Public Option: RIP

[derby378]

Well, that's it. Neither the Senate bill nor the House bill will have a robust public option. Instead, they only offer a pseudo-public option that is only available to the uninsured and deliberately set up to fail.

In the meantime, we get stuck with a mandate to buy private health insurance or face either fines or extra taxes, depending on which version of the bill passes conference.

This is NOT change I can believe in. This is a sell-out. And Big Insurance is being rewarded for bad behavior - their squawking mercenaries at the August townhall meetings have had the desired effect of killing the public option.

How is Barack Obama going to explain this to Sasha and Malia?

[Teaser]

1. argle bargle boogedy boo

.

[guitar man]

2. only available to the uninsured?

So does this mean it's available if I drop coverage with my employer, or do I have to quit my job or get fired to qualify for it?

[Armstead]

6. You will prob ably have to die to qualifty for it

They're putting on so many restrictions and hurdles that it will basically be meaningless to the majority of Americans -- and to the insurance comnpanies.

[guitar man]

8. well, depending on what

their "insurance reform" does to the premiums I'm paying on my insurance at work, death may be the only option. As it is now, I can't afford what I'm paying, have been scraping and sacrificing everything I can for the bloodsuckers and next month is open enrollment again, I just can't wait to see how much the premiums are going to go up this time :(

[derby378]

7. I think you have to quit your job or get fired in order to qualify

If your employer offers an insurance plan, you don't qualify for the "public" option. Even if your employer's plan comes from UnitedHealthCare.

[guitar man]

10. well then

I may just go sit down then, I can't see going to work every day just to pay insurance premiums, which is where more and more of my check goes each year. there is a point of diminishing returns I will reach very soon at this rate and when I do, working simply won't be worth it anymore.

[slipslidingaway]

9. Even if you can drop the employer coverage will the employer's contribution...

follow you to the exchange?

I'm not even sure the employer contribution goes to the "public option portion" of the exchange or just "to the exchange" where there are also for profit companies.

:shrug:

[lumberjack_jeff]

29. In HR3200 The coverage your employer must offer must comply with standards

... and your employer must pick up 70+% of the tab.

But yeah, if you have coverage, your problems are less urgent.

Take comfort in knowing that if you get sick and lose your job, you will still be insured.

[guitar man]

36. my employer is already picking up 70%

And it's still killing me to maintain coverage. I hope to god they manage to lower the premiums and soon, I have already scraped, sacrificed and sold off meager posessions hat I worked damn hard to have just to keep my family covered as long as I have. I can't take another increase, not another penny :(

[joeycola]

39. There will lots of anger when so so so many discover they have been LEFT BEHIND.

[walldude]

58. You can't drop your employer coverage. It's stated plainly in the bill.

Only people without access to employer insurance can get on this.

[guitar man]

65. Well I hope the rates drop then

Because what I'm paying now is killing me. :(

[walldude]

66. Yeah I know man, I was paying $1500 a month before I became self employed

Almost 1/3 of my income at the time and that was 10 years ago.

[guitar man]

70. Damn that's steep

I'm not paying that much but my premiums have doubled over the last 3 years. I have cancelled cable and Internet at home, gotten rid of a vehicle, sold off microphones, amps and a couple guitars...and the premiums just keep going up. My pay was frozen this year, no raise and only 2% last year . If something doesn't give and fast, it's just not going to be worth getting up and going to work anymore...

[eridani]

73. Not hardly. This is designed to let the rates go UP n/t

[librechik]

3. calm down. That's our toe in the door. In 2010 we can get enough people

to fix it. Let's work on that.

(smiley face--I'm disappointed, too.And i can't talk about Obama's role, I'm too angry.))

[Sebastian Doyle]

27. Just the opposite is true

Any fucked up plan that FORCES people to pay for corporate insurance is a death sentence to the party that allows it. We will lose seats in 2010 if this bullshit is allowed, not gain them.

And even if we did gain seats, would it fucking matter if they were more corporate fellating cowards?

[GreenPartyVoter]

63. Bad reform now means losses in 2010.

[joeycola]

41. BY 2010 to many of us who fought for true health care will just sit

out the election cycle.

[placton]

50. me included

and spare me the recriminations, please?

[placton]

51. DUPE

[librechik]

55. my point is to kick out the corporates and replace them with progressives

that's the trend (don't listen to the lying conservatives. They're going nowhere) Politics is slow.

[walldude]

60. Isn't that what we just did? Majority in the house and Senate and the Presidency

How much more do they need?

[librechik]

64. There are 12 in the Senate, and more than that in the House

but I've given up on the Southern States. Also it's harder to replace them if they're incumbents.

I know, it's a bitch but it's the reality.

[Egnever]

78. Not even close

Theres loads of cleanup left. We have a majority on paper but theres a lot of corp dems that still need to go. Along with the damn near all the pukes.

[Raineyb]

62. Not counting the ones who have died in the meantime of course. n/t

[flyarm]

67. I will gladly sit it out! I am damn sick of the sell outs in congress and the White house thugs like

Rahm!

[SammyWinstonJack]

85. I know I will.

[leveymg]

83. We'll lose 3 or more Sen. seats, and 15 House because of the Bluedogs obstruction of real reform

This is going to split the Democratic Party like nothing the GOP ever could have done. You REALLY think we're going to gain seats next year? I can tell you this much, the Senate Finance Committee Chair lost the VA Governor's race for us.

[Armstead]

4. Get your helmet on for incoming fire......But I basically agree with you

It's shameful that they felt like they had to neuter the public option, which was already a major compromise for those who wanted a real solution of single payer.

[Libertas1776]

5. Sadly, I drank

one cup too many of the "Obama-Hope-Change-Democrats" Kool Aid.

This morning has been like one giant sobering cup of black coffee.

[chimpymustgo]

12. Sadly, people are still making excuses and talking about 11 dimension chess. Delusioned.

This was probably the plan all along. Beat the liberals down with months of haggling, so they'd accept these crumbs - grateful for anything.

[joeycola]

42. yes, I know what you mean.

[Triana]

11. It's now nothing but a for-profit corprat insurance company welfare plan!

Force US citizens to give for-profit insurance companies money. :wtf:

Not that I'm surprised at this. Is there a 'trigger' in the useless thing too? (ie: an "excuse" to not enact publicly funded health care)?

Kay Hagen LIKES the trigger, and "co-ops" - both of which effectively GUT any robustness from any public option in regards to providing competition with the for-profit insurance VULTURES.

She is BEYOND useless.

[glinda]

56. Too many options will have no muscle. Only one solid plan will work.

[AllentownJake]

13. I have a feeling Sasha and Malia are going to be fine

In fact, I'm guessing there will be universities competing for the first daughters to enroll and afterwards businesses climbing over themselves to employ the daughters of a former President.

Not attacking or begrudging Sasha and Malia, but really he doesn't need to explain much to them as far as their future is concerned.

Now to the rest of the kids in the country...probably has more explaining to do.

[SammyWinstonJack]

86. Clearly he doesn't care about the rest of the kids in this country or their parents either for

that matter.

[KharmaTrain]

14. Right On Time...

Seems like every week the Public Option gets buried, yet arises again.

So if there's no option, what's yours? Hope the entire process fails? It's easy to piss and moan, but what's your alternative?

Seems like there are those who relish seeing PO fail...since it's not exactly what they want and would rather see the entire process die and the status quo and the rushpublicans win.

[sabrina 1]

22. Why did Obama change his mind about Mandated Insurance?

He was right when he opposed it. Do you agree with punishing poor people because they cannot afford to buy a 'commodity'? So long as they keep calling Health Care coverage a 'commodity', which they are, how is it legal to force anyone to buy it?

And even aside from that, how can you force someone to buy a commodity from people they do not trust? It is unconscitutional. But I haven't heard constitutional lawyer President Obama address any of these issues so far.

And didn't we hear none of this would pass in the end, Obama was just letting them do their thing so they couldn't say they didn't get a chance?

Face it, the minute they forbade anyone who supported a Single Payer system from participating in the debate, the writing was on the wall. I see nothing that has happened since to prove that this is Health Care reform, and not simply Insurance Reform done to make sure the Insurance Industry gets a windfall from millions who cannot afford it, in order to save them from financial collapse.

Hope and change THEY can believe in, but not the general public. We've been far too willing to give them the benefit of the doubt even when it's been clear from the beginning what was going on.

They loved the tea-baggers. Those fools, some of them anyhow, were unwitting tools thinking they were fighting against 'Communism'. No wonder the WH never responded to them all summer.

All that's left to the people now is to boycott the whole ponzi scheme by refusing to buy from these thugs. But fear will prevent that as they well know. There just isn't the spirit in this country to stop them. In the past, people were willing to die rather than accept this kind of oppression. Now, they're not even willing to give up cable. An organized boycott of millions of Americans threatening to drop their premiums if they are not given a choice, would solve the problem. But I expect even this post to be flamed for even suggesting it.

[KharmaTrain]

49. And You Know This Is In The Final Bill?

I can understand your frustration...this is a vital issue not only to you but for the welfare of this entire country. I have posted more times than I care to think that I want every person to have the access to basic medical care focusing on prevention and driving down costs through competition. But what you or I want isn't where the game (and yes it's a game) is being played. The ultimate decisions will be made within the framework of the legislative and involves many parties with a wide variety of interests...good and bad. They call politics the art of possible and this healthcare reform, if there is to be any, will hinge on a lot of give and take. This bill and debate are just starting...and I'm not ready to write things in or out until we see if ANY bill can pass cloture in the Senate.

I could care less what others say or think...and I'm looking for alternatives and solutions that can be done. Not to point fingers but to look forward to what can be done. Defeatism is what the beltway types are hoping for right now either to stop any reform from happening. Not only gone would be public option but also protections against being dropped for a pre-existing condition and stripping the insurance companies anti-trust exemptions. But I expect more as I expect a bill, with a public option, to pass in a few weeks. Listen to Dr. Dean...he's been steady on his predictions and if and when he sounds alarms, then I will as well.

As far as mandates...no matter what system is adopted, there are gonna be costs that all of us will have to pay. The hopes are with competition driving down overall costs as well as cutting out a lot of the waste premiums will be far less than they are now and affordable for anyone similar to how they were before the age of Raygun. For those who still can't afford the premiums there are several proposals for subsidies.

Speaker Pelosi today spoke of the House proposal that is as much a vital part of any final bill making sure 47 million people will have coverage....including a strong public option. Thus saying this process is already lost or some big sell-out is not ony premature, it's defeatist.

Again, I want to see plans of action. No flaming here...what good is that? But I'm also a realist that knows there are going to be compromises and to write and call my Congresscritter if and when needed...and to work toward moving this country in a more progressive way. Change doesn't happen by fiat...it means fighting for things and outlasting the cynics and the special interests.

Cheers....

[eridani]

75. Great, we have "coverage." So what?

The shitstain useless fucktards can still deny you reimbursement, and you are still on the hook for 30% of your costs.

[ElboRuum]

92. Dewey Defeats Truman

I'm not calling the public option dead until I see the corpse.

[Xicano]

52. Why? Probably the same reason he changed his mind about NAFTA, and FISA

I don't think he never had any intention but to do what is being done. Just giving the appearance to us, the base, that he's for us instead of his Wall Street sponsors.

Just face the fact. He's serving his corporate sponsors who bought and paid for him just like just about every other politician. They all lie. They go on TV to lie to us and to divide and conquer us. Thats half of what they're paid to do. The other half is to write/pass bills to sell us out for the benefit of Wall Street.

No Public Option. No immediate withdraw of troops out of Iraq/Afghanistan. No repel of NAFTA. No repel of FISA. No more support from me. Zero, zitch, nadda. And notice I didn't say I wouldn't support Democrats. Because I am a Democrat and will only support Democrats who haven't betrayed our party.

I would love to see our party's rank and file, every last one of us, join in solidarity in a tax revolt. Slogan: "No public option, No taxes."




Peace,
Xicano

[eridani]

74. You want incrementalism? Open Medicare to open enrollment.

If not to all, then at least to some.

[sinkingfeeling]

15. Really, when did HCR get signed by President Obama? There are 6 steps to this action and we've got

one complete.

[bvar22]

16. I'm even more cynical than you.

I believe this was The Plan from the git-go.

Health Insurance Reform WILL BE a massive transfer of Public Money to the For Profit Health Insurance Industry. This does NOT count the Billions of out-of-pocket Dollars from each individual American who will be FORCED to BUY a bad product from a For Profit Industry.

Dangling the shiny object (Public Option) in front of us was merely Kabuki Theater for distraction.

I actually thought they would give us a few crumbs, but now THAT even looks like a joke.

AND IT IS THE DEMOCRATS who have done what the Republicans could only dream about.
Could you imagine THE OUTRAGE if The Republicans were trying to pass THIS?

But Watch Out!
Social Security "Reform" is next on the list.
The "Centrist" Democrats are already calling it "Entitlement Reform".


Centrist DEMOCRATS !
Transferring MORE WEALTH to Private Corporations than Republicans could ever dream about!


NOW we have Your Children’s Money too !!!
And there is not a fucking thing you can do about it!
Now THIS is “Bi-Partisanship” !
Better get used to it!!
Hahahahahahahahaha!

[G_j]

19. I agree

who didn't really know this would happen?

[slipslidingaway]

20. + 1000000. nt

[sabrina 1]

26. You should make this post an OP.

This is just one more step for the corporatists to get their hands on more public money. One of Bush's only failures (from their pov) was helping them to get their hands on the SS fund. But they never give up. They have a new salesman now, which I'm beginning to think is the main role played by US Presidents, left or right. You just won't get to the WH unless you show them you will work hard for their interests.

Our only hope as a country, is in Congress. NOT this Congress, they are mostly already bought, or paid for before being elected.

Many more people will die, and now added to that, many will end up in jail because they cannot pay these forced purchases. Another bonus for the US for-profit jail system.

But if the people fought back, they could still win. However looking at the excuses being made even on Dem boards for this criminal system, I don't have much faith in that happening.

[Ganja Ninja]

34. Last I heard there wasn't a Centrist Democratic Party.

They're all in this together whether they like it or not. If there are some of them with any integrity at all left then they better separate themselves by forming a new party.

[bvar22]

47. Election 2008...

...was a crushing defeat for Liberals/Progressives.
The Progressive Caucus has been reduced to writing letters to The White House.


I have my line in the sand,
and future support for The Democratic Party depends on their performance on Health Care.
For years, I ridiculed Republicans for voting AGAINST their own Economic interests.
I WON'T be voting against mine (at least not again).

[SammyWinstonJack]

87. Obama calls Medicare and Social Security entitlements and wants them 'reformed'.

:grr: So I guess he will accomplish what george w. couldn't.

STEAL OUR RETIREMENT and give it to Wall Street. Nice! :mad:

[CTD]

17. Wow. Just wow.

Reality check time.

Do you *really* think an ideologically pure bill has ANY chance of passing in the current climate? I mean, to go from ZERO to PERFECT in ONE BILL?!?!

That has never happened in the history of the country, and it's even less possible in the current hyper-political climate.

This bill is much better than I thought we'd ever get in the first pass. And like Medicare before it, it will become more robust with the passing of time, as people begin to rely upon it.

Passing *something* is step number 1. This *something* happens to be much stronger than I ever expected Obama would be able to pull off.

He deserved major credit for this bill not disdain.

The simple reality is that we can't get to perfect in one fell swoop. It will take time and patience.

I know that people are dying and that this is important. But too many of our politicians are beholden to monied interests to get there right now.

[derby378]

21. "I know that people are dying, BUT..."

That's a big part of the problem right there. For the vast majority of working Americans, there will not be any change in their health insurance except for rising premiums and hefty penalties if they drop coverage. There is no way to keep Big Insurance honest in either the House or the Senate version of the bill.

And nobody is talking about going from "zero to perfect" - that would be single-payer. I'm talking about getting the bare necessities, which it appears working Americans are not going to get.

[bvar22]

23. NOBODY was asking for "ideological purity".

EVERYBODY (57%-70% of Americans Democrats and Republicans) was asking for a "government run Public Option "like Medicare" available to anyone who wants it. THAT goal was realistic, and entirely achievable.

A pathetically weak (even weaker today) Public Option available to LESS than 3% of Americans offering LESS than a 10% price advantage (before today) that must be purchased from the mysterious "Exchange" administered by a private corporation which will be a consortium of For Profit Health Insurance Corporations (not "the government")...

....will NOT "open the door to Single Payer".
It WILL FAIL.

Medicare was implemented in less than 11 months, and had a 93% enrollment after 1 year.

[eridani]

76. So allowing some people into Medicare right now is "ideologically pure"?

Explain that.

[garybeck]

18. Paging Michael Moore.... Paging Michael Moore....

I expect we'll be hearing from him very soon.

[Ganja Ninja]

24. Don't blame the town hallers.

Don't blame the insurance companies either. The blame belongs squarely on both Republicans and Democrats. Both parties are on the take and they would like to keep it that way. This whole thing went wrong when they dropped single payer. A single payer plan would pretty much end that gravy train. That's why it was thrown out the window first thing and that's why we needed it. If we leave them an opening they'll find a way to screw us. "Public Option" what a farce!

[spanone]

25. it's not the squawking mercenaries, it's the payments to politicians' re-election efforts

congress is corrupt

[lumberjack_jeff]

28. Can I make a quilt from all y'alls rended garments?

HR3200 is currently a good bill.

No one knows what the revised bill on which the house will vote will look like, but unless it's greatly dissimilar to the current one, we have much to rejoice about.

[derby378]

30. Not if we can't enroll in the public option, we can't

That was (and still is) the proverbial line in the sand. If we can't enroll, this bill is a failure.

[lumberjack_jeff]

31. If you can't enroll in the public option, you already have coverage.

If the problem is 45 million uninsured, and the risk that the currently insured will lose coverage if they get sick, then this bill is a success.

[derby378]

35. The issue is not coverage just for the sake of coverage

My insurance plan has drastically raised premiums while cutting back on services. I can't even choose my own doctor anymore under the insurance plan my employer offers. The problem is that those of us who already are insured aren't getting the care that our premiums are supposed to entitle us to.

There are worse things than losing coverage. For example, being stuck with coverage that doesn't give you the treatment that you need in order to preserve your health and improve your quality of life.

[eridani]

77. It is utter garbage which will impoverish anyone near but not at retirement age

Providing "coverage" is useless if the shitstains can still deny you care.

[lumberjack_jeff]

84. Pestilence! Locusts! Plague! Dogs and Cats living together!!!! n/t

[eridani]

94. Thanks for cheerleading the elimination of most of my retirement income

Fuck you very much.

[lumberjack_jeff]

95. Get real.

If you're in a position where you might need to cannibalize your retirement to pay medical insurance premiums, you'll either be eligible for expanded medicaid or a big subsidy.

The hyperbole is ridiculous.

[eridani]

96. The unaffordability INCLUDES the fucking subsidy, dammit!

I know because I checked the Kaiser Family Foundation calculator. And even then, the fine print says that subsidies can be cut if the deficit targets aren't met.

[Cali_Democrat]

32. How is Barack Obama going to explain this to Sasha and Malia?

Congress sucks? :shrug:

[joeycola]

37. along with the WH! (on this so-called "reform")

[Cali_Democrat]

44. I really don't think Obama is gonna tell his own daughters that his White House sucks

Ya think?

[joeycola]

46. LOL probably not.

[inna]

33. Can someone please explain what actually happened? I no longer have cable, and I am completely out

of the loop.

[derby378]

38. Nancy Pelosi just unveiled the House version of the bill - WITHOUT a strong public option

In other words, we got screwed.

[Sirveri]

40. That's really not what I read when I looked into it.

It's actually worse. If you work for a small business, they don't have to help you get insurance at all, but you still have to pay for it unless you earn less than 9350 a year (good luck with that). That said, there ARE some good things in some of the bills, things that NEED to be passed. One is that they eliminate anti-trust exemptions from the health insurance agencies. They also eliminate annual and lifetime benefit caps. They also cap expenses at 5k and 10k for families.

So there are some diamonds buried in this pile of shit.

From the following source: http://edlabor.house.gov/documents/111/pdf/publications/AHCAA-DETAILEDSUMMARY-102909.pdf

Individuals. Individuals are required to obtain health insurance coverage or pay a fee equal to lower of 2.5 percent of their adjusted income above the filing threshold or the average premium on the Exchange. Individuals and families below the income tax filing are exempt. (NOTE: In 2009, the threshold for taxpayers under age 65 is $9,350 for singles and $18,700 for couples). Individuals may apply for a hardship waiver if coverage is unaffordable and selected exemptions from the mandate are provided in the statute. Those with coverage through the VA or who are eligible for government-sponsored healthcare because they are a member of a tribe are considered to have fulfilled
the requirement to obtain coverage.

Eligibility. People are eligible to enter the Exchange and purchase health insurance on their own as long as they are not enrolled in employer sponsored insurance, Medicare or Medicaid. The Exchange is also open to businesses, starting with small firms and growing over time. Firms with twenty-five or fewer employees are permitted to buy in the Exchange in 2013

Small business protections. Small businesses with annual payrolls below $500,000 are exempt from requirements to offer or contribute to coverage, including the 8 percent payroll contribution for failure to provide health benefits to their workers. As a result of this exemption, 86 percent of America’s businesses are exempt from any requirement to provide coverage to their employees. The 8 percent requirement is phased in for small businesses with an annual payroll between $500,000 and $750,000. There is also a tax credit program to help low-wage small businesses offer coverage to their employees.

[earth mom]

43. Where are the rah rah cheerleaders now?

Maybe this will wake some people up to the fact that "Hope & Change" was a TOTAL SCAM.

:argh:

[flyarm]

69. ahh they are still posting their propaganda..i just blasted some of them in other threads..i am sick

and tired of their bullshit and i am saying so! Loud and clear!

[Teaser]

72. Oh boy! You're making a difference on the intarwebz!!

.

[QC]

71. They're rah rah'ing it up over in the cheerleader camp. n/t

[SammyWinstonJack]

88. It should but it won't.

:banghead:

[d_b]

45. I'm just waitng for the pres. to sign a piece of shit

It's going to be weird having 'O' (for other) on my registration card.

[placton]

48. how will Obama explain to his daughters?

"Darlings, we will have the best health care for the rest of our lives. Daddy is a multimillionare, and he will make even more after he leaves office. You will be protected from the scum that live outside our door here, because you will be rich and pretty and have access to a life most Americans will only dream of. So, don't worry your pretty heads about it. Nite nite."

[flyarm]

68. you think he gives a shit? hell they are giving the vaccine that ha shardly been tested to kids in

school for swine flu..but don't you worry your little head..his kids are not getting that untested shit!

[PHIMG]

53. MEDICARE FOR ALL!

It's an issue worth fighting for.

We can't leave reform to the sold out politicians. We have to force them to do what WE WANT. MEDICARE FOR ALL NOW!

[joeycola]

54. Congressman Wiener needs your help on his single payer Medicare For All amendment.................

Forum Name General Discussion: Presidential
Topic subject Congressman Wiener needs your help on his single payer Medicare For All amendment.
Topic URL http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x8715792#8715792
8715792, Congressman Wiener needs your help on his single payer Medicare For All amendment.
Posted by joeycola on Mon Oct-26-09 04:27 AM


Do it. Thanks.

Dear xxxxx

Congressman Wiener needs your help on his single payer Medicare For All amendment. I just got back from a conference in Boston where Rep. Wiener asked for help on two things:

First, and urgently, he wants people to contact Speaker Pelosi and ask her to keep her promise to allow a floor amendment and floor debate on a single payer amendment to the House bill. Although the Speaker promised such a floor amendment in July , there is a strong likelihood that she will back down on that promise in the very near future unless she gets a flood of emails, faxes or calls. So let's flood Nancy Pelosi's office with faxes like we did once before.

http://www.1payer.net/faxapp/senders/add/cid:40

Remarkably, Speaker Pelosi said in Democratic Caucus "If it were up to me, we would have single payer." Let's remind Nancy Pelosi with a flood of faxes: it IS up to her because she is the Speaker.

Second, Rep. Wiener asked that we flood our Congresspersons with calls and push them to support the single payer Medicare For All amendment. About 100 other Congressmen are solidly behind it now and even blue dogs are wavering, so Wiener thinks a push on Congress will help a great deal. You can send a fax supporting the Wiener single payer Medicare For All amendment right now. Just click here.

You can send a FREE fax to Pelosi very simply and easily.

Here is the link to the fax.

It simply asks Pelosi to keep her promise for a floor debate in the House. The Pelosi fax linked above is very important. You can also call her office at

202-225-4965.

Don't let her back down on her promise of a single payer floor debate in the House.

[glinda]

57. You are right on

[mdmc]

59. yesyesyes

...

[Kansas Wyatt]

61. If they make this Chump Change Token Effort their 'Health Care Reform'

While Corporate America is handed the U.S. Treasury keys, then they have fucked themselves and divorced themselves from the Democratic Party that brought the New Deal and Medicare to this country.

The only positive thing is that the Democratic Party is ONLY the lesser of two evils, but they are not anything better with the fucking they are giving to the American People.

Democratic Politicians, their minions, and their cheerleaders...
Enjoy the next year, because you are going to find out what happens when you work for Corporate America and DO NOT represent the American People, in the 2010 & 2012 Elections. You are going to fucking deserve it!

Oh, and there will be NO MORE FUCKING CRYING, when people allegedly 'vote against their best interests,' because you were too busy stuffing your own pockets and lining up your own board seats to give a fuck about their best interests!

[benny05]

79. The problem is the change we believe in

and maybe our President thought would happen, didn't. It's a teeny-tiny bit of progress and perhaps our President thought it could happen with his huge vote last year (or charisma, take your pick) but he was sorely mistaken. If pre-existing conditions are taken out, then it's considered progress to many.

Meh, I wanted bold change. That's why I was a John Edwards (second choice Dennis K) supporter. OK, enough about Edwards' personal situation. But let's pretend that wasn't the case. He would have pushed hard and sooner for health care reform, let alone tweaking the insurance regulations which is what is happening now. As Jon Stewart pointed out this evening, you start off high for negotiations. Obama didn't lay out that vision early on (I suspect he's not very good at negotiations), and thus it was too easy for Baucus, Conrad, Landrieu, and especially Sore Loser Lieberman to maintain status quo as they have been bought by the financial services industry and pharma even more during the year.

President Obama also made a HUGE mistake by allowing the pharmas to sit at the table early on. Edwards always said (correctly), if you let the special interests sit at the table, they will take all of the food.

And guess what. Edwards was right on that issue.

But President Obama is struggling, and I guess Dems feel some need to give him a break since he is new on the job.

[Teaser]

80. "struggling"

so much fail, so little time.

[Orwellian_Ghost]

81. Rather than believe in all that

just follow the money.

Obama ain't struggling with jack.

And BTW did you know that Obama actively campaigned for Joe Lieberman against antiwar candidate Ned Lamont?

[SammyWinstonJack]

89. Edwards was right and that is why the PTB 'took' him out early on.

We were left with the candidate that Corporate American wanted us to vote for. The candidate that would serve their interests best. As always.

[ProleNoMore]

82. Progressives Warned All That This Would Be The Outcome

eom

[SammyWinstonJack]

90. +1 nt

[tomp]

91. the real question is: will any dems vote against it?

that will be the litmus test of integrity (imo, of course).

[Xicano]

93. "The left wing was broken long ago....

....by the slingshot of cointelpro. And now it's so hard to have faith in anything."