Banks make $38bn from overdraft fees

[babsbunny]

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/43d18c68-851d-11de-9a64-00144feabdc0.html?nclick_check=1

By Saskia Scholtes and Francesco Guerrera in New York

Published: August 9 2009 22:52 | Last updated: August 9 2009 22:52

US banks stand to collect a record $38.5bn in fees for customer overdrafts this year, with the bulk of the revenue coming from the most financially stretched consumers amid the deepest recession since the 1930s, according to research. The fees are nearly double those reported in 2000.

The finding is likely to increase public hostility towards the financial sector, which has been under political pressure to ease the burden on consumers by increasing credit availability and lending more fairly after being bailed out by taxpayers.

[bbinacan]

1. Solution

Don't write a bad check.

:eyes:

[parasim]

6. Easy to say...

... not so easy to do when you live paycheck-to-paycheck.

It's been decades since I've written a bad check (not on purpose) but sometimes it happens. and if you do make that mistake and can't make it up immediately, they'll charge a whopping fee ever day you're overdrawn.

I made a mistake in my math one time long ago and within a short time I owed something like 250 bucks. I was not even aware of my mistake until I got something in the mail from the bank.

I've gotten much better in keeping track of my finances since, but many have not.

[bbinacan]

7. Personal responsibility.

It's so easy to blame others.

[AwakeAtLast]

11. May you never have anything bad happen to you.

[bbinacan]

16. I've had bad things

happen to me but I don't blame others for my fuck up.

[Skittles]

54. fucking up is one thing

being gouged and ripped off by banks is an entirely different matter

[dmr]

65. Thank you

Some people are just so righteous, and have little to no empathy for their neighbor.

[Skittles]

94. I used to print NSFs for banks

I could see for myself how the poorer folk were fucked a lot more than others - and that was back in the 80's - I can't imagine how it is now

[RB TexLa]

34. What does living paycheck to paycheck have to do with either math skills or honesty?

[EFerrari]

43. It means you don't have $500 in your account to buffer against a human error

on your part or against the predation of your bank rigging your account to go red.

It's long past the days when just good math skills and honesty would keep your account in the black. Billions of dollars of long past those days. That's how these people make their money now.

[parasim]

77. Where in my post did I mention honesty?

When you're living paycheck-to-paycheck, mistakes in math can cost a pretty penny, because you don't have a buffer to cover these mistakes.

So, I'm a liar when I talk of making math mistakes in figuring our my budget?

[RB TexLa]

78. Just using the two causes of overdrafted checks, mathematical mistakes and dishonesty

[EFerrari]

80. You're not even reading this thread, are you?

[RB TexLa]

82. Yes I've read how banks have singled out people and switched their transaction orders

to get $35 fees out of them, and how it is done over and over and is common pratice and yet not a single attorney in America has filed a class action. Yes I've read the thread.

[EFerrari]

85. If you search BoA Overdraft Charge Investigation

there are actions ongoing.

http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=Bank+of+America+overdraft+fees+investigation&y=Search&fr=yfp-t-151&fr2=sb-top&xargs=0&pstart=1&b=1&xa=2ZMX91yujSds21znLrgjzg--,1249965421

And the BofA practice has been in the news as well:

http://news.search.yahoo.com/search/news;_ylt=A9j8euxJpH9KzBYAsg7QtDMD;_ylu=X3oDMTBhNjRqazhxBHNlYwNzZWFyY2g-?p=Bank+of+America+overdraft+fees+&c=&ei=UTF-8&fr2=tab-web&fr=yfp-t-151&x=wrt

Edit: that link breaks up but all I did was search Bank of America overdraft fees in "news".

[RB TexLa]

87. Let me know when one of them wins something.

:rofl:

[EFerrari]

88. I hope those goal posts aren't too heavy.

[RB TexLa]

89. If you actually search class action lawsuits you see the successful one was thrown

out on appeal.

Most of the results are warning about class action scams regarding it. This thread seems to have a few that are prime targets for a rip off on that.

[EFerrari]

90. But that has zip to do with the fact that BofA is scamming honest people

who can do math.

You don't really think that all of a sudden, people turned dishonest or can't add any more, do you?

BILLIONS of dollars in fees.

[RB TexLa]

91. I think people became lazy, and don't keep up with their balances.

[EFerrari]

104. I can't speak for everyone but I've never been lazy

because I can't afford to be. Btw, Amy Goodman reported this story this morning in her headlines.

Somehow, I don't think Bank of America's business plan counts on strapped people being lazy. Helpless maybe, but not lazy.

[parasim]

81. I get it. You were referring to something that I had not addressed in my post.

But you can add a third cause... the banks manipulating the first two causes for profit.

[RB TexLa]

83. And as I just posted to someone else, every single attorney in America must be just too busy to

file a class action on what would be a lucative case. Maybe it's because . . . never mind . . . that must be the reason, they are all too busy to file one. Sure, that would be the reason.

[parasim]

84. Ok, so executives of these banks will have no idea they are screwing people...

... until they're brought in front of a judge? Who cares how lucrative a case it could be... couldn't these bankers just show a little decency on their own?

[RB TexLa]

86. It wouldn't be lucrative because there isn't a case. The posting rules are the same whether a debit

is going to clear or not.

[Mariana]

44. Once upon a time, they would call you

and give you a little time to come in and make the check good, if you were a good customer and it didn't happen all the time. This was within my lifetime, because I remember my mom having to rush to the bank to cover a check that was overdrawn because my dad had forgotten to enter a withdrawal into the register.

Nowadays, they manipulate the order the checks go through so as to rack up as many charges as possible. Bastards.

[EFerrari]

46. Exactly. I remember my mom's bank calling her

and Mom driving in to make sure she got there before the end of the business day.

[dmr]

95. My bank still calls when there's a problem

My son made a mistake and the bank called. To make a long story short, I called the bank manager and over the phone we did a transaction from my account into his. No charge for this at all.

This is a local bank with only 2, maybe 3 branches. They run a neighborhood friendly, solid ship, and didn't get caught up with bad mortgage loans either.

I'm very happy with this bank.

[EFerrari]

13. You don't have to write a bad check. These banks rearrange

the order of the entries and bingo, you're overdrawn.

When I was doing accounting for a few small businesses, we called that cooking the books.

But nice going blaming the victims of this practice.

[bbinacan]

17. I used to work for a bank

and you're full of shit.

[EFerrari]

18. Well, there's no arguing with that.

LOL

Yes, it's called cooking the books. They control what is posted and when. Do you think it's an ACCIDENT that these people make their profit via these fees? No wonder you USED to work for a bank.

[bbinacan]

24. What you accuse

I have never seen.

[DUlover2909]

27. Then you are an incompetent former bank employee.

They process the largest transactions for a day first. If I have $100 in my account and three transactions (or checks) occur on the same day, say for $75, $26, and $5, they always put the $75 first so that the following transactions are overdrawn, thereby earning the bank $70 in fees.

The PR people for the banks claim that this is what the customers prefer, which is a lie.

[bbinacan]

30. This is a joke, right?

I was an AVP at a large bank and I changed careers that allowed me to double my income. Retail bankers don't make squat for what they have to put up with. BTW, I was an investment consultant and my client's accounts were closley tied in. I've never seen what you claim

[CoffeeCat]

62. There was an article about...

...the very fee-gouging practices that people are describing here. Exactly as described, the banks would
put the largest checks through first--and four or five smaller checks would bounce--creating more fees
for the banks.

There was a quote in one of the articles from a bank executive--saying that it was their policy to cash
these larger checks first, because they felt they were doing the customer a favor. Her reasoning was
that these larger checks must have been more important, so they were cashed first.

Everyone knows, that's a crock.

Yes, it's impressive that you're a VP. I have a good friend who is a VP at one of the largest banks in the
country. He worked in subprime during the housing boom and he had no idea about what was really going on--that
he was part of creating a giant bubble that would burst--because his bank and others were doling out loans that
would never be paid back. Lots of people knew this would happen, but he did not. Sometimes being a VP just
isn't enough. Anyway...most banks have a million VPs. You'd have to be in the elite upper echelon to
be privy to the trash talking that goes on behind those doors.

[bbinacan]

96. Do you have a link

to that article. I'd like to read it. Thanks.

[Cetacea]

69. Bank of America does it.

I know someone who is an AM there And this is in fact what they do. and that is why they are being investigated.

[TexasObserver]

32. You are correct. The other poster is not.

And it's common knowledge in the industry.

They process the payments to create the highest number of overdrafts, which yield obscene overpayment charges.

[beyurslf]

37. The poster is correct. Bank of America does this all the time.

They didn't used to until last summer. If you had pending debits over the weekend and had a deposit posting Monday, it covered it all. Now, it does not. For example, you deposit a check on Friday at 5 pm or on Saturday morning. You had 10 bucks in there before the deposit and the deposit is 200 bucks. AFTER the deposit, you shop, buy some gas, eat out, and spend about 150 of what you deposited. You do this all on your debit card. BOA charges you overdraft fees for every transaction! Their reason is that the deposit was not available until it posted on Monday night. Those debits were made with "floating money" that you deposited but had not yet posted to your account. The tricky part is that the debits you make over the weekend won't post until Tuesday or maybe even later (in the case of the gas). They still charge because they say you are using money that is not yet yours (even though it is really always yours).

I know this is true because it happened to me. I had not over drawn in years and had almost $350 in OD charges from that weekend. The banker graciously reversed half of those even though they were "legitimate" charges. I call it theft and I am no longer their customer.

[EFerrari]

41. BofA is one of the very worse offenders.

They rearrange your transactions while you sleep and in the morning, you owe them another fee because they overdrew your account with their creative posting overnight.

[Cetacea]

70. Absolutely. n/t

[beyurslf]

92. I dont even understand how it is legal. You have to select some option online

to even see the overdraft because otherwise it looks as though you didn't (because you didn't)

[RB TexLa]

35. No, posting rules are the same for every transaction, if a check overdraws or not.

[EFerrari]

39. Who do you bank with?

The big banks rearrange your transactions to benefit their bottom line. These BILLIONS of dollars aren't coming in because people all of a sudden can't balance their accounts. It's a business strategy and by God, it's working.

[Statistical]

100. It changing the order results in an overdraft then....

the account was NSF at the time the check was written.

It simply means you were able to "get away with it" in the past.

The banks have taken all the slack out of the system.

If you account has sufficient funds (i.e positive balance sufficent to cover the check) at the time you write the check you can't get overdrafted.

[Lagomorph]

36. Saw that myself

Bank of America was doing it to me.

I scheduled a payment on the first of the month, when I get paid and they posted it before the deposit.

However, I had checked the account earlier and saw the deposit was posted before the payment was deducted.

They pulled a switch on me.

I'm at Wells Fargo now.

[EFerrari]

40. Exactly. They control the posting, they can do whatever they want. n/t

[Vidar]

48. Very good point.

[Statistical]

99. You can't be overdrawn if you don't write a check with sufficent funds.

Banks can manipulate the order of checks to maximize the overdraft fees (i.e. 3 fees instead of 1).

Banks can also manipulate the order of deposits & checks to ensure overdraft fees if you write a NSF check but the check is cashed same day as the deposit hits (i.e process checks first and then deposits).

It is dishonest to say "you don't have to write a bad check".

You MUST write a back check. The banks can just make it worse.

Example:
Write a check for $50, $100, $200 and the account has $400 in it. There is no way the banks can "cause" a overdraft.

[DUlover2909]

25. It's not about checks only. They push debit cards for a reason.

The bank says that they are "unable to decline a charge made on a debit card transaction" in the way that credit cards are declined. That's a fucking lie. They arranged this system and paid off regulators to have the system that they prefer. It's obvious they are lying because if I try to purchase oh, say, a diamond Rolex and I only have $100 in my account, somehow it gets declined. But if I buy a tank of gas and only have $5 in my account, it goes through and the bank makes $35 off my overdraft. It's a crooked racket and they know it.

[EFerrari]

33. Banks routinely declined debit transaction up until about five years ago.

It's a scam.

[Skink]

56. That's right.

That's why I use debit so it might get declined. Now I guess I must rethink that.

[EFerrari]

59. They trained us to use the debit card because that way

we couldn't go over our balance and then, they changed the rules.

It's hard to believe that was an accident.

[blueamy66]

102. I use Bank of America

and their practices are bullshit.

I have called and asked them to decline a debit transaction if I do not have sufficient funds and they refused to do this!!!!!!!!!!!

I want my debit transactions to post as they occur...not on Monday, in highest to lowest order.

And, if BofA clears my highest transaction first, because that is the one that is most important...then why do they then clear the rest with NSF fees. THEY ARE GOING TO CLEAR THEM ALL...SO WHO CARES WHICH ONE THEY CLEAR FIRST. They clear the largest first so that they can collect the most NSF money.

It's a scam.

[depakid]

76. Even bettter solution

Consumers have scored another victory in the battle against exorbitant bank charges when the Westpac group announcing plans to cut a range of penalty fees from as much as $40 to just $9. The decision by Westpac and St George - the NSW-based bank it bought last year - follows a move last week by their big four rival, National Australia Bank, to axe the entire overdraft fee of $30 on accounts used by 700,000 personal customers from October 1

But in a bid to outdo one another, Westpac said that it would cut the fees by as much as three-quarters that it slugs its 5 million customers if they incur an overdraft, have a cheque dishonoured, go over their credit limit or when they miss a credit card payment.

The latest ''war'' over charges will put intense pressure on the Commonwealth Bank, which is the country's largest lender, and ANZ to follow suit.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3997800

Of course- this requires as ethic of corporate responsibility- something Americans aren't exactly used to hearing repeated like a mantra.

[ejpoeta]

2. it's a struggle sometimes to stay tight on the money in my account.

and they are pretty good at taking fees out when you are really low.... I don't want to give them any more than I have to, thank you very much.

[FarCenter]

3. It is actually illegal to write a check against insufficient funds.

[shimmergal]

93. It's only illegal if you

do it deliberately, (not from a math mistake) and even then most outfits traditionally gave you time to make it good.

Plus somebody has to be willing to prosecute, so the bad intention would have to be egregious, or there'd need to be enough money involved to make it worthwhile to pay lawyers, court costs etc.

Theoretically the sheriff or city/county prosecutor will do this, but doing so for a "normal person" or a small business who's received a bad check, turns out to be pretty low priority. I lost $400 when a tenant's rent check bounced; never got it back because the house & tenant were half-way across the US from me, and it was just too complicated to try to recover. (The people had afterwards moved & it took a while to find their new address, among other problems.)

[benld74]

4. Actually it is much more than writing a bad check, or having insufficient funds,,

its about HOW the banks process the debits and credits within you account. THAT is how the majority of their overdraft charges occur, and from your responses, I take it has NEVER happened to you. I hope it never does, because it is a pain in the ass, because when you call them and complain, they usually remove the fees, IF you have been with them long enough and IF you have a good enough credit rating.
People need to stop making things black and white, because in life things rarely are.

[FarCenter]

9. Ether the sum of the day's debits exceed the sum of available funds in the account on not

The computers just do arithmetic.

[yowzayowzayowza]

10. Oh, no!! Their not netting anymore.

We were charged last month for a transaction that went thru at 6pm when a regular automated deposit showed up at 11:30pm, both on the same 'banking day.'

eta: The daily balance detail showed no overdraft. They have another screen these days with the instantaneous balance detailing the negative balance. First time I've ever seen that. Bastards.

[FarCenter]

15. Was the 6 pm transaction a debit card transaction?

More and more banks post debit card transactions in real-time as they happen. Same thing with Fed wire and some other payment networks. Most probably still post checks and ACH transaction in the batch process that runs overnight.

Eventually, the batch Cobol programs running on mainframe computers will all be replaced by real-time transaction processing systems.

[yowzayowzayowza]

20. No, credit AUTH transaction. n/t

[FarCenter]

26. With a debit card authorization transaction

The amount of funds in your checking account become "unavailable" immediately in anticipation that the settlement transaction will follow.

Credit card authorization transactions also work the same way. Except then the amount is subtracted from your credit limit. Except that credit cards don't have overdraft fees. They have over the credit limit fees.

[momrois]

12. Not really true

Well, part of it is true. Computers do do the arithmetic. It's the way the computers are programmed that's the problem. They do the debits before they do the credits, and they take out the larger debits first, thus causing smaller debits to cause additional overdrafts before your deposit even gets posted.

[DCKit]

19. +1. Larger debts first, all the way down to the $1 dollar fee for charging a fee...

which costs another $39 in overdraft charges.

[EFerrari]

22. Bingo. And that's how they produce all that red ink. It's a huge scam. n/t

[yowzayowzayowza]

103. Rec'd the documentation for this overdraft in the mail...

today. It states the overdraft was for an entirely different transaction, directly contradicting the EXISTING online detail. They can't even keep their story straight!!! I repeat, FUCKING BASTARDS!!!!

[EFerrari]

14. Nope. They control the postings. They can post or not post

any of your transactions to overdraw your account. Unless you have a healthy buffer, you're a sitting duck.

[FarCenter]

21. Right, you can't rely on today's credits posting in order to pay today's debits

There are any number of reasons why one of today's credits might not post, which can create an insufficient funds situation. Also, only part of a large check deposited today becomes "available" immediately. The rest of the check becomes available in the next day or two -- see your account's funds availability rules. Also, a check deposited today, might bounce from the drawn on bank in the next day, and be debited from the account.

As for the order of posting of debits -- the theory is that the larger debits should post first since they are the most important payments that the customer is making. Not saying that customers necessarily agree.

[EFerrari]

23. It's a scam and the "rules" you cite are written to maximize OD charges.

Before deregulation, transactions were posted in order.

Banks today make most of their profit on these charges. It's like banking at a slot machine, it's rigged.

[FarCenter]

28. More likely, an check was returned to the depositor or to the Bank of First Deposit

In the good old days, the bank just sent the stuff back, and charged the depositor a returned check fee.

Charging the check writer an overdraft fee is better, since it better discourages writing checks against insufficient funds.

[EFerrari]

31. It's BILLIONS of dollars better. n/t

[anigbrowl]

60. Not necessarily

Make a number of small withdrawals and then make a large cash deposit. Look at your statement or online account information a day or two later. The deposit will show up ahead of the withdrawals. Having gotten stung with a bunch of these charges in the past, I now avoid them by simply not allowing my balance to fall below a certain amount. If I have less than $xxx in my account I treat it as if I had already run out of cash,

[EFerrari]

61. Let me put this another way. Remember the order of operations

from basic algebra? If you knew the order, you could solve the problem.

What these banks are doing now is essentially changing the order often enough that the most diligent person gets caught up. That's their business plan.

[anigbrowl]

109. It is nothing like changing the order of operations in algebra

It is confusing to people and the fees charged are wildly excessive and predatory, though it happens that their system treats deposits the same way as outgoings (ie, if you make a number of small withdrawals followed by a large deposit you can actually make this system work in your favor). In a mathematical context, this would be like changing the order of terms, not of operations.

The second-easiest way of avoiding losses from this (following the basic idea of keeping a balance and using a higher safety threshold than $zero) is to make a written request to the bank to discontinue courtesy debit payments on checking accounts. In other words, to assert you'd rather have your card declined than be charged a fee. As with many things, this might necessitate two emails since the first response will usually take the form of a polite demurral. It is (almost) never worth dealing with your bank on the phone since you have no way to preserve a record of the conversation.

I am not sticking up for the integrity of the banks, who I consider to be mainly thieves. On the other hand, it doesn't require much effort to protect oneself from this thievery.

[abumbyanyothername]

5. Why do we need private banks?

This is one that has always escaped me.

I mean, I could see it if they were democratically run institutions. But these are little oligarchs deciding who gets money and who pays money.

[harun]

97. We don't.

[Stuart G]

8. These selfish pigs never get enough..But I must aplogize to all

pig lovers out there.. No offense meant to our animal friends.

[DUlover2909]

29. They are not pigs. They are parasites. Not too many animal lovers also love parasites.

Banks are just vampires.

[Taitertots]

38. The way they run banks should be criminal.

I've seen someone cash a paycheck, wait a day and make several purchases. Then the bank applied overdraft fees that were so large they ate the whole check. Then they applied an insane rate to the balance, where it was going to be more than double by the time they got another paycheck.

I've had paychecks that I have deposited Friday, not show up in my account until Tuesday before.

I've had transactions not go through for several weeks.

I've had companies refund my account without telling me, and reapply the funds later when the product shipped.

[EFerrari]

42. I remember when my mom's bank used to call her in the 60s

to tell her that she needed to make a deposit because one of her checks might bounce.

We're light years away from that now.

These people are preying on low income customers -- the ones who don't have a big buffer and whom they can ding, day after day after day.

[Taitertots]

45. Light years away from that

My debt card will automatically withdrawal from my savings if I overdraft. This is only because when I got the card I caused a big fight with them, essentially demanding it, yelling, threatening to take my account elsewhere. It is the only way you will get them to do ANYTHING.

Don't even get me started on the sub-inflationary stipend they call my interest rate.

[Mariana]

49. I remember that, too, in the '70's they were still doing it.

It happened to my mom several times because my dad would occasionally forget to enter a withdrawal in the register. The phone would ring and she'd quickly gather us kids up and we'd rush to the bank so she could cover the overdrawn check.

[Horse with no Name]

47. They do everything they can to scam you

Like if you pay at the pump with an ATM card--they lock up $50 for a few days--even you only spend $20. Not all of us have thousands in the bank and some of us actually have to stretch our paychecks. It MAKES a difference whether I spend $20 or $50 at certain times of the month for gas. It can be a matter of a check squeaking through or getting returned with a big fat fee--even though I technically "had" the money "on hold" "just to make sure".
I refuse to pay at the pump for this very reason.

[EFerrari]

50. I'm amazed that people don't see it. Maybe you have to be old enough

to remember when your bank wasn't a predator. :shrug:

[Horse with no Name]

53. I remember "counter checks"

Now that is the epitome of trust, eh?

[EFerrari]

55. My grandmother used to get a pension check from El Salvador

because she was a military widow. She used to be able to take that check to the grocery store and shop for all the sweets my mom wouldn't buy. In fact, she used to be able to call a cab who waited for her while she shopped.

lol

Damn.

[Mariana]

64. See, I had no idea they did that

because I do have enough "cushion" that crap like that has never bitten me in the ass.

I'm learning a lot. If the time comes that money is tight for me again, I think I'll do every transaction I can in cash.

Bastards. I have no idea how these people sleep at night. I wouldn't be able to.

[Horse with no Name]

72. I can still use my debit card

But I have to walk into the store and use it. The 3-day $50 "hold" only applies to pump purchases. Apparently, the computer at the pump can't process the transaction as accurately as the computer inside the store--yet can calculate purchases to the nth cent.:eyes:

Edited to add:
FWIW, I drive a car that gets 34 miles to the gallon because I cannot afford to put $50 in the tank at a time. My car takes about $20. So that "hold" is 2 1/2 tanks of gas for me. Yet I get no interest on my money that they "borrow" for 3 days.

[aikoaiko]

51. overdraft fees suck, but having your check bounce is worse.

These fees are probably worth it. At least they were for me when I ran short.

[EFerrari]

52. The fees sure are worth it to the banks who are bleeding their customers dry.

[aikoaiko]

58. yes, they benefit too, of course

[shimmergal]

57. I'm dealing with this event right now--

Apparently there was a actual overdraft of under $4, and by the time I found out about it and could do anything, the fees had cascaded up to about $263. I'm trying to put together a letter requesting they reverse some of them... I can't bring myself to call; I always get out-argued in such a situation on the phone. Then I'm likely to lose my temper which makes ME look like the irresponsible one.

So what's your advice? My daughter says I should grovel; I think I have to let them know how unreasonable I think it is. Although I can do so nicely, in writing. It iS true that by the time I've paid my rent and car payment, it leaves me with almost nothing with which to even buy food and gas for the rest of the month.

also, does anyone know where I can find that article about the Australian bank that's reducing their overdraft fees to $9? I think I saw it somewhere on DU a few days ago.

And what's the Congressional Committee that deals with regulation of consumer finance like this? Is that Barney Frank's committee, or does it just handle mortgage law? Whoever does, I'm definitely planning to write and send details if I don't get any satisfaction from the bank.

Not to mention, as soon as this mess is straightened out, I'm going to look for a credit union where money from a savings acct. can just be applied. Not that this happens often to me.

Worse come to worse, at least we're lucky here in Las Vegas. You can make arrangements to cash your paycheck at a casino, free, and just take the cash out. It's certainly handier to have a bank & checking account, but it's not worth almost $300 a year in unjust charges. (Of course the casino figures you'll put some of that money back in their machines. But you don't have to!)

[anigbrowl]

63. Easy. Write it down, then go to a branch

Talk to a branch manager (get seated first). They'll (maybe) tell you to call the customer service people. Refuse. Get the manager to call. Just stay put, be very polite, don't raise your voice, but say 'theft' and 'dishonesty' a lot. Be prepared to spend up to an hour arguing.

[Cetacea]

74. Bank of America has reduced their fee to 10.00 for under 5.00 IFs

Or maybe it's under $10.00. Either way, they must be feeling the heat from the Justice Department to suddenly drop their fees by twenty-five dollars.

I would tell them what BOA is doing and how unreasonable they are being. I would also call rather than write and ask to speak to a supervisor.

[Balbus]

66. These fees can be avoided...

Contact your bank and opt-out of overdraft protection. It is a scam, but it a scam you can choose not to participate in.

[Balbus]

67. dupe

[EFerrari]

68. That doesn't kill the fees, in fact, it just sets you up for more.

[Balbus]

71. Yes, it does kill the fees, and no, it doesn't sent you up for more.

[EFerrari]

73. Having no OD protection makes it easier for them to cook your account.

[Balbus]

75. You don't know what overdraft protection is.

Simply put, without overdraft protection, if you don't have enough funds to cover the transaction, the bank will deny that transaction - no fees, no cooking, or anything else, except maybe a little bit of embarrassment at the checkout line when the cashier says, "I'm sorry, you're bank is denying the transaction.."

[EFerrari]

79. Not any more. The bank lets the transaction go through

so they can charge you $35 a pop for each transaction that overdraws your account.

You did read the word BILLIONS in the OP?

Let me repeat that: their new strategy is not to deny your transaction but to let it go so they can charge you OD fees.

[CBGLuthier]

98. and you can opt out of that

Letting it go through and charging the fee is "overdraft protection"

You may opt out of that process. That is still in your control. If your bank will not let you opt out I would find a real bank to do business with.

I had to replace a debit card recently and they dared to try to sign me back up for this OD bullshit. I told them I would close all my accounts and walk out on the spot if they ever offered that to me again.


I agree 100% the banks practice are on the edge of criminal.

That said I have not paid a single fee to a bank in well over 15 years. I watch my accounts like a hawk and do not write checks. Why the hell anyone still writes checks is a mystery to me.

[Rex]

101. Oh please, banks can do what ever they want to.

:eyes:

[Wednesdays]

107. Vito and Vinnie can do whatever they want to, too.

[reflection]

105. Here is a lawsuit against BoA which was settled

http://www.clossonsettlement.com/PDFs/FinalSettlementAgreement.pdf

Page 5 refers to the practice of high-to-low transaction posting. Bank of America denied all claims of such but felt it was in their best interest to settle.

Applying the Michael Jackson standard of settling cases, we can conclude that BoA was stone cold guilty of the process, right?


(edit for sp)

[Wednesdays]

106. K&R

:kick:

[JNelson6563]

108. Yep, there's gonna be blood in the streets one of these days.

I have been hearing many people grumbling very loudly about this. It's out of control. One of these days, all these folks who are being stretched too thin are going to snap. Gonna be ugly.

Julie