Devout Mormon teen butchers woman, cuts throat of child

[cali]

MONT VERNON, N.H. - A devout Mormon on the verge of becoming a church missionary helped lead a group of machete-toting teens accused of butchering a nurse in her bed and slashing her 11-year-old daughter’s throat in what officials say was a sadistic pact to attack at random.

Police said Christopher Gribble, 19 - a handyman and member of the Church of Latter-day Saints - allegedly slashed to death 42-year-old Kimberly Lynn Cates in a brutal bloodbath that left sixth-grader Jaime Cates bleeding in her family’s front yard Sunday morning after attempting to run for help.

Authorities allege a cold-blooded quartet of Granite State teens - Gribble, Steven Spader, 17, William Marks, 18, and Quinn Glover, 17 - were hell-bent on killing and robbing whoever was home at an address they randomly picked early Sunday.

“They took a woman who was full of life,” said neighbor Yuki Chorney, who believes young Jaime was running to her house. “And they took away the innocence of Jaime.”

Spader, who dropped out of Hollis-Brookline High School last year, slit the young girl’s throat with a machete and along with Gribble fatally hacked her mother in the head, torso, left arm and left leg, authorities said.

Gribble’s friends found it difficult to understand how such a pious Mormon, who dutifully attended missionary prep class in Lowell, could morph into an alleged crazed killer.

“It doesn’t mesh with my knowledge of him,” said Ben Gentile of Boxboro, reached by phone yesterday at Brigham Young University in Provo, Utah.

Andrew Johnson, 18, met Gribble in the Boy Scouts when they were both 6 years old. Gribble’s father, an EMT, taught the cubs CPR for their life-saving merit badge.

“He was always wicked nice,” Johnson said of Gribble. “He’d give you the shirt off his back . . . it’s incomprehensible.”

On his Facebook page, Gribble lists himself as a fan of former Bay State Gov. Mitt Romney and Abe Lincoln. Gribble was home-schooled and a member of the ROTC, friends said.

<snip>

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/regional/view/20091007teen/srvc=home&position=0

[BoneDaddy]

1. The twisted minds of people

this is horrible.

[CurtEastPoint]

2. His boyhood friend said "“He was always wicked nice..."

Wicked. I know that a big New England phrase but it's chilling here in this context.

[Lance_Boyle]

3. And they say home-schooled kids have a tough time socializing...

Does Utah have a death penalty?

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

7. What does Utah have to do with this story aside from his BYU attendance? (n/m)

[Name removed]

30. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[brendan120678]

49. Utah does...but I'm guessing the trial will be in New Hampshire. (nt)

[mitchum]

68. Utah even has the firing squad option so that their blood atonement...

doctrine can be observed.
And I honestly don't care if one of you marks took offense at my now deleted post.
It's the history of your cult; deal with it.

[MNDemNY]

4. read "Under the Banner of Heaven" By Jon Krakauer.

good read.

[Beaverhausen]

43. My first thought when I saw this headline

that book was chilling and is a very important read.

[Love Bug]

5. That just goes to show sociopaths are everywhere,

religious or not.

[MineralMan]

I don't see how his being a Mormon is really part of this.

Every nutcase murderer is something. Every religious group has nutcases. This is a non-starter as a story, and the Mormon connection is WAY overplayed.

[Javaman]

33. I think the point about the mormon thing is that this kid was on the

god path to "righteousness" by becoming a brother.

it's the juxtaposition thing. Good going bad.

The real issue is that this kid was probably always a fuck up but everyone cut him slack.

[sinkingfeeling]

6. Why did the reporter have to lead with 'a devout Mormon'? I don't think his religion played any

part in this.

[hedgehog]

9. I think the headline used that lead because of the unexpected juxtaposition

of devout Mormon and murderer; sort of man bites dog.

I'm afraid the story got posted here out of anti-Mormon feelings.

[notesdev]

12. Couldn't have been that "devout"

I'm pretty sure the Mormons have a "thou shalt not kill" in their code somewhere.

The reporter is suffering from extreme anti-Mormon prejudice to have written this story in this way.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

14. +1 to you and the others.

Substitute Jewish/African American/Muslim/whatever and the bigotry would be glaring.

[Oeditpus Rex]

53. It would, but those are incongruous to religion in this sense

Jewish/African American/Muslim/whatever people aren't generally considered to be "good" by virtue of those factors alone, so there's no irony.

[MidwestRick]

16. Yep.

Exactly what I was thinking. How devout a Mormon was he, if he is guilty of this crime?

[Gman2]

22. Bullshit. they want power, period. Their tenants have been debunked.

It is a political organization.

[MidwestRick]

24. In your opinion...

and you are welcome to it. I just happen to disagree.

[druidity33]

29. it's tenets, not tenants. nt.

[MNDemNY]

32. Yup.

And an anti-american political organization, to boot! World dominance is their goal.

[MNDemNY]

25. Read of the history of mormonism, you will change your tune.

"extreme anti-mormon prejudice"...this is a prudent "prejudice" to have.
Mormonism is to christianity, as the taliban is to islam.

[piratefish08]

44. all religions are lousy with prejudice and persecution including christians.....

hell, ESPECIALLY christians.

all of them.

[MNDemNY]

47. I totally agree, but as to mormonism...

there is sooooo much RECENT documentation showing it as a total sham (crime), filled with violent actions. This f'n thing is only 150 years old. total shit.

[NICO9000]

61. MNDemNY is right on the money

I find it extremely sad that Mormonism has been so legitimized in our society. I've been saying the same thing MNDemNY is for years now. How anyone can buy into this crap will always baffle me.

[mitchum]

69. +1000

[JuniperLea]

67. I don't think it's any more unlikely than...

Virgin birth, burning bushes, rising from the dead, a big boatload of male/female paired animals during a flood, or people without belly-buttons obliviously cohabiting with snakes and trees in some garden.

It all requires a stretch. Adding a magic hat, some gold pages and a sole human being who knows how they work and it's no more or less believable.

I don't care what people believe, as long as they don't foist it upon others, or behave as a pontificating jerk... or kill in the name of God.

[MNDemNY]

86. Not more "unlikely", just easier to dismiss as it is all so recent, with news papers and all.

You know, verifiable sources and such.Read some history of mormons, it is quite the case study of how myths take on a life of their own.

[KamaAina]

42. And in the Boston Herald, of all places

practically Romney's campaign newsletter for years. :eyes:

[Oeditpus Rex]

52. More likely:

The reporter followed a practice that's nearly as old as journalism itself: irony leads. These reporters (four are bylined) lucked into a story with blood as well as irony, allowing for a sensational lede.

Interesting that the copy editor who wrote the hed played it straight; the Herald's hed reads, "4 small-town teens held in random attack."

I would've let "A devout Mormon on the verge of becoming a church missionary" stand, but taken out "machete-toting." The story needs many other changes, mostly to similar lurid adjectives. I also don't know why the news media think it relevant to report what's on someone's MySpace or Facebook page, or why reporters seem to do this only when the subject is a young adult.

Meanwhile, 11 grafs down, we find this:


Spader, the other accused killer, showed signs of being a misfit - having once drawn a swastika on his head and proclaiming himself a member of the predominantly black Crips gang.


Someone — reporter or copy editor — apparently decided the irony of faith was more of a grabber than signs of neo-Nazism. One is somewhat relieved that the reporter didn't lead with something like, "A devout Mormon and a self-proclaimed white supremacist formed an unlikely pair in the brutal slaying..."

[Tsar_Bomba]

79. Perhaps

It's people finding excuses for religion that's the problem. When I read the word devout, I think of fundamentalist, and that person's religious beliefs justifies murder for whatever reason. Stop finding excuses for religion, the cause of suffering and death of thousands worldwide.

[redqueen]

37. Why do they mention it when religious leaders or workers are caught

molesting children?

Because it's something that adds to the shocking nature of the crime, I would think.

What's strange to me is how this kind of outrage isn't usually found in threads about pastors caught molesting children. Very odd.

[Beaverhausen]

54. There's devout and then there are fundies

http://www.exmormon.org/violence.htm

http://www.newsweek.com/id/57922

[Tsar_Bomba]

80. I don't see a difference.

[hedgehog]

8. What about all the pious Mormon teens who did not wake up this

morning and go out and slash someone's throat?


Also, this just in, most clowns do not murder people and bury their bodies in the crawl space of their homes.

[The Animator]

13. Yeah, clowns usually just eat their victims...

... no burial necessary. :+ :hide:

[robo50]

10. If you look around at the Herald related article and photos, these guys

don't look like devout ANYTHING religious, they look like thug skinheads.

How and where are these teens being raised? What's with the religion angle, (I'm just not getting it), other than the fact that people who cling to religion every so often don't seem to be too far from people who decide to do something this "wicked" for no reason at all.

Senseless cruelty and mindless religious devotion, there's something there, but I'm not sure what it is.

I know lots of religious people who would never do anything this horrific. I just wonder what the religious fervor of that young man might have been covering up, as far as his sanity goes.

[el_bryanto]

11. I must have fallen asleep in Sunday School that Sunday they taught us to kill and steal

Oh well live and learn. Now that I know what the "true" teachings of the Church are, I shall be sure to act on them.

Bryant

[Echo In Light]

15. Always be wary the so called "pillars" of the community: they often seek such status as cover

[Lerkfish]

17. completely as an aside, ALL mormon young men are about to become missionaries

they're required to complete two years of missionary work. Every one of them...So I don't know why that modifier was necessary, and indicates a lack of knowledge of the culture.

[K8-EEE]

18. Sad to be a devout Mormon though.

"Bigotry" aside & in no way excusing his actions but I really feel sorry for anybody born into that particular religion and it really does have a lot of people at the breaking point, not necessarily violent breaking point but the amount of anti-depressants taken to keep up that "perfect mormon smile" that indicates you are living as a LDS is really heartbreaking. I saw this play "Confessions of a Mormon Boy" about a gay LDS and what he went through in the church trying to get "fixed" by various crazy ways (being made to watch football and make scripted sports comments with other gay LDS!)

[el_bryanto]

19. Feel free to pity me all you wish. You might also enjoy feeling superior to me. n/t

[MNDemNY]

34. You "religion's" founder was a pedophile murderer, and a con-man.

Not to mention bat-shit crazy. Deal with it.

edited to add "" to religion's.

[mitchum]

71. +1000

[mitchum]

97. The ONLY justified lynching in US history was when con man Smith was killed

[el_bryanto]

102. Yeah - fuck you.

[MidwestRick]

27. no they aren't

becoming a missionary is a voluntary action and is actually paid for (in most cases) by the family.

[Lerkfish]

55. not what I was told by several mormon coworkers

so if what they told me was wrong, then either they are wrong, you are, or I completely misunderstood.

I was told two years of missionary work was mandatory. they weren't putting that in a grey area.

[MidwestRick]

56. It is pushed, but not manditory

Typically the only Mormon males who don't go on a mission are those who converted later in life, or BYU quaterbacks (no joke). That being said, it isn't manditory for anyone. If a male or female wish to go on a mission, it's 24 months for males and 18 months for women.

[Lerkfish]

73. semantic differences between what you said and what I did are minor.

I said "young mormon men" and you said "typically the only mormon males who don't go on a mission are those converted later in life"


so....

I'm not really seeing where we disagree much.

[MidwestRick]

Not really.

The point I was discussing was the word "forced". Nobody is forced to go on a mission, it is a personal choice.

[Lerkfish]

83. and yet you say no one refuses that choice... right?

you pretty much say everyone does it.

not much of a choice, then, is it?

[Name removed]

57. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[fishwax]

99. there are many young mormon men who don't go on missions

They are more or less expected to, but it doesn't have the force of excommunication or anything like that, and one can still participate in the church (and do things like get their marriage sealed in the temple) even if they didn't go on a mission. Still, there is a lot of social pressure, on both the individual and his family (including, for example, that it's more difficult to find a mate within the community if you don't go on a mission, since young mormon females often have it instilled in their heads from a young age that their best bet for salvation is to marry a RM).

Even so, there are young men from mormon families who don't go, for various reasons (including not being particularly devout).

[marshall]

20. I wonder what religion the other guys followed?

Other than one being described oxymoronically as a Nazi-Crip, the article fails to mention the faith of the others.

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[kestrel91316]

23. Blood atonement. Maybe the killing was specifically targeting a non-Mormon?

[Arkana]

26. So he's a nutjob who also happened to be a Mormon.

My creepy factor regarding Mormonism aside, it really is irrelevant. I know plenty of Mormons--and they're very nice people.

[MNDemNY]

36. That is redundant.

[ddeclue]

28. Unrecced for gratuitous Mormon bashing - did he kill them because he's a Mormon?

If not then why does it matter that he was a Mormon?

:shrug:

[cali]

45. I don't think it matters that he's a Mormon. I do find it interesting that

he was evidently raised in a very religious way.

[Gormy Cuss]

46. +1

The fact that he's Mormon is secondary to the description of him as pious. Very religious people are presumed to be above such behavior -- at least presumed to be by others among the faithful.

[mitchum]

31. Was he celebrating the Mountain Meadows Massacre?

[MNDemNY]

35. It was the "Indians"!!!!

[petronius]

38. It sounds (reading between the lines) that the other man, Spader, was more

the instigator, and the journalist played up Gribble for the religious shock-factor. It's hard to know if it's bigotry about Mormons, or if any faith would be mentioned; I've never really noticed religion mentioned in articles like this before.

It doesn't really matter, however - it's not the religion that made him evil, it's the home-schooling... :popcorn:

[MNDemNY]

40. No, in this case it was the "religion"

:o

[robo50]

41. How about a combination of home schooling and hanging around

with creeps? If anyone looks at the pictures, these four young men are sort of what we used to call, THUGS and skinheads.

I'm not sure what Morman has to do with this, other than my thinking that this young man's mind was toyed with in many ways over the past few years, by the home schooling, and by the fairy tales of Mormanism.

[slackmaster]

39. Thank God he didn't shoot anyone

:sarcasm:

[JuniperLea]

62. Seriously...

Then they would be dead-dead...

:sarcasm:

[brendan120678]

48. He doesn't sound very pious to me. (nt)

[Ezlivin]

50. Judges 19:29

When he reached home, he took a knife and cut up his concubine, limb by limb, into twelve parts and sent them into all the areas of Israel. (NIV)

I wonder where he got the idea?

[troubledamerican]

100. + 1

[asdjrocky]

51. Wow, just imagine what the MSM would be saying if-

even one of these guys worked for ACCORN.

[Name removed]

58. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[FreeState]

59. As a former Mormon I find the bigotry expressed in this thread disgusting

I dont care what your faith is you will find people in it that do terrible things. Catholics, Buddhist, Progressive Democrats all have examples of murderers.

We know better than this.

[Gman2]

63. We ain't so hep on pedophilic priests either. Or fundie freaks. Said the christian.

[Gman2]

64. I ain't at all sure bout Buddhism.

[FreeState]

72. Deranged Buddhist monk kills 2 men

http://www.buddhistchannel.tv/index.php?id=52,6337,0,0,1,0

It happens

Deranged Buddhist monk kills 2 men
The Nation, May 5, 2008

Bangkok, Thailand -- A deranged Buddhist monk fatally stabbed two men at a Bangkok intersection before cutting his own stomach Sunday morning police said.

Eyewitnesses told police that the monk from Surin was lying on a sidewalk near the Bang Khunnon Intersection and he started attacking two men when he was helped onto his feet.

The monk was identified as Wichalanee Mawichai from Srabua temple in Surin's Chumpol Buri district. He inflicted a severe cut on his stomach after attacking the two men.

His first victim was Sunthorn Hompuangpu, 45. He happened to walk by and the monk grabbed his neck and stabbed him about 20 times. He died at the scene.

The monk then walked to Chamnarn Malawichai, 29, who was riding his motorcycle and was stopped at the traffic light. Chamnarn died on his way to the hospital.

[JuniperLea]

65. I thought it looked like an equal opportunity religious nutbag bashing thread myself...

If the news agency had a Mormon bigoted slant, that's their business.

What I'm seeing is an age old disgust with piety, from ALL of its sources.

This article just happened to be about a Mormon... it could have easily been another sect/cult/religion.

[arcane1]

60. I'm currently reading the creepy "Under the Banner of Heaven"

about another devout Mormon who slashed the throats of a mother and her young child. Now my skin is crawling..

[MNDemNY]

87. Makes you want to become a mormon, does it not?

:sarcasm:

[rucky]

96. I wonder if investigators know about this book.

It could shed some light.

[TexasObserver]

66. These kind of criminals always seem to have a rigid religious upbringing.

They always seem to come from families that embrace a fundamentalist religion that urges one to think of the world as run by a spirit world of good and evil, with a Devil force out there looking to seduce wayward souls. Only by embracing the dogma of the religion, they are told, can they find salvation.

The Mormon Church, the Catholic church, and the fundie Christian churches all have the rigidity of dogma and the mix of good versus evil themes to support the creation of these murderous little monsters. It doesn't happen with many young people from such religious groups, but almost all of them orginate in such environments.

[Gman2]

70. As Kalil Gabran said in "The Prophet"! if you stamp down base urges, they just come back amplified.

[Gman2]

74. Also, ALLLL the late Mormon bloomer guys, did it for the nookie.

You have the pressure soon after meeting a mormon girl, to migrate away from whatever church you used to attend, in anticipation of any consideration for longer term. Playing stepford husband lasts bout three months. Then, you want to slash or burn. So born into it, or Johnny come lately, You are gonna think berserk thoughts, in response to your aquired asceticism.

[TexasObserver]

76. It's gotta hurt when a boy's grandfather or uncle steals his middle school girlfriend.

Excuse me. I was thinking about an episode of Big Love. Nevermind.

[MNDemNY]

88. lotta truth in that show.

the lds hate it!

[MidwestRick]

77. Huh?

"You are gonna think berserk thoughts, in response to your aquired asceticism. "

Are you speaking from experience?

[Gman2]

81. There was a time, when I checked out maybe a hundred different religions.

Everything from debating a satanist, to discussing cosmology with a Hari Krishna monk?, to every flavor of christian church. Witches covens, fortune tellers, comparative philosophy courses, and no religion EVER owned me. Although that fact did make others berserk. For instance the fundie church I was in where the elder said that God was going to kill me very soon, and I would spend my eternity in hell. Cuz I brought a spirit of questioning into the church.

[MNDemNY]

89. are you dead yet?

[Gman2]

95. I think{therefore} I am.

[charlie]

75. Quinn Glover YouTube videos

He's a local musician:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sK_7N_VxJ-M

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bw9j50oHYN4

[proteus_lives]

78. Wow, no different from FR.

We'd be seeing the same type of comments on a freerepublic thread about some muslim psycho killing people.

It's not surprising.

[Gman2]

84. Do a little research. And if it was PROVED that Muhanned was a fraud, the religion

loses the dignity of official religion. Then, they are to be treated like any other fringe lobbying arm.

[BrklynLiberal]

82. Scary..just scary

[Liberal_in_LA]

85. 'wicked nice'?

[JuniperLea]

92. Man, we were saying that in So Cal in the late sixties...

Everything was wicked:)

[HillbillyBob]

90. I don't really care what religions folks play at leave me, my home

and family alone.
I have had to cope with Jehovahs witness, church of gawd, mormons and about a dozen others claiming to have the 'truth' coming to my door at various times and places. There IS NO TRUTH IN WISHFUL THINKING.

And I say unto you stay the hell away from me I think the lot of you are rude for trying to push your superstitions off on me.

I have always been nice, polite and respectful up to a point, then I get nasty and even have gotten violent when they try to force their way in, come back repeatedly, like one bunch came back ever Saturday at 7 am for 6 months. Then there was the jehovahs that came back repeatedly every Sunday afternoon at nap time for about 2 months, when I said look i have been nice and asked you to leave me alone(I was taking cancer treatment at the time) and he tried to come on in anyway. I slammed the door on his foot.

[Taverner]

91. "...found it difficult to understand how such a pious Mormon...could morph into a crazed killler"

It's simple - all of his piety was an act. Like most Religious folks.

Funny how the more conservative the religion (Mormonism, Evangelicalism, Islam) the crazier the nuts are who come out of them.

[HillbillyBob]

93. You Mean like Glenn Beck?

nt

[Taverner]

94. Yes, exactly like Glenn Beck

And there is no insanity like that of a convert...

[SWr]

98. a good reason to ..

Bring back public hangings.

Then again Im sure there will be "those" who claim they should be rehabilitated. There's still "hope" oh lets sit

down and talk with them .... boo freking hoo.

[astral]

101. Antidepressants may have played a role.

I'm not saying they did or would we ever know anyway due to privacy laws, but when people suddenly turn suicidal or homicidal with no previous history of anything wrong 'up there' they are frequently found, especially so in young people, to have been put on antidepressants not too awfully long before it happened.