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Guns Don't Kill, Bullets Do...Our Culture Does

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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:00 AM
Original message
Guns Don't Kill, Bullets Do...Our Culture Does
Edited on Tue Apr-17-07 11:36 AM by RestoreGore
I am so saddened by the tragedy at Virginia Tech, and angry at a society that does nothing but glorify violence in everything it does then wonders why tragedies like this happen. Violence and the glorification of it is so ingrained in our society and we see it in everything from cartoons, to video games, to the general atmosphere in this country that pushes aside civil discussion in lieu of jumping to the violent knee jerk responses first. People in general don't talk anymore, it is about instantly throwing out insults, vulgarities, and punches. Being the strongest to many means being the most violent and our media does teach that to our kids and it needs to stop.

And of course, this war mentality we have been living under is not helping anything. But above all that, it is not the gun that kills, it is the bullets inside the gun. I then don't understand why the sale of bullets in this country cannot be more severely regulated in regards to selling them especially to those who have criminal records, and why we are not holding those accountable who sell bullets. I could walk into any Walmart or Kmart and buy boxes of bullets without any check whatsoever being done on me. So again, I could own one of every type of gun out here, but it would do me no good if I had no bullets to put in them.

This really is such a touchy issue that I try not to comment when tragedies like this happen because so many people are grieving and the last thing they want to hear is a bunch of people pontificatiing about it all especially politicians, but this is just so sad and senseless and does speak to a much more serious deeply rooted problem with our society. Which is why I get so sick of politicians on both sides of the aisle who always strut out after a tragedy like this looking to get their faces on TV to talk about how horrible they feel as they sit voting to continue an illegal war that is killing off our children and increasing a defense budget that does nothing to address the root causes of violence in this country, namely POVERTY. The hypocrisy of it all makes me sick. Perhaps if our "politicians" on both sides actually gave a damn about issues instead of only propping them up at election times we might actually get somewhere with real gun control in this country which to me starts with controlling and regulating the sale and importation of bullets.

My heart goes out to all of those parents and loved ones of those who were killed yesterday, and I think our lawmakers in general should be absolutely ashamed of themselves at how they have allowed this country to decline all for their own political sport. How many tragedies does it take to get effective results? Where is our security? It is so sad such tragedies have to occur before dialogue is started, and even after that they are forgotten much like Hurricane Katrina which in and of itself has spawned a violent crimewave in New Orleans that no one even reports on anymore. Our politicians have forgotten why and who they are there to serve. However, we have to begin not only with gun and bullet control laws but with the very way our culture in this country operates in regards to the pervasive violent mentality being fostered that is reaping financial benefits for those who make profit from tragedy. It is time they were held accountable for it along with those who take the guns in their hands and shoot them.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:07 AM
Response to Original message
1. But people don't kill people nearly as often in Canada. nt
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. Amazing, isn't it? n/t
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #4
20. Same violent TV, music and culture...but they don't kill each other nearly as often....nt
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:46 AM
Original message
maybe because they aren't paranoid and living in fear
This society seems to thrive on it.
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #20
23. maybe because they aren't paranoid and living in fear
This society seems to thrive on it.
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #20
24. maybe because they aren't paranoid and living in fear
This society seems to thrive on it.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #20
34. You've watched canadian news? Nothibng about
if it bleeds it leads

Oh and they DO HAVE a safety net
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elocs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:07 AM
Response to Original message
2. Right! Guns may be Constitutionally protected, but bullets aren't.
I am sure this has been tried before, but it is worth pursueing again. Guns are very easy to obtain, but bullets should be made very difficult to easily buy.
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Xenotime Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Chris Rock said a bullet should cost $5000
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. I'm for that.
Don't understand why others can't see it. Without ammunition you got no gun. Time to make it VERY HARD to get it.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. That's why Rock is a comedian. He was joking--see post 6. NT
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:16 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. I still believe it is something we should look at. And I know what he is, but he had a point. n/t
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:26 AM
Response to Reply #9
15. If the price of bullets goes up, more people will start making their own.
It's not rocket science. And it's cheap to do.
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firefox_fan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:13 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. I think it's not difficult to make a bullet.
If they costed $5000 someone would start making them in their basement and selling them illegally for much less.
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. Then I guess it is pointless to give a damn in this country anymore
It isn't then about laws but about human nature, and on that score we lost along time ago.
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scrinmaster Donating Member (563 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #2
10. When they banned alcohol, and drugs, people made their own.
This will be no different. If I see some sort of "bullet ban" coming up, I'm sure as hell going to stockpile and buy a Dillon reloading press and a shit load of dies.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:11 AM
Response to Original message
6. You don't need no steenking WALMART for bullets--you can make your own!
http://www.outdoorlife.com/outdoor/shooting/article/0,19912,547526,00.html



Someone once said that if you aren’t casting your own bullets you really aren’t reloading. There’s a lot of truth to that. Most reloading of handgun, rifle and shotgun ammo is like baking a ready-mix cake—you just dump in the ingredients according to the instructions and the results are pretty much predetermined.

When you cast your own lead-alloy bullets, however, you take control of a whole new dimension of reloading and ammo performance, with virtually limitless variables and possibilities.

Hand-cast lead bullets, of course, go back hundreds of years before the appearance of jacketed bullets. (It was not until well into the 20th century that jacketed bullets equalled the accuracy of fine lead bullets cast by hand.) The great bison slaughter of the 18th century was carried out with cast-lead bullets. Hunters would retrieve bullets from buffalo carcasses, then remelt and recast them over campfires and kill more buffalo with the same lead the next day. Nowadays there are hunters who still prefer cast-alloy bullets for their hunting pistols and rifles, and a number of rifle competitions are limited strictly to cast-lead bullets. With a good rifle and expertly cast bullets, sub-minute-of-angle accuracy is possible at considerable distances.

Cast-Bullet Advantages
It is among handgunners, however, that cast-lead bullets are most widely used. This is for several reasons, the most common being economy. With 10 pounds of scrap wheel weights, which can be found cheap or free at most tire and auto service shops, you can cast over four hundred 150-grain, .38-caliber bullets or nearly three hundred 240-grain bullets for your .44 Magnum.

There is a common but mistaken notion held by some shooters that cast bullets are naturally inferior to jacketed bullets and are fit only for casual plinking. Such opinions have probably been caused by the poorly cast bullets that some shooters seem content to load and shoot and also by commercial cast bullets that sometimes are of poor quality. Also, cast bullets have a reputation for causing an ugly condition called “leading”—hard-to-remove traces of lead in the barrel resulting from bullet friction. (The lubrication grooves in cast bullets are designed to minimize this.) This situation, like almost all the other misinformation spread about cast bullets, is simply the result of faulty casting and preparation techniques. .....

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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #6
11. So your point is what?
Keep things the way they are?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #11
16. My point is, that halfassed ideas--jokes, really--about five thousand dollar bullets do nothing to
advance the matter of gun control. And that is the matter. The question is, does America have the stomach to go forward with such an effort? To revitalize the bans that BushCo let lapse, for starters?

You can say "Guns don't kill people, people do" or "Guns don't kill people, bullets do" or "Guns don't kill people, a good aim does"--it really doesn't fucking matter.

A person with a million bullets and no gun isn't gonna kill anyone, unless he shoves the bullets up someone's ass and then lights the person on fire.

So, all this counterproductive and foolish "limiting" talk on peripheral equipment is just a waste of time. IMO. And it doesn't deal with the tough issue of gun control, that no one wants to deal with because of fears that "They're gonna take away our guns..."
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #16
22. I don't find discussion counterproductive and foolish
When seeking discussion. If you find it foolish no one is forcing you to respond to it.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #22
27. Reading is fundamental. You aren't reading the words on your screeen.
That's your problem, not mine.
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Xenotime Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. How is it fucking legal to make your own bullet?
Where the hell is the regulation?
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #12
14.  It isn't, but those who want their toys will find any excuse n/t
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EstimatedProphet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #14
18. It is too
Reloading parts and accessories are common.
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #18
25. Ok, then is it regulated? n/t
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EstimatedProphet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #25
32. Not to my knowledge
But then, the regulations wouldn't fall on bullets (except for certain kinds) anyway.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #14
19. Judge not, lest ye be judged. You're making "ass"umptions, you see. NT
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. So sorry I offended those who like shooting furry little things to show their omnipotence
God forbid people actually look to something to address the senseless killing and violence in this country.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #21
26. Now you're just full of shit, and not reading my posts, but again, making ASSumptions.
That seems to be a problem with some folks. I post information, and some foolishly and wrongfully assume I am an advocate. You just did that. Con brio, too.

I won't hold my breath for your apology, though. You are way too vested in being "outraged" about guns, so you accuse someone who has posted elsewhere in this thread, in response to YOU, about the need for gun control, of wanting to go shoot "furry little things."

Heckuva job there Brownie. You might want to look into remedial reading lessons. Try reading what people write before you make a fool of yourself next time.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 12:39 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. It was directed at me, and said 'those who like' -- you were plainly including me in that universe.
But go ahead and parse--and look in the mirror. Miserable, indeed. Get over yourself. Rachet down your outrage and try aiming it for a change.
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. Think what you like. I know what I meant.
You seem to thrive on confrontation here. Have at it by yourself now.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #12
17. There isn't any. And you can get all the materials you need at the junkyard for ten bucks. NT
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 12:47 PM
Response to Original message
30. Bullets Made Here Also Kill In Other Countries
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 01:04 PM
Response to Original message
33. U.S. Gun Laws By State
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