The aproximate income of a minimum wage worker is 50K \ year,

[nadinbrzezinski]

this is what Rick Berman said on the Rachel show...

He is confusing mean income with what people on minimum make.

If that was the case, my hubby is NOT making minimum wage. I'd love it if that was the truth. those would be LIVING WAGES...

She tried to call him on it, but damn no wonder that woke me up... I had to tune in to make sure I heard right.

[Touchdown]

1. When did they raise min wage to $25 an hour?

I need to call my union!:wow:

[nadinbrzezinski]

16. So does my husband

and why I said that would be a LIVING WAGE...

Your union and his missed that memo!

[Connonym]

2. maybe if they work 24 hours a day 365 days a year

clueless assholes

[provis99]

14. would that even do it?

:shrug:

[DireStrike]

35. You would have to work 19 hours a day, 365 days a year

You would be dead, but you would have a 50k paycheck. Before taxes.

*numbers are approximate

[Name removed]

45. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[nadinbrzezinski]

52. Yuo realize that those people are pulling in

15K a year.

That is poverty my dear.

By the way, enjoy the pizza.

Me... rather fight for LIVING WAGE not minimum wage.

[PearliePoo2]

3. He's in la la land

Do the math Rick.

[rcrush]

4. Where can I get me one of those minimum wage jobs?

That sounds pretty good

[CAG]

5. Wow, math was not his favorite subject, good thing he's not an accountant

[blue_onyx]

6. No way

The approximate income of someone making minimum wage is: 7.25 * 40 hrs/week * 52 weeks/year = 15,080

[Fastcars]

9. Maybe he meant..

if one worked 120+ hours a week at min wage one could EASILY earn around 50k a year?

[me b zola]

36. I used to work 100 hrs/wk at one job

This was several dollars above minimum wage, one employer (meaning over-time). My taxable income was $36,000.


So no, the pro-business jerk was simply lying. That's what people who are anti-labor do--they lie.

[RoyGBiv]

7. Well, that woke *me* up ...

For a minute I thought you were talking about the Star Trek guy.

Anyway, yeah, that guy's pretty much the moron's moron. He's a lobbyist for morons in other words.

[Eric J in MN]

8. Email a tip to Media Matters about it.

[e-mail]

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. Done...

I was going... WHAATTT... I took a nap on the first go around and I went, NAh I could not have heard right.

I did

[Horse with no Name]

10. Hmmm...I do believe we wouldn't be in the shape we are in were that so

$50k pays a lot more light bills and buys a lot more groceries than $15k.

[realisticphish]

11. well shit

My company better pony up another 40 grand this december

[Stevenmarc]

12. Someone's a tad out of touch with reality

[xchrom]

15. she did a MISERABLE job talking to that man. miserable. nt

[NMDemDist2]

18. sadly I agree. i love RM but she wasn't her best on that interview. n/t

[Ruby the Liberal]

28. Agreed. Dr. Maddow is not easily intimidated, but she backed off on this one.

[Ozymanithrax]

17. To make $50,000.00 at $7.25 an hour you must work 6896.5 hours.

If you work 8 hours a day, five days a week, for 52 weeks a years (no vacation for minimum wage slaves) you work 2080 hours.

So, no, people on minimum wage do not make $50,000.00 a year.

Rachel should rip this guy a new one...

[NMDemDist2]

19. even if both spouses work, it still doesn't come close to $50k n/t

[Name removed]

46. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Horse with no Name]

51. Did you mean for your name to be "imanass"?

You certainly shot your wad quick.
Do you think that forcing workers to work more than 40 hours a week without extra compensation is garbage?
:popcorn:

[firedupdem]

54. +1

Perfect!!

[cliffordu]

53. I hope you're paid exactly what you're worth for the rest of your life.

not one fucking penny more.

[XemaSab]

55. Do your masters know you're using their computer for goofing off instead of working?

:shrug:

[Solly Mack]

56. So...how much does blowing hot air pay then? Flinging poo?

You'd obviously know.


"People should be paid based on what they do, plain and simple"

[Forkboy]

58. You must be flat broke.

[sjdnb]

60. Overtime and Doubletime apply to those working after

normal working hours or on holidays. Not garbage ... just fair compensation. Ever try to reach an employee at your bank after 5 pm?

[Name removed]

61. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[krispos42]

62. You're absolutely right

Let's do some math, shall we?

52 weeks a year times 40 hours a week equals 2,080 regular hours a week.

At the federal minimum wage of $7.25 an hour, the maximum a minimum-wage person can earn without going into overtime is $15,080.


Okay, that means you have to earn $34,920 at time-and-a-half. Time-and-a-half is $10.875 an hour, so they would have to work an additional 3,211 hours to make that additional $34,920.

Total: 5,291 hours.


Now, there are 8,760 hours in a year. Assuming you sleep 7 hours a day, then you spend 2,555 hours a year sleeping.

So, 8,760 - 2,555 - 5,291 = 914 hours a year left for "everything else". About 2.5 hours a day for bathing, cleaning, housework, commuting, cooking, shopping, recreating, exercise, intimacy, and child-rearing. And college or trade school, if they want to advance.


I'd love to hear you explain how large numbers of citizens having to do this is good for the country, but I doubt you'll be here long enough.

[krispos42]

63. Ah, a GD mod rang the doorbell while I was double-checking my math

:rofl:

[Horse with no Name]

64. Dude probably thought it was Avon

:D

[krispos42]

65. Instead, it was....

[TexasObserver]

66. nicely done!

[DireStrike]

72. Wow. Excellent points.

I hadn't considered time and a half. Even so, no employer is gonna pay their minimum wage employees overtime... let alone over SIXTY HOURS of it a week... HAH!

As to how it would be good for the country... well obviously, mr. or ms. freeper would not be forced to pay any of his or her (undoubtedly hard-earned) tax money to support THOSE PEOPLE. They'd be SELF-RELIANT, PERSONALLY RESPONSIBLE. Also, probably dead inside and sick or dying on the outside, by the time they're 40. So they won't take up any social security!

[omega minimo]

20. Fuckhead

[RKP5637]

21. These people live in such a BS fantasy they can't tell what reality is anymore! n/t

[rufus dog]

22. He is the Devil, you need to be very careful to listen to exactly what he states

and that is the average household income of a minimum wage worker is 50k.

So, my daughter made minimum wage this summer, wife and I make more so you take the three wage workers in the house and the Minimum wage worker lives in a household above 50k.

Two years ago my personal number would have been a lot higher, so if my daughter had a summer job then, you could load on 10 other households making 15k per year on to mine. Average things out and hot damn, you would have an average income of 50k for the eleven households even though ten of them were making 15k!

It is meant to be extremely misleading.

[nadinbrzezinski]

23. He did not say mean pay, which is 50K

that means that half of US workers are making LESS than 50K, and the other half over 50K

He said that is the average pay of minimum pay workers. He counted on people thinking oh he must mean Average US Pay...

And yes, he was extremely slick. She tried to call him on it, but he was SUAVE on moving on. The damage is done.

[rufus dog]

29. No he did not say average pay

He said the average household income of a minimum wage worker was 50k.

So you could have 3+ minimum wage workers in a house and that would be 50k.

You could have a person making a million a year with a kid working a part time minimum wage job. So let's say the kid made $1,000 at the summer job, then the household income was $1,001,000 for the year. If you take twenty-seven households with a single minimum wage workers, add them to the one million dollar house household, divide by 28 and you have an average household income of 50k.

[DireStrike]

40. The only thing Rachel could have done would have been to slow the interview to a crawl

Hit him point by point. She doesn't need the numbers to call him on his bullshit.

There are so many fucking things wrong with what he said that it would take 5 minutes to stop and explain them all.

[anigbrowl]

71. You do not understand math

"(average/mean pay) that means that half of US workers are making LESS than 50K, and the other half over 50K"

No, it doesn't. If 9 people earn $1/hour and one person earns $11/hr, the average pay is $2 ($20 / 10 people), but the ratio of those paid above and below the average is 9:1.

you are probably talking about the median, not the average. This has been pointed out to you before.

[valerief]

24. Wow. That's an amazing lie on Berman's part.

7.25 * 40 = 290
290 * 52 = 15080
15080/50000 = 30%

How could he be so far off? Oh, yes, he's a slimeball lying thieving bastard.

[Graybeard]

25. I heard that too but he's such a lying sack of crap that

it was just one more lie in his litany. Rachel tried to debunk as many as she could.

[Ruby the Liberal]

26. I was making $52k a year when I was laid off.

Apparently, I am not qualified for most $9/hour jobs now as they need x years in their specific industry AND a bachelors degree. I have the latter but in most cases, not the former.

A lot of firms will have a rude awakening when this economy turns around and all of their bargain basement hires jump ship.

[DireStrike]

37. Wow I hope you're right about that.

I'm considering taking up a trade, so I won't be quite as dispensable when the depression hits.

[SmileyRose]

49. A rising economy will not raise wages for college folks.

The economic boom of the 90's did very little for the non-college folks. Wages have been stegnant at best, with a big loss in spending power thanks to inflation. They've already hammered down the HS and VoTech crowd, this time they came for the college crowd.

When the economy picks up they will crow about all the new jobs they created - conveniently leaving out the fact that President StupidAss was speaking the mind of the powers that be when he exclaimed having to work 3 jobs to get by is a great thing about America.

[alarimer]

27. Then I make way less than minimum wage

I am not even sure you could possibly work enough hours in the week to make 50k at minimum wage. Probably with overtime you might be able to but certainly most people (the vast majority in fact) on minimum wage are working less than 40 hours a week.

[smoogatz]

30. Wow.

That's not bad. I'm going to ask my department chair if I can have a raise to minimum wage.

[Bjorn Against]

31. Wow, it sounds like I need a minimum wage job because I am not earning nearly that much

Do these people think we can't do simple math?

[ElsewheresDaughter]

32. Not a very bright bulb that one is, eh?....

in NY that's $15,080.00 a year.

[DireStrike]

33. LOL. wow this is what they really think.

No wonder we can't get anything done.

On federal minimum wage, working 40 hours a week, 52 weeks out of the year with perfect attendance, a minimum wage worker makes 15080.

Before taxes.


Never mind that a LOT of minimum wage earners are not in full time jobs.

[Control-Z]

34. So unbelievably stupid.

Did Rick Berman just lie, or did he drop out of school before 3rd grade?

[iris27]

38. Really? Somebody owes me an extra $24k a year then...

and here I thought I was making about $5/hour over minimum wage...:rofl:

[gratuitous]

39. That's from picking cabbage at $50/hr, right?

The Republicans really need to change their name to the Clueless party.

[Horse with no Name]

67. That's why the illegals flock across the border

stealing those $50k cabbage picking jobs (and I certainly hope I don't have to use the sarcasm smiley).

[Orrex]

68. I know you're trying to be sarcastic, but they really are doing the jobs that Americans won't do

I mean, I refuse to pick cabbage for anything less than $55k.

[Rude Dog]

41. 50 K?

HA!

I'm lucky to make 10K.

Whatta maroon that guy is.

[autorank]

42. Wasn't that guy a total jerk k*r

He's useless, totally. He motor mouthed through the interview but did nothing but look
like he was afraid of Madow. And you're a smartie! for picking that up.

[nadinbrzezinski]

48. On the first run it literally woke me up from my nap

I went... nah, could not have said THAT...

Imagine this happily napping, hear this, and I say BULLSHIT before eyes even open.

[robinlynne]

43. I wish!!!

[Rex]

44. Oh you know he is not confusing the two, just somemore outright lying.

He gets away with it.

[drm604]

47. He said the "family income" of the minimum wage worker.

Which includes the wages of the worker in question plus the wages of any other workers in his or her family. So it may be literally true, I don't know for sure. In any case it misses the point.

I wish that Rachel had been a little harder on him. She tried to dispute the point you bring up but he stepped on her attempted response and she never followed up.

I'd really like to see the data behind his claims that 80% to 85% of economists say raising the raising the minimum wage doesn't help the poor. Notice that he didn't cite any actual economic data, only data about economists, which makes me suspicious.

[nadinbrzezinski]

50. He's also behind eating a ceratin heavy metal in fish

ain't that bad for you, and cites the Harvard Medical school

And what he said is false... patently false...

But the right has been trying to stop further minimum wage increases, let alone ... living wage, for decades.

[drm604]

57. The man is lying scum,

I don't dispute that. I'm just explaining that what he said was possibly literally true, but dishonest since it misses the point. That is often how these people lie. They speak the "truth" in a misleading manner.

Rachel had a good opportunity to point this out but, as much as I do admire her, I think she failed to do so.

[DireStrike]

74. She's probably kicking herself over it

I can think of several good ways to respond to the point. But this is after the fact.

How the fuck can you prepare to counter something like that? He just picked a statistic at random that had words in it that sounded like it might be relevant. She had to resist the temptation to call it bullshit outright... because as you point out, it might be true. Such an astonishingly pointless and misleading claim is stunning, literally. Probably why it was effective.

[Orrex]

59. Dammit! First he screws up Star Trek, and now this?!?

[Brigid]

69. Woke you up?

You mean you weren't already bouncing off the walls after KO's special comment?

[nadinbrzezinski]

75. That was last night

[dsc]

70. damn I don't make 50k a year

[shadowknows69]

73. In wha country? I'm moving there tomorrow

[JVS]

76. "He is confusing mean income with what people on minimum make."

Actually, he's confusing median income for household of presumably 2 earners with what a single minimum wage earner makes. The median income for a single earner is $25K.

[DireStrike]

77. I didn't hear him say "household of two people"

he might also be including households with students earning minimum wage, and two full time employed parents.

It's the most thoroughly meaningless statistic I've heard in a long time.

[JVS]

78. It doesn't matter if he said it. The median income of earners is not $50K...

that's the household median. Whether he cares what to say he's confusing the minimum wage with is irrelevant.

[DireStrike]

79. It only adds a degree of ridiculousness to his claim.

Unfortunately his claim had the words "minimum wage", "income", and "50,000" in it, and that is all that casual watchers heard.