How much of Cho's actions were his fault?

[LoZoccolo]

[damntexdem]

1. Clearly 100 percent.

And probably an additional 100 percent the fault of his mental illness.

In other words, how can we possibly tell?

[billbuckhead]

2. America's degenerate gun culture ate him up and 31 other souls with him

May they all rest in peace and the gun pimps all go to hell.

Devil's Right Hand
Steve Earle

About the time that Daddy left to fight the big war
I saw my first pistol in the general store
In the general store, when I was thirteen
Thought it was the finest thing I ever had seen
So l asked if I could have one someday when I grew up
Mama dropped a dozen eggs, she really blew up
She really blew up and I didn't understand
Mama said the pistol is the devil's right hand

The devil's right hand, the devil's right hand
Mama said the pistol is the devil's right hand

My very first pistol was a cap and ball Colt
Shoot as fast as lightnin' but it loads a mite slow
Loads a mite slow and soon I found out
It can get you into trouble but it can't get you out
So then I went and bought myself a Colt 45
Called a peacemaker but I never knew why
Never knew why, I didn't understand
Cause Mama said the pistol is the devil's right hand

Well I get into a card game in a company town
Caught a miner cheating I shot the dog down
Shot the dog down, watched the man fall
Never touched his holster, never had a chance to draw
The trial was in the morning and they drug me out of bed
Asked me how I pleaded, not guilty I said
Not guilty I said, you've got the wrong man
Nothing touched the trigger but the devil's right hand

[ulysses]

3. we're supposed to divine this how?

[LisaL]

5. Exactly. How am I supposed to calculate this?

[ulysses]

11. what annoys me

is this tendency, after a tragedy like this, to apportion blame (12.37% to his parents, 7.67% to his second grade teacher) and to define the "pure evil" in the act.

[orpupilofnature57]

Spawns conversation about human beings and their philosophy or

lack there of ,thats a bad thing?

[orpupilofnature57]

Spawns conversation about human beings and their philosophy or

lack there of ,thats a bad thing?

[orpupilofnature57]

24. Spawns conversation about human beings and their philosophy or

lack there of ,thats a bad thing?

[orpupilofnature57]

4. Your not always responsible for what you think ,just what you do, 100%

[MnFats]

6. he was clearly profoundly mentally ill but he knew the difference ...

...between right and wrong.

[MedleyMisty]

7. I didn't know the guy

Nor am I a trained mental health professional with access to all his records and experience treating him before his death and expert knowledge on his particular mental illness.

So how am I supposed to know?

[Matsubara]

8. Where's the choice for "stupid question"?

This is not a quantifiable thing. His actions were totally uncalled for and wrong, but his classmates may have made things worse by ridiculing him.

If anything, I'd say his mental illness was to blame more than any person. But it's a shame that no person stepped in to really help this kid.

[LoZoccolo]

9. Judging from what you wrote I think your answer might be the last one, "I don't know." n/t

[BlooInBloo]

17. Let me know when you find it, please.

[sam sarrha]

10. he was schizophrenic, sexually abused and his mental illness probably complicated by Acutane side

side effects of paranoia, hostility and suidcidality..

i guess you could say he is responsible for being schizophrenic.. you can blame Ronald Reagan for closing all the mental health facilities.. and Rethug propaganda and party dogma keeping them closed,.. the Democrats for not getting their shit together to do something about it

but essentially he is personally responsible for being schizophrenic and having the courts declare him a danger to self and others then being let go cause there is no place to treat him... the lack of any mental health system had nothing to do with it... the school for letting a Bat Shit Crazy person to roam the campus stalking girls and setting fire to a dorm and terrorizing other students for a long time..

[Blue_Tires]

12. 80-99

and i'm much much closer to 99.999 than i am to 80

[johnnie]

13. From what I have heard

1/16th The gun makers, 1/16th The guy who sold him the gun, 1/16th bullies, 1/16th his roommates, 1/16th his ex g/f, 1/16th the doctors, 1/16th law-makers, 1/16th the cops, 1/16th teevee, 1/16th medication, 1/16th school officials, 1/16th his parents, 1/16th society, 1/16th movies, 1/16th Walmart, 1/16th The NRA and.... well, I ran out of 1/16ths, so no Cho.

[Double T]

14. 'fault' might be divided between Cho, other individuals or groups, msm, american culture and........

society, bigotry/predjudice, etc. Dividing the blame, fault or respondsibility by percentages is impossible. Clearly people with these types of disorders must be dealt with and NOT discounted or ignored.

[Zandor]

15. Arbitrarily, 50%

By the time he commited the crime, he no doubt had lost his mind and all sense of right and wrong. But at some earlier point he should have realized ne needed help.

So I split the difference.

[Systematic Chaos]

16. I say 3 parts nature to 1 part nurture.

He had the inherent instability to perform this action (75%) and the bad experiences of his life were the catalyst (25%). But no matter how you choose to quantify it it's nobody's fault but his own.

99.9% of the children who get picked on in school all the time are not murderers, let alone mas murderers.

[polichick]

18. There are so many factors to consider...

Of course the shooter is responsible for his actions - but if we really want to prevent this kind of tragedy we need to realize that his horrible actions were at least in part REactions to things that had happened to him. The HATE that the media goes on and on about was in large part HURT ~ something glossed over in this case and previous ones because we don't want to be responsible for the intentional cruelty (bullying, etc.) that is so prevalent in our culture. We also gloss over the contributions of violent films and the availability of weapons only meant to kill humans. It's easier to talk about craziness and hatred than it is to see how sick our culture is and curb our own disgusting habits.

Eerily, I was reading Jodi Picoult's Nineteen Minutes when this happened, a novel about a school shooting that beautifully shows how complicated it all really is. It's a great read and Picoult is known for her careful research. I highly recommend it!!!

[Blue_Tires]

19. welcome to the site!

[newyawker99]

29. Hi polichick!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Bluebear]

20. Oh for the love of...

[Behind the Aegis]

21. I feel ya!

Nobody is responsible for anything anymore.

"Jews are the reason for all wars" = alcohol

Racist tirades at comedy clubs = he was heckled

Racist remarks about basketball women = not really a racist, just stupid remark

"Jews are good at making money" = a head cold

All I can think of is the Family Guy episode explaining why Hitler was the way he was...all because he was puny, and couldn't lift weights, yet the kippah-wearing Jew, was bulging with muscles and had all kinds of women hanging on him. Hell, that makes more sense than some of the shit I have seen here in the past few months!

[Dorian Gray]

27. Personal Responsibility

has been steadily diminishing in our society. Everyone wants to blame everyone else for what they choose to do.

Cho is solely responsibile for the murder rampage. He may not be solely responsible for the state of his mind, but he is totally responsible for his actions.

[Hippo_Tron]

22. I don't think there's a point in assigning a percentage of blame

Since he committed suicide, the issue of justice in this particular instance isn't relevant. Rather, we need to ask how this can be prevented in the future.

[orpupilofnature57]

23. Make bullying a capitol crime?

[salin]

25. Rather than this question - the one I would ask - is there anything

to be learned - so that some future tragedy might be avoided. And I have no answer to that question at this point in time.

[liberal renegade]

26. Silly me

I thought it was Clintons fault.....

[NashVegas]

28. Better Question: How much of Cho's actions were his Responsibility?

I think we can all agree on the answer to this one. No 'gotchas' needed.