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NanceGreggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 07:57 PM
Original message
You've Got To Be Carefully Taught
Edited on Wed Apr-07-10 08:23 PM by NanceGreggs
It is obvious that in view of the current state of the nation, the story of Constance McMillen may seem unimportant – that in the great scheme of things, a young girl’s tale of a disastrous prom night doesn’t deserve yet another retelling, by me or anyone else.

And in most other circumstances, I would tend to agree.

But there is this: When you think about everything that ails us as a nation, and as a global community – aggression, war, torture, corporate greed, a lack of empathy towards others, a sense of entitlement to power – and trace them back to their beginnings, you will undoubtedly find the kind of meanness of spirit that Constance was subjected to at the very core of the cancer that continues to creep, unabated, throughout the body of humankind.

Having been denied access to her own prom because, as a lesbian, she intended to bring her girlfriend as her date, Ms. McMillen – with the able assistance of the ACLU – had her day in court, and was told by school officials that her prom had been officially cancelled. Of course, that “official prom” was later reinstated, or so it seemed - until
Ms. McMillen arrived at the event and realized that she, along with seven others, were the only attendees.

In the meantime, students, teachers and parents had arranged for an “alternate prom” – one to which Ms. McMillen was decidedly not invited.

To say that none of this could have taken place without a massive effort on the part of said teachers, students and their parents is stating the obvious. And not quite satisfied with things as they were, insult to injury had to be added – as the students who attended the “alternate prom” posted their photos on Facebook, delighted by the fact that they’d managed to pull the wool over McMillen’s eyes.

The fact that two students with learning disabilities were also directed to attend McMillen’s “official prom” speaks volumes about a community that apparently decided that people who are different, by virtue of their sexuality or their disabilities, are equally deserving of exclusion.

Looking at these students from the vantage point of my advanced years, I see them as “kids” – not in the sense that they are immature, incapable of adult behavior, or not old enough to accept responsibility.

I say it in the sense that their young minds are still open to persuasion, malleable, capable of being led in the right direction, or misled into believing that the lessons recently taught by their parents and teachers – i.e. that discrimination is acceptable, that circumventing the law is completely permissible, that those who are “different” are deserving of exclusion from society, that downright meanness is somehow a good Christian value – are lessons that should be taken to heart.

And there was another lesson offered up as part and parcel of the aforementioned; the lesson that choosing to stand up for what you personally believe to be just and fair can have its consequences as well.

I think it safe to assume that not all Ms. McMillen’s fellow students felt that the actions of their parents and teachers was appropriate or justifiable. But once the mob mentality was allowed to take hold, (and the writing was on the Facebook wall, if you will), the choice presented was clear: you either stand with the perpetrators, or you stand with the victim – and, in doing the latter, you are fair game for the same kind of ridicule Ms. McMillen was subjected to.

Those of us who are politically active often comment on the policies of our elected officials; we opine on the greed of corporate powers-that-be, we wonder how some people can be so callous in their speech, so unethical in their business dealings, so lacking in sympathy towards their fellow citizens.

We ponder what kind of upbringing, what kind of family background could lead to such easy dismissal of the rules of law – as well as the rules of simple decency. We wonder how self-proclaimed “Christians” can be so bereft of empathy, so brazenly selfish, so without regard for the wellbeing of others – and not even seem to be aware that they live their lives in complete contradiction to the religious tenets they publicly pride themselves as adhering to.

This is where it starts. It begins with accepting discrimination, on any grounds, followed by a pat-on-the-back from parents, teachers, and the community-at-large for having done so. It is encouraged by a wink-wink/nod-nod, don’t worry, you’re one of US mentality given free rein. It is nurtured by a pseudo-Christian philosophy that says the end always justifies the means – even if you have to break a few commandments here and there along the way. It is allowed to flourish when otherwise good kids are taught how to go along to get along, lest they find themselves on the receiving end of the next round of harassment and ridicule.

And where does it end? I think we all know the answer to that question.

It ends with an insurance company CEO who feels entitled to a multi-million dollar salary, even if it comes at the price of thousands of people denied healthcare. It ends with crooked politicians who firmly believe the law is something to be twisted to their personal satisfaction, or ignored entirely because they are above it. It ends with warmongers calling for the deaths of those whose religion or color renders them somehow inferior because they are “different” . It ends with people who, once having attained some form of political or monetary power, use that power to live as they have been, oh, so carefully taught – with regard only to their own ambitions, and without regard to anyone else.

It ends with some of those things, many of those things, all of those things – and sometimes it even ends with a twenty-one-year-old kid, beaten and tortured, tied to a fence and left to die.

It is for this reason I personally believe that Ms. McMillen’s story deserves national attention, and careful scrutiny. Her story is but one tale – but there are others that will, unfortunately, go forever untold.

It may strike some that I am being overly dramatic in stating my case – or, more to the point, supporting Constance’s case.

But I have lived long enough to see the outcome of discrimination, of hatred, of so-called “Christianity” being used as a shield to protect behavior that is so clearly contrary to the teachings of Christ.

I have seen its genesis in incidents like the one at-hand, and understand that if weeds are not uprooted and exposed to the light of day, the garden stands little chance of reaching the full promise of its potential beauty, and its ultimate perfection.



“You've got to be taught to hate and fear, you've got to be taught from year to year,
it's got to be drummed in your dear little ear, you've got to be carefully taught.”
*

*Rodgers & Hammerstein, “South Pacific”
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Atticus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:01 PM
Response to Original message
1. Well said, Thank you. nt
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happygoluckytoyou Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #1
39. IN A RELATED STORY fox news awards sarah palin the wink-wink/nod-nod award for the 2008-2009 season
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CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:06 PM
Response to Original message
2. What happened to Constance, and the other kids...
Unconscionable. I am aghast.

Thank you, my dear Nance, for voicing my outrage so much more eloquently than I could ever hope to.

K&R

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DCKit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
3. Nance, this really needs to be submitted as an LTTE in a LOT of papers. n/t
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DontTreadOnMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:33 PM
Response to Reply #3
9. I agree
needs to be in every newspaper in America.
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formercia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 09:10 AM
Response to Reply #9
38. I second that.
many times over.
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Mojeoux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #38
62. And Proper Respects to you Nance, for referencing South Pacific
Edited on Thu Apr-08-10 06:28 PM by Mojeoux
Still magic after all these years.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:09 PM
Response to Original message
4. I thought of this song the other day in the context of the tea baggers.
I found this rendering of the song by Barbra Streisand.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZSt1pgjQdk
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elleng Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:18 PM
Response to Original message
5. As a professor told me/us,
Edited on Wed Apr-07-10 08:22 PM by elleng
it is up to a community to recognize that something is wrong, to say it. It is from that point that the larger society has the opportunity to adopt the right way, and state it loud and clear.

We may be made up of too many 'communities' now, so that what happens THERE, while definitely NOT acceptable HERE, will remain operative there. What do we Americans AS A WHOLE say and do about what happened 'down there?'

{And after all, Richard Rodgers and Oscar Hammerstein were New York Jews.} So am I.

;(


Sorry
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panader0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:19 PM
Response to Original message
6. Thanks Nance You always hit the nail on the head. K&R
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katandmoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
7. One of my favorite songs. K&R.
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BlueMTexpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #7
22. From my favorite R & H musical ...
and it is so true.

:hi:
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unblock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
8. ironically, excluding learning disabilities students as well made the school's legal position worse
given that legal protections for those with disabilities are stronger than those for sexual orientation.

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obxhead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:39 PM
Response to Original message
10. Excellent piece.
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eppur_se_muova Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
11. A sedate, measured, and righteous "rant", Nance. K&R. nt
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BadgerKid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 08:56 PM
Response to Original message
12. "Blame the victim" comes to mind
to describe the faux-justification for many behaviors, including this.

Thanks for all your writings. You have a knack for eloquence.
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madamesilverspurs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 09:18 PM
Response to Original message
13. My heart breaks for those kids,
those who are mistreated AND those who are taught to mistreat.

A couple of years ago I used Hammerstein's lyrics (attributed) in a response to an online LTTE that advocated some rather brutal deportation tactics for anyone remotely suspected of being in the country illegally. A responding poster accused me of attacking the letter-writer by painting him with my own ill-hidden racism and followed that with "You should be ashamed, Mr. Hammerstein!"

Sigh.

--
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ladym55 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 09:41 PM
Response to Original message
14. What AWESOME role models
What incredible parenting!!! What values!!! What FINE upstanding teachers and administrators!!! :sarcasm:

As a parent, I sure would be PROUD to have my children be a part of a school system like that.

And in South Hadley, Massachusetts, the school bullies who drove one their classmates to suicide face criminal charges. And we are puzzled as to why such things occur. Hmmm.

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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 10:07 PM
Response to Original message
15. Wow. Thank gosh you were carefully taught to think and express
yourself, so we can see. :hug:
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Bobbie Jo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 10:17 PM
Response to Original message
16. Recommended.
:applause:
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SeattleGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 10:25 PM
Response to Original message
17. Well said, Nance
What kind of "role models" are those parents and teachers? Bad ones, most certainly, as they are teaching the kids who went to the "real" prom a bad "us vs. them" lesson. Just wait until someone else decides that some of the "us's" are now "them's". I bet they will caterwaul like crazy, and demand to know how such a judgment could be made about them. And I bet further that they will never make the connection between that and what they just did to the students they sent to the "fake" prom.



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cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 11:19 PM
Response to Original message
18. Yep. Exactly.
Just right, Nance, Just right.
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Nikki Stone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-10 11:29 PM
Response to Original message
19. If you REALLY support gays, you should K & R this:
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 04:31 AM
Response to Reply #19
28. Are you concerned that Nance might not really support gays?
I see nothing here that should foster such a concern.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 06:47 AM
Response to Reply #28
32. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
DesertFlower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 12:53 AM
Response to Original message
20. another great post. K&R
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stevedeshazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 12:58 AM
Response to Original message
21. You just did it again.
Kicked some bigoted ass.

Nice work, recommended.
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hay rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 01:26 AM
Response to Original message
23. K&R
Excellent piece. The ugliness that pervades our society now has deep roots. Love the Rogers and Hammerstein quote at the end- from the "greatest generation" when it was the greatest generation...
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HappyCynic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 02:30 AM
Response to Original message
24. K & R
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Egnever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 03:32 AM
Response to Original message
25. Geezus Nance
Please tell me you are getting paid for this stuff.
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Are_grits_groceries Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 03:50 AM
Response to Original message
26. Here's a little one who is carefully taught:
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 04:28 AM
Response to Original message
27. This was so disgusting and yeah, I think this sort of thing is at the heart
of the cancer killing this country of ours.
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noiretextatique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 04:50 AM
Response to Original message
29. a popular meme is that hate is natural
but i agree with you: there is nothing "natural" about hate...it is learned.
we need only take a lesson from nature: does the rose "hate" the daffodil? no...plants don't have a construct called hate, but unfortunately humans do.
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Delphinus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 05:45 AM
Response to Original message
30. "Downright meanness
is a good Christian value" ... nailed it!

Great - thank you.
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rasputin1952 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 06:42 AM
Response to Original message
31. Perhaps in my old age, I have seen too much...
the discrimination is this country is so absurd that there are times when I am ashamed to wake up and realize I am a citizen of this nation.

What did this young woman do to be afforded such scorn? Did she burn down the Town Hall, did she set fire to school, did she physically or verbally attack others? No, she was nothing more than herself, a living, breathing, caring, loving and growing young person. A fellow human being that was caught up in a situation that is no one else's business, and yet, some remarkably foolish people decided that for some absurd reason, she should be treated "differently". So the "moral leaders" of the community decided that for some reason, they had some sort of "obligation" to make this young woman and her SO, as well as five others feel like outcasts from society, outcasts from humanity...what gave these "people" that "right"?

The people that do things like this have no concept of the fact that when discrimination is applied to any one individual, we are all discriminated against. There is no justification, "moral" of societal to deny these young people the same Rights and Privileges other citizens enjoy. By the very act of discrimination the "moralists" used to deny these young people a small chance at happiness, these individuals have shown me they have no respect for these people, their families or their community; hell, they have no respect for humanity.

Constance McMillen, and the others that were treated like this will go through life having to remember that they were "outcasts". None of them did anything criminal, none of them asked to be tossed into this terrible situation, they are kids, trying to be a part of a community that sees them as "different". I have to wonder how many of the "normal" parents and community members have kids that have actually done things that they most assuredly would not be considered something to be "proud" of. For that matter, how many of those who stood on a shaky moral "pedestal" to make these individuals outcasts would be able to stand up to scrutiny themselves...I am willing to bet none of them are as pristine as they would like others to think. As a matter of fact, because of their glaring lack of caring, compassion, empathy and common sense, I can virtually guarantee most, if not all, have skeletons in closets than they would be mortified if brought into the light.

My heart goes out to these 7 kids, each having a different situation, situations that this "community" decided that they "needed to be treated " differently. It is a community that needs to sit down and take a look at just how patently evil their system of "values" has become. Casting the hopes and dreams of young people onto the pyre is never conducive to citizenship, it just prolongs the pain some are forced to feel; it perpetrates the hate; it strips people of the shame they should feel for denying basic human rights to others.

Yes, there are times when I am ashamed to be a citizen...and there are times when I am ashamed to be a part humanity. What these community members have done, made me ashamed that that I am a part of the same species. Now, if only they are capable of feeling shame, they might actually become a little more human...but I have my doubts.
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JTFrog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 06:48 AM
Response to Original message
33. K&R
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Mad_Dem_X Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 07:44 AM
Response to Original message
34. This brought tears to my eyes
Thank you, Nancy. That's all I can say. Thank you.
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NJmaverick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 07:58 AM
Response to Original message
35. K&R
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The Wizard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 08:25 AM
Response to Original message
36. Hatred is not a family value.
It is learned behavior, and those who preach it, especially those who preach it for profit, need a good kick in the ass.
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Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 08:37 AM
Response to Original message
37. Discrimination in any form, including that which is embraced
Edited on Thu Apr-08-10 08:43 AM by Bluenorthwest
by Barack Obama, Tim Kaine, and the rest of the DLC anti equality set. The words of Donnie McClurkin and other Obama surrogates embolden these haters, and those who defended that hate speech have their hands covered in all the injustice that follows, all of it. This is not what 'they' did. Sorry about that, hon. This is what y'all did.
This is the end result of the hatred and discrimination that is part and parcel of the heterosexual community.
Those who wanted to elect a man who used hate speakers need to meditate on that, and upon Constance, and Phelps and the vast injustices committed each day to serve this religion of discrimination touted by Obama. Those who stand against equality stand with Rick Warren, and you are all shouting 'one man, one woman' and kids in schools hear that 'just one song' or 'just one prayer' and then they say "let's go after Constance again, like the President says 'one man, one woman'." Now you can pretend it is otherwise, but it is not. All who pushed any measure of invective, or supported or defended the use of that invective own all that results from that invective.
The Donnie McClurkin Democrats are just as culpable for this bullshit as any Republican. On DU I was told that the hate speech was needed to prove Obama's 'bona fides' to straight Christians in the South. Think about that. A short drive to Constance's school, Obama's rallies had hate preachers preaching hate toward Constance, and DU said 'that's ok'. Defended it. And that is just a fact of life that will not vanish by distance.
When you sick dogs on a people, it is silly to pretend shock at the sight of blood.
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Toasterlad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #37
43. Exactly.
It sure rings hollow to condone Obama's bigotry on the one hand, and then admonish a group of other bigots, albeit in a wimpish "they're only kids" sort of way.
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unapatriciated Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #37
50. +1
we must address our own involvement in continuation of hate speech. If we are silent we are part of the problem not the solution.
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NanceGreggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 07:26 PM
Response to Reply #37
63. So now hatred and discrimination ...
... are part and parcel of the heterosexual community?

Thanks for the broad-brush smear. I had no idea that being a heterosexual automatically equated to supporting hatred and discrimination.

I think that might come as a real shock to a lot of people - ya know, people who hate being stereotyped and all.


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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #37
65. Odd that what seems to me to be the main thrust of this piece is so roundly excused
as if the OP's were only applicable to those we disagree with. But then, why should I expect anything less?
:thumbsup:

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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #37
67. +1000000
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Raster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 09:20 AM
Response to Original message
40. Thanks, Nance. What happened to Constance went beyond just fear of the unknown...
Edited on Thu Apr-08-10 09:21 AM by Raster
...it went decidedly into the realm of cruelty in their exclusion. This is what this country is becoming. Children are being taught to hate and fear. It makes us all much easier to manipulate and control.

And you are entirely correct, to pull off the subterfuge required for the alternate "Hate Prom," students, parents, teachers and school administrators all had to participate. This was an entire community displaying their worst. They all are to blame.

Unfortunately, the fear, the hate, the discrimination and the horrid episodes they breed will just keep coming.

I wonder which prom Jesus would attend?

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jbeing Donating Member (116 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
41. Big K&R - I love how you encapsulate an issue and empathize
with the people you write about. I have read your other entries and am always impressed with your balance of kindness and anger. NanceGreggs, I want to be you when I grow up.

Oh and BTW - I totally agree with you.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 10:37 AM
Response to Original message
42. It begins with male-supremacist relgiion and those who support it --
This is where it starts. It begins with accepting discrimination, on any grounds,
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
44. kick.....
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BlancheSplanchnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 10:59 AM
Response to Original message
45. you moved me so powerfully
that I'm pretty much speechless.

Bravo!

Everyday behavior does matter! They behave this way on an everyday basis--we need to start talking back when they do it, even if it's not polite! (I think manners and timidity stop us often. We need to stop letting that shackle us.


ok, so I got over the speechlessness....
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abelenkpe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 11:29 AM
Response to Original message
46. wow
I can't believe parents and teachers helped to conspire to do something so hateful and bigoted. They are supposed to be the voice of reason, not reinforcing discrimination. It is a sad sad statement on our society that this took place in 2010 in a country that claims to be a beacon of democracy and justice.

I hope those kids get together and sue the country and school board or something. So why were those seven kids misdirected? Was it that they had supported McMillen? If so, good for them.

The only good part of this story is that I now know to avoid that community like the plague since clearly it is full of bigoted asshats.
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Guilded Lilly Donating Member (960 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 11:33 AM
Response to Original message
47. The Anti-Christs of today's Christianity
Edited on Thu Apr-08-10 11:34 AM by Guilded Lilly
are thriving everywhere from deep within their own house. They breed within the circle of the protective spirit of their stated *Christianity*.

This kind of behavior exists outside of the Christian faiths as well. It is not by any means exclusive. But the shield of the term *Christian* is used despicably by those with rank spirits.

It would be safe to say that repugnant meanness has resided in humanity since the first intelligent (?)thought was spoken in words. However, with the advent of instantaneous communication via the advanced technology of TV, texting and especially our beloved Internet, we have given a huge stage for all these foul players to become their own *stars*.

Ugly-minded children of the past have apparently grown into ugly-minded adults of authority today. Accountability is a dirty word to many. Shame is practically non-existent among those who should feel it the most. Denial is an embraced life choice.

But those same technologies that enable the wretched behavior can also be a tool for those in this world who refuse to accept the ugliness. And yes, a lot of the hope rests in the children and kids of this world...but not at all exclusively. Every single good-spirited person of any age can find the backbone and courage to step up and simply refuse to accept this viral alternative of lethal ugliness. "Goodness" isn't weak unless we allow it to be. I often think that those who practice the lifestyle of ugliness get away with it because they have so little resistance.

My Dad, who passed away from cancer when I was 9, would say..."if you are going to kill someone kill them with kindness." I knew what he meant then and I strive to hold on to that teaching now, hard as it may be.

And it is hard. Bone weary hard sometimes.

So, let's give em *goodness* HELL. Like YOU do, Nance. There is an immense strength and potency to that goodness that can be underestimated. Particularly by those individuals who practice it. Calling out the wretches of this world is a good start. Using intelligence and fierce determination in the fight...

Bravo for your words.

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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
48. Fantastic.
:applause:
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Prism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 12:38 PM
Response to Original message
49. Great! So, when do you plan on no longer accepting discrimination?
Discrimination from a President whose active and passive bigotry continues to harm the LGBT community, and who warmly invited some of the most virulent homophobes in the country to unify with his voice and message. A President who allowed the Democratic party to send out these messages you cite.

Discrimination from a Party that continues sending out an unapologetic, unambiguous message of disinterest and marginalization whenever the LGBT community dares remind them of our inequality.

Discrimination right here on this board, as scores of people apologize for passivity, indifference, and hostility to LGBT equality. As our issues are reduced to ponies, as our criticisms are called racist or single-issue or selfish.

Your post is a lovely sentiment, but it's over-simplified, good vs. evil, conservative vs. liberal, Democrat vs. Republican illusion. When it comes to anti-gay sentiment, people of all political persuasions give as good as they get when it comes to diminishing the dignity and dismissing the rights of the LGBT individual.

When it comes to anti-gay sentiment, the Democratic Party, the President, and a large chunk of this board are living in quite a glass palace. Sometimes, it's better to just step away from the catapult.

It's easy to rag on the right-wing (who generally don't read here and won't reply, btw). It's a bit like firing cannon at a whale in an aquarium. It's harder to challenge these sentiments in your own house.

So when are you going to take them to task about all of the anti-gay nonsense we're seeing? When are you going to speak truth to the actual people in power? When are you going to help clean up your own backyard before you start bitching about the neighbors?

That I would love dearly to see. That would be something. Quite something. it'd be even, dare I say, courageous and meaningful and worth writing a thousand words about.
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unapatriciated Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #49
51. thanks see post 50
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NanceGreggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 06:05 PM
Response to Reply #49
61. You might want to go back and read the OP again ...
I said nothing about conservative v liberal, Democrat v Republican. As you yourself stated, "When it comes to anti-gay sentiment, people of all political persuasions give as good as they get when it comes to diminishing the dignity and dismissing the rights of the LGBT individual."

I have stated my opinion about discrimination against LGBT individuals, as well as discrimination of all kinds - be it on the basis of religion, colour, ethnicity, or any other criteria.

The fact that you opined that "it's easy to rag on the right-wing" leads me to conclude that your own prejudice is showing - as you obviously assumed that any statement on the topic must be aimed at "the other side" of the political spectrum - despite the fact that the OP made no distinction between parties, nor their supporters, as "owning" the biases that affect all of us.

You might want to consider your own mindset before accusing others of being "simplistic" in theirs.

You are an adept writer, and I would suggest that you express your thoughts in your own thread, rather than attempting to turn mine (which was posted in GD as opposed to GDP, because I wanted to approach the subject from the perspective of our common humanity, rather than our common politics) into a forum for your complaints against the Democratic Party as a whole.




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Oldtimeralso Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 01:52 PM
Response to Original message
52. K & R and proud to be # 100
The real question that the school administration and the students should answer is WWJH?

Who Would Jesus Hate?
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LittleGirl Donating Member (377 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 01:53 PM
Response to Original message
53. thank you
I've been so busy moving, I didn't have an update on this story. How truly sick and sad that they did this. I think you should mail this out to all of "voice of the people" sections in all of the newspapers.
Beautifully put.
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colsohlibgal Donating Member (670 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 02:43 PM
Response to Original message
54. Very, Very Well Stated
Meanness and intolerance....when it is displayed like this it always says more about the insecurities of the perpetrators than anything else.

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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
55. If her name were "Carrie", the similarities with Stephen King's book would be legion.
K&RF
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 04:07 PM
Response to Original message
56. Having Rick Warren give the Presidential invocation validated the bigotry that you wrote about
Rick Warren is the same man that supported a law in Uganda that would lead to the execution of gays and lesbians. Warren only back pedaled after the publicity got too hot for him.
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robinblue Donating Member (385 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #56
64. Yes, I agree, That deplorable incident validated the bigotry.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #56
68. Shhhh! We're not supposed to talk about that! n/t
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lsewpershad Donating Member (964 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
57. It's always such a joy
to read your well thought out posts. Thanks once again for telling it like it is.
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ejbr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 05:15 PM
Response to Original message
58. k & r n/t
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
59. Yes. 100% correct. I am with you.
What happened to her was a classic example of the madness of power that goes along with "tyranny of the majority"
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deaniac21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 05:28 PM
Response to Original message
60. dog bites man
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Naturalist111 Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-10 09:13 PM
Response to Original message
66. Here Here!
Kick
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