Standing up for the "purists"

[democrank]

I honestly never thought I`d live to see the day when standing up for age-old Democratic principles would be a bad thing...in the Democratic Party. Over four decades in the party and I just found out I`m a bad influence on moderates because I`m a so-called purist, one of those bad seeds that believes no torture means no torture, pro-union means pro-union, equal rights means equal rights, no White Phosphorus means no White Phosphorus. There`s no wiggle room here, not even to fit in with moderates or our wonderful friends across the aisle because I`d rather stand for something than win.

When we`re willing to close our eyes to families living in their cars, drug addicts living in boxes, prisons bursting at the seams, inner city schools rotting into oblivion, foreclosures as normal as sunshine, caskets rolling in from TWO wars and throw our unconditional support behind all those leaders who stood by and let it all happen, what kind of people are we? Win at all costs? Win no matter who gets hurt? Am I really supposed to nod in the affirmative as Leader Reid prostitutes himself for Olympia Snowe`s vote or pleasantly explains away Joe Lieberman`s latest example of treachery? A multi-week debate on a 1,000+ page health care bill while people are dying for lack of care? 1,000+ pages? Multi-week debate? Are they serious?

Third or fourth tour in Iraq or Afghanistan while our "leaders" run out and buy flag pins? Talk about dithering! We can`t even take a stand on that after how many years? Seven? How many dead soldiers and maimed children? Oh, I forgot. We have to be moderate and talk about how we love freedom.

Selling out isn`t compromise. It`s selling out. We`ve become so accustomed to wishy-washy that we now think it`s normal. Why do you think it`s so shocking when someone with a spine accidentally gets hold of a microphone? If we were used to courageous leaders, a show of spine would be a normal, everyday occurrence not an anomaly that gets the attention of every news program known to mankind.

So Cheney the war criminal does the Sunday morning rounds and torture photographs are kept from the citizens that paid for the secret program and we`re waiting on another surge. Why? The same old players with the same old excuses are in the same old position to play the same old game. It`s not really about the people, it`s about the power. Most of these politicians don`t take a stand. They take a focus group vote then take your check. Just say no. No change, no check. No change, no vote.

[natrat]

1. good rant, wish there was more positive, but it is indeed bleek

[lildreamer316]

81. "Bleak", sorry.

Don't bite my head off. Sorry.

[polichick]

2. Happy to make it 5 - k&r

[HowHasItComeToThis]

59. HAPPY TO BE 111, YES THAT IS ONE-HUNDRED ELEVEN

http://thefrankfactorspace.ning.com/

[RaleighNCDUer]

65. That would be eleventy-one. nt

[Stinky The Clown]

3. Off to The Greatest with ya.

[EFerrari]

4. It really is about the power, not the people.

Very well said.

[StarfarerBill]

20. I concur completely. +1

And, EFerrari...I love that sig picture you have; it elegantly tells the story of progressives' comradeship in the face of brutal power. Mind if I borrow it?

[EFerrari]

21. Please resteal what I stole and

welcome to DU, Bill.

[StarfarerBill]

22. Thanks and thanks again, EF. :)

[jonnyblitz]

5. k & r nt

[gleaner]

6. Beautifully said .....

I wish there were more people who felt as you do and let everyone know it. Maybe then we could inspire our leaders to have some spine and stop playing footsie on our dime while the abuses become tolerated, acceptable and a part of ordinary life here.

Wrong is still wrong, and no matter how much they try to sugarcoat it, the facts still show pure evil. We need to open our eyes and see it, then open our mouths and protest long and loudly.

[tblue]

7. You can't even say you wish Obama would do something without being trashed here.

I'm done biting my tongue, too.

[upi402]

10. yeah, makes me wonder

even duers aren't thinking for themselves. i wonder if there's hope. i sure won't give my $ or time to republidems.

[MNDemNY]

17. That's "President" Obama to you, Bub!

gobama.

[jonnyblitz]

18. the pod people are NASTY. nt

[upi402]

8. we gave dems power and we get the shaft

actually, we gave the 'other' corporatist party power. but hey, i'm a noiemaker from the NOW radical left.

[bobbolink]

86. So, we give them no more votes until they can treat us with common courtesy and respect.

[katandmoon]

9. K&R

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

11. "Purists" are usually the people who want politicians held accountable no matter what party. K&R

[Kermitt Gribble]

12. Big K&R!!! It still amazes me -

all the years we laughed at the 23 percenters on the right that supported * no matter what and it turns out we have the same type of people on our side. The sad thing is they deny any resemblance.

[upi402]

14. Colonel Sanders

and the chickens who love him


Meet the new boss...

[Orwellian_Ghost]

13. Maybe the bottom line is...

Those of us on the Left have heard for decades now sentiments such as "what will ever make you happy?" and "you are a purist" and "it is easy to criticize, but do you have any positive suggestions or do you just like to whine and complain?" and other similar statements.

There are a number of implied assumptions behind this "not perfect enough for you" line of assault - and make no mistake, it is an assault, designed to silence people and terminate discussion.

To say that we are seeking perfection is to imply that the political ship of state is kinda sorta there or moving “in the right direction." What "the purists" tend to point out here is not that our elected officials are failing some perfection test – an imaginary test that suggests that he/they are mostly OK but has a few flaws that only perfectionists would notice, and a test that the people being accused of using it are not using - but rather that these people are not at all, in any way, remotely, or vaguely aligned with the working people and that the notion that they are aligned with us is all a carefully created and totally false illusion. What are presumed to be "flaws" – which a few of us are supposedly unwilling to overlook in our stubbornness and obtuseness – are actually accurate glimpses through the camouflage at the whole picture, not minor peripheral and insignificant flaws.

Beyond the question of whether or not this particular person is perfect, I also reject the assumption that we are all looking for a person to begin with, and that looking for a person is the essence of politics.

Looking for a person is the problem, not the solution. Insulting, frustrating, and silencing the most perceptive among us is what is destroying the possibility of a strong Left emerging, and is the tawdry and amoral House Negro work that keeps the ruling class in place.

Maybe the bottom line is whether or not we all seek the same depth of changes in our society.

[rapturedbyrobots]

47. comment from subcomandante marcos

i really like how he described this issue of change and leadership in an interview that a local community center i've worked with did with him a few years ago:

“The social ship is adrift, and the problem is not that we lack a captain. It so happens that the rudder itself has been stolen, and it is not going to turn up anywhere. There are those who are devoted to imagining that the rudder still exists and they fight for its possession. There are those who are seeking the rudder, certain that it must have been left somewhere. And there are those who make of an island, not a refuge for self-satisfaction but a ship for finding another island and another and another...”

[Orwellian_Ghost]

98. Excellent n/t

[Grinchie]

58. "Glimpses through the Camouflage"

Very well said, simply because it's the best description of why they attempt this attack. They count on uniformed people to not see the Candy Striped Corporate Fist that is blending into the background noise.

Those that can see the fist, despite its superficial appearance as candy, are told they are seeing things, while the ones that can't see it, refuse to no matter what.

Of course, there are Saboteurs in the crowd that help maintain the illusion to further their goals, and it's anybodies guess why they would be motivated to do this, since some of us have already moved on to freedom and no tethers to the economic control mechanisms in place for the vast majority of people.

Too many people believe that they must keep their Jobs at any costs, and they do. They are too afraid to actually experience the realities of the Social System when it comes to feed off their lifetime accumulation of "Stuff". If more people did that, they would learn the real lesson of todays society, which is the true value of things, vs the perceived value of things.

The cheerleaders here are on a self destructive path, and they don't realize it. All of the crimes that have been comitted by Bush and left unchallenged can come back and bite all of us on the ass at any moment. With all the chaos of the huge beauracracy that is the Homeland Security Department, and it mountains of new regulations and laws that have never been divulged to the public, we are going to be in for some shocks to the system.

[Enthusiast]

71. You are so right.

"All of the crimes that have been committed by Bush and left unchallenged can come back and bite all of us on the ass at any moment."

Selectively enforcing the law is in itself BREAKING THE LAW.

[Grinchie]

76. Yes, this haphazard implementation of law is insanity itself.

Maybe they know that we are all inevitably headed for Population overshoot and eocological collapse, and are just fending for themselves until the shit hits the fan.

[Enthusiast]

99. That is as good an explanation

as I've ever heard for the insanity that is ever growing.

[Enthusiast]

70. Excellent post. nt

[SammyWinstonJack]

15. K&R

:applause:

[MNDemNY]

16. Why do you hate America?

gobama.

[Enthusiast]

72. LOL

[Karmadillo]

19. We have to fight the purists over here so we don't have to fight them over there.

nt

[Enthusiast]

73. Funny!

[Horse with no Name]

23. Proud to K&R

And fucking proud to be a purist!

[bvar22]

24. K&R.... up to +49

Here is some purity:

“The Economic Bill of Rights”
Excerpt from 11 January 1944 message to Congress on the State of the Union

It is our duty now to begin to lay the plans and determine the strategy for the winning of a lasting peace and the establishment of an American standard of living higher than ever before known. We cannot be content, no matter how high that general standard of living may be, if some fraction of our people—whether it be one-third or one-fifth or one-tenth—is ill-fed, ill-clothed, ill-housed, and insecure.

This Republic had its beginning, and grew to its present strength, under the protection of certain inalienable political rights—among them the right of free speech, free press, free worship, trial by jury, freedom from unreasonable searches and seizures. They were our rights to life and liberty.

As our nation has grown in size and stature, however—as our industrial economy expanded—these political rights proved inadequate to assure us equality in the pursuit of happiness.

We have come to a clear realization of the fact that true individual freedom cannot exist without economic security and independence. “Necessitous men are not free men.” People who are hungry and out of a job are the stuff of which dictatorships are made.

In our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all—regardless of station, race, or creed.

Among these are:

The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the nation;

The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation;

The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living;

The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad;

The right of every family to a decent home;

The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health;

The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;

The right to a good education.

All of these rights spell security. And after this war is won we must be prepared to move forward, in the implementation of these rights, to new goals of human happiness and well-being.

America’s own rightful place in the world depends in large part upon how fully these and similar rights have been carried into practice for our citizens.

Now THAT is purity I can get behind.



"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone

[democrank]

33. A solid, principled message, bvar22.

I guarantee that Paul Wellstone wouldn`t have had to hire a political consultant to examine the pros and cons of torture and he never would have needed to take months to decide whether he supported an unemployed mill worker with terminal cancer or the insurance company refusing to treat him.

There wasn`t a lot of gray in Paul Wellstone`s world. He didn`t operate in the (let`s see where I can get the most votes regardless of the consequences) middle of the road. And, if he saw that WHO WOULD JESUS BOMB? bumpersticker, his answer wouldn`t have depended on what he feared from some flag-waving Republican in a Barco-Lounger. He would have let it rip, loud and clear, "NOBODY!"

While the DLC worked feverishly to move the center of the Democratic Party further and further to the right, "purists" stood firm on basic party principles. We didn`t make excuses for AT&T teaming up with the Bushies to spy on Americans. We didn`t cheer when Fallujah was flattened with White Phosphorus. We marched against the invasion of Iraq. We fought against the government siding with Big Pharma over negotiated (and lowered) drug prices. We didn`t support "The Surge" or keeping any commander willing to lie about how Pat Tillman died. We didn`t blame poverty-stricken New Orleanians for not having the money to escape Hurricane Katrina.

Democratic Party "purists" have been told for years to go hug Ralph Nader....or a tree. But, from where I stand, "purists" are motivated by issues not blind loyalty. I`m not going to make excuses for continuing with Don`t-Ask-Don`t-Tell nor am I going to applaud wildly as Harry Reid shows more concern with Olympia Snowe than millions of sick and desperate citizens.

[rapturedbyrobots]

46. progressive purists are not motivated by issues

that's unless you're talking about white upper middle-class progressivism. progressive purists are motivated by PEOPLE and the issues they face in their daily struggles. focusing on issues is what allows people to settle in the grey areas in the first place.

on edit:

by 'white' i don't mean white skinned people...i mean white as a historical relation to capital.

[valerief]

37. +1

[dgibby]

61. Amen! n/t

[chill_wind]

25. K & R. Amen, amen.

[Cleita]

26. You speak so eloquently for true Democrats.

I personally don't give a ***** about what the others think, or how much they try to insult and call us names. It's Democrats and true patriots like you and me and the others who know what it really stands for.

[Le Taz Hot]

27. Another K & R

from another "purist."

[xchrom]

28. ...

:applause:

[Blue_In_AK]

29. Thank you, Democrank.

My sentiments exactly. :thumbsup:

[flyarm]

30. Thank you so much for your post..and i could not agree more! Proud purist here! eom

[eridani]

31. Hey, the people in favor of passing the Pelosi bill no questions asked are the "purists"

I'm the one recommending passing parts of it.

[Solly Mack]

32. Bravo!

K&R

[PVnRT]

34. K&R

[BzaDem]

35. 1,000 pages? Multi-week debate? We are dead serious. You are the one that is not serious.

I would not call myself a moderate. I would call myself a progressive. Why? Because I want a healthcare bill. Many purists do not. Oh, they claim to want single payer and all the rest, but single payer isn't going to happen. Purists have no concept of the phrase "isn't going to happen." They think that the more they want something, the more likely it is that they are going to get it. You might really, really not like that we are not going to get single payer. But that doesn't make it any more likely that we are going to get it. You might even hate the idea that we won't get single payer, but we still won't get it.

You are absolutely supposed to nod in the affirmative as Leader Reid tries to get Olympia Snowe's vote. Because that is the only way to get a healthcare bill. Lieberman is dead set against voting for any meaningful reform, and Snowe is the only path to 60. Reconciliation is not going to get a bill nearly as good as even one that Snowe writes herself.

In reality, the only way to get healthcare passed is through a 1,000 page bill with a multi-week debate. If you are against the bill being 1,000 pages or are against a debate that is multiple weeks, you are against healthcare reform. Period. There isn't anything else to it. There is very little difference between someone who wants to kill heatlhcare reform because it isn't single payer and a tea-partier who wants to kill healthcare reform because it helps people. Both views are equally destructive to our country and its citizens, precisely because both do not want any healthcare bill that can pass Congress.

[Bluenorthwest]

36. I've read so many of your posts and they are all the same

For months on end. You promote the agenda you promote, which was and is in favor of weak profit heavy 'reform' and in opposition to Single Payer, based not on what is best, but based on your own editorializing and theorizing. You speak of the politician created morass in DC as if it were an immutable force of nature, rather than the construct they have made to enrich themselves and waste the people's time, divert the people's will. That crap that goes on in Congress is not 'reality' it is a sham of what it was intended to be, it is what happens when elected officials are corrupt and in pocket. It is not nature, it is crime.
Do you even know how long the original Medicare bill was? Social Security? Way less than this epic string of terms of art. Bad lawmakers make bad law. And this is bad law. Everybody knows you favor that which favors industry and you try like hell to frame it as 'pragmatic' but you know, the President also speaks of 'faith' when he wants to oppress minorities and 'faith' is not 'pragmatic' so he and his co Insurance Salespeople need to pick one, and go with that. The hypocrisy, the situational logic and ethics is just tired, old and over worked. Redundant, repetitive and as it did not change any minds the first several hundred times you tried, ineffective.

[Tigermoose]

40. Utopia never existed

"That crap that goes on in Congress is not 'reality' it is a sham of what it was intended to be, it is what happens when elected officials are corrupt and in pocket. It is not nature, it is crime."

When was this time of sunshine and ponies where politicians met the ideals that they espoused in their rhetoric? From my perusal of history, that time was NEVER. Reality based politics take what is there, not what we wish were there. I guess that in the virtual reality of the internet, we feel free from the constraints of differing opinions in our enclaves of ideology. So we get more raving fanaticism. Thus the Teabaggers. And thus the purists on the left.

We're all people doing the best we can, even the Republicans. They are not the devil. And neither are Democratic 'moderates.'

[dgibby]

62. You aren't really equating purists to teabaggers, are you?

Please tell me I'm reading this wrong, because I'd hate to think anyone on this board would be calling another DUer a teabagger.

[BzaDem]

96. I don't know if that poster is, but I sure am.

Purists and teabaggers BOTH do not want any healthcare bill to pass that actually has any chance of passing, which is a destructive view for our country and its citizens. The motives of either group aren't really relevant to me. Both want to stand in the way of actually insuring 96% of Americans, and that is what matters. I don't care if that hurts your feelings. This issue is too important to be stopped by either purists or teabaggers.

[Skittles]

49. YOU KNOW IT BNW

YES INDEED :thumbsup:

[BzaDem]

95. Glad I could be of service. :) Your post completely proves my point.

You talk about Single Payer, as if it actually had some remote chance of passing this Congress.

This is on the very same day that Congressmen Kucinich and Conyers said the following:

"Many progressives in Congress, ourselves included, feel that calling for a vote tomorrow for single payer would be tantamount to driving the movement over a cliff. The thrill of the vote would disappear quickly when the result would be characterized not as a new beginning for single payer but as an end."

So what is it? Are Kucinich and Conyers corporatists? Are they simply mistaken about Congress when they think that it is an "immutable force of nature?" Come on out and say it.

After all, saying such would be a much more intelligent thing to say than this gem:

"That crap that goes on in Congress is not 'reality'"

Really? That's funny. To me, it sounds like the crap that goes on in Congress is reality by definition. If it weren't reality, it wouldn't be "going on." Just because it is a "sham of what it was intended to be" does not make it any less of a reality.

That is what you and people like you don't understand. You make no distinction between what you want and what you are going to get. None. You think we are going to get Single Payer just because Single Payer is a great policy. You don't understand (or at least don't act like you understand) the concept of a policy being a) great, and b) not achievable at a given time. You whine about corrupt elected officials making bad law, as if it is possible to eliminate corruption or make law perfect. You think you (as a non-elected official) can just "fight" for a policy and then actually get it, because you "fought."

In the end, we are going to pass a bill. It is going to pass whether you like it or not. It will pass not because of you but despite you. It is going to end up being such a great policy (originally and as amended in the future) that over the long term, many of the Republicans that vote against it will come to regret that vote for the rest of their lives, just like many still living today regret voting against Medicare (and others who aren't living today regretted voting against the extremely limited and incremental original Social Security bill). People like you who claim that insuring 96% of Americans is somehow "bad law" will wish that you could take down that permanent record of your opposition to it.

I will continue exposing farcical bullshit when I see it, without particularly caring whether or not you feel that it is "redundant" or "repetitive." Have a nice day. :)

[peace frog]

39. Welcome to Ignore

"...you are against healthcare reform. Period." :eyes:

I threw up a little in my mouth. :puke:

[kenfrequed]

51. Yeah

Definitely best to have compromised on that BEFORE the debate began. That was an awesome tactic! Mega-win!

Seriously, had we started the debate at Universal Single Payer and negotiated from there to a public option we probably would be standing on much firmer ground now.

But no, Baccus started to the right of where the majority of the population is and the overwhelming majority of Democrats are and continued to negotiate to the right from there. All to get Olympia Snowe's support. Pathetic.

[bobbolink]

91. Thank you for your mind reading, purist. We are soooo confused,

and need you to tell us what we are REALLY thinking and wanting.

Just like the RW has been doing for 30 years.

I'm guessing you have a big, shiny shrink certificate hanging on your wall.

[peace frog]

38. K & R

Solidarity for purists.

[bvar22]

41. It is ALWAYS "The Purists" who have compromised.

When have "The Centrists" (DLC) EVER moved to The Left in a compromise.

For near 40 years, "The Purists" have continued to support a "Democratic" Party that has basically told us to "Fuck Off and Die" because:
"What are you going to do?...vote for a Republican?..Hahahahahahaha."

I've had enough.




"I don’t represent the big oil companies. I don’t represent the big pharmaceutical companies.
I don’t represent the Enrons of this world. But you know what?
They already have great representation in Washington.
It’s the rest of the people that need it.”
---Paul Wellstone’s Last Commercial

[bobbolink]

92. There are millions of us who have had enough, and come next November,

the anti-purists are going to be crying for our votes.

HA!

[Fedja]

42. I'll have a Democrat speak for me

Grayson isn't my hero. He's not even the perfect politician. He's not too far left for me or too far right, and I still don't agree with him on everything. But goddamn it, Grayson is a Democrat. He's the archetype that a liberal party stands for. Fuck, even he compromises sometimes, he's not a myth, he's a politician. A mainstream leftwing politician.

Still, he's seen as a superman, a hero, a champion by some, and as a loon by others. Both bother me equally.

He's a good politician. Instead of thinking of him as a hero, we should all demand that more politicians are like him. And that's not even goddamn purism, it's just expecting that someone on the left finds the balls to stand shoulder to shoulder with Grayson and face to face with the armies of brave retards the Republican party has lined up.

Goddamnit.

[Soylent Brice]

43. thank you.

K&R

[bvar22]

44. I have no respect for those who "compromise" before the fight.

Perfection & Purity should ALWAYS be the ultimate goal.

What do you STAND for?
This is what I STAND for, and I will FIGHT HARD for each issue listed.
ALL of the following I consider reasonable and achievable goals.
I do NOT demand instant gratification.
I DO demand movement toward achieving these goals.

*Medicare for anyone who wants it.

*Immediate withdrawal of ALL military forces and "contractors" from the Middle East.

*Immediate reduction of Military Spending by at least 50%

*The immediate break-up (Trust Busting) of everything "Too Big to Fail".

*Fair Competition Legislation that lets Mom&Pop (small locally owned businesses and farms) compete with Big Box and Factory Farms on a level playing field.

*An end to "Free Trade" (Race to the Bottom)

*Organized LABOR and local co-ops.

*An end to the two-tiered Judicial System

*Prosecution of rich American War Criminals and War Profiteers. (Oh yes they did!)

*An END to "Corporate Personhood"

*Strictly Enforced Publicly Financed Elections (severe penalties for criminals)

*Transparent and Verifiable elections (Why isn't this a front burner issue with the Democratic Party?)

*Re-Regulation with strict oversight of Banking/Investment, Transportation, Communications, Trade, Energy, Utilities. There should be NO Public Money for private Prisons, armed Private Police, armed Defense Contractors, or private intelligence agencies.

*Immediate Civil Rights and Equal Protection for ALL. (No Exceptions)

*Free Quality Universal Education to everyone who wants it.

*Strong Social Safety Net and Consumer Protections.

*An end to The Patriot Act and a return to The Constitution.(especially Habeus and privacy protections)

*A refutation of the "Unitary Executive", and legislation to ensure it NEVER happens again.

*An END to Republican/Corporate influence INSIDE The Democratic Party !
(NO! They DON"T deserve a seat at the table!)

Perfection may NOT be achievable,
but movement toward perfection should is ALWAYS worth the fight.

The current Health Insurance Industry Profit Enhancement Bills are a step in the WRONG direction.

[ElboRuum]

79. I've got a dumb question...

I'm a moderate and moderates been given a lot of shit of late because of these "purist" threads. Now, I'm going to just guess that you would self-define as a purist. Now, let's just assume that for a moment. I read your list of stuff there, and I want all of those things too, with a couple of minor caveats to some of them.

If I'm a moderate and I'm with the program (and I would absolutely say with some confidence that many true left moderates probably WOULD be for all of those things), I'm having difficulty understanding where the implied conflict is here such that we need threads like these. What's the conflict? Is the purist/moderate thing directed more at the federal government and our elected personages therein, and not directed at some perceived factionalization here on DU? Are we getting trolled a bit more than usual?

Seriously, I don't know where all this purist vs. moderate noise got started, but it really is depressing to see.

[frylock]

45. i wonder if thom hartmann will reference this thread on his show?

knr

[David Zephyr]

48. K&R.

!

[NJmaverick]

50. Can I visit your ivory tower some day

sounds like a great place to hang out.

[underseasurveyor]

52. First I'm an Idealist

Now I'm a Purest. Gosh if the shoe fits YAY:bounce: I like the company I'm in.
That makes me a Purest Idealist.
Say that fast three times;-)

BIG-BIG HUGS FOR YOU:hug:

[kctim]

53. Bravo for standing up for the "purists"

but until there are more of you, you will just have to accept that compromise is the only way anything will get done.

[theFrankFactor]

54. We're a Minority

My post will sink into the abyss for lack of excuse making and wimpyness. You have to be like a little kid- if you haven't something good to say, don't say it. BULLSHIT!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=6933947&mesg_id=6933947

[Grinchie]

55. You Named it, and it is the Truth.

While it would be nice to believe that we have a Government that has the needs of the World in mind, the facts of the matter is that the path the Government is taking appears to be ignorant of the dangers, and is happy to take the riskiest, most dangerous, expensive and depleting path it can find to get there, thus destroying any future benefit.

There comes a time when the individual cells of this organism called the United States discover that the "Mind" has embarked on goals that no longer support or care for the Cells in any meaningful way. We see this is the hysteria of the Swine Flu situation, where we have a highly contagious variant of seasonal flu, which has less mortality than the regular flu does on an annual basis, yet, we are one step away from mandatory vaccinations if the WHO dictates.

We have Wars where none should be, and fiscal policy is in survival mode, bracing up the rickety structure that fraud has built. Hollywood Schmaltze instead of Industrial Strength.

I no longer have much respect for leaders that ignore the citizenry at their own peril. It makes me just want to live Alternatively, and find ways to withdraw any support from the ongoing Corporate takeover by starving them to death, and withholding any benefit they can get from my existence, such as taxes, labor, information, etc. No more Consumption unless it involves good nutrition, Hydration or well being. No more support of a toxic/ poisonous agricultural system. No more implicit trust in the word of Giant Corporations on the benefits of some product, technique, process, investment, style, or way of life.

I have taken control of my life, and despite the horror stories foisted upon all of us regarding taking a step back towards a simpler life, have found that we have been told many lies. Living simply doesn't mean having no internet, computers, entertainment and technology. Far from it, yet most people think that it means living in a shack and crapping in a bucket. We guess what, even if it goes that far, it doesn't matter, because if you are out of debt, and able to have time to figure things out for yourself, you have gained more freedom than most.

I quite the Obama fan club when he Allowed Michael Taylor to return to the USDA. I saw the Corporate Creep already in the DLC takeover, but when they started Frantically transforming into Clinton Part 2, I knew we were screwed.

I have been waiting for something that would show that I was hasty, but at this point, their is nothing, and my predictions on the insanity of the Health Care Reform are coming to pass.

As I said before, Obama ans his DLC/Corporate Strategists are not concerned with the cellular health of the U.S. All they care about is keeping the Mind alive at any cost, willing to discard us as needed.

No more support to liars. My boundaries are cast in stone, and I am not alone. I demand that people do as they say, and when they don't, I will hold them accountable. I demand the best, simply because more than enough fiat money has been printed to make it to mars and back, yet all we get are pigs like F-22's, C-17's and Multibillion Dollars Sub's and Missile Frigates.

I'm not buying that 3D Chess, "Give Him Time" rhetoric, because it's the same old shit that the DLC has been peddling for years.

[saracat]

56. Thank you , Thank you, Thank you. I am a proud "purist" as well.

Every day, excuses are being made while choice and GLBT rights are trashed, religion is elevated, unions and education are denigrated, and war is promulgated. Health care is a sham and only corporations and Big Pharma benefit but now to complain is being called a bad Democrat? Meanwhile thousands of "New" Dems stayed home and didn't vote for the Democrat in Va and NJ because the candidate that they didn't bother to choose in their primary didn't meet their expectations.

The President personally campaigned for the governors but his fan club couldn't get up off their duffs and vote yet they say the rejection isn't a reflection on the President, or the Democratic party. In NJ, the Democrat won only because the GOP candidate with drew and endorsed the democrat , yet some insist this is a "victory " for the Dems and their leadership!The only victory last night was CA 10 and that was wonderful but somehow, it is likely the Dems had little to do with it.

In Maine, the Democratic party and the DNC REFUSED to do anything to protect the gay marriage Amendment. They are more concerned with the reelection of this pathetic self serving majority instead of the civil rights of the people.And yet, many say we should "trust" them to "fix" health care when the crappy bill passes.

[enigmatic]

57. Great post

:thumbsup:

[dgibby]

60. Bravo!

Thank you for saying what I've been feeling. Count me in!:yourock:

[defendandprotect]

63. Used to be thought useful to have visions of a better future . . . now we're fighting

to just not go into total REVERSE --

[Vidar]

64. K&R

[Mithreal]

66. K&R

[Eyerish]

67. K&R n/t

[noiretextatique]

68. our expectations of government have been so diminished

that many americans are willing to except...nothing. :thumbsup: i am a proud purist, and i think it's time to start putting my money where my mouth is. it's becoming increasingly clear that the democratic party is simply the lesser of two evils. it's time to face the facts, and invest in the green party.

[Enthusiast]

69. If you are a purist I want to be one!

What a perfectly timely post!

The PTB are at work behind the scenes, as usual. I just listened to NPR where they are trying to convince their listeners that America is becoming "more conservative", mostly based on results of the Tuesday election. Unbelievable!

To maintain the usual corporate control we have to adopt the notion that it is wrong to be progressive on the various issues. We must "compromise". In other words we must capitulate on health care reform, cap and trade legislation and financial services industry reform.

I say this is COMPLETE BULLSHIT. This is more of the smoke and mirrors and we are witnessing it right in the Democratic Party and on DU.

America is not becoming more conservative. The PTB only want you to act as if it is so!

[ProgressOnTheMove]

74. There's definitely been lots of change in a very hort time, the other issues we have to push...

many of the issues we want to take on are very entrenched in government and will take long term struggle to alter. But saying hey why can't I have it all now doesn't really make sense to me. The making a stand without understanding the long term commitment it takes makes the stand a little fruitless really. I can see your good intentions and appreciate them, but the only way your going to see them is to stay in the game no matter what. I in no way think the "purists" are wrong, but it'll take more than one year from the President but most of all more than one year from the people that care. That is f they dogenuinely care... I feel I do that's why I'm going to make the very most of this window of opportunity and be as motivational and inspirational toeffet change. Now we can take this window of opportunity and make the most of it or allow it to close again those choice is all with the people. Every President we could ever imagine to run will disappoint us, the question this timeround is will we disappoint ourselves.

[debbierlus]

75. Thank you. AMEN!

You have to stand FOR something...or stand for nothing.

[midnight]

77. Good reminder. Selling out is not compromising......

[dajoki]

78. K&R!!

[Kurovski]

80. K&R. (nt)

[lildreamer316]

82. K & R.

Thank you for saying this.

[bobbolink]

83. Let's put it simply and to the point... the criticizers have taken their methods directly from the

RW.

For thirty years, we liberals have endured the name-calling from the RW.

Because that's all they have.

Now we're supposed to swallow it from our supposed team mates?

Not a chance!

When all you have is name-calling and criticism, YOU'RE NOTHING BUT A BULLY!

BASTA!

[Geek_Girl]

84. The term Moderates these days means corporatist. Moderate is just a nice word that these jack asses

like to hide behind.


I'm a moderate. The Moderate dems, blue dogs, dlc whatever you want to call them are nothing but Neocons there is no difference.

[tekisui]

85. knr!~

[PuraVidaDreamin]

87. K&R

Time to Rise Up!

[Land Shark]

88. Lincoln: Certain principles should not and must not be compromised. Were it not so, then....

are there any limits to the evils that can happen? If so, what are those besides the will of those who don't wish to follow the principle or law in question?

[earth mom]

89. Great rant! The centrists, moderates, dinos and DLCers can FUCK OFF!

Ain't nothin liberal about any of em! :grr:

[merkins]

90. K&R

Well stated and on the money.

[scentopine]

93. No change - no cash! -nt

[kathrynjoy714]

94. Never Back Down.

What is absolutely astonishing to me is the willingness that this country has not only to ignore the poverty, joblessness, and unrest but also to cause it in so many other countries…purists must stand up for what’s not only in the best interests of this country, but also of other countries around the world. “Purists” from the Democratic Party have to stand up for their true beliefs; it’s a shame that so many democrats have become so moderate. I think your point is well made, not necessarily a rant as others have said, but rather valid truth from an intelligent democrat. What does this party even stand for anymore anyways? Our views must not conform and compromise what this party is about and has always been about in the first place. We, as Democrats, stand up for those who are struggling, those who can’t get on their feet, those who need direction and those who just need a hand up. This very conviction that our party holds manifests itself in every single other issue we stand for. Without these beliefs, there would be no hope for those who need us in this great country; and when it comes full circle, and we are dealt a hard hand of cards in life, we will be helped back up just like we helped those before us. To all you purists out there…never back down!

[Overseas]

97. Beautifully said !! K&R. //nt