IL and NY DUers: Tracking the Obama and Clinton votes in time

[BurtWorm]

I called Hillary Clinton's NYC office today at about 5:00, just after I heard there would be a vote tonight. I was given an obviously canned statement about changing direction in Iraq. I then asked the staffer if he knew what her vote would be. He paused then said, "I don't know. She hasn't shared that." Another pause, and I said, "I hope she will vote--" and I was interrupted. "Thank you," the staffer said. "--against the supplemental." "Thank you," he repeated and that was the conversation. No questions about whether I was a NYer. No interest in my thoughts. Just a rapid race to the hangup.

So I was left thinking, is this staffer just an ignoramus or incompetent who doesn't know his boss's mind on a vote that has been in the news for two full days? That didn't seem likely. Chances were, I thought, that Clinton was purposely keeping everyone in the dark until the vote. I was surprised when I saw that she had voted "nay." I was sure that her office was acting like one of a Democrat planning to disappoint the liberals for the sake of wooing the "moderates"--Clinton's usual MO for the last six years and change. But when I saw the "nay" vote, I wondered if maybe it was just that staffer who was in the dark after all. Maybe.

Just now, I read on TPM a comment that HRC and Obama had waited until after the votes had been counted and knew the bill would pass to decide to vote against it. My experience with HRC's office certainly doesn't contradict that scenario. Can anyone point me to a reference somewhere, besides a casual remark or comment on a blog, to verify that?

I also wonder what other people's experience calling Clinton's and Obama's offices were during the day. Was anyone at any time told how the Senator would vote? Or did others get the brush-off I got?

[PBass]

1. I live in NY and call Clinton's office regularly.

I always assume that the people answering the phones are interns and college students, with no special insight or access to the Senator.

They probably wanted to get you off the phone quickly because the phones to the capitol were absolutely jammed today. The faster they can mark down your commment in the correct column (pro, con) the faster they can get to the next call. I try to explain my rationale when talking to these folks, but I know full well that the details will be lost once we hang up, and my comment will be converted into a simple pro or con vote to be tallied.

I have noticed (like you) that Clinton's office doesn't ask for an address all the time (I always start my call by saying that I'm a constituent though). Every once in a while they'll ask for a name and address but not as often as other Congresspeople do, in my experience. Maybe they have a caller ID system and already know where your call is coming from, I don't know.

[BurtWorm]

5. However, I have called and been told how she would vote before.

This was her NYC office, by the way. It could be a little different there. They could be a little more in the dark than the DC office. :shrug:

[illinoisprogressive]

2. Okay, all of them knew how the vote would go. No big news to them.

Obama always waits until late to cast his vote on anything. It's his way. He never votes early. period.
Plus, Obama was blogging on his site about the fact that he would vote no and why before the voting started. See MYDD for the story.
Plus, anyone who actually believes that the senators did not know how the vote would go is really silly.
If anything at all, clinton was waiting for obama to vote and he had a little fun with her by languishing with some guys before he voted.
there is no conspiracy. There is no sneaky evil reason.
whether they voted early or late is of no difference since everyone already knew how the voting was going to go in the first place.
end of story.

[BurtWorm]

3. That makes a lot of sense.

I didn't get the impression that the charge is "conspiracy," but, rather, the more plausible one of being sure they don't get blamed for the negative consequences of voting for a bill that passes (like IWR, for instance). Fair or not, true or not, a lot of us NYers see Clinton as an overly cautious politician, unwilling to risk seeming to be on any side of a divide. Her late (and belated) steps toward being where the majority of Americans clearly are is viewed (maybe unfairly, who knows?) as opportunistic. It would seem to be like her to want to be absolutely certain she could cast a vote that looked brave but had little risk of endangering her the way her IWR vote endangered her by making her readable (i.e., as a war supporter in a war opposing environment--now she may be more readable as a war opponent, but the wind seems to have taken her there).

I am totally aware that this reading of HRC may be as fictional as the right-wing's reading of her. I am almost helpless to read her any other way, however, until I see stronger evidence of a principled person acting in good faith in her shoes.

PS: It's somewhat uncomfortable having a Senator do the right thing (whereas Schumer didn't even vote!) and not being able to trust that she did it for a good reason. And I honestly don't know whether the problem is her or me.

[EFerrari]

4. Schumer didn't vote?

[BurtWorm]

6. According to the Times, no he did not.

My wife thought it might be because of a Jewish holiday (Lag B'Omer)--but Lieberman voted. And Schumer himself appeared earlier this evening to announce the no-confidence vote on Gonzalez. Schumer apparently just decided not to vote. :shrug:

[EFerrari]

7. I'm going not to say anything now.

:nuke:

[Nite Owl]

8. I read something about

Schumer being sick. I think he was being treated for Lyme disease.

Here's a link: http://www.newsday.com/news/local/state/ny-bc-ny--schumer-lymedisea0524may24,0,1809978.story?coll=ny-top-headlines


Says it wasn't bad so it could be an excuse for not voting either way. He should at least be saying how he would have voted.

[BurtWorm]

9. He was well enough to announce the date for the no-confidence vote

against Gonzalez. Then again, maybe he thrives only when the spotlight is shining directly on him. ;-)

[Nite Owl]

11. I just wish he'd

see the light!

[City Lights]

10. I spoke to Obama's office yesterday morning, and at that time the person

I spoke to said he didn't know how Obama was going to vote.