"I Have Been Ignored By The Media-I've been predicting violence from these people for years now"

[kpete]

Jesus will kill all those smart-ass, Democrat-voting, overeducated people who have been mocking us!

Frank Schaeffer

New York Times best-selling author
Posted: April 1, 2010 02:24 PM




The Evangelical "Mainstream" Insanity Behind the Michigan "End Times" Militia
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/frank-schaeffer/the-evangelical-mainstrea_b_520990.html

As the son of well known evangelicals and far right leader Francis Schaeffer I was in the middle of the chain of events that led to the arrests of men prepared to kill cops for Jesus. The rhetoric we in the early pro-life movement unleashed combined, with the apocalyptic fantasies of the fundamentalist evangelicals, is a deadly brew.

As I describe in detail in my books Crazy For God and Patience With God this movement has a deep evangelical background. In fact I've been predicting violence from these people for years now, something I talk about in detail in Patience With God (from which I drew material for this article since I have a whole chapter there about the "Left Behind" cult).

My warnings have been largely ignored by the mainstream media who haven't a clue as to the sort of religious paranoia boiling in the Tea Party and other movements.

Jerry Jenkins and Tim LaHaye's Left Behind series of sixteen novels (so far!) represents everything that is most deranged about religion. What happened with this militia group is that their paranoid, deranged fantasy jumped from the page into sick brains and was turned into action.

The Left Behind franchise holds out hope for the self-disenfranchised that at last everyone will know "we" were right and "they" were wrong. They'll know because Spaceship Jesus will come back and whisk us away, leaving everyone else to ponder just how very lost they are because they refused to say the words, "I accept Jesus as my personal savior" and join our side while there was still time! Even better: Jesus will kill all those smart-ass, Democrat-voting, overeducated people who have been mocking us!

All the folks in Michigan did was decide to start the killing a little early.

Knowingly or unknowingly, Jenkins and LaHaye cashed in on years of evangelical/fundamentalists' imagined victim-hood -- something that is now key to understanding the Tea Party movement.

more:
http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2010/04/armageddon-patriots.html

[polichick]

1. Fortunately Rachel Maddow hasn't ignored him - Schaeffer is a frequent guest. nt

[eleny]

2. yup

:thumbsup:

[Wapsie B]

3. Funny how we've heard from people on the right how the age of victimhood is over,

that is unless you're one of the conservative fundies.

[monmouth]

4. The good news is that money is dropping in these mega-churches. Even

the Crystal Cathedral is unable to pay their bills. Maybe people are starting to smarten up.

[valerief]

19. No, they've just all lost their jobs and homes and have no money left for Jeebus. nt

[RaleighNCDUer]

21. And that pisses them off, and they WILL find someone to blame. nt

[1776Forever]

27. I come from a moderately well to do county in Ohio & most of the people are Republicans.

Even after they have lost so many jobs they still think being a Christian and being a Republican are synonymous! They are such fools! I always told them I didn't have a 100 mil in the bank so I was a Democrat. They just don't get the hypocrisy that these Repub's use on them and make them believe they are on their side! It is really tragic that they play these games with people who think they are following Christ's teachings when it is the truth and cannot be denied that Jesus would be considered a Socialist in our times.

This is a good reference for this truth:

Biblical Basis for Liberal Politics
By David Chandler

http://www.lcurve.org/writings/BiblicalLiberal.htm



The "Religious Right" (Moral Majority, Christian Coalition, etc.) gets so much media attention for its conservative political activism that a casual observer would think conservative Christianity somehow equates to conservative politics. This is not the case. In fact many people with left-leaning political views find a solid basis for their positions in the Bible. There are many sides to this topic, but we will limit our focus to attitudes toward the rich and the poor...

By these standards Jesus was a socialist.

Jesus spoke remarkably often about wealth and poverty. To the poor he said, "Blessed are you poor, for yours is the kingdom of God," (Luke's version). To the rich he said, "Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth," and "go, sell what you have, and give to the poor." When the rich turned away from him because they couldn't follow his command he observed, "it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

For Jesus, helping the poor and the outcast is not optional: it is the essence of what it means to love God. In the parable of the last judgment he welcomes the righteous into heaven saying, "I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me." When the righteous answered that they didn't recall doing any of these things, he said, "as you did it to one of the least of these my brethren, you did it to me."

We are to "forgive our debtors" and "give to every one who begs from you." But don't handouts contribute to moral decay? Jesus was more concerned about the moral decay in those who are so attached to their wealth that they would hoard it for themselves. In our better moments most of us recognize that giving does not corrupt...

What's wrong with trickle-down economics? Every time I hear that phrase I think of the story Jesus told about a rich man and the beggar Lazarus "who desired to be fed with what fell from the rich man's table." Needless to say, the story ends with Lazarus going to a better place than the rich man. Trickle down theory is about crumbs. Those who say we should settle for crumbs would make us a nation of beggars.

Greed may be a driving force for the economy, but Jesus saw it is as destructive to community...

Jesus' response to economic inequality is very direct: we are to share the wealth...

Is this "bleeding heart" liberalism? You bet it is! Jesus is the definitive bleeding heart, and he calls us to follow him.

...........

Yes, Jesus was a Socialist!

[crazylikafox]

31. Thank you. Yes, Jesus was a Socialist.

It never ceases to amaze me how these people can call themselves Christians. Whatever their religion is, it's certainly not based on the teachings of Jesus Christ.

[The Doctor.]

37. Yet the Christo-Fascists can't be bothered to know what Christ believed.

[elocs]

38. "Jesus is a Liberal":

http://www.jesusisaliberal.org/

Why is Jesus a Liberal?

Webster's dictionary defines a Liberal as one who is open minded, not
strict in the observance of orthodox, traditional or established forms or
ways. Jesus was a pluralist Liberal who taught that one need not
conform to strict and orthodox views of God, religion, and life. He
rejected greed, violence, the glorification of power, the amassing of
wealth without social balance, and the personal judging of others, their
lifestyles and beliefs.

Over and over again, He taught us to believe in and live a spiritual and
ethical life based in our essential, inherent goodness. What Jesus
promoted was succinct set of spiritual principals and a way of life
based upon the of love, compassion, tolerance, and a strong belief in
the importance in giving and of generosity to those in need.

While not Biblical scholars, our common sense understanding of His
lessons as philosophically and politically Liberal is founded upon Jesus'
own words (see quotes below), modern interpretations of Liberation
Theology, and in the positive, loving and compassionate application of
His teachings - from the many early Saints to Mother Theresa and
Liberation Theology.

Certainly, Jesus brought a radically Liberal theology to the Orthodox
believers of his time. Jesus IS a Liberal even today because now more
than ever, His principals align with the very core of Liberal Beliefs.

[krabigirl]

43. This is true..people may still even believe but not be into these hateful "churches".

[dgibby]

5. Frank is like a prophet, crying in the wilderness that is the MSM.

They either don't understand or don't want to understand what is happening with the Talibornagains. They will not be happy until they've started another Civil War.

[nadinbrzezinski]

6. Preach it brother

and yes he is correct, but many folks will keep digging deeper into the hole of denial they are in.

[zbdent]

7. hell, I've said from early 2002 that

had Gore been the recipient of the favorable ruling by the SCOTUS in December 2000, Osama bin Laden wouldn't have attacked on 9/11 ... because he would have been laughing his ass off watching the "liberal media" cover "Civil War II", with the courageous "Patriotic" Americans besieging Washington DC with guns a-blazin', trying to get the "rightful, duly-elected President" into the White House, and the "pretender/usurper" out ...

[old mark]

13. They still hate Gore, almost as much as Obama - They still hate

Hillary, too.
The are really good at that, those "christians"....


mark

[martymar64]

8. Why does he have to plug his book in every single statement he makes

Every television appearance he is on and in every article he writes, he plugs his book right off the bat. I know he has some valid insightful things to say, but hustling his book every time he opens his mouth is getting a little old.

Just sayin'

[nadinbrzezinski]

9. Becuase that is marketing 101

just saying...

[martymar64]

10. He's doing himself a disservice by overdoing it

And doing it on a news show inserts a germ of doubt in the minds of viewers. Is he there to impart information or just flog his wares like its an infomercial? OK, we know you wrote a book! If you want to plug it, then buy some ad time!

It reminds of the endless plugs that saturate evangelical TV shows, like Swaggart and Oral Roberts. They could not go five minutes without inserting another plug for whatever bullshit they were hawking. He is using the same method in his endless plugs that his former colleagues use.

As I said before, he has many valid insights that are worth listening to and worth heeding. I just wish he would lay off the hustle while he's on a news show. If he wants airtime to plug his book, he can go on "The View" or "Good Morning America". If he wants to be on the serious discussion shows, then lay off the plugola.

[nadinbrzezinski]

15. He comes from that tradition

the oral Roberts tradition.

They have made millions using that basic technique

To you (and I may add me) this is to a point grating, but it is so effective that it is recommended you do it at any business school in the country.

Hell I am really bad at selling my wares, but obviously he is not.

Yeah he is doing himself a disservice with some folks, but not most.

Oh and for the record the first time I LISTENED to him, on the Maddow Show I looked for his books.

You want some insight into the thinking, now I will do the selling for him, I highly recommend them.

[martymar64]

16. I feel his message sells itself

Now that everyone is aware of who he is then maybe he can tone it down a little. If he's doing the same thing vis a vis his book 6 mos or a year from now then it could reasonably be considered overboard by most.
What he is saying isn't really new to me, I've lived around those types growing up in extremely conservative surroundings. I think people actually should read his book. If they are not familiar with the evangelical mindset, they will be shocked.

On marketing, I guess I'm just a little oversensitive to and suspicious of marketing. I tend to doubt the value of things if they have to be sold to me rather than me choosing to buy them on my own.
Marketing helped get us into a war in Iraq. Marketing sold cars with faulty brakes or sold baby formula chock a block with melamine.

If I feel somebody is pitching me, my defenses automatically go up. I'm more receptive to listen if I feel somebody isn't trying to just get into my wallet.

But the merits of marketing is for another discussion at another time.

[nadinbrzezinski]

17. THe merits are for another day

yet they are at the core of the consumerist economy we live under.

Alas it is used to sell all from my food to religion

:-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFowNFvmUxw

[Th1onein]

30. I, for one, would like to know the name of his books.

I'm glad he mentioned them. I'd like to read them and will buy them.

[nadinbrzezinski]

45. I've read both of them, on the IPOD, (kindle editions)

and they are very much worth readying.

I get the criticism from a few, but I also know why he is doing it.

[RaleighNCDUer]

22. Because there are 305.5 million people in this country who have not

yet read it - and 250 million of whom have no idea who he is.

[troubledamerican]

11. Blackshirts are just the red carpet for a military coup. Worry about Pentagon Tea Parties.

[jaysunb]

20. +1

n/t

[Quantess]

12. Somehow I just knew it was Frank Schaeffer.

I was correct!
That guy needs a microphone and as much air time as he can speak. He knows what he's taklking about.

[gratuitous]

23. I remember when he was "Franky" Schaeffer

Described by a friend in those days as "scary . . . Franky's a scary moon monster." He was in the evangelical, end-times stuff up to his eyeballs and beyond. But it's very fatiguing, living on the edge of eternity like that. A lot of people just aren't built for it, and I'm glad to see that Schaeffer is away from it. And he does indeed know what he's talking about with end-timers, and their impatience for God to get off his celestial duff and start meting out some divine justice.

It's a complicated and in many ways fascinating phenomenon, and it would serve our society well to have it brought out and examined in some detail. As it is, much of it is dismissed with an airy wave and a muttering that "those people are nuts," and that's the end of it. It's a fine line to tread, between examination and endorsement, but it's useful to have this information out there. Forewarned being forearmed and all.

[BrklynLiberal]

14. If anyone would know, it would be Frank Schaeffer....

His appearances on Rachel Maddow's Show have been VERY noteworthy...He is an excellent speaker and very passionate about his
fear toward the fundies. I would guess that having been one, gives him some insight that the rest of us might lack.

[mopinko]

18. i think he is trying to atone.

he regrets his and his father's contributions to this mess.

[BrklynLiberal]

35. Guess he inherited some humanity that his father lacked.

[8 track mind]

24. For those of us who listen to shortwave,

It's not a new surprise. When dubya got elected, it calmed down to some degree. The night Obama got elected it went insane and it's been ramping up ever since. There are people calling for armed revolt on the airwaves, and they are not on low power station at all. They buy airtime on 50 kilowatt stations with an antenna that concetrates the power into roughly 2 million watts. So needless to say their hate and drivel goes world wide all day long. No wonder the rest of the world thinks we are insane......

[1776Forever]

28. I wondered about that. I used to be a CBer & have thought about going to Shortwave.

What kind of equipment do you have? Can you pick it up shortwave on the internet anywhere? Just wondered. I know you can pick up the police/fire scanners. Thanks!

[8 track mind]

41. there are different ways of doing it

Personally, i restore old vacuum tube receivers and transmitters. I love stuff that glows in the dark eh? One of the best deals out there is the old radio shack DX series. I had a DX-392 that i really loved until i lit up a transmitter next to it. Oops. Blew a lot of stuff out that i couldn't find replacements for. Anything from Sony or Grundig is a good choice. There is a lot of activity right now including bonafide radio pirates. If money is tight, ican show how to modify a standard old school am radio to do shortwave. Super easy mod. let me know

[1776Forever]

44. Wow that sounds great! I would love to know more. Maybe you could put a pamphlet together & sell it

Did you ever think about that? I think with the way the climate is acting lately it would be good to have a shortwave radio for that purpose alone! If I can help you out let me know. I used to do graphics and I will do it for free for the help you can give me.

Thanks again!

:hi:

[varelse]

25. K&R

thanks for the reminder - I need to buy his books :)

[YOY]

26. "Overeducated"...well someone has a vast inferiority complex and wants to share.

n.t.

[Th1onein]

29. This is a great article.

I've seen pieces of these guys shows -- Hagee and Van Impe -- for years, on cable TV. I always considered them some really good comedy. It amazes me that anyone would take these guys seriously.

That the Bush administration and the Republicans, in general, would take advantage of the idiots that do take them seriously is shameless. How low can they go?

[N_E_1 for Tennis]

32. Religion will kill us all.

The Pope, rape of children, bombings in every religions name, fundamentalists Christian, Muslim - whatever, may as well be Pok -e - Man beliefs. Humans just really do not want to think for themselves. We want, need, desire someone to explain the unexplainable to us. When we can't parse the explanation "believers" go off the deep or deeper end and conjure up the "Way it is". Then will- to the end - defend what they made up in their deranged minds. I have seen this in my own family. Smart people, intelligent people, college educated people, capable of very interesting dialogue, believing the Universe began 6,000 or so years ago.

Why?, I asked so many times. Because the bible says so, they say.

Does the bible explain ....... I counter..... then I stop, whatever I say the fucking bible will "explain" it. Oh yeah they have the verse and number. "Look it up", they say. "Oh. wait I have a bible stuck to my ass, in my back pocket, here look at this!!!"

Did you think for yourself?

* I have the good book.*

Did you think for yourself?

* I have the word of god.*

Did you think for yourself?

* I went to service on Sunday and bible classes throughout the week.*

Did you think for yourself?

* Hey, god said so!!! *

Did you think for yourself?

Do you think for yourself?

I'm so tired, exhausted, I think I'm going to pet my dog and just relax take some stress off.


Well he's been dead. Maybe in the next life. LOL.

[defendandprotect]

33. Religion is a political tool of elites -- they've been trying to recreate VIOLENT religion ...

for four decades now!

GOP gave start up funds for the Christian Coalition in the 1980s . . .

Right wing wealthy -- Scaife funded Dobson's organization --

and other right wing wealthy funded Bauer's organization.

Everything the right does is funded by their wealthy -- from magazines, to think tanks,

to the T-baggers!


US/CIA also used religion in the ME -- to create warmongering by Israel by arming right

wing Fundamentalist Israelis. They created the Taliban/Al Qaeda to BAIT the Russians into

Afghanistan. US went into Afghanistan 6 months before the Russians came in. And, they

did it to "try to give the Russians a Vietnam-type experience." We didn't want to be losers

alone!

And, US government also wrote, printed and shipped those VIOLENT Islamic teachings we've

heard so much about -- in order to create a violent Islam in the ME.


If patriarchy, organized patriarchal religion cannot resurrect a VIOLENT religious movement

they are finished! When debate is possible, when people will use their intelligence,

organized patriarchal religion is over -- so is patriarchy.

Religion is an ages long tool of elites to infiltrate other nations -- take over their wealth

and natural resources -- take over their country! How many times have we seen that --

Ireland, Hawaii, Native Americans, on and on --

[SalviaBlue]

34. K & R

[AsahinaKimi]

36. Its interesting that

Once long ago, I was told in all seriousness, by a born again Christian that when the end times come, if I did not converted to Christianity, it would be his patriotic duty and pleasure to slay me where I stood. He told me that all non-Christians would be slaughtered like dogs and that he was ready, willing and able to do just that, once the signs of the bible were in place.


It makes me glad that I took Kendo lessons all those years, and I do know how to use a Katana. If ever it came to people like these getting out of hand, I would defend myself with my utmost ability.

[Beako]

39. Sheesh you live in a scary place! O.o

[AsahinaKimi]

40. Heh, not any more.

I was told that while living in Arizona. I am back in San Francisco, the town I grew up in. Thank goodness, we don't have many like that roaming the streets here.

[krabigirl]

42. I agree ro

however to be fair, there are a lot of (mean) atheists in the "tea party" as well..many RP supporters or Randian types are not into religion. They are still just as mean and nasty.

[Mojeoux]

46. The First Time I Saw Those Screaming Tea Baggers,

I saw the same faces as the people screaming at little kids going to school after, "Brown vs. The Board of Education."

I'd like to see a comparison of those faces, side by side, with the RW rally faces of last summer.

The hairstyles and clothes are different, but the KKK hate in their crazy-eyes is identical.

The world was revolted back then and by November Americans are going to be experiencing an inner cringe response.

Bless you for all your work and focus.

BTW........... did you see the "Hannity, 'fakes news'" clip where he addressed his audience as "wanna-be Mc Veighs?"

And they all cheered. The guests on stage included California Congressmen David Dreier and Kevin McCarthy.