Alcohol abuse is a four times better predictor of psychosis than pot abuse..

[Fumesucker]

Isn't it interesting how the bolded bit at the end of this paragraph never gets mentioned in the M$M, or even here on DU for that matter?

Now keep in mind I've dramatized the title of this OP a bit but that is what is almost always done for drugs other than alcohol and nicotine and they don't tell you they're dramatizing the title.

http://www.schizophrenia.com/prevention/streetdrugs.html

Overview: Use of street drugs (including LSD,methamphetamine,marijuana/hash/cannabis) and alcohol have been linked with significantly increased probability of developing psychosis and schizophrenia. This link has been documented in over 30 different scientific studies (studies done mostly in the UK, Australia and Sweden) over the past 20 years. In one example, a study interviewed 50,000 members of the Swedish Army about their drug consumption and followed up with them later in life. Those who were heavy consumers of cannabis at age 18 were over 600% more likely to be diagnosed with schizophrenia over the next 15 years than those did not take it. (see diagram below). Experts estimate that between 8% and 13% of all schizophrenia cases are linked to marijuna / cannabis use during teen years. It is also notable that some research suggests that alcohol abuse is a stronger predictor of psychotic symptoms than regular cannabis use (by a factor of four).

[Oregone]

1. Funny that...I thought psychosis predisposition was a predictor of pot/alcohol usage

Hrm...you word it like that and it all sorta makes sense.

[Fumesucker]

3. I just put this up in answer to the multiple threads about pot causing psychosis..

I started digging around some of the links and ran into that in just a couple of minutes..

And I tend to agree with you that the cause/effect relationship has not been yet determined.

But clearly there is a strong political element in what gets reported in the M$M and even what gets posted here on DU.

[blue neen]

4. Honestly, I was thinking the same thing.

If a person's brain chemicals are off in the first place, then it's more likely that they will self-medicate!

[Oregone]

8. Or even that they will be less inhibited, more explorative, and have less regard for social norms

[Richard Steele]

18. "Cart before the horse" syndrome is on the rise. nm

[elleng]

2. Customary lack of understanding of alcoholism prevails.

Posted elsewhere:

Since 1956, the American Medical Association has recognized and defined alcohol addiction as a primary disease, not a secondary symptom of an underlying psychological or medical illness. Since then, this definition has been extended to define all chemical addictions as "chronic, progressive diseases characterized by significant impairment that is directly associated with persistent and excessive use of psychoactive substances. Impairment may involve physiological, psychological, or social dysfunction."

Research into the neurochemical basis of addiction points to the dysfunction of one or more of six major neurotransmitter types as being the basis of the symptoms of addiction, withdrawal, and drug cravings. Studies have shown strong genetic predisposition to some types of chemical dependency regardless of social environment.

http://www.lakesidemilam.com/DiseaseOfAddictionSynopsis...

Glossary of relevant terms, fyi:

http://www.lakesidemilam.com/GlossaryOfTerms.htm

[Fumesucker]

5. I doubt there is anyone on DU that isn't at least marginally aware of alcoholism as a disease..

I was just posting this in response and as counterpoint to all the OMG..POT CAUSES PSYCHOSIS!!1!11! threads that are in GD on a regular basis.

[Juche]

6. Social isolation also increases the risk of psychosis

That doesn't mean the government should mandate that everyone have friends. Nor does it mean the government should ban pot or alcohol.

http://www.schizophrenia.com/hypo.php

For people at risk of diseases like this, they should have honest information about what the risk factors are and what neuroprotective things they can do to prevent an episode. And pretending pot has no risks doesn't help them.

Pot and alcohol can make psychosis worse. So can living in an urban area, being lonely, being stressed, being born in winter, etc.

However with pot as long as you do not have certain alleles that code for dopamine related proteins or you are over 20~, it really doesn't seem to matter.

At the same time dozens of things can lower the risk of developing psychosis. Omega 3s, counseling, adequate maternal nutrition, etc.

[suede1]

7. K & R.

[BakedAtAMileHigh]

9. but but but i saw reefer madness!

There are a lot of seriously gullible people here at DU. I remember when I was a kid they told me pot will:
1. Kill brains cells. (totally false)
2. Make my testicles shrink and make me grow man-boobs. (also false, thank jeebus)
3. Turn me into a lazy slacker (well....two outta three isn't bad....)

It's all bullshit, people. Everything they have ever told you about cannabis is a total lie. All of it, every word.

[bemildred]

10. Correlation is not causation, and it is not prediction either.

Statistical correlation just means that things are statistically correlated. It might be interesting or suggestive, but it is not causation or prediction, either one. That is a higher bar to get over.

[geckosfeet]

11. Should have stopped at "Alcohol abuse is a four times better".

[Fumesucker]

13. But alcohol really does kill brain cells..

:crazy:

[geckosfeet]

21. Point being?

[Fumesucker]

23. Whut wer wee talkinnn aboot?

:evilgrin:

[seabeyond]

12. being a californian living in texas causes absolute psychosis.

ok, maybe, maybe not

[Prisoner_Number_Six]

14. It's true.

As a recovered alcoholic I'm here to attest to the fact that I AM well and truly brain fried.

[tblue37]

15. A link (correlation) is not causation. The people who later developed schizophrenia might have had

problematic symptoms earlier that they used marijuana or alcohol to manage. Many people self-medicate with drugs, alcohol, and cigarettes to handle psychological problems. That doesn't mean the stuff they are taking cause the problems, just that it is correlated with the problems.

Also, isn't "factor" misused here? I thought that a factor of four was way more than four times more--i.e., a factor of 1 = 10 times more; a factor of 2 = 100 times more; a factor of 3 = 1000 times more; a factor of four = 10,000 times more.

Math isn't my thing, so I might well be wrong, but that's what I thought "factor" meant in a statement like this.

[bemildred]

17. I think the usage "factor of four" is OK.

You are thinking of "power of four". "Factor of four", in the given context, appears to mean that alcohol use has a 4 times great correlation with eventual "psychological problems" that pot use does.

But you are correct that this study, scientifically speaking, does not mean much.

[Fumesucker]

19. You are thinking of "order of magnitude" which is powers of ten..

[tblue37]

20. Thanks. nt

[geckosfeet]

22. Factor is used in simpler sense here. 4 indicating 4 times more, or a factor of 4.

[brewens]

16. If I'm around redneck alcohol junkies I love to say, "I don't do heavy drugs",

if they offer me a drink. That usually causes them to get defensive and deny it's drug use. I like to point out that alcohol is the only drug I've ever seen anyone overdose on and I've seen that a lot.
I don't have anything against recreational drug use, at least the drugs most people can handle. Pot and alcohol are the only two I trust myself with. I usually don't drink anymore but probably will from time to time.