Can someone tell me when the President's optimism has proven to be true

[AllentownJake]

Iraq-Not going to meet his initial time table or goal
Health Care - Thought he'd have a bill by August
Gitmo - Nope not going to get closed in 12 months
Unemployment - Projecting 8% in the 1st quarter of 2009 for the fourth quarter of 2009.
Afghanistan - July 2011?

Honestly, the guy gives an optimistic time table or projection on something and everyone cheers, but time and time again he proves absolutely wrong.

Than the people who were cheering break out the pony line when someone says something. Maybe if he stopped thinking his policies would result in ponies people would stop looking for them.

[Deep13]

1. We dodged another 30s-type depression. nt

[MercutioATC]

3. We DELAYED it.

Whether we actually avoided it or not remains to be seen.

[Orrex]

15. Then you can't yet say that we merely DELAYED it, either

Whether we merely delayed it or not remains to be seen.

Cuts both ways.

[MercutioATC]

16. Oh, we definitely delayed it.

Whether that delay was sufficient to enable a real recovery is debatable.

[Orrex]

17. How long does it have to be delayed before it counts as "prevented"

Or "dodged" or what have you?

[MercutioATC]

19. Honestly, I don't know.

What I DO know is that we've made virtually NO policy changes...we've just thrown hundreds of billions of tax dollars at the problem willy-nilly (which, however untargeted, WILL improve economic numbers).

There are a thousand schools of thought on what the "model" looks like...most of them engineered by people with something to gain.

Viewing the entire scenario, I don't see anything positive. I don't see a true recovery, I don't see future prosperity...hell, I don't even see a glimmer of hope. This country is being sucked dry, which may work as a "recovery" for some, but not for the vast majority of us.

[Andronex]

41. Any accountant would look at the balance sheet...

and conclude America is bankrupt, if we were a business no bank would lend money, but we are a military empire and we can print all the money we want so who knows how long this will last?

[Deep13]

28. No problem is ever solved forever. nt

[MercutioATC]

30. My point is that NOTHING has been "solved".

We've delayed a real crash. Nothing more.

That delay may enable a recovery, it may not. The only think we've actually done, however, is bought time.


We have not actually "solved" anything.

[MercutioATC]

2. It's bleaker than that.

Health Care - No real reform in sight. Congress advanced their typical do-nothing legislation. IF we get it passed, it'll be nearly worthless.

Unemployment - Again, no reform. Want increased unemployment? It's an issue of trade policies and TARGETED tax incentives to businesses...it's not a series of unconditional handouts.

[Bluerthanblue]

4. Jan. 20, 2009

The other things you mention are all vunerable to all kinds of outside influence.

He can't do any of these things on his own.

He's not the King or the Dictator or the Emperor and he's not GW Bush- none of the things you listed can actually be accomplished without the apporval and support of others-

:shrug:

We seem determined to have our whipping boy. :thumbsdown:

[AllentownJake]

8. That didn't adress the OP

It was a bunch of apologist bullshit.

The OP states, when has he been right about any time line or projection he sets when he goes for a policy.

I'm thinking the President might suffer from overly optimistic delusions.

[Bluerthanblue]

11. the OP doesn't state anything of the kind-

and I agree with you that Pres. Obama does seem to have more optimism than he should- but what's the alternative?

Would you rather hear the kind of hopeless crap that Bush and Cheeney fed us? That the war on terra was going to go on for generations?

Obama stated what he would LIKE- or would HOPE to see happen with the HC bill- he didn't say it would be accomplished, nor could he- it DOES depend on many other people.


:hi:
goosfraba

[Warpy]

5. He's looking considerably less optimistic these days

as the impossible job of getting anything through a stodgy and corrupt Senate becomes a reality to him.

He certainly didn't look optimistic last night and there was nothing upbeat about that speech, refreshing after the usual jingoistic Mom/apple pie/innate superiority of the American way speeches we're used to about war.

[TornadoTN]

25. He started looking considerably less optimistic after he had that meeting shortly after the election

I can't recall exactly which one it was, but I remember the look on his face. It was as if he aged 30 years in a two hour session.

I believe it was the one where he was briefed on all of the secret government protocols and was finally let into the loop of the executive branch.

[bsd13]

6. The question I like to ask is...

Was it optimistic time lines that he was giving, or was it complete bullshit to get himself elected? Did he honestly believe in the rhetoric he was spouting or was it a ploy to tap into the general mood of the country who wanted something other than Bush Jr. (McCain) in the White House? Or could it be that the issues were much deeper, much more complex than he had supposed them to be when he started running?

[rucky]

7. It's a project management strategy

to get moving on something that could otherwise be tinkered with forever. You set a target date - half-knowing it won't be met - but the work done after the date has an urgency to it, and the manager has something to pressure the team with.

[tekisui]

9. Yeah. WHen has war ever produced the best-case scenario.

The troops are going, they'll be there for years.

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MineralMan]

13. I thought Spam came in a can.

[Johonny]

12. On the other hand your continuous rally against the stock market

hasn't really paid off either. But feel free everyday to tell us THE ECONOMY IS DOOMED! So your post is kind of ironic.

[dionysus]

14. daily doom thread huh jake?

[AllentownJake]

23. Attacking me not attacking the premise of the OP

Standard Operating Procedure of all your posts.

[dionysus]

26. pointing out that all you do is post negative, gloomy OPs is an attack? really?

i'd say you're on a mission to demoralize everybody.

[AllentownJake]

29. I've posted plenty of positive things

However if it doesn't involve your hero, you never seem to jump in positive or negative.

[dionysus]

32. "plenty" ? dude you usually post multiple doom threads every single day!

and the dude is not my hero/god/cult/pom pom/ ect, that whole schtick is old by now man

[MercutioATC]

31. Jake's realistic.

Realism isn't exceptionally conducive to optimism these days.


Blame the state of the world, not Jake.

[dionysus]

33. well, the second great depression he's been pushing for months hasn't happened yet.

[AllentownJake]

34. For you nt

[MercutioATC]

39. You expected another depression to be announced?

The periodic "economic data" we all get isn't data at all...it's spin. It's commentary. It's 2 inches of poorly-written op-ed.

Actual data paints a much bleaker picture than is generally being reported.


I'm not calling it a true depression yet...but only because we've artificially floated an unsustainable model on irresponsible policies and delayed reaching the real bottom.


The house IS on fire. So far, all we've done is to turn off the alarms so as not to alarm people while hoping that it will extinguish itself...and that's the charitable scenario. Reality is probably closer to the landlord setting the fire so he can collect the insurance money (and the copper pipes).

[saracat]

40. I would say the lack of progress by this Admin to do anything constructive about the

economic situation combined with the recent announcement of a troop surge are what demoralizes everyone. Congress and the WH demoralize us, not jake.

[MineralMan]

18. Can someone tell me when Jake's optimism ever existed?

[MercutioATC]

20. Sometimes, circumstances don't call for optimism.

This may be one of those times.

[MineralMan]

21. I disagree.

[MercutioATC]

22. Fair enough.

[AllentownJake]

24. November 2008

Killed in March of 2009.

[Freddie Stubbs]

27. When he thought that a young, mixed-race, 1st term Senator with a funny-sounding name could get

elected President of the United States.

[spanone]

35. so, would you prefer pessimism?

[AllentownJake]

37. Well when you set yourself up for failure

by making rosey predictions....you can't be surprised when people stop believing your rosey predictions.

[Obamanaut]

36. Well, he said last year he was going to be the next president. That

was optimistic, but some thought he was wrong.

[AllentownJake]

38. Outside of his own political career

An election isn't exactly the implemenation of a policy.

[Obamanaut]

42. The question asked was the question answered. There were no

limits in the question.

[AllentownJake]

43. He hired good people to run a primary campaign

and was able to pull of a victory where a democratic ham sandwhich should have won against any republican.

[Obamanaut]

44. Go ahead. Admit it was a poorly worded question, that could get

an answer you didn't want or expect. You can do this.

Think positi.....never mind.

[Bobbie Jo]

45. Iowa, 2008.