Der Spiegel accidentaly jumps the gun, revealing tantalizing details of imminent WikiLeaks release.

[Poll_Blind]

Oh, I just love shit like this. Well, Der Spiegel accidentally posted a Q&A about what are probably going to become known as the 'Embassy Files'. Here is the link to Der Spiegel where it was posted but the page has been removed. However, at least two different WikiLeaks-watching organizations caught the information before it was removed and here is a tantalizing glimpse and what is about to be released.

Before I continue, all the content in this message comes from two websites. All hail, them. They are:
WL Central
Owni.fr

More information than what I've posted is contained on those sites, so visiting them will yield more details for the curious.

:redbox: 251,287 diplomatic cables will be released.
:redbox: 8,000 directives from the State department.
:redbox: 15,652 documents are classified ’Secret’- none 'Top Secret'
:redbox: Included are 251,287 cables and 8,000 diplomatic directives
:redbox: One cable dates back to 1966, but most are newer than 2004
:redbox: 9,005 documents date from the first two months of 2010

The following is a map showing the distribution of classified cables by country/region.



If you were hoping for stunning revelations about Algeria, for instance...you're probably out of luck. Just about every place else though and... :evilgrin:

Wikileaks partners are The New York Times, The Guardian, Le Monde, El Pais and Spiegel. They have had prior access to the files and reviewed them. These are the guys who're going to be dropping the biggest bombshells first because they've had more time to sort through the epic amount of information. However, expect such a huge amount of data to produce revelations of both major and minor magnitudes for weeks if not months.

PB

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

1. No wonder the "diplomats" are scurrying around trying to cover their sorry assess.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

3. exactly what is wrong with diplomats if i may ask since you sound derisive about them? n/t

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

6. I have nothing against diplomacy - if conducted in the open.

What these guys are doing is trying to hide what they've done from the common herd, the ones most effected by their antics.

“The shepherd always tries to persuade the sheep that their interests and his own are the same.” Marie Beyle

[qazplm]

8. sometimes diplomacy needs to be conducted in secret

yes?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

10. Does it? Really?

Why is that? Are the common people not to be trusted? Or, are they mere pawns to be used by the diplomats and have to live (and/or die) because of the secret agreements?

[qazplm]

12. yes, really

and it has little to do with the "common people" and everything to do with the fact that nations compete and sometimes you'd like to discuss something with an ally without exposing all for a rival.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

60. You need to read "The CIA and the Cult of Intelligence" by Victor Marchetti

a former CIA officer.

The thesis of his book was that all the countries knew what the others were up to because they had all infiltrated or compromised one another and that the main reason for "top secret" classifications was to prevent the people of their own nation from learning what dirty tricks they were up to.

[provis99]

21. that you for that Authoritarian Commentary of the Day.

[qazplm]

23. lol

thank you for the extreme response of the day.

Nothing authoritarian about that.

[backscatter712]

42. Sometimes whistleblowing is necessary...

so the crooks robbing us blind can't just hide behind the veil of National Security.

[qazplm]

54. sometimes it is

I dont think diplomatic cables are generally one of those times.

[JackRiddler]

70. Please reconcile the current level of secrecy with a democratic system. Thanks.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

11. i would have to disagree somewhat to be honest

the goal of a diplomat is to achieve the goals of their country, you do not always want your opposite to know those exact goals even if you are the closest of allies.

I see nothing wrong in the orders they have been given being 'hidden' since it tends to be hard to achieve ones goals if the opposition knows what the US in this case really really thinks about the topic discussed and exactly what they want to achive(compared to what they pretend they want).

All I know is that I hope for Wikileaks sake that each of those documents shows some involvement with something that is illegal(if only slightly), if they are just diplomatic documents with nothing illegal et al then i hope they throw the book at those responsible for releasing the documents(if it causes damage to the US or one of the countries it relates to)

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

15. I'd much rather know what they're doing in my name.

And, what effect it's going to have on people. I don't buy into the "Daddy knows best" theory of government, particularly in an alleged democracy where "the people" are supposed to rule.

[qazplm]

17. so

we should put every plan we have out there right?

Every single contingency, every single war plan, every single economic strategy, and we should ignore any demands by our allies that we keep things secret just so "the people" can know 100 percent what is going on.
We'll just ignore the damage such revelations will have on the nation and in fact on "the people" by doing so.
I suspect most of "the people" would prefer some things remain secret because they understand the need when dealing with other nations that do not have our best interests at heart (nor is anyone arguing they should).

[Pavulon]

19. Then a representative democracy may not be a great place to live

for you.

[qazplm]

24. seriously

this is not a direct democracy, and for good reasons.

[Pavulon]

27. See cali votes on gay marriage for rabble based politics.

never underestimate average and then remember half the people you meet are even dumber.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

33. Especially if they're kept in the dark about what our "leaders" are doing.

[Pavulon]

37. Sorry friend, thats not how it works here.

you want to know get elected and serve on the senate armed services committee. get it?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

30. How the hell do we know if they're representing us if they're doing it in secret?

Isn't the very idea of democracy that "the people" get to decide their own fates? How are we to do that if we aren't allowed to know what the politicians are doing?

[qazplm]

32. we aren't a democracy

we are a democratic republic.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

36. With an uninformed electorate that's kept in the dark by the bosses..who know what's best for us.

Got it.

[Pavulon]

39. Get elected, serve on the right

committee. thats how it works. this is not hacker land ethos, all information will not be free.

[Pavulon]

35. FIOA thats your check. You dont get a say. You dont get read in on CIA

operations prior to kickoff. Not now, not ever. You are not participating in reality if you think this will ever happen. It was never considered during the church commission, and it will not happen now.

read, learn, understand.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

38. And, the humanitarian CIA has worked in our interests ever so well.

And, you're right. It will never happen as long as we accept our fate as pawns in their games.

[Pavulon]

40. You can vote or pick up a fucking gun and go to work

the system is there for a reason. dont like it , change it.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

44. Or, don't go along with it. Like Assange is doing.

I had enough guns while taking orders derived from secret diplomacy and issued by good little robots who questioned nothing the bosses decided.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

46. Is any harm to the US or its allies acceptable for you to know exactly what is going on? nt

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

47. I'm a helluva lot more worried about what they're doing in secret.

Our "allies" have been dragged into wars, murdered, had their governments overthrown, by our secret diplomacy. Our own citizens have been sent off to kill and die because of secret agreements between governments. We have been duped into paying for wars manufactured by secret diplomacy.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

51. I should read that as a 'yes' then? n/t

[qazplm]

53. of course it is a yes

when you view the US as the source of all evil in the world, then why wouldn't you?

[qazplm]

52. ah yes

the we are the source of all evil and war in the world argument.

Silly, ridiculous, wrong, but terribly predictable.

I'm not happy when our government is embarrassed or when something harms our standing or ability to act in our own self-interest in the world generally speaking. You clearly are quite excited about such possibilities.

[boppers]

65. ...or pick up a fucking keyboard and go to work.

Turns out that a few keystrokes can shape the world in ways a gun never could.

[moodforaday]

69. "achieve the goals of their country"

Bodhi BloodWave: "the goal of a diplomat is to achieve the goals of their country"

I wonder if you've read any Howard Zinn. Zinn's argument, convincing to me - is essentially that your statement quoted above is greatly misleading. There are no "goals of a country". Countries to not have goals, people do. So you have to ask: whose goals? Are they yours? Or those of the few biggest corporations at the top of the food chain? Those of a political party, or an economic class?

And, you know, this analysis works. Which of YOUR goals did the bloodshed and destruction in Iraq accomplish, for example? Mm, I didn't think so.

[Posteritatis]

2. Is it odd that I'm instantly curious about the 1966 one? (nt)

[CreekDog]

4. DeGaulle complained that LBJ stunk up the bathroom right before he was gonna use it

[WinkyDink]

43. LBJ probably planned it!

[Poll_Blind]

45. There HAD to be a SECOND SHITTER! n/t

PB

[Saokymo]

5. Not really

I'm most curious about that one, too. I know we've been doing shady things in the 2000's, but what have they dredged up from 1966?

[Poll_Blind]

7. Just remember these documents were pulled up allegedly by a 23 year old...

...so to know the mind of the searcher is to possibly know what the search result contains.

With that in mind, it's almost surely something salacious in the extreme. :evilgrin:

PB

[FarCenter]

59. If these could be accessed by a 23-year old nobody, wouldn't all spy agencies have them alrea

Professional diplomats and intelligence analysts around the world probably already know all the "embarrasing" details from their own espionage sources?

It is just the clueless public that they want to keep in the dark.

Can't have reality mucking up the manipulation of public opinion.

[Turborama]

13. I'm going through Wikipedia's 1966 page to check out what happened that year

Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1966

[Poll_Blind]

16. WWBMSF? (What Would Bradley Manning Search For?) that would hit on '66?

That's what I'm lovin' the thought of right now.

PB

[Pavulon]

18. How much we have to pay to fix this is my question

no other question, we're not going to quit so we pay to make nice nice.

[Poll_Blind]

20. Maybe we should start acting in a way that our secret-holders feel is honorable?

Instead of just bribing people maybe there's something a little more complex at play, don't you think?

The main reason individuals with security clearances expose classified material in this manner is they believe there is no other way to stop the corruption/illegal acts.

The people who leak this information do so at their greatest personal expense. They're not looking for remuneration, they're upholding an ethic- potentially at dear cost to their lives and futures.

I read your words and they seem to imply a filter in which you view these events as merely acting-out for a payoff.

PB

[kgnu_fan]

22. It is like a family secret. Just like on-going incest, or clergy abuse, breaking silence is

the first step.

[Poll_Blind]

26. +1

PB

[kgnu_fan]

28. And the power holders are scared of the truth of their ugliness

[Pavulon]

31. No they know how fucking stupid people are and require secrecy

to conduct state business. The cuban missile crisis could not have unfolded as it did with the rabble in the middle of it.

[kgnu_fan]

34. Ugly and violent --- but there are different ways of being in this world

[Pavulon]

29. Please. The world conducts diplomacy in secret. The ENTIRE world..

it is childish to suggest that will (or should) ever change. You are supporting an asshole fucking up diplomacy. He is not disrupting the war or warfighting systems.

Only DIPLOMATS..

[kgnu_fan]

41. "Coercive Diplomacy" by Daniel Ellsberg, have you read it?

“Coercive Diplomacy” in the Light of Vietnam

“Coercive Diplomacy” in the Light of Vietnam written November 9, 1970. An analysis of the Rolling Thunder bombing campaign against North Vietnam as an experiment in coercion, wrongly inspired by Kennedy’s successful threats in the Cuban Missile Crisis.

http://www.ellsberg.net/archive/coercive-diplomacy-in-the-light-of-vietnam

[Pavulon]

49. Will pick it up.. I can guess his perspective from a Bright and Shining lie

what he did does not equal what manning did.

[kgnu_fan]

55. Ellsberg himself said that their motivation is equal. Here is something you may be interested

http://www.ellsberg.net/archive/us-nuclear-war-planning-for-a-hundred-holocausts#more-248

U.S. Nuclear War Planning for a Hundred Holocausts



<snip>

[Pavulon]

56. Ellisberg was not trying to showoff on the internet. manning was. you can read his

confession online. So i disagree on that point.

[kgnu_fan]

57. I have read everything I can find on lamo and manning etc, came to a different conclusion than yours

[Pavulon]

58. manning he hated the army, got busted down for fighting

and dumped information for the lulz (being a showoff). Ellisberg was an officer and did not bump random diplomatic cables.

You conclusions are yours alone but my read is that he was a showoff and a shitty soldier before becoming a felon and traitor.

[Pavulon]

25. Nope sure dont. you dont beat scumback fuckers

by out loving them. The KKK was broken with money and people using methods conducted in private. The children who think that all diplomacy will be conducted in the open are just that. Irrelevant to the discussion at the adults table.

Manning wanted to show off, he was and is a dejected little asshole looking for lulz. you can read his confession on boingboing, stupid fucker confessed online.

It is far more complex and needs diplomats to have the ability to pass information in private.

You dont think the rest of the world conducts diplomacy in public do you?

[Soylent Brice]

62. holy shit

that's one hell of a year...

lot of war escalation in Vietnam, namely, as well as the formation of the Church of Satan, and on the lighter side of things a lot going on with the NHL. guess it was a big year for hockey and heathenism.

who knew?

interesting space exploration events as well.

that cable could be one of a million things. my money is on LBJ war escalation chatter.

[BlueMTexpat]

64. It could literally be anything. That was a very tumultuous year..

But my money - if I were a betting person - is that the cable might concern something related to these events, as cited in the wikipedia link provided (with embedded wikilinks leading to the individuals and events named):

January 10
The French paper L'Express publishes a story of Georges Figon, who took part in the kidnapping of Mehdi Ben Barka.

January 18
French police announce that Georges Figon has committed suicide, prior to his arrest for the kidnapping of Mehdi Ben Barka.

Yet another convenient "suicide" leaving a lot of unanswered questions .... It may seem quite small in the great scheme of things, but there were allegations (never completely disproven) that both the CIA and Mossad were very much involved in this kidnapping. Ben Barka, a very charismatic personality, was also known as the "Che" of the Arabic-speaking world. There was a huge diplomatic incident between France and Morocco as a result and De Gaulle was reportedly livid that the kidnapping had taken place on French soil with the participation of French security personnel, presumably without his knowledge or approval.
The kidnapping may have been one catalyst for the timing of this event - although there were other reasons why De Gaulle wanted out of NATO.

March 11
French President Charles De Gaulle states that French troops will be taken out of NATO and that all French NATO bases and HQ's must be closed within a year.

Of course, just looking through the list, there were a lot of coups, both successful and thwarted - against leaders around the globe whom the US was not particularly friendly with.

[laughingliberal]

48. That and what's in there about Columbia are at the top of my must read list.

Nothing would please me more than to see that incestuous CIA/Columbia party broken up.

[sarcasmo]

61. That date caught my attention too

[Bluebear]

63. Then we are both odd.

:)

That's what instantly caught my eye!

[Hissyspit]

9. Kick nt

[Poll_Blind]

14. UPDATE: Full release may come as soon as 1:30PM PST, 4:30PM EST or sooner.

Basing this off of some more information from Der Spiegel that was removed, the time quoted (2230) and their local time in Hamburg.

Also from The Guardian editor David Leigh via Twitter:

"The truth about the #wikileaks cables is going to come out in the #guardian soon"

Stay tuned to WikiLeaks Central, #StateLogs (French) and #WikiLeaks

Got better hashtags, live blogging sources or whatnot for this breaking news?

POST THEM!

PB

[Poll_Blind]

50. AFP: Italy's embattled Berlusconi calls rally of support (WikiLeaks corruption info)

Coming at a bad time for him, LOL!

From Google News/AP

ROME — Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi called Saturday for a rally of support ahead of parliamentary votes on his embattled government, as critics mocked its claim of a plot to destroy Italy's image.

Centre-right Berlusconi, who has been fighting off a series of scandals, called for a "big, big demonstration and a collection of signatures of support" in Rome on December 11 and 12.

He faces confidence votes in both the lower and upper houses of parliament on December 14 and, according to the Italian constitution, a loss in either house would force him to resign.

--snip--

The government said this "strategy" included reporting on the Naples garbage crisis, Italy's fears of negative repercussions from documents to be released by WikiLeaks, and an enquiry into the Finmeccanica group.

Remember, these diplomatic cables reveal extremely sensitive information about corruption of foreign officails as well as the other things.

:evilgrin:

Fucking eat shit, Silvio!

PB

[Rex]

66. Thems some big circles lot of hotspots.

[Dover]

67. Does anyone question all of this, the whole premise for the leaks and how it all came about?

Just curious if it's a way for the Western allies to put out some piece of info (buried in massive quantities of not-so-important info) that applies pressure on some issue or reveals something that they couldn't otherwise use openly as leverage? I just think if there was any real danger to us or our intelligence people we would have found a way to shut down the leaks by now.

At any rate, we'll see what pieces are picked up by the media for magnification, and see its effects.

[CJCRANE]

68. IMO it's basically a massive limited hangout.

My own worry is that this will swamp out other important issues like putting pressure on the Repubs to ratify the new START treaty.

[pauldp]

72. I tend to agree with you.

The Afghan war documents that Wikleaks released in July included information about the ISI funding and directing the Taliban in Afghanistan.
I saw a Democracy Now report right after and the journalists Amy Goodman was interviewing said the ISI info represented a massive story.
Of course we've heard little to nothing about that story from major media since. The limited hangout may not be Wikileaks intention, but that certainly seems to be how the MSM is dealing with it.

[gristy]

71. Do you really think it was an accident?

I can't imagine how one could have information to make such a conclusion.

[pleah]

73. K&R Keep it leaking.

[ooglymoogly]

74. Many of the posts I have "skimmed" on this OP are

of straw men and red herrings.

The state dept is corporate America's man in Washington; there to protect their god given right to steal the resources of less powerful countries, with force, if necessary. United Fruit; where Banana Republic was coined wherein the dictators it supported and the leaders it destroyed with the help of US authoritarian "diplomacy" to keep countries with vast resources in line; by choosing their dictators or assassinating or destroying democratically elected leaders. Perhaps the best example was Cuba and United Fruit; the vast oil reserves of Iraq, and Venezuela add infinitum; and the proof; the Chavez coup documented by "The Revolution will not be Televised" never refuted and never a peep from our own "MSM" (google that if you dare).

Amongst the many other deceits, the Wiki leaks will only confirm that; and that is what will be confirmed by these documents and that is what our "paternal" big brother government is afraid of. Pavulon and tag team; the intrepid and always "my country right or wrong bunch; will not ever deviate from promoting the authoritarian rights of "our" government to lie, to cheat, to steal, to grow ever more toward fascism; to work in secret against the interests of this country and its people while blatantly stealing and hording the worlds riches by the hands of a few ruthless greedy men. That is a given.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5832390545689805144#