVER brought up

by Dems... It could help us get off the goddam defensive

[nadinbrzezinski]

27. Outside the beltway we see this

but inside... its all about their next election.

That is why I am seriously smelling a third party challenge to BOTH parties

(no not the greens, but a surprise, out of the blue move... oh and not bloomberg either)

[azurnoir]

28. with who's permission?

But I give up lets trash the shit out Dems scream for Nancy's and Harry's impeachment and gee we'll probably get our wish.

[BuyingThyme]

3. How could they lose?

[azurnoir]

13. They are not holding the veto pen

Do you really think a he said -she said between the WH and Congress would be helpful? That is what would have happened with the stuck in the middle of it, while still fighting.

[BuyingThyme]

16. That's a Puke talking point.

The troops are already stuck in the middle of it.

[azurnoir]

29. No its the truth you done want to hear n/t

[BuyingThyme]

Nope. 100% nonsense. Pure Kool Aid.

If a deadlock went on for over six months, it still wouldn't take money from the troops on the ground. The money they just approved is an "emergency" supplemental and there's enough money in the defense budget proper to keep things going for quite some time.

[atreides1]

4. They Could Have Put up a real fight

The polls are in their favor right now and they didn't take advantage of that, who knows what mood the American people are going to be in whne election time rolls around?

And what happens in September? Will they put up a real fight or just repeat what they did this time, and sign that blank check?

How many more have to die or be maimed before they stand up and fight for real regardless of what might happen?

[AndyA]

9. And that is pretty much the nitty gritty of it.

When are the Dems going to stop playing with the troops lives and stand up for what is right, irregardless of the consequences?

And if they can't/won't do it now with the vast majority of the public supporting them, when can we depend on them to do the right thing? :shrug:

[Proud2BAmurkin]

10. A fight they would inevitably lose, this round. They can keep working for a veto proof

majority but until then why do something futile if there is blowback from it?

[magellan]

30. You mean as opposed to the blowback they face now?

[ninkasi]

33. The feeling I get

from talking to different relatives and friends, is that even without the votes to overturn a veto, this was a kind of "Alamo" thing, where even if we lost in the end, we ending up gaining respect for standing for something, and for at least attempting to fight.

[gravity]

11. NADER 2008

Woooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Who cares about accomplishing something when you can vote your heart?

[nadinbrzezinski]

14. Won't be ralphie

but don't be too surprsied if we hae a surprise third party.

[BuyingThyme]

21. There is NOTHING that Pelosi could have done to hand Bush

a bigger victory.

Worst speaker ever.

[mmonk]

22. You're right of course. Why couldn't I have seen this more clearly.

By wanting the democrats in congress to put up more of a fight against bush now that they are the majority party in Congress, I'm giving bush a bigger victory. I have to quit supporting bush like this. Thanks for clearing that up. I get so confused over this politics thing sometimes. Even though we're the majority in congress now, we must keep being as the last six years the only party in congress that compromises. Gotcha.

[DU GrovelBot]

31. ## PLEASE DONATE TO DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND! ##

==================
GROVELBOT.EXE v4.0
==================



This week is our second quarter 2007 fund drive. Democratic
Underground is a completely independent website. We depend on donations
from our members to cover our costs. Thank you so much for your support.

[BlooInBloo]

32. Dems' fault, of course. They're gonna bitch no matter what you do....

... may as well do the right thing, jackasses.