Estate Tax: the taxed person isn't the one who earned the money and died.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

It's the one who DID NOT EARN the money and is GETTING it.

A simple distinction which the RW propagandists take care to propagate exactly backwards.

[ProgressiveVictory]

1. Just his family who is getting it. thanks for the info :)

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

2. Except when it's whoever was named in the will instead of the family. -nt

[ProgressiveVictory]

3. correct.

[Oregone]

4. But thats the founding idea behind capitalism

Getting money you didn't earn

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

8. Inheritance is actually the LEAST earned money of all.

For all others, no matter how morally questionable, the earner had to do SOMETHING. Buy stock, buy a house, buy a lottery ticket.

Inheritance? The moolah just falls on the person's lap.

[Oregone]

11. "Buy stock, buy a house, buy a lottery ticket."

Yeah, but most often with money they inherited.

:)

http://www.faireconomy.org/press_room/1997/born_on_third_base_sources_of_wealth_of_1997_forbes_400

[DURHAM D]

5. I am not sure why you posted this but:

Estate Taxes and Inheritance Taxes are two different things.

An important distinction...

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

6. The distinction is mostly academic. -nt

[ProgressiveVictory]

7. whats the difference?

[DURHAM D]

10. Estate taxes are paid by the estate.

Inheritance taxes are paid by the beneficiary.

Many states have phased out Inheritance taxes. However - states struggling for funds are taking a fresh look at using Inheritance taxes to raise revenue.

As regards Estate taxes - some states use the same federal exemption amounts and others have completely different limits. Again - states are looking at Estate tax exemption amounts as they struggle to raise more revenue.

[ProgressiveVictory]

13. thank you :)

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

14. An "estate" seems to be a weird entity.

A bunch of assets that are owned by nobody -- by a name that ceased to be attached to a real person long ago -- and that is managed by... some people.

Shouldn't all estates be inherited eventually? (Nasty legal fights that create gridlock notwithstanding)

[DURHAM D]

15. I have no idea what point you are trying to make...

I don't think it is all that difficult to understand.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

16. Mostly musing about the meaning of an abstract legal entity -- but there's a point too.

The point being that applying one or the other has little difference for the real, living people who stand to actually benefit from the deceased's assets.

[DURHAM D]

17. Its not an "abstract legal entity".

Is this a follow on thread to something else you were musing about? or

Is it happy hour where you are?

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

18. I see NO reason whatsoever to get your pants in a knot.

If you suspect I'm an evil pro-tax rich-oppressing commie -- well, I am, and I make no secret of the fact.

I had the illusion this could be an information-rich subthread. Ah well.

Bye.

[Solomon]

26. No, but he's right. I work in estate tax too. There is a

distinction between inheritance tax and estate tax. Inheritance tax is a tax on the beneficiaries for receiving property. Estate tax is a tax on the decedent for the privilege of transfering property.

It's neither here nor there to the point you are trying to make, which I believe, is to counter the argument that republicans make about estate tax which is: why should the estate be taxed when the decedent was taxed on the property during his lifetime? - it's like a double-tax.

The real reason that that's a bullshit argument and dosn't hold water is every time money changes hands, there's a tax. It could be argued that everything is "double-taxed". You get taxed on your income, and then you go buy something, you pay a sales tax, etc. etc. Estate tax is no different in that regard from any other tax. Everything is subject to tax, even a gift.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

27. So the transfers are respectively from deceased to estate and from estate to inheritors.

In any case, not a "death tax", and not any more "double taxation" than any other tax.

Did I get that right?

[Solomon]

28. The inheritance tax is a tax on the beneficiaries for the privilege

of receiving property, and the estate tax is a tax on the decedent for the privilege of transfering property.

There is no federal inheritance tax. Some states have inheritance tax and some do not. Some states have estate tax and some do not. Somes states have no inheritance tax and no estate tax. I happen to work in a jurisdiction that has both an inheritance tax and an estate tax. The inheritance tax takes preference. If you owe inheritance tax and estate tax, the amount of inheritance tax paid gets deducted from what you owe in estate tax. If it's equal to or more than the estate tax, then no estate tax is owed.

I didn't want to presume, but I thought the point you were really trying to make is on the canard about "why should we pay taxes when we die when we paid taxes on that property during life."

But the point is, everything is subject to multiple tax. Every time money changes hands. So it's fair to say everything is "double-taxed". So in the fianl analysis, why should death taxes be any different?

Your point was being submerged in the confusion over inheritance tax and estate tax which distinction really has nothing to do with the point you were trying (or I thought that you were trying) to make.

[Mendocino]

9. The right always gives us reasons why

somebody has no right to gain from something they didn't work for like welfare and affirmative action. Then they turn around and pull this crap.

As if legacy Dubya had to work hard to get into college.

[WinkyDink]

12. That's why they'd like to change to "Death Tax", to make it seem like, PtE, over-kill.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

19. PtE = ?

[ellenfl]

21. pardon the expression? eom

[WinkyDink]

25. Yes.

[SheilaT]

20. The taxes are paid by the estate

of the person who died. Those who inherit, get what's left over after Uncle Sam and Aunt Belinda (the feds and the state govt, if there's a state estate tax :) )

Rich people often give money away so as to avoid estate taxes. That's why various foundations exist, why rich people sometimes make very large gifts to charities.

[DailyGrind51]

22. And, the estate tax only impacts $$ large estates, not what your average working stiff bequeaths.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

23. i.e. not "small businesses".

Which is one of the rightoids' favorite canards.

[DailyGrind51]

24. "Their" definition of "small" differs significantly from "ours".

Most family-owned businesses don't own the facility from which they operate, it is either leased or mortgaged, thereby greatly diminishing net assets. If "mom and pop" leave the business to son and daughter, they usually just leave the name of the enterprise and the inventory.

[Dappleganger]

29. But to a right-winger being born wealthy is just as good as your great-grandaddy earning it.

That silver spoon in their mouth has to count for something, right??

[mhatrw]

30. Please explain why it is preferable to tax income over the generational transfer of unearned wealth

[Dr Morbius]

31. I can see exemptions for family businesses and farms worth over $7m.

Otherwise, there's a tax. Get past it; taxation is not punishment and it is not evil.