Waltzing at the Doomsday Ball - Capitalism is Dead, But We Still Dance With the Corpse

[kpete]

Waltzing at the Doomsday Ball - Capitalism is Dead, But We Still Dance With the Corpse

Joe Bageant
CounterPunch
Sat, 10 Jul 2010 14:34 EDT

As an Anglo European white guy from a very long line of white guys, I want to thank all the brown, black, yellow and red people for a marvelous three-century joy ride. During the past 300 years of the industrial age, as Europeans, and later as Americans, we have managed to consume infinitely more than we ever produced, thanks to colonialism, crooked deals with despotic potentates and good old gunboats and grapeshot.

Yes, we have lived, and still live, extravagant lifestyles far above the rest of you. And so, my sincere thanks to all of you folks around the world working in sweatshops, or living on two bucks a day, even though you sit on vast oil deposits. And to those outside my window here in Mexico this morning, the two guys pruning the retired gringo's hedges with what look like pocket knives, I say, keep up the good work. It's the world's cheap labor guys like you -- the black, brown and yellow folks who take it up the shorts -- who make capitalism look like it actually works. So keep on humping. Remember: We've got predator drones.

After twelve generations of lavish living at the expense of the rest of the world, it is understandable that citizens of the so-called developed countries have come to consider it quite normal. In fact, Americans expect it to become plusher in the future, increasingly chocked with techno gadgetry, whiz bang processed foodstuffs, automobiles, entertainments, inordinately large living spaces -- forever.

..............................

As my friend, physicist and political activist George Salzman writes, "Everyone in these 'professional' institutions dealing in money lives a fundamentally dishonest life. Never mind 'regulating' interest rates," he says. "We must do away with interest, with the very idea of 'money making money'. We must recognize that what is termed 'Western Civilization' is in fact an anti-civilization, a global social structure of death and destruction. However, the charade of ever-increasing debt can be kept up only as long as the public remains ignorant. Once ecological limits have been reached the capitalist political game is up."

You can see why I love this guy.

more:
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/211851-Waltzing-at-the-Doomsday-Ball-Capitalism-is-Dead-But-We-Still-Dance-With-the-Corpse

[dixiegrrrrl]

1. Somehow Bageant always makes me feel better.

Maybe because he is so free of bullshit.

Keep on sharing him, if you please, kpete.

[4dsc]

2. consumerism is dying and most people don't know it

with peaking oil production on a worldwide basis, our current way of life is going to go through some major changes in the coming decades that will rock the very foundation of our souls.

[glowing]

3. Not if you are prepared for the changes or have kept your eyes on the horizon.

If you are "awake", you realize the current systems in place don't hold water. The almighty govts of the world are choking just trying to pretend that the corrupt institutions are worth while protecting. The rich gas bags are clawing desperately to control and keep their sence of entitlement to themselves.

Honestly, I think China or India could bring the world to a stop. If they started striking, then the world would change.. we would be stupid not to join in. But many of the muddle class are trying NOT to be the poor class. The wealthy class detests the middle class.. they don't want to live like that, they just use the poor. Fear is what holds back a different way. Change doesn't have to be bad...

[maryf]

4. http://www.joebageant.com/

read him anytime...

[Taitertots]

5. Oh its so bad, but what are we going to do..... *Crickets*

"the cynic knows the price of everything and the value of nothing"

People like this have no plan forward. It is just like a child stamping their feet, throwing a temper tantrum.

He is descended from colonial capitalists. I'm descended from the white Polish victims of communism and socialism. Fan the flames of bigotry against white people, when you should be mad at rich people of all races.

[socialist_n_TN]

9. You are descended from victims of STALINISTS

NOT communists and especially not socialists. Remember the Nazis called themselves "socialists" too. State economies that are planned on the micro level are merely fascist, no matter what they call themselves.

When Stalin won the power struggle with Trotsky, Lenin's REAL legatee, the course was set for a century of cult of personality and state control that they CALLED "Communism", "Socialism", and "Marxism", but had little relationship with the ideals of Marx or even Lenin. Just because Stalin perverted the words, don't think the IDEAS aren't worth trying.

Anyway it's a moot point today. Today it's an either/or situation RE: Capitalism/Socialism. If you don't favor free market, unregulated capitalism, TO THE CAPITALIST you ARE a "socialist".

[Taitertots]

10. Since we don't have unregulated free markets are you going to stop calling us Capitalists

Even if we don't have unregulated free markets TO THE SOCIALIST you are still a capitalist.

[socialist_n_TN]

12. Not really. Socialism as a system covers a LOT of ground

from the Euro style democratic style version to the more capitalistic system of China, where the POLITICAL power is centralized, but the economy is more capitalist. Socialism basically means that the PEOPLE (mostly through government) have control over businesses, ESPECIALLY the large multinational corps, and not the reverse.

Of course, it doesn't matter WHAT we actually have OR what we actually believe it is, the capitalist ideal is unregulated, free market capitalism. You can think of yourself as a supporter of capitalism all you want, but if you want ANY government regulation, to the capitalists you ARE a socialist. And THESE unreg, free market capitalists are the ones who put policies in place when they gain power. Ergo they ARE the capitalists.

[Taitertots]

13. So we are Capitalist despite not having unregulated free markets

But they were not Socialist/Communist despite having most all the features of those systems.

[socialist_n_TN]

14. Who will institute the economic policies

of this country if they are elected? And who HAS controlled, at LEAST, the economic DEBATE in this country for the last 30 years? Grover Norquist. What does HE consider capitalism? Cause that's what we'll get if he has his way.

I make a distinction between Euro style Democratic Socialism and USSR style Stalinism, which have socialist elements (mostly government control of business). Do you?

[Taitertots]

16. So you are going to keep pushing that we have a capitalist system despite our lacking unregulated...

free markets.

When you will admit that our system isn't capitalist, I'll admit that soviet russia wasn't communist.

[rhett o rick]

29. Are system is capitalist. You are using the test of complete unregulation

to determine if we are capitalists. Yes we have some regulations. That doesnt preclude that we still have a capitalist system. The regulations didnt stop Enron or BP or Massey Energy or any other capitalist corporation.

[Odin2005]

19. Capitalism is not about markets, it's about who owns the means of production.

The "who" being the Parasitic Investor Class. Fascism is the pure form of Capitalism, the ideal "free market" is a delusion that can only exist in the heads of Libertarians.

[Hannah Bell]

27. in truth, capitalists want free markets in capital & regulated markets in labor.

regulated by THEM.

whatever lies they spout for public consumption.

if it were not the case, people would be able to cross borders as easily as capital.

[stuart68]

21. So, Marx and Lenin should be emulated ?

Educate me...

[txlibdem]

31. The Soviet Union was not communism it was state-run capitalism

http://dbzer0.com/blog/misunderstanding-communism-its-not-ussr

[Better Believe It]

33. Not really. Fascism is state run capitalism. The economic system in the old SU was not privately

owned. Now it is.

Capitalism without capitalists owning and controlling industry, transportation, communications, finances, world trade, etc., isn't capitalism. I don't think a good argument can be made that capitalism, state-run by capitalists who supposedly control the government, exists in Cuba today.

I suppose one could call it that if a new and accurate description of the temporary economic system that existed in what was once the Soviet Union or what exists today in Cuba.

I think the theory that state (government run) capitalism existed in the Soviet Union fell apart once real capitalists actually took governmental power in the former Soviet Union and restored a capitalist economic system.

[rhett o rick]

28. I so agree. Why listen to the man yelling "fire, fire" if he has no fire truck. I assume you have a

plan forward?

[marmar]

6. "Capitalism is Dead, But We Still Dance With the Corpse"

That's about the best description of our economic situation I've heard.

:thumbsup:

[dixiegrrrrl]

7. Right now finance makes up 42% of GDP, and is rising, he says.

Gulp.

[marmar]

8. Toss in the health "care" biz and the military....and you've pretty much got our economy.

[Festivito]

34. 42% or 47% after single-payer.

6 financial + 2.5 Wealthcare + 6 other = 14.5 US GDP, finance 42%

6 financial + 0.9 Healthcare + 6 other = 12.9 US GDP, finance 47%

Single payer costs about $3,000 per capita (UK system) for 300-million Americans or .9-trillion dollars.
Wealthcare costs about $7,200 per capita for total cost of 2.5-trillion dollars.

No wonder why Europeans can afford more vacations that we can.

[varelse]

11. K&R

[Tumbulu]

15. wow, I love him too

thanks for the post and link; I'll keep reading.

[Starry Messenger]

17. k & r

[Odin2005]

18. Bageant is right one, as usual!

[laughingliberal]

20. K & R nt

[DeSwiss]

22. K&R!!!

"Remember: We've got predator drones."

"The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side,
but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them." ~ George Orwell

[dixiegrrrrl]

36. Good Orwell quote

[opihimoimoi]

23. kick.....r 2

[Hydra]

24. This was a long read, but especially good

To anyone who is paying attention, things look doomed. Fortunately for American capitalism, nobody is paying attention. They never have. Even given the unemployment numbers, foreclosures and bankruptcies, most Americans are still not feeling enough pain yet to demand change. Not that they will. Demand change, I mean. We haven't the slightest idea of any other options, outside those provided by the corporate managed state. So in a chorus well-schooled by the media the public demands "reform," of the present system, the systemic pathogenic system based on exploitation of the many by the few, the one presently eating our society from the inside out. How do you reform that?

It's amazing that people are still defending capitalism. I even bought into the idea that this was "crony capitalism" for awhile, and that "real" capitalism would be better.

Hint to the "Free Market" people- Free Market means no regulations, which means Microsoft can strangle your software business, Exxon can steal your oil wells, and your Doctor can cut your leg off by accident and you can do absolutely squat about it.

Capitalism is poison. You can regulate it all you want. It's still poison.

[Capitalocracy]

25. One more time to kill the pain...

About what you say about money making money, I read an interesting article recently about capital gain and the Bible (not that I'm too interested in the Bible in general, but I've come to understand that some people are). It basically said that charging interest on a loan is not the only thing prohibited by the Bible, but also capital gain. It said that there's a part of the Bible that says people should be paid for their work "before the sun sets". In other words, people shouldn't be paid the next day for work they've done today, allowing their employer to continue to make money on the capital they owe them in the interim. Now, of course, we get paid generally after a week, two weeks, or in some cases like with freelancers (like me, Spanish/English translator) or private contractors, a month or two or three (or more).

[ooglymoogly]

26. Capitalism, the kind where folks are profiting off inventions

or discoveries in some cases developing resources that would not ordinarily be developed or from their own creativity, should be a tool, but only one tool, of a peoples government that is truly of, by and for a highly educated people and where corruption is punishable by long prison terms or death. No one should be able to amass a fortune beyond 10 million +- and never be allowed to conglomerate into anything that can pose a threat to the peoples government; A progressive tax code should take care of that, providing a comfortable safety net for all who are in need. Corporations should not be allowed to own vital signs like hospitals or health care or our airwaves or the like or make contributions of any kind to that government. Elections should be publicly funded. There is a balance and we have to find it. Unbridled, all of the options lead to fascism. The successful civilization will be a careful mix, governed by all the people whose education is mandated and whose religion or not is a private thing having nothing to do with that government or the communal (public school) education of its children for whom all must attend, be he rich or poor, teaching, beyond the basics, the things that it takes to make a successful life and keep a successful democratic government in place uninfluenced by any interest that is not of the people, working as a democratic whole.

All loony, treasonous and cheating pugs and DINO's should be brought before the full might of the an honest court (not at all what we now have) and that would solve 99% of our problems.

In other words adhere to our constitution....Our forefathers had it about right and it is not difficult to understand their intentions and we have let a bunch of obscenely treasonous and greedy shitheads tear it up.

[rhett o rick]

30. I agree about adhering to our Constitution. The Bush admin tried to

squash the Constitution and that was horrible. But now with a Democratic President and a Democratic Congress not willing to restore the Constitution, that is worse.

[txlibdem]

32. Best. Post. Ever. eom

[blindpig]

35. Love Joe, but he's been geting pretty defeatists lately.

He understands the problem pretty well but doesn't seem to think that the people will rise to the occasion.

I can't go along with that, can't give up, there is too much to lose, too much wrong that cannot be allowed to continue.

[Lost4words]

37. I am too late to rec but here is a great big kick!!

:kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: