Are you up for another Friday afternoon challenge question?

[CTyankee]

Which of these two paintings of the same scene is by a woman?

Extra credit: names of both artists.

Art majors/conoisseurs, pleast hold back for a bit. I want to see if an art work can be "gendered" just by looking at it.

#1



#2

[DebbieCDC]

1. My guess is the first one is by a woman

but I don't know either artist.

[CTyankee]

3. Why do you guess that? nt

[DebbieCDC]

9. It just feels like that's the one

I think because in the second painting the woman looks a bit "squeamish" about what she's doing and in the first painting both women are focused and determined. I think that's how a woman would paint the scene.

[CTyankee]

24. I think you are right in your reasoning. This female artist was herself a rape victim.

And this is Judith beheading Holofernes...she got him drunk and then beheaded him. She of course being an Israelite and he a Philistine. I can see why the theme would appeal to her...

[lumberjack_jeff]

6. My guess too.

The expressions on the faces of #2 conform to stereotype at odds with the subject matter. It displays cognitive dissonance by the painter.

The women in painting #1 are badasses, befitting what they are doing.

[CTyankee]

12. Can you explain a bit more what you mean by "cognitive dissonance"?

nt

[lumberjack_jeff]

14. The painter of #2 was unable to identify with the killer.

Killers don't look like that. "Now what would snow white look like if she was forced by the wicked witch to slit grumpy's throat?"

[CTyankee]

25. I like your Snow White reference! nt

[damntexdem]

30. #2 emphasizes the blood, much more macho

On the other hand, I don't see reticence in the expression, just attention to detail: "gotta cut through both cartoid arteries as well as the windpipe here."

Still, I think #1 was done by a woman.

[onenote]

17. I would have guessed number two was by a woman

[Raven]

2. #2

[CTyankee]

4. Why do you guess that?

[Liberal_in_LA]

5. Violent!

[CTyankee]

8. Yep. Both are...nt

[DebbieCDC]

10. Really?

Who are the artists?

[CTyankee]

13. Sorry, I meant both are violent, not that both are by women.

Only one is by a woman...

[barbtries]

7. i have no idea

i'm not familiar with either painting.

[Wickerman]

11. I'll guess #2

because 1 seems more conspiratorial and the 2nd more regretful and perhaps defensive. YMMV.

[NYC_SKP]

15. Oops, forgot to wait. Edit.

Sorry...

:dunce:

:hi:

[SharonRB]

18. Delete -- I was wrong.

[CTyankee]

19. Hey, you are good! Mind if I ask how you knew it...

nt

[NYC_SKP]

21. I wasn't sure of both...

So had to check on the Gentileschi in one of my books, was sure of the Caravaggio, though.

Books from college days. I was pretty sure I'd seen the image.

Aren't they both great to contrast?

The expression of the Caravaggio is like, "wow, so this is how this feels, how odd."

While the other is more, "Hold still, This might sting a bit."

[CTyankee]

23. Gentileschi was a rape victim which is why I believe her work is even more violent

than Caravaggio's (and he was a pretty violency oriented guy!).

While I was not an art major I did an independent study on him while working on a Masters in Liberal Studies, because I thought he was a fascinating fellow.

[lumberjack_jeff]

27. The Carvaggio is is conflicted. the Gentileschi, not.

In my experience, men can't understand/believe/identify with Judith. It is at odds with cultural expectations.

[CTyankee]

32. That is an interesting insight. I agree with it. I wonder why Caravaggio did it.

Usuaslly, in his works, he is very involved in his subject, but this is really different. I wonder about it...

[lumberjack_jeff]

34. I suspect he thought he was in tune with her.

Snow White with an icky job to do.

[CTyankee]

33. A good point. I agree. Of course it is at odds with cultural expectations.

The expectation is that a woman wouldn't wait until you are drunk and then decapitate you....

[lumberjack_jeff]

35. LOL, when married it's best to remain sober enough to run away if necessary. n/t

[SharonRB]

16. Delete. My bad.

They are both the same beheading.

[bishopsred]

20. oops I didn't wait...

[Saphire]

22. I think #2

I just see more emotion on the faces.

[KittyWampus]

26. I recognize Caravaggio. The young woman seems to be like "WTF? Why is my sword

cutting off this guys head?!"

She looks kind of puzzled.

The older woman looks fairly resolute.

So now I can say my days as an Art History major paid off :D

Except the top painting is new to me. Agreed the woman there is badass, cutting off the head cause it has to be done.

[CTyankee]

31. Artimesia Gentileschi's father, Oresto, was a friend of Caravaggio.

Her painting is a bit later than his but obviously influenced it by him. Both of course are early Baroque era.

[NYC_SKP]

28. Judith seduced him, then beheaded him while he was drunk. Don't fuck with Judith.

It's an interesting story, more interesting with the revelation that the artist Gentileschi was a rape victim herself (thanks, CTyankee!)

In summary, Judith, a beautiful widow and chosen by God, has used her charms to enter the tent of Holofernes, an Assyrian general out to destroy Judith's hometown. Overcome with drink, he passes out and is decapitated by Judith; his head is taken away in a basket (often carried by an elderly female servant). Artists have mainly chosen one of two possible scenes (with or without the servant): the decapitation, with Holofernes prone on the bed, or the heroine holding or carrying the head.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judith_and_Holofernes



:patriot:

[CTyankee]

29. And look at what Donatello did...

pretty grim, that...