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Public Option Favored by ALL Demographic Groups – Including Republicans

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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 05:10 PM
Original message
Public Option Favored by ALL Demographic Groups – Including Republicans
Anyone who tries to tell us that support for a public health insurance option in the United States is weak or non-existent is either lying or seriously misinformed. As for Republican House Minority Leader John Boehner saying “I’m still trying to find the first American to talk to who is in favor of the public option”, what planet does he live on?

It is true that some opinion polls on the public option show support to be as low as about 55%. But that’s only because of the confusion that the insurance companies and its bought-and-paid-for politicians have sown about it. As a result of that confusion, a recent (August 27, 2009) poll by Nate Silver showed that 23% of American admitted they didn’t know what the “public option” is, 13% believe it is a network of health care cooperatives, 26% believed it to be “a national health care system like they have in Great Britain”, and only 37% correctly answer that it is “a government created health insurance company that competes with existing private insurers”.


Overwhelming support for public option when it is described in clear language

When asked a straight-forward question about the public option in a way that describes what it actually is, Americans routinely demonstrate overwhelming support for it. Here is a question that measures actual support for the public option because it asks about what people actually want, without giving it a label:

In any health care proposal, how important do you feel it is to give people a choice of both a public plan administered by the federal government and a private plan for their health insurance – extremely important, quite important, not that important, or not at all important?

When asked that question in an August 2009 poll, 77% of Americans answered that it is either “extremely important” (58%) or “quite important” (19%). Here is the breakdown by demographic group, of the percent of respondents who say that a “choice of both a public plan administered by the federal government and a private plan…” is either extremely or quite important:

Gender
Male: 71%
Female: 83%

Race
White: 75%
Black: 84%
Hispanic: 91%
Other: 75%

College attendance
Yes: 75%
No: 80%

Income
< $40 K: 80%
$40 K – $80 K: 74%
> $80 K: 76%

Age
18-34: 85%
35-49: 71%
50-64: 77%
65+: 77%

Region
Northeast: 80%
Midwest: 71%
South: 78%
West: 78%

Ideology
Conservative: 67%
Moderate: 80%
Liberal: 90%

Party affiliation
Democratic: 86%
Independent: 71%
Republican: 71% (!!!!!!!!)


So there you go. Even Republicans favor the public option when given an accurate definition of it. Undoubtedly, if Republicans were told before answering the question that President Obama favors the public option their support for it would plunge dramatically.


Requirements of a reasonable public option

It should be evident to most Americans by now why our country needs a public option: Private insurance companies, in their quest for profits, have failed to meet the health needs of the American people. It’s that simple. 47 million Americans are uninsured today. Just as bad, many of the 250 some million Americans who do have health insurance do not have the health insurance they need – as exemplified by research showing that health insurance companies operating in California alone denied more than 45 million health insurance claims (22% of all claims) over a 7 year period. Consequently, nearly one million Americans go bankrupt every year as a result of medical bills – and that number is on the increase.

Because government sponsored health insurance will be unhampered by the need for profits that characterize the private health insurance industry, it will be able to offer a much superior product. But the fact that it is able to do so does not mean that it will do so. It could very well turn out that our Congress, in an attempt to appease their constituents by passing legislation that contains a “public option” will offer a public option of little value. In this way they may be able to appease the insurance industry by offering a product so poor that few people will choose it over private insurance, while simultaneously appeasing their constituents by saying that they passed a “public option”. So, this is a tricky issue, and one that we need to watch out for. We need to consider the criteria for a public option that will meet our needs. Here are some of the most important:

Universality
For obvious reasons, a “public option” should be an option for all Americans. In that regard, I was disappointed in President Obama’s September 9, 2009 speech to Congress, in which he proposed a “public option”, but one which “would only be an option for those who don’t have it” and for which “we believe that less than 5% of Americans would sign up.”

As I discussed above, it is not only Americans who currently totally lack health insurance who are in need of a decent insurance plan. Most of us who do have private health insurance are also in need of a decent insurance plan. If our government subsidizes the purchase of health insurance, and yet ends up providing a government plan to only 5% of the American people, such a system will turn out to be a massive gift to the private insurance industry at taxpayer expense.

Cost
A major reason why so many millions of Americans lack health insurance is that it is too expensive for them. Many tens of millions of Americans are barely scraping by today from paycheck to paycheck. Having to pay additional money for health insurance would tip many of these people into financial ruin. For these people, government subsidies should cover the entire cost of whatever public option is available. For the rest of us, sufficient subsidies should be provided that, at a minimum, we are no more burdened in paying for health insurance than we are under the current system.

Health care is a necessity of life. Most people who lack health insurance do so because they cannot afford it, not out of choice. Meaningful health care reform means that health insurance will be affordable for all Americans.

Quality
It is not easy to precisely specify a minimum acceptable quality for a health insurance plan. At a minimum, there should be no discrimination based on pre-existing conditions, and all reasonable health care needs should be met. It is of course difficult to say exactly what “reasonable” health care needs are. Since our society does not have unlimited resources, there must necessarily be some limit on the amount of health care that can be provided by government. Perhaps the health care needs that are met by Medicare would be a good starting point for comparison.


The politics of health care reform

We must keep in mind that the driving force behind opposition to meaningful health care reform – which must include on option to obtain health insurance from the government instead of through a private plan – is the health insurance industry. If our government offers us a superior and less expensive health insurance plan than we now obtain through private insurance, that would cut greatly into the business and profits of the health insurance industry.

So the outcome of the quest for meaningful health care reform in the United States boils down to whether or not the health insurance industry can convince Congress to either say no to all proposed plans or pass legislation that lacks a public option or one that contains a public option that is virtually worthless. Since Congresspersons are dependent upon their constituents to vote for them to continue in office, that means that the health insurance industry – and their lackeys in Congress – have to convince the American people that the provision of a government sponsored health insurance option is a bad thing.

But how can they do that when the vast majority of the American people favor a public option? So vast is that majority in favor of a public option that it is likely that not a single Congressional district in the United States opposes it. As noted above, polls show that even the good majority of Republicans favor it.

So, in order to turn us against it, the health insurance industry has to make us believe that it is something that it is not. They talk of death panels. They tell us that the option to choose government sponsored health insurance over the for-profit insurance that they offer us would not be an option at all, but a mandate. They tell us that we will have to give up our choice of doctor if some people – anyone at all – have the option of purchasing government sponsored instead of private health insurance. And that is why their bought-and-paid-for politicians, like John Boehner, make lying fools out of themselves by saying things like “The public option is as unpopular as a garlic milkshake” or that they’ve never met single person who was in favor of it.

We have to make sure that Congress understands that we understand this game and that we will not be happy about any Congressperson who votes against or otherwise obstructs the passage of health care legislation that contains a good strong public health insurance option.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 05:11 PM
Response to Original message
1. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 05:12 PM
Response to Original message
2. It raises a big burden off of companies, large and small. Of course Repubs would go for it.
Who WOULDN'T? (Apart from mega-wealthy insurance companies wanting a FREE RIDE...)
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polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 05:14 PM
Response to Original message
3. Just think how easy it would be if our leaders weren't corporatewhores?! nt
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 02:14 AM
Response to Reply #3
12. Our political system needs a major overhaul
Corporations have control of our news media, which they use to spread their lies. And then they bribe our politicians to spread more lies. That's why so many of our leaders are corporate whores.

We need to criminalize bribery of politicians and break of the corporate news media monopoly.
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dotymed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 07:38 AM
Response to Reply #12
15. Publicly Financed Elections
are the answer.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
4. All demographics, 'cept one. Corporatists.
To bad The Senate and the white house are controlled by that demographic. Tis a shame.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 07:30 PM
Response to Original message
5. Yet we want to give states a way to opt-out of it.
I am racking my brain over that one.
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 07:31 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. But you're so certain it's going to suck! Why do you want to FORCE people into a shitty program!!!
:rofl:
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NYC_SKP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
7. K & R! nt
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humbled_opinion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
8. There must be a public option and it must be low cost
because there is no way I can support legislation that forces me to get insurance (which I don't have now because of cost) if it is no seriously cost effective and that meas to me virtually free...

I don't mind paying a little bit but I really don't have the luxury of paying for something I might need versus paying for something that I do need (food)...
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. Absolutely
Legislation that forced people who couldn't afford it to buy health insurance would be unconscionable -- and a major breach of campaign promise.
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ChoppinBroccoli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 09:42 PM
Response to Original message
9. Can I Get A Link To This?
I want to send this to every jerkoff who told me the country was overwhelmingly against healthcare reform.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Sure. Do you mean for the poll?
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 09:48 PM
Response to Original message
10. Thanks for the stats, Time for change.
Rec and kick.
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dotymed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 07:25 AM
Response to Original message
14. I firmly believe
that if Universal Health care were inserted instead of Public
Option, the numbers would have been even higher. Everyone I
know, wants UHC. They believe it is a basic human right....and
it is.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #14
29. Americans have strongly favored universal health care for a very long time
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The Court Jester Donating Member (26 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 08:24 AM
Response to Original message
16. No one is really talking about the real problem
The real problem is that not many people can afford to pay $200 for 2 aspirins and a band-aid. If we had more nurse practitioner run mini-clinics we could solve a huge part of the problem right there. But no, you have to go to a regular clinic, wait for an hour in the lobby, then go to a waiting room and wait there for 40 minutes, and then see the doctor for about 14 seconds, and then you are given a prescription, usually for a drug that doesn't have a generic option because the doc gets a kickback from the pharmacutical company.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #16
34. That is indeed an important problem
But I certainly don't think it's the only one. The insurance industry has made that problem a lot worse with its schemes to extract every last penny out of their customers while giving them little in return.
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kctim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 09:25 AM
Response to Original message
17. That is NOT a "straight forward" question
and it is no surprise that the majority favor it.

You will only get a somewhat accurate reflection when you ask if people are willing to accept a mandate to pay for a public plan administered by the federal government and have an option to pay again for a private plan if they so choose.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. No, that is not what the public option is or has ever been advertised as
Edited on Fri Oct-09-09 09:53 AM by Time for change
The public option, as put forward by the three leading Democratic presidential candidates during the Democratic primaries, is a plan whereby government subsidies are given to American citizens who need them in order to make health insurance affordable, and they then have the choice of either purchasing private health insurance or public health insurance.

Nobody has ever said anything about having to pay twice for those who choose a private plan.

The public option is exactly how it was phrased in the question quoted in the OP.
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kctim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 10:21 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. Really?
So I will NOT ever pay one single penny to the public-option plan if I choose to use a private plan of my choosing? Cool, I could live with that.

What are govt subsidies and where do they come from again?

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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #19
20. That is correct that you will not pay one single penny to the public option plan if you choose
Edited on Fri Oct-09-09 11:02 AM by Time for change
a private plan of your choice. It is highly likely that the private plan will be much more expensive, because of their need to make a profit.

As you probably are aware, we don't yet know all the details regarding the amount of government subsidies, or how they are distributed, or even if a public option of any sort will be included in whatever Congress decides to pass.

Where does the money come from? It comes from our government, just like the money we use to occupy and fight in Iraq and Afghanistan. The Bush tax cuts on the wealthy are due to expire soon, so as long as Congress doesn't extend them, that should provide plenty of additional money for any health plan that passes. If you don't make over $250,000 a year you don't have anything to worry about.

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kctim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #20
21. Glad to hear that people will never pay higher taxes
in order to support the public option plan. Really glad.
How will the plan and subsidies be funded then?
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #21
22. See my edit in post # 20
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kctim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #22
23. Ah, that explains it
I did not realize they were still saying that taxing the rich would be enough to pay for it. Thats not anything new and I doubt if it will change any minds. Its also not a guarantee that people will never pay more in taxes in order to pay for it.
No wonder polls show the two fringes supporting their side and the majority not knowing enough about it.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. A strong public option will almost certainly save the good majority of people a great deal of money
Even if taxes are raised on the middle class, which doesn't seem likely, the savings by virtue of the fact that they won't have to deal with private insurance, should amount to much more than whatever they have to pay in taxes.

You seem to be saying that the poll question is worthless because it doesn't specify exactly what it will cost. Such predictions can rarely be made with much accuracy, but all predictions are that it will results in substantial savings to most people. The private insurance industry is a major drain on the savings of millions of Americans. Giving them another option will do a lot to alleviate that. If the true cost savings were added to the poll question, the percent of people who approve of it would probably be even higher than it is.
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kctim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 12:42 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. I'm saying the question is not accurate
because it is saying people support the public option without asking if they support it enough to pay an additional heavy tax for it, as they do with social security and medicare. People care and worry about the cost to their individual wallets more than they do the cost savings over 10 years.

There is no way the plan can work or last without a tax increase on individuals to support it and the people know that. It will be an all out safety net program just like SS and medicare and judging by the track record of those two programs, many people are leery to add another one to the mix.

Give us a plan with a REAL option; support and participate or not.
Would be a done deal if they did.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. The question IS accurate
When polls ask questions about support for government programs, they almost never include a precise -- or any -- estimate of cost. It is generally assumed that there will be a cost to government programs. That doesn't need to be included in every poll question. Have you ever seen a poll question asking about support for a war that included an estimate of the cost? I doubt it. The question simply asks about support for the war. The fact that it will cost money is assumed. The same applies to questions about any government program.
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kctim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Are you saying tax increases
have no bearing on how people vote or what programs they support? Sorry, but if that were true, we would be taxed 90+% right now.
Or are you saying people don't care about the total cost of the program, so it does not matter if its in the poll or not?


I'm probably not explaining this right, so I will give my personal view on this and see if that does. Sorry about that.

I support the idea of a public option or single payer system.
I will not vote for a tax increase on myself and others in order to pay for them.
I would have voted yes in that poll. Do I favor the public option?
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. No, I'm not saying any of those things. Please read my post # 26 again
I'm saying that polls about government programs rarely include specific information about costs, and that when people answer polls about government programs they assume that the program will cost something. Since they assume that the program will cost something, it's not necessary to note in the poll that it will cost something in order for the poll to accurately reflect the respondents' choice.

As for the example you give, it seems clear to me from everything you've said that you do not support a public option. So your saying that you would have voted yes to that poll does not compute in my brain, and I can't make sense of it. Therefore, I can't comment further on it.
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kctim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. Wasn't trying to be hardheaded and I thank you for your time
just thought you were onto something I had not thought about.

BTW: I would vote yes to that poll because of the way it is worded and would vote no if it asked for a tax increase.
People KNOW the program will cost something, but assuming this means they agree with a tax increase on themselves to support it, is not accurate.

Thanks again for your input and time.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. Thank you
I guess we'll just have to agree to disgree about this... but I appreciate the civil conversation with someone I disagree with.
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
27. Both the Blue Dog DINOs and the Republicans have lost their last remotely
legitimate-sounding reason for opposing the PO. The only remaining reason is insurance industry money. Tehy'd better be piling up a lot of it, because they're gonna have to buy a helluva lot of air time to try & explain to the American people why they opposed giving them adequate health care.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #27
35. Let's hope that some of them start early and switch sides so that they
don't have to worry about explaining the inexplicable to their constituents. :toast:
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. There seems to be some evidence that defections are already occurring.
Too many insurance company cats have gotten out of the bag. They never counted on all their dollar-driven cruelties getting so much exposure all at once.
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TheKentuckian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 03:04 PM
Response to Original message
30. No argument here. A full and robust optional government program
Edited on Fri Oct-09-09 03:05 PM by TheKentuckian
available to all Americans with their employer contributions intact, as well as a fully open national exchange should be shoved down the throats of traitorous Republicans sporting a (D) and the Confederates.
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RDillon Donating Member (14 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 05:47 PM
Response to Original message
36. This is what
Is so outrageous about the Senate Finance Bill. A huge majority of Americans have supported the PO all along and you get a few idiots screaming like children at townhalls and all the sudden the media and Corporate Democrat Senators want to act like Americans oppose it. Such lunacy. Great article, a thorougly enjoyable read!!
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #36
38. Not lunacy, IMHO.
More like deliberate disinformation, desperately cobbled-together astroturf campaigns, etc. aimed at preserving the corrupt system that makes obscene profits out of human misery. No, not lunacy. Flagrant psychopathy.
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WeCanWorkItOut Donating Member (182 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 10:32 PM
Response to Original message
39. But you're talking about an idealized public option. That's far from what we're offered
We have not had the debates yet that will allow us to create a good public option. Too few people even know why our health care costs so much. It has not been adequately discussed. How then are we to bring costs down without causing excessive pain? in a way that is not a gift to the big lobbies, the hospitals, doctors, insurance companies and pharmaceutical companies?

It's reasonable not to be impressed by John Boehner. But for all that, the bill they are going to vote on is not a good bill. It is not the good public option we would like it to be, and will deprive many Medicare patients of needed care.



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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. I have a whole secgtion of the OP
where I talk about the requirements for a good public option, and I say that we shouldn't let them get away with pawning off a weak version on us.
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