Females were barred from Paladino's appearance at synogogue, female reporters were out on sidewalk

[Liberal_in_LA]

Whoa, whoa, whoa. The press is justifiably full of stories reporting New York Republican gubernatorial candidate Carl Paladino's remarks about gay lifestyles -– but it's left to the New York Post to tell me that female reporters and photographers were banned from Paladino’s appearance at a synagogue, where he made some of these remarks?

Religious reasons, the Post reported, barred women from covering the Paladino event at a synagogue in Brooklyn.

So, stop right there. Carl Paladino is apparently cool with the fact that representatives of more than half of the nation's population are excluded from doing their jobs and covering an event featuring one of the two major parties' candidates for governor of the nation's third-most-populous state? Excluded female journalists, the Post reported, had to stay outside on the sidewalk, where they had insult added to injury when someone dumped water on them



http://opinion.latimes.com/opinionla/2010/10/carl-paladinos-women-problem-there-werent-any-women.html

[stevenleser]

1. I've been attacking Paladino 24x7 but this is religious rules at Orthodox Synagogues.

Women and men do not worship together at Orthodox Synagogues. I'm not sure directing outrage at this works.

Besides, there is so much to be upset at Paladino about we dont have enough time between now and election day to talk about it all.

[defendandprotect]

4. These are male-supremacist religious rules... why wouldn't attacking them be a good thing????

[brooklynite]

6. Add to that the fact that they weren't worshiping...

This was a political event; no reason for religious discrimination to kick in.

[KharmaTrain]

10. It Was Inside A Synagogue

Women in the Orthodox world are second class. "Tradition" in this world consider that they must be submissive (walk one step behind their husband) and do not lead in any activities. These people live religious discrimination 24/7, you just saw a few minutes of it.

[defendandprotect]

18. Sad ... aren't these the women who shave their heads + then wear wigs + tons of children???

Stuff like this should certainly be questioned and challenged at every opportunity!!

And, I think that Paladino felt so comfortable saying the horrific things he said there

makes me question the Synagogue and these religious fanatics even more!

[KharmaTrain]

23. You Should, I Do...

Yes, if this is the Lubovitcher sect or an offshoot, they live a very "literal" life...and one that they do by free will. I've had several friends who, after suffering loss and personal problems turned to what I call "the dark side". Inside they find a strong community and some acceptance that they don't get in "our world"...in return they give up their individuality.

Question as you will but these people choose this lifestyle and are "oomforted" in the certainty it offers. Almost all are very peaceful and thoughtful people but there are some who have exploited long-held racial and sexist beliefs for their own gain. In the Paladino matter, he was invited by one of these "rabbis" who wrote what Paladino read. Yes, the dude is a fanatic and represents a small, small "cult". I think I read that his synagogue has no more than 20 members.

However, perception is the game here. Paladino thought he could exploit the orthodox stands against homosexuality as well as anti-Arab and black resentment into some votes in the heart of New York City. Unfortunately there are many in that community that do support the GOTB for it's "Pro Israel" (translation: pro-Likud) positions. They totally miss the irony that they are abetting a similar persecution that their parents, grandparents and ancestors endured in Europe.

Cheers...

[defendandprotect]

28. Mainly agree with you, however people in "cults" aren't using free will any longer ....

they live a very "literal" life...and one that they do by free will.


And, certainly, most organized patriarchal religions follow the rule of "getting them

while they're young." So much of this is very early brainwashing -- especially of

females who are certainly oppressed by all male-supremacist religions.

[KharmaTrain]

30. There's More To It Than That

I've seen it go both ways. I grew up with orthodox kids who later broke away when they became adults...rejecting the lifestyle not the religion. Inversely, I also saw two good friends go to "the dark" side in their 30s and 40s. Both came from homes that weren't very religious but events in their lives seemed to have dictated this choice...and it definitely was and is a choice.

By no means do I condone this lifestyle but have spent a lifetime around it and have tried to understand it. Most orthodox I know aren't as strident as the group Paladino was trying to woo. Most go about their lives in the "secular world" and keep their faith to themselves...just don't try to call them on a Saturday. Just like in any religion, you have extremists who use religion as a weapon and those tend to get the most attention.

Cheers...

[defendandprotect]

35. A "cult" as you've acknowledged some of this to be is a brainwashing experience....

-- there is no longer free will in that experience.

People essentially need to be "de-programmed" to free themselves from it --

and, of course, Jamestown and its dead are evidence of that reality.


As far as any "orthodox" - or fundamentalist religious experience -- I think Thomas

Jefferson described the inability of members tossing it off as akin to a young

monkey trying to toss off a fear of snakes!

These religious brainwashings can last a lifetime, even when young adults walk

away as soon as they can.

HOWEVER, what I was discussing was the effects of female domination in these cults

and orthodox communities -- unhealthy for the children, unhealthy for the women,

and certainly unhealthy for the young males who are brainwashed to see females in

very limited roles -- and certainly as inferior.

[pnwmom]

20. So? Orthodox women don't stand out on the sidewalk.

There is a separate area inside where they can view what is going on. At the very least, why couldn't the female reporters be there?

[KharmaTrain]

22. Each Synagogue Has It's Own Rules

I've grown up around what I call "the dark side"...Orthdox Judiasm is mideval in its origins and practice. I'm not familiar with this particular synagogue but there are some that are men only...women aren't even allowed inside to pray yet alone participate. In their world, reporter reshmorter, their rules are sacred and are not to be questioned. Paladino could have read his statement outside but felt this was his key to the Crown Heights vote.

[Lance_Boyle]

25. Orthodox Judaism is WAY older than Medieval.

Orthodox Christianity is medieval in origin. Orthodox Judaism is practically stone-age.

[KharmaTrain]

26. The "Rituals" Are Middle Age...

The old testament is said to go back several thousand years but the rituals many Orthodox observe come from their interpretations...or "commentaries" in Europe during the Middle Ages that were supposed to be the "literal" interpretation and this is the basis of their lifestyle.

In many ways its similar to the rise of the Benedictines at around the same time.

[pnwmom]

29. We have an Orthodox Synagogue near us,

where families walk together to attend services. (Since they don't drive on the Sabbath.) Based on the clothing and the men's hair, I'm guessing they're Hasidic. I'm sure those women don't stand outside when they get there.

I didn't realize that some Synagogues ban women completely. What do the women do then? Not go to services? Walk to another service by themselves?

[stevenleser]

15. In general or as a way to get at Paladino is my question back at you.

In general, I think it is a point worth pressing at all times. I think these religions need to get to the 21st century. That goes for various Christian and Islamic denominations too. However, it is not effective as a means to get at Paladino and compared to the other stuff we have on him is milquetoast. The folks who live in the NYC metro area who are generally anti-Paladino are not going to be further energized by bringing this up because they are fully aware of how the Orthodox worship.

[defendandprotect]

36. I see, you're strickly looking at this as politics in play .....

Paladino comments can't be shown without this receptive audience. It was receptive?

Re the religions, it's not only about the 21st century, it's about ending male-supremacy

and patriarchy throughout our societities. That has to be a primary interest if we want

to set this world aright!

[Book Lover]

13. Since he wasn't there to worship but to speak to the press, it was

to be very, very kind to an undeserving SOB, a tone-deaf move.

[pnwmom]

21. This isn't worship. It's a political speech.

But there is a place for women in Orthodox synogogues, where they can hear and observe the service. So why weren't the women reporters allowed there?

[XemaSab]

27. I think directing outrage at this does work

If Obama decided to give a speech at a Black Muslim church that didn't allow white people, his career would be OVER.

So why is giving a speech somewhere that doesn't allow women ok?

And I'm imagining that it's not because there wasn't another venue available.

[defendandprotect]

37. EXCELLENT point . . .

Certainly this male-supremacist orthodox community should at least be a side issue in this

conversation, IMO. The opportunity to stand against female suppression shouldn't be overlooked.

[HEyHEY]

2. Accusations of you being an anti-semite in three...two...one....

[defendandprotect]

3. Paladino must have thought he had a receptive audience ... ???

[dsc]

5. I would imagine it wasn't reported because most New Yorkers

who are familiar with Jewish customs would have known that the women weren't permitted in. I am a little surprised about the women press not being let in, but not that there would have been no women in the audience. Now, that said, he had no business going in there in the first place.

[krispos42]

9. OT - your sigline pic link is dead.

FYI :hi:

[COLGATE4]

11. To the ulttra-orthodox even looking upon a woman who is not

their wife in that setting can be cause for great discomfort. Not so much modern male chauvanism but rather the product of almost 6,000 years of religious tradition.

[defendandprotect]

38. 6,000 years of male-supremacist brainwashing is much more than "tradition" -- !!!

[Pirate Smile]

7. What would Faux and the RW echo-chamber be saying if it was Muslims excluding women?

Still OK?

[emilyg]

12. I'd rather they were

excluded than stoned to death.

[Pirate Smile]

17. Uggh.

Well, I agree with that but let's not act like this exclusion would be ok if all religions did it.

It certainly wouldn't be OK if a RW Christian group did it.

The more fundamentalist all religions get, the worse they are. It does seem odd that these guys seem to get a pass.

Is there any other group that would get a pass for doing this? Honest question because I can't think of one right now. Is the reaction different if a Democrat does this?

[emilyg]

8. Orthodox Jews.

[Ozymanithrax]

14. They were just orthodox, but Hasidic Jews...

There isn't just one flavor of Orthodox Jew.

[EC]

16. I heard that the women reporters had water thrown on

them from a balcony...?

[Shallah Kali]

19. Imagine if a Dem. spoke to an Islamic group that wouldn't let women in

Imagine the howling.

[quaker bill]

24. The quesion is not about the Synagog

some do not allow women in the worship space. People are free to choose to go to them or to others that allow women.

Given that this place does not allow women in, the question is why choose this venue as a site for a political event? Surely there are other buildings nearby where women attending would be just normal. This is stunningly bad politics.

[Liberal_in_LA]

31. amen. I hate that 'keep women behind a curtain, outside, in the back' shit

[spanone]

32. i'm sure carl is cool with that, why the hell the women reporters didn't scream is beyond me

[Winterblues]

33. when someone dumped water on them

It wasn't God was it?

[Quantess]

34. I hope he loses, big time.