Serious question about the smoking diplomat

[malaise]

Are you telling me that the flight crew and the marshal don't know the smell of cigarettes versus some other smell. Sure the diplomat is a jackass but some common sense must be required before people run up the costs associated with the scrambled jets and other emergency crews. The fear factor is driving people bat shit crazy.

[Are_grits_groceries]

1. It may have been the

"light my shoes on fire" remark that did it. They arrest people for even joking about a bomb on a plane even if they are not aboard. Being on a plane would trigger a lot of action considering current events and "The Shoe Bomber."

[malaise]

4. Before they reached there

the flight attendants smelled the cigarette smoke. That cannot be hidden on a aircraft.
People have been sneaking into aircraft toilets and smoking for decades without us calling air marshals. For fugg sake, did Bushco frighten us to the point that we have thrown out basic common sense?

[Are_grits_groceries]

6. Not arguing with that.

They overreacted about the cigarette smoke. However, he made the mistake with the bomb joke.

[jberryhill]

23. There are smoke detectors in there... see my comments below /nt

[Turbineguy]

2. This is a case where "Free Market Forces"

might help.

Send him the bill.

[Diclotican]

3. malaise

malaise

I don't know, but I'm afraid that after 11 sept 2001, many, or not most americans just lost their head, and for some reason or another, have never managed to find the dam head again to put on ... And the terrorist won because one of the thing they wanted anything more than anything, was to make americans be scared - all the time... And they succeeded far better than anyone could imagine..

I remember once i was on my way to my mom, in the northern part of Sweden, Was flying with SAS in a MD82 aircraft.. And a man who had some beers before he was going to the aircraft had the bad idea that he NEEDED a cigarette.. (this was after it was made illegal to smoke in aircraft flying inside scandinavia) and off course the pilots in the front know what happened when they got a "fire" from the lavatory in the back on the aircraft.. But it was not making a lot of fuzz about it compared to what happened in US.. Instead of having the SWAT team at the destination airport the whole case was resolved by the co-pilot coming back, and in no setting way telling the poor Sharp that he would be reported to the police when they was landing, and that he possible got a fine up to 10.000 SEK.. Who in that day was a stiff fine for a 5 minute sigaret... The chap was sorry about the whole incident, and was sitting silent as a little mouse in the face of a big cat the rest of the trip.. I'm nut sure he even got out of the aircraft before the rest...

[malaise]

8. You nailed it

That is how rational people react to violations of aircraft rules. They don't panic and create unnecessary expense. The smell of something burning is way different than the smell of cigarette smoke. That's my only point here.

[Diclotican]

11. malaise

malaise

And that is the way it should be don. By justt telling the man that he have oversteped the rules, and that it would have consequenses.. And in a manner where only the few who was seeing it was knowing it.. Im pretty sure that most of them, who was on the aircraft not even know that the poor man smoked and that he pilots have to came back... Both the flight attentians, and the pilot acted in a proff way, and treated the man who had smoked with both dignety, and respect. But also told him as a winters night, that he had problems. And it was resolved queit and easy...

But then, im pretty sure that we in the northen europe do have a way of telling what is what in a more calm way than in most parts of the world.. I have told a few times to others that Im not pleased with thing, and not even raised me voice:P: And it have worked well. Better than the times when my head exploded and I just blow it...

And most know the difference between a smoke, and other types of smokes.. This is pure over action by people who lost their cool, and not to say, their with....

And the media also made its parts, by making this far bigger than it was.. It was just an stupid man who desided he wanted a smoke, at an aircraft.. He might be an diplomat, but still a dumb man..

Diclotican

[malaise]

15. The diplomat wasn't the only dumb person

last night - he had loads of company

[EFerrari]

16. That's what I told my mom last night.

He doesn't live in this country and he doesn't know how crazy we've gotten.

[trumad]

5. While I agree we've all lost our heads in this country...

If the guy truly said "light my shoes on fire".... and I was in the plane... I'd freak a bit.

[dorkulon]

7. It's really the last thing a guy who was actually lighting his shoes on fire would say. nt

[trumad]

9. Agree--- but still...

I think once the Marshall's had him collard everyone should have stood down.

[malaise]

10. Why did they need a marshal when they smelled nothing but

cigarette smoke. We've all lost our heads.

[jberryhill]

24. Yeah...

And I know a few dorm rooms that used to smell like incense, too.

[eilen]

12. Actually, I am kind of sick of these assholes who don't think the

rules apply to them. So I secretly cheered over the over reaction. What a dickhead thing to say on an airplane.

[global1]

13. Look - I'm Glad It Turned Out The Way It Did - It Also Makes A Good Example Of .......

how the 'marshall' system works and that should it have been a terrorist - we know the system works. It also is a potential deterrent for potential future terrorist attempts. At least a message goes out to a would be terrorist that - yes - there really are undercover marshalls on flights and they really take this stuff seriously.

If this incident was overkill - like many here are implying - I'm all for it.

On the other hand - if something really was amiss on this plane and the story turned out tragically different - those same people that are complaining here about overkill in this situation would be complaining about how our system failed.

[LetsgoWings13]

14. And what would happen if they called off the fighter jets

and the cig smoke was only a cover up for something else he wanted to do? and he did do something and the plane went down? what would everyone be saying then? im sure they knew what cig smoke smells like, but you cant take a chance these days.

[Cleita]

17. I think the airlines should seriously think about passing out Snus

to the smokers. They used to give you cigarettes on the airplanes back in the Jurassic period along with gum. It seems that Snus, the tobacco pouch you put under your gum to get your nicotine hit, could be a solution. There is no smoke. It's not messy like chewing tobacco and it keeps the addicts calm.

[jberryhill]

25. I use those

nicotine patches too.

On a 19 hour flight to Sydney, you can lose your mind!

[onenote]

18. forty years ago, a buddy and I made a bomb joke and ended delaying a flight

Many DUers are probably too young to remember, but air marshals were first used back in the late 60s and early 70s in response to a series of hijackings of planes to Cuba. During my senior year in high school, a friend of mine and I were flying to North Carolina from DC during spring break and after we went through the search of our bags, my friend (being stupid) turned to me and said, "they didn't even look for the bomb". Now, one might argue that no one with a bomb would say such a thing. But the response was swift and, frankly, unsurprising. A couple of marshals stepped out of the shadows and asked us to follow them. We were questioned and our bags (we didn't have any checked luggage) were thoroughly -- and I mean thoroughly -- searched. We were certain that we were going to miss our plane but amazingly, it was delayed. We were the last passengers to board and, thankfully, no one knew why the plane was delayed so no one was as pissed at us as they had every right to be.

Given what has happened since then, I don't have any problem with the reaction to this idiot's "joke."

[Gormy Cuss]

19. You're right that the caution against joking about bombs isn't new

and I don't think it was wrong for the air marshal to react in this case. However, I do think that the attempt to frame every on-board incident as possible terrorism is ramping up the level of fear beyond what is reasonable based on the risk.

The guy was an ass and broke several rules/laws, but since his name was Mohammed al Something he MUST be a terrorist. :sarcasm:

[war sucks]

20. no way!

[walldude]

21. Uh the guy lit a cigarette in the bathroom and then

came out and made a "joke" about lighting his shoes.. Were they supposed to laugh? I think the Quatar Embassy should pay for all the costs. And there are a lot, tons of flights were delayed all around the country.

[jberryhill]

22. I've seen no reliable indication he was smoking....

You can get all sorts of unusual smells in an aircraft cabin, including smokey smells from time to time.

The more important question is why the lavatory smoke detector did not go off.

If he were smoking, it would have gone off. If it didn't go off, then lav smoke detectors need to be checked, because that is the only area of an aircraft where anyone can be secluded.

Obviously, the news reports are based on second hand information, since anyone in the vicinity of anything has a different version of events.

My guess is that he was in for a long time, raised suspicion, and someone connected this with an unusual smell *of some kind* and asked him if he had been smoking. Then, with his joke in response, the situation went from there.

But if he had been smoking, the first indication would be the smoke detector, not ANYONE'S nose. It's sort of the dog that doesn't bark in this story.

Now I've heard that a condom can be placed over the smoke detector inlet, and a cigarette held close to an open sink drain, to mitigate the detection of smoking in an airplane. Of course, anyone would be an idiot to do so, and tampering with the smoke detector is itself an offense.