So have we ceded so much power that we are picking a fight with a comedian??

[Skidmore]

Is this what we have come to? Parsing the words of a satirist while blatant propagandists and provocateurs lob Molotov cocktails in to the political discourse and try to sabotage civil rights and worker rights? Keep handing it over to them. Y'all got a winning strategy going here...

[Ozymanithrax]

1. Jon Stewart made the mistake of not being 100% with many of us as we thought...

Being only 90% or 78%, means that he is against us.
And many find that intolerable.

[Skidmore]

2. When we've reached the point where we are demanding

purity tests of people who have been our friends, then we are no better that the 'baggers, not one whit different than them. We have become what we despised. At this rate, we are assured of being busted back to pre-New Deal conditions and it will take as many generations to regain the lost ground.

[Ozymanithrax]

15. The polarization brought on by ideology driven media runs deep...

in our society.

[tularetom]

3. Glen Beck? Rush Limbaugh?

Actually you're right. I'm still curious to know just what it was that the man was saying. The whole interview was 20 minutes of my life I'll never get back.

I know it was an hour long interview. 20 minutes was all I could take.

[Cronus Protagonist]

4. I don't like Jon Stewart

As a person, he's fine, as a comedian, well, he may be great for some, but a quirky eyebrow raise is only good for a small smirk once or twice for me, not every show. Having said that, Jon is not the enemy; he's on our side and although he's trying to straddle a line to keep some sense of apparent objectivity so he can make mo'better jokes, that doesn't make him bad and wrong.

[Skidmore]

8. Exactly.

[EFerrari]

13. Do we have to mix up "bad" and "wrong"?

[ixion]

5. Voltaire, Swift, Shakespeare...Stewart is in good company. That's not who the fight is with, though

our fight is with the fascists in the government right here at home.

[Skidmore]

7. Then take it to the facists.

Or are we too afraid to do that? And I'm not just talking about the people we've elected, I'm talking about those that sit around here and parse and put together technical jargony political verbage and make up cutesy nicknames for everything and everyone they say they oppose--wastes of energy by people who fear.

[SidDithers]

6. K&R...nt

Sid

[Lucian]

9. Jon wants to play nice.

The past has shown that playing nice doesn't work.

[Skidmore]

10. So, the last time I checked, it is still legal for a person

in this nation to hold an opinion on any given topic. You don't agree, so be it. It is just as much his right as yours.

[Lucian]

11. I was stating a fact.

Not an opinion.

[EFerrari]

12. This thing is, when Beck attacks MSNBC or Code Pink

and defends Bush and the invasion, we push back. Pushing back when Stewart does it is just being consistent.

Stewart is not an open miker. He's an opinion leader a big audience and, like it or not, a gatekeeper now for political discourse.

Which brings up something remarkable about Rachel. Because she is a grown up, she knew there would be a big reaction to that interview and she invited her audience to write to her about it. Very smart. Respect the response, give people a way to channel their response into the habit of activism, keep the larger conversation going. That is how you take back the media.

[pacalo]

14. Yes, enough is enough. I've been harsh with Jon, but it was the montage that caused it.

It was the fear I had that the debate caused by the montage would spark the same anti-Keith Olbermann sentiment that Jon caused with "Crossfire". And Keith's suspension fed my fear.

I strive to be fair, & I promise you that if it had been Keith who had undermined Jon, I would have been just as harsh toward Keith in defending Jon.

Both are on our team -- of truth -- & both are just as valuable as the other. I'm ready to move on to focusing on more important concerns: preserving SS & having Congress use common sense in cutting the budget by eliminating $700 million tax cuts to the super rich.

[JackRiddler]

16. Your use of "we" is a hell of a rhetorical weasel.

Who are we?

What power did "we" cede, or have to cede?

Are the "we" who "ceded power" the same "we" who are "picking a fight with a comedian"?

Is this a fight, or are you so offended by a bit of critical thinking applied to said comedian that you're confusing criticism with punches? And isn't it possible to criticize a comedian and at the same time also raise objections to "blatant propagandists"?

Who is the "you" at the end of your "we" paragraph?

Have I also ceded power, because I'm criticizing -- oh, sorry, picking a fight with -- some person on the Internet who seems to be in the grip of a rhetorical hysteria out of proportion to the empirical referents?

Thanks for playing.

[Poboy]

20. Compelling questions Riddler. Lets see if they are answered. -nt

[Canuckistanian]

17. Tell me - who on the left is there to provide alternate media views?

We cheered him becuase there was NO ONE ELSE in popular media who challenged RW idiocy.

We thought Stewart was on our side. He ridiculed the same things we did. He was aghast at all the RW insanity, including the Teabaggers. It was like a breath of fresh air - FINALLY, someone was AGREEING with us. And on a MAJOR TV show, with MILLIONS of viewers.

And although he didn't specifically SAY he was a liberal or progressive, he sure talked like one. We honestly thought he was one.

Now, we're not so sure.

[stray cat]

18. Some people mistakingly though Jon was made in their image instead of an independent thinker

[madrchsod]

19. i have no idea what he said nor do i care

his vote counts just the same as mine.

[ZombieHorde]

22. He said TV pundents should use real debate and reflection, as opposed to

buzz words, stereotypes, and insults. He also said we should assume the other side has reasons for their beliefs and we should acknowledge those reasons.

[Lucian]

25. The other side has their beliefs...

but their beliefs are wrong.

[madrchsod]

26. thanks...in the real world that would be so but in the..

bizarre world we live in now...

[ZombieHorde]

21. I don't think most people understand what JS was talking about.

I am surprised by how many are confused by the concepts he was using.

[Poboy]

23. I think people understand just fine. I also think you have a problem with him being critiqued.

HE is not infallible, and in fact, he is flat out wrong on this.

[ZombieHorde]

24. I do not have a problem with anyone, other than Gary Gygax, being critiqued.

HE is not infallible

You are using a logical fallacy called a strawman. A strawman argument is an argument against a made up claim or a claim which has been altered in order to "knock down" easier. I never claimed JS was infallible, I claimed most people do not what he was talking about in is interview with RM.

he is flat out wrong on this

OK, what is "this?"