Why what Imus said does not matter.

[Neshanic]

Last time I looked on cable, MTV MTV2 BET and other networks freely show videos of women on music videos with lyrics using the taboo words such as "nigger, whore, slut", and also the lyrics include violence rough rape-bordering sex.

So now Imus who has not been funny in many years, but can claim he is morning show jock that does wild and zany things, from the time I listened to him YEARS ago in New Jersey, he's being taken to the woodshed.

Well let's get it all taken care of in one session on the MSM shrink couch. It all sucks but you can't call out one guy for making a joke that sucked, but a joke all the same, when 7 year olds are watching college "girls" shake it like a "whore" on MTV's numerous shows. Also the last time I checked current popular music, faggot is the word of the day, and nobody says shit about that, Eminem, and others use faggot all the time.

He's a bad comedian, He's old and past his game. What Stern said about him is all true. He thinks he's some sage political wise man now and he's not. He's delusional. He's past his game, He's a moron. He is not a bigot.

What he said though was a bad comedy try. So if you think otherwise, you indignant PC police, you better start at Viacom and work your way down, because what Imus said as a bad joke, pales in comparison to the women hating visuals/homosexual hate that accompany music that's blasted trough your lovely cable system...and they are not kidding. For them it's no joke.

[DainBramaged]

1. You will be vilified for speaking with grace and intelligence

Well said. Nothing will be done about MTV, disparaging Rap music, or "approved" content. But the old man must be punished.

Be well

[Morgana LaFey]

94. I missed the grace and intelligence part, but I sure got my fill

of racism and sexism being okay, especially in the service of a JOKE.

Some people don't remember -- or never knew, perhaps -- that one of the key ways Nazi propaganda vilified and demeaned the Jews, which then enabled them to do what they did to the Jews, was through "humor" and ridicule.

Jokes that are racist, sexist, homophobic and otherwise bigoted are NOT okay. Not if they're funny jokes, not if they're unfunny jokes. The intent behind such remarks -- to be funny or not -- doesn't matter. The results are ALWAYS the same and that it that it normalizes and promotes hatred.

And, if I need to repeat myself: that's NOT okay.

[DemBones DemBones]

103. I'm with you. Are there other people guilty of the same things as Imus?

Yes. And they should be axed or clean up their acts pronto.

One of the Rutgers players, Heather Zurich said it well "Our moment was taken away. Our moment to celebrate our success, our moment to realize how far we had come both on and off the court, as young women. We were stripped of this moment by the degrading comments made by Mr. Imus last Wednesday."

Amazing how many WHITE MEN don't get why this is an issue. Some BLACK MEN, too.

How would they feel if their wives, girlfriends, sisters, mothers were referred to as "hos"???


And did you hear that today, on the air, I-mess referred to Rev. Sharpton as "Rev. Hargis," a politically incorrect character from old Imus shows?

Stick a fork in him!

[Morgana LaFey]

111. So true and perfectly said

And ThAT is precisely what's behind the sexism. It's intent is absolutely, positively to put the women down -- put them in their places:

One of the Rutgers players, Heather Zurich said it well "Our moment was taken away. Our moment to celebrate our success, our moment to realize how far we had come both on and off the court, as young women. We were stripped of this moment by the degrading comments made by Mr. Imus last Wednesday."

And NO WOMAN IS IMMUNE. If ANY woman can be treated this way with impunity, ANY woman can. We see it here on DU -- the rightwing women we don't like are vilified and degraded and demeaned on the basis of their sex, sexuality and gender, NOT on substantive issues. People will call Coulter names -- gender slurs!! -- instead of criticize all the horrible things she is and does. And it's all allowed, or too much of it.

BTW, I saw bits and pieces of the press conference today and was VERY impressed with these amazing young women.

[BlameCanada12]

2. It's called 'Hypocrisy', and 'Political Correctness'.

Everybody just ignore that giant elephant in the room, nothing to see here...Move on.

[Connie_Corleone]

9. No one is ignoring a damn thing.

You're the ones who ignored it until one of your own got caught spewing racist crap.

Quick! Bring up the rappers to deflect attention from Imus!

[Bake]

69. "One of your own"????

I thought we DUers were supposed to be united, but I see from your comment that there's still an "us vs. them" mentality, even here.

Very enlightened. And enlightening.

Bake

[jobycom]

16. If you are refering to what the OP said, I agree. If you are referring to the protest of Imus

you are wrong. I can't tell from your post which you mean, though.

[The Count]

52. Funny you should mention an elephant next to "political correctness"

You don't even realize how right you are - yeah, they are part of the GOP propaganda infrastructure. The term "PI" was branded as a pejorative by THEIR think tanks to allow them to be vicious racists with impunity and paint decent people as "prudes"and themselves as 'irreverent". They plunged lots of money in finding moral justifications for their ugliness.
Enlightening how many DU-ers buy it!

[jollyreaper2112]

63. you spelt it wrong

hiphopcrisy

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Neshanic]

4. Really? You must not have cable.

[devilgrrl]

7. No. I just don't watch that shit on MTV...

in fact, I had no idea that it was still on the air.

[mzmolly]

110. Unfortunately most of our children do watch "that shit."

:(

[Connie_Corleone]

5. You're not listening carefully to the music stations.

They cut out the offensive words in the music videos. They're cut out on commercial radio too.

What makes you think that people are not calling out these rappers using those terms? Prominent people have blasted the rappers for their portrayals of women. The local black talk radio I listen to discuss it all the time. It's not their fault that it doesn't get coverage in the big media.

Besides, Imus will stay on the radio just like the rappers who disrespect black women will stay on. They're money makers for the corporations.

[Neshanic]

11. Yes, cutting "whore" from a video of a woman getting slapped by someone

really degrades the image. Nickelodeon should show these sanitized videos, they are so benign.

[Connie_Corleone]

15. Yes. Ignore the rest of my post.

I told you about what people in the black community are saying about rap music that demean women.

But, you choose to ignore the rest of my post, so you can hang onto your strawman all you want. I could care less.

[Neshanic]

37. I am not ignoring you, but the record companies and rappers are.

[FredScuttle]

90. name the video

go ahead

[cloudbase]

6. Rev. Al

doesn't exactly have the integrity to be calling anybody on the carpet.

[Lex]

8. Hahaha. I just love how people are now concerned about rap music lyrics

and other people's usage of the n-word now that Imus said what he said.

Typical and transparent.

[mzmolly]

113. It's not simpy rap music. However Sharpton mentioned the issue as well.

http://www.arte-sana.com/articles/violent_lyrics.htm

MISOGYNST LYRICS ARE NOT EXCLUSIVE TO A PARTCULAR GENRE

Research has shown that males who listen to heavy metal music endorse more stereotypical, negative attitudes toward women that men who listen to easy-listening music.

(St. Lawrence, J.S. & Joyner, D.J. (1991). The Effects of Sexually Violent Rock Music on Male’s Acceptance of Violence Against Women. Psychology of Women Quarterly, 15, 49-63)

A study in 1995 demonstrated that males who were exposed to violent "gangsta rap" videos (i.e., videos replete with images of shootings, beatings, etc.):

 expressed a greater acceptance of violence
 reported a higher probability that they would take part in violence, in comparison than adolescents in a control group
 possessed more acceptance of violence toward women, in comparison with those in the control condition

[dogday]

10. One does not justify the other, but having said that

If we are going to address one, it is time also time to address the other...

[Neshanic]

12. Thank you. In the wild frenzy, some ignore the obvious.

[msongs]

22. the illiteratti will claim their smut is sacred while your smut is....bad

some people who make millions of dollars denigrating their mothers, sisters, and girlfriends hos and bitches are bad while others who do it are....credits to society and upstanding contributors to the welfare of humanity.

one radio idiot is being correctly condemned and denigrated for comments while hundreds of others who say the same thing in a more insidious manner go unchastised, are rewarded, or sell cars on tv commercials.


Msongs
www.msongs.com

[AngryOldDem]

45. Thank you

Ever since this shit started, I've been trying to find a way to say this. If it's not "okay" in one segment of the population, then it should not be "okay" in another. A good example of this are racial slurs. I think excusing the use of any kind of denegrating, racist language by making a distinction of "limited community use" as opposed to "widespread community use" just perpetuates the double standard -- and the use of the slur. If it is offensive in one context, it should be offensive in ALL contexts.

One more thing. Yes, lyrics are sanitized on MTV, etc., but the images are still there, and message is still being sent loudly and clearly.

[JuniperLea]

84. And when you buy the album...

All the words are there. iPods, MP3 players... all spewing the same smut.

[Kickin_Donkey]

118. Apples and oranges ...

The people using n*gger in rap videos are black. Don Imus, who is white, is denigrated blacks with his comment. That is a world of difference. It's in-group vs. out-group.

[dogday]

132. Thats a racist statement there...

If Al Sharpton had called them the same Imus did, it would of been ok?


Racist as hell on your part...

[Arkansas Granny]

51. I agree with your remarks that talk of this nature is not acceptable

and should not be tolerated from any source. The only way to stop this kind of trash talk is to protest it any time we see or hear it whether that amounts to boycotting a product, informing advertisers of your displeasure or demanding apologies from the people who make these remarks. It won't stop until we make it stop.

[JuniperLea]

83. The voice of reason, as always, dogday

Calling people names is so third grade. And this is where third graders get their disgusting ammo... just about everywhere, sadly.

[dogday]

86. You can tell people they can't say this and they can't

say that.. You can fire them, chastise them, whatever...

But the challenge to change must come from within...

Otherwise they are all just nice racists not saying the words, but still feeling the feelings....

[JuniperLea]

87. You can't change people's beliefs...

by hitting them over the head with your own. I think a lot of this is very counter productive. We see it in politics all the time. We can show those in Freeperville the error of their ways, but that only serves to make them stronger in their feelings. I'm betting that Imus, and any rapper who has been called on the carpet for their stupidity, will shut up momentarily, but they can't wait to issue a great big F YOU to their detractors.

[Kickin_Donkey]

120. But you can change their behavior ...

At one time, use of the word nigger in mainstream America was acceptable. But the users of that word got hit over the head, metaphorically speaking, for using it. Now, fortunately, that word is no longer socially acceptable.

And comparing Imus to rappers is a false analogy. If you can't see the difference, you're either ignorant, disingenuous, or racist.

[dogday]

130. Nobody did that

You are the only one....

You are purposely inciting and it stinks....

Read my original post... I say one does not justify the other, that means that what Imus did was wrong... But now that we are exposing all the racists statements, it is time to bring them all out into the open for dicussion...

Stop twisting mine and everyone else's words here....

[earth mom]

97. Exactly. Anyone-black, white or purple-that spews that kind of crap should be called out for it.

To not do so is absolutely hypocritical.

[mzmolly]

116. Absolutely.

:hi:

[mzmolly]

114. Indeed.

Agreed.

[Kickin_Donkey]

119. What a BS parallel.

The people using n*gger in MTV videos are black. Imus was offending another racial group.

You're using a strawman to deflect criticism from Imus; why, I don't know.

[dogday]

129. No Kickin Donkey

You have floated from thread to thread calling people racists.. Good long time DU members and I am calling you on it now... Stop your shit...

I said there was no excuse for what Imus said...

I did say having addressed Imus, we now need to address other groups who do the same...

Now that makes sense... Your strawman argument makes no sense except to inflame and incite...

Good day to you sir....

[MedleyMisty]

13. You can't have it both ways

If we should be upset about sexist images in popular culture, then we should also be upset about sexist comments like the one Imus made. One is not different from the other. Both are indicative of how pervasive racism and sexism are in our society.

Prejudice is not a joke. Period. And come on, everyone knows complaining about "political correctness" is code for closet prejudice.

[Neshanic]

19. Oh yes, I am a bigot gay man. Everyone knows PC= closet predjudice.

[Connie_Corleone]

21. Not speaking of you personally, but there are bigoted gay men.

It's a big problem in my city. So, it's not so uncommon.

[Neshanic]

29. Yikes, you must live in Roy Cohn Estates.

[Connie_Corleone]

36. Cincinnati.

[jonnyblitz]

58. CT gay.com chat room was FULL of rich,white, racist rightwing

gay ASSHOLES when I used to go there. I fought with them all the time. they were as vile as an straight white bigot guy.

[mzmolly]

115. Indeed, Sharpton said the same thing.

You can't critique current music and not Imus or visa versa. I take issue with what Imus said, but at least he apologized. M and M just calls it 'art' and it's ok?

[jobycom]

14. Winner of today's "You'd do it for Randolph Scott!" Award.

The right wing trots out their straw man rap image every time a white guy goes racist. It's an exact echo of saying "People are murdered in US cities everyday and no one cares, so it doesn't matter how many people died in our Iraqi invasion." It's a non-sequitur.

Not to mention that many of the black leaders, like Sharpton, who are condemning Imus also condemn the type of rap you are talking about. So what you are in essence telling people like Sharpton is "Even though you've protested the message of sexist rap lyrics and videos for years, you are wrong to protest what Imus said because of that music we white folk didn't listen to you about." (and I'm not commenting one way or the other on my opinion of the rap music red herring).

What Imus said has the majority of African Americans outraged. What you just said is that their outrage is uninformed and beneath our concern as a nation. Sorry, but I can't think of a nice word to describe that attitude.

You may be right. What Imus said may not matter. And that is the death of the last vestiges of America, if it is true. In a decent nation, it must matter.

[Neshanic]

25. Well Al's outrage sure put a dent in the violence aginst women and faggot lyrics.

God, I can't remember when I saw something like that. Oh wait, the TV is off.

And since when do the "artists" claim free speech concerning their lyrics, and videos, and Imus can't make a joke? A bad joke, but he has no free speech?

I love when the defense of popular culture icons, music, and film come running to beat down the door, when listening/watching women getting beaten and called whores in videos and death to homsexuals in song lyrics loaded on the Ipod attached to their skull.

[ellacott]

32. That's a pretty shallow defense

You are right, Al's outrage hasn't made a huge impact yet. C. Dolores Tucker died fighting the same issues. It must show you that it is a much deeper issue. He has free speech. Where do you get this from? His free speech has consequences. There was a college that cancelled an appearance by a rap group because they didn't like their lyrics. What's the difference?

I criticize Imus and the rappers along with the violent tv shows and movies.

[Neshanic]

34. Well then we agree. I just am pointing out the forest, not the tree.

[jobycom]

64. Read my post and respond to it, don't just restate your point and think you've said something.

My point stands. Rap music has not one damn thing to do with what Imus said. It's not a defense of Imus, it's not a condemnation of Imus, it has nothing to do with Imus or what he said. Respond to THAT, not to the voices in your head telling you you are right.

[Neshanic]

98. What rappers say is directly related to what Imus said.

How?

Oh SHUT UP! I am talking now!

That was not directed at you but the voices in my head....

Ok...it seems to me rappers are rather pouplar. So popular in fact that school kids sing parts of the songs at a very young age. Matter of fact, I have heard it, and not the voices in my head. Things about your mothers a ho, your mama's so fat, she's such a ho that..you know. Actually there is a show on the Tiffany Network's MTV that is nothing but a contest of debasing others in style, and they get awarded for it.

Back to the rappers.

The songs lyrics run the gamut from gangstas, dealing, rough sex, whores, pimps, to fag killing and Eminem's disturbing fantasy of doing bad things to his mother.

It's all there, on music awards shows, and it is now the language of courseness that we all are subjected to. Imus in his bizzare need to be hip, thought that if it's out there. all of it, 24-7, and rappers calling women whores, then he could joke about it.

The problem is that his bad joke was the joke that was in search of publicity. Odd how there were no rappers behind the people at the press conference or the Rutgers circus. It was a bad joke, from an old shock jock.

By their conspicuous abscence in this whole affair, it's the proof that rappers had a big part in this, and how it's come to be, and the sorry place we find ourselves.

[jobycom]

124. So you're honestly arguing that Imus doesn't know any better than to call

a group of student athletes "nappy headed hoes" because rap music does it? I understand your argument, but it's just weak. You could say that because gay men call each other the F word, Ann Coulter was justified hurling the word at John Edwards. Hell, you could argue that since movies have so much violence in them, Bush was justified in invading Iraq and slaughtering hundreds of thousands of innocent people.

Imus has to stand on his own actions. If you're troubled by rap music, that's a completely different topic for discussion, and one that I'm sure would start long and angry threads of its own. But rap music is no excuse for what Imus did, and whether Imus should continue to be paid by a major news network to hurl more racial and sexist slurs at people has nothing to do with anything other than Imus and his disgusting abuse of these kids--well, and his own admission that he'd probably do more of it in the future.

[Neshanic]

126. Weak as it being the lauguage of courseness that pervades our lives now.

Blame Canada?

[ellacott]

17. So you're saying since everyone else is doing it Imus should do it too

Everyone is abusing children so I guess "Joe" abusing a child is no big deal.

People have been speaking out about those things for years but the problem is the media will not focus on these protests. Just like the media doesn't focus on many issues talked about on this forum.

There is no way to justify calling anyone, national tv, a nappy headed ho. Why is this hard for so many of you to understand.

[Cha]

82. Yeah, 60,000 Wrongs do not

make a right.

Fire imus' ass and let him whine about being made an example of and maybe that will open the discussion of "The Examples"!

[Pacifist Patriot]

18. Good thing I can multi-task.

I'm perfectly capable of advocating Imus' dismissal AND boycott and lobby companies like Viacom for the eradication of their misogyny and racism.

[ellacott]

20. I wish more people were like you.

:)

[The Count]

57. Yup. And walking, and chewing gum while doing that. The straw men on this thread

are only obscured by the finger pointing.
In short, other people's shortcomings/actions are never a defense for one's own.
Imus racism/sexism stands on its own.
Whatever else is wrong with the media, society, the players in this case, do not mitigate his responsibility.
Nice try, though.

[Pacifist Patriot]

70. Is your last line directed at me? Preaching to the choir there I'm afraid.

[DainBramaged]

23. Hmmm, Don Imus must go, Glenn Beck and Fox Network, ok

no problem. Rush Limbaugh, he can stay too. Bill O'Liely, he's ok too. Michael Savage, no problem. Ann Coulter, she can spew forever.

It's ALL bullshit people. Condemn and fire them all, stop being selective because the old man is an easy target.

[ellacott]

24. Who in the world said any of those people should stay?

No one said anything close to that.

How the heck is he an easy target?

[DainBramaged]

28. When did Jessie Jackson or Rev. Al protest any of them?

When was the last time the members of Du called for the ouster of any of the above listed with the fervor they are calling for the hanging of Don Imus?

Moderation, something I have noticed is missing from DU lately.

[ellacott]

62. You must be kidding?

They have protested and many people here have called for the ouster of many of these people, most notably, Ann Coulter.

[DainBramaged]

80. And are they STILL in the mainstream media? You bet they are.

[Pacifist Patriot]

73. Please tell me you are joking. I can't imagine anyone missing the...

outrage and activism present here at DU and with Jackson and Sharpton. How many times have we bombarded the media with calls for Coulter's and Limbaugh's heads on a platter? I'm not kidding, just very confused. Where have you been?

[DainBramaged]

78. Have you had their heads?

Limpballs and Coluter are WAY more dangerous than that old man, stop and think. Neither Jackson or Sharpton deserve the stature they are afforded. Those whom I respect aren't on TV lapping up the publicity but condemning Imus with editorials or simple statements of commendation.

[americanstranger]

30. Utterly false dichotomy.

You're saying that if someone is upset about Imus, that means they can't or won't be upset about either hip-hop lyrics or MTV or Limbaugh or Coulter.

In case you haven't noticed, people here have been taking action against Limbaugh and Fox et al for years.

Or am I just imagining an online community that's been writing letters to the editor and signing petitions protesting the unfairness in the media since I joined?

- as

[DainBramaged]

33. One more time, has your efforts made a difference?

Why is this time special?

[Pacifist Patriot]

35. Have they made a difference this time?

[americanstranger]

40. Well, gee, I can remember an old web site of mine

that cost Limbaugh about a half-dozen sponsors through a boycott we did once. I remember that the efforts of that site, Take Back The Media, got me and my partner Mike Stinson on a few cable shows to boot.

So, yeah, I've seen results.

You?

- as

[Pacifist Patriot]

72. May I take this opportunity to thank you for your activism?

Thank you.

[americanstranger]

75. No need to thank me.

We were just doing what people here do every day. Just had more of a platform from which to do it, for a time at least.

- as

[Connie_Corleone]

44. Michael Savage was taken off TV due to people voicing their outrage.

[DainBramaged]

79. No, his ratings were crap. Less people watched than watch Tucker

Is he still on the radio? I need not ask, he is.

[americanstranger]

95. But what triggered his show being dropped?

Wasn't it something along the lines of saying 'I hope you get AIDS and die' to a caller? Didn't he call that caller a 'Sodomite?'

Why, yes, he did.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=michael+savage+MSNBC&btnG=Google+Search

They most certainly did not drop him for poor ratings. His show was only on for a few weeks when he was fired.

- as

[DainBramaged]

81. NOTHING has changed, BOTH are still broadcasting

I'm not hallucinating!

[americanstranger]

96. So, what do you suggest?

You're making a lot of noise about them still being on the air, despite people protesting them for years.

What's your suggestion?

- as

[DemBones DemBones]

105. No. Imus goes, then the others go, unless they have the smarts

to watch their mouths and stop being crude, rude, incivil, insulting, arrogant, etc.

It's amazing how many WHITE MEN don't get this and think Imus should keep his job. People who are in a position where they should know that supporting him is going to hurt them.

Is Imus going to be homeless, eating at a soup kitchen after being fired? Hardly. No doubt he'll get a book deal, which ought not to happen, but likely will. And he'll still be peddling his "green" products, not telling anyone that the only "green" cleaning products anyone needs are baking soda, vinegar, and water.

[cboy4]

26. Apples and oranges. He's a bigot. It's time to stop allowing people

to hide behind the shield of comedy after they make bigoted and racists comments.

[terisan]

27. What is your problem with any woman standing up to a rich white guy who

calls women ugly, demeaning names on public radio waves-scarce radio waves supposed to be owned by all the people and just licensed to a particular company ?

Your concern for Imus is your personal issue. You have every right to identify with Mr. Imus, sympathize with him, or personally excuse his comments. I have every right to oppose his nastiness toward women.

If CBS wants to hire people to spew hatred at women, they can----but let them do it on their own private property or corporate property, not airwaves belonging to the public.


I don't care whether Imus is a bigot or not. He can say whatever he wants in his living room, on the street, He can get work at a comedy club and people who like his brand of humor can go listen to him.

[Neshanic]

31. You also can change channels. Us gay guys do it.

[Connie_Corleone]

39. Sure you do.

So the next time a right winger on TV tells a gay man he hopes he gets AIDS and die, gay people shouldn't protest. They should just shut up about it and change the channel.

Yeah, okay. LOL!!

[Neshanic]

46. What do you want me to do, complain to the DLC? Oh wait...

My parties two "front runners" have quite interesting views on gay rights.

It's don't ask me, because I walking a tightrope here!

[DemBones DemBones]

107. I think most people were outraged by Savage's comments,

not just gay men, and complained so that Savage was fired.

But women and blacks are fair game and should "get over" this "joke."

"He apologized."

"Move on."

It's time to stop all the crude, rude, bigoted speech. Imus is the tipping point. Others will fall, too, unless they make big changes in their "humor." Humor should be funny, not offensive. Is it OK to poke fun at public figures and groups of people. Sure, up to a point, particularly when public figures are the victims of the "jokes." They have chosen to be in public life. College athletes haven't made that choice. Five of the girls were only freshmen. They were good athletes, not criminals. Why make such a crude remark about them?

Short answer: Imus has gone way past the point of decency for years.

[terisan]

42. You are missing the point, we are supposed to Own the public airwaves

CBS is merely a licensee. They can change their venue, Imus can change his----of course neither may make as much money as they can with their current license, which is why they are hopping to suspend him and he is agreeable.

You can be nostalgic for old Don all you want---you want to listen to his crap about Jews and women buy his tapes of past shows. I want to hear some radio I enjoy. Imus is squatting on prime real estate radio. Let him move upstate and broadcast on one of those low-signal stations.

[BlooInBloo]

38. Ah yes... the Fineman defense: racism + sexism = just bad comedy...

DUers slay me.

[Neshanic]

43. Thank you. I don't make up the facts, I just report em'.

One day watching music videos any alien would come to the conclusion that the females of the species are things.

Love is a violent thing.

The females sell their sex.

Imus made a joke. Really. Eminem sells millions and is not joking. Really.

[BlooInBloo]

49. You guys should formalize it - just create the "fair and balanced" wing of DU.

[Neshanic]

50. The paradox of it all. Gay, liberal, open minded, but point out poular culture

treatment of women and gays, and you are a FOX infiltrator.

The feeding frenzy continues.

[americanstranger]

53. Pot, kettle, etc.

Didn't you post something upthread that pretty much accused people upset about Imus of being fine with Limbaugh and Glenn Beck and Ann Coulter?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=616206&mesg_id=616415

Feeding frenzy, indeed.

- as

[Neshanic]

55. No, I never metioned them, just ultra-violent "whore" videos on cable, and

faggot throwing entertainers.

Want to start there too?

[americanstranger]

56. Oops. Confused you with a different poster. My mistake.

But that accusation has been made in this thread, and it's as goofy as someone calling you a Fox infiltrator.

- as

[OHdem10]

41. There is a whole lotta hypocrisy going on:

What Imus said crossed the line---yes, yes, yes.

There is a reality. American's sense of humor,for the most part, is
one which loves to poke fun at each other. In other words,
we are not into the Queen"s rules for civilty. They are
having fun and do not have evil intentions.

Let's be honest. I am not defendeing Imus's words--everyone
knows they were wrong and crossed even the lowest marker
of civilty. However, Imus has spent 40 some years pushing
the envelop. Imus has an audience. Many Americans therefore
must like and enjoy his brand of humor. How many of us
including the journalist and other Media have almost strangled
on our morning coffee listening to Imus and his humor. People
who listen to Imus or any Radio Talk host--get a secret glee
out hosts who say things they(listeners) dare not say.
I see a bit of hypocrisy when many of those criticizing
and calling for Imus"s Scalp--love to do their own brand
of poking fun at others. We all do it. I am not saying
Imus deserves a complete pass, but nor does he deserve
to br burned at the stake. $0 years of this pushing
edge stick--Imus pokes fun at everyone . Crossing the
Line deserves punishment but not destruction.

Sure there Americans who do not like this humor--they
do not watch or listen to Imus.

The Companies who have employed Imus over the years
have enjoyed the ratings and therefore, the money
he has brought in.

I have a problem with anyone who tries to get anyone
fired. This crosses a line in my mind. I do not
think O"Reilly is correct to try to get people
fired when he thinks they have wrong opinions
and then goes ater their employers. The same
goes for Imus.

Everyone who wants to--has the right to criticize
Rosie O'Donnells comments. Likewise everyone who
who wants to has the right to criticize Imus.
The Employer has the right to determine how they
will handle each situation.

In the end you cannot argue taste.

It would behoove us all to remember:
There is so much good in the worst of us
and so much bad in the best of us
that it hardly behooves any of us
to talk about the rest of us.








t

[terisan]

47. Yeah he has an audience and the person who replaces him will have a bigger audience.

.....and they will do it without the anti-women, anti-Jew jokes.

[The Count]

48. How magnanimous of you to not mind - me thinks you're not black or a woman

so, it didn't bother YOU. I am thinking, posting it here, you also think of yourself as "brave" :eyes:

To me, racism, sexism are personally offensive- not because they are directed at me - but they offend my sense of decency. The airwaves are ours and I say this ugly hatred doesn't belong there.

[Neshanic]

54. No, not brave, just gay. I think some gay guys are the bravest I know.

More brave than indivduals that go for the easy, than the ones that endure being degraded every day in poular culture.

[The Count]

59. As someone who has endured prejudice, you should be more atuned to the

way it affects people.
I suppose you decided to develop a thick skin for survival and now expect others to do the same...It was your coping mechanism. Demanding it from others sounds a bit like "raise yourselves by the bootstraps" besides the immoral enabling of the bullies.

[Neshanic]

61. No sometimes a joke is a joke. His sucked. The national nannies..

decided that this would be the issue. He's and easy target because he's a creepy moron.

It still was a joke.

[Kickin_Donkey]

122. It was a RACIST joke ...

What don't you get? Outrage over racism is not being a nanny or PC. It's the right to do.

[The Count]

128. IT WAS NOT A JOKE! IT WAS A SLUR!!!!Coulter, Limpballs all say "it was a joke" when caught.

[Neshanic]

60. I have to go now. So I will not be accused of starting a flame war...

I am going to work. It's a large late-modern building that was remodeled and is elegant and quite beautifull. The people I work with vary, and during the course of the day, I will hear faggot at least once, and a gay reference at least once. Also I will hear the sexist joke.

I use the "Blazing Saddles" test on if they get called out on it. It's just my little way of knowing a joke, and what's not meant a joke.

Rappers that want to strangle women amd kill gays is not a joke.

An old past his game, lame ass disc jockey that thinks he's a cowboy, well he tried to make a joke. If Stern said it, if a hot comedian said it, there would not be the national freak out. It was an easy target moron. Imus.

I will be back after work, so feel free...

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

65. Rappers that want to strangle women amd kill gays is not a joke.

No, but claiming rappers want to strangle women and kill gays because those are lyrics in a song is a joke. A bad joke. Oh, and btw, Johnny Cash never actually shot a guy in Reno, just to watch him die.

"well he tried to make a joke."

Shit, even Imus isn't dumb enough to say that.

[philosophie_en_rose]

67. Stephen King has killed a lot of fictional people too.

:bounce:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

77. Romeo and Juliet was child pornography.

:crazy:

[FredScuttle]

92. Neil Simon was an early advocate of same sex marriage in "The Odd Couple"

And don't get me started on Uncle Miltie in the Carmen Miranda outfit.

[AngryOldDem]

88. I don't think anyone will accuse you of that

If they take issue with what you said, that's on them. Thanks for starting the discussion -- it is needed.

[philosophie_en_rose]

66. Why what George W.Bush does not matter.

You see, there are also examples of lying asshat warmongering idiots in other countries.

Therefore, nothing W does matters. If something evil is pervasive, then you can't be against it.

And, music and comedy routines rooted in angst from a history of racism, poverty, and oppression are exactly like privileged white guys calling college-educated athletes nappy-headed hos. exactly the same!

Won't someone please think of the poor, oppressed white guys!

:sarcasm:
:sarcasm:
:sarcasm:
:sarcasm:

[2bfree]

68. What bothers me about the whole "Imus" thing is.....

These young women were not "shaking it like a whore" on MTV, they had just won the championship basketball game. They should have been praised for a job well done and not treated in such a misogynistic, racist way. I don't like the hip-hop either but my guess is that if Imus was talking about a rap video instead of a college basketball team no one would have paid him much attention.

[Pacifist Patriot]

71. Small quibble.

They actually lost the championship game. ;)

But I still agree with you. Praise and congratulations are all that were necessary.

[BronxBoy]

76. And why even bother to make a joke about it???

What in that situation just cried out that this was a comedy generating moment.

I think I'm getting old and senile for I have forgotten what funny is.

Woe is me

[Bluedogvoter]

74. Why I don't care to raise a fuss over what he said.

There are more important things going on than what some washed up hack has to say.

For instance the Stem Cell legislation that is happening currently. The war in Iraq. I could care less about what Imus says in comparison.

[Kickin_Donkey]

123. There are a lot of important issues in America ...

health care, Iraq ... and racism. Race is one of the central issues of American. That's what makes what he said important.

If you're not willing to stand up to racism, maybe you don't belong on this board.

[LanternWaste]

85. You believe...?

You believe that his critics must start at Rap music and work their way down? What's the precise and relevant detail that prevents someone from criticizing both at the same time? Why do you believe that it must be done one-by-one in a linear fashion?

Also, what prevents me from calling it bigotry despite the fact that other forms of racism, sexism and degradation are being aired simultaneously?

As I see it, one can be offended by multiple things and on multiple levels at the same time despite whether we voice our concerns about A rather than B, or B rather than C. And, so you don't lose all respect for the intelligence of those who call Imus a bigot (and those you call "indignant PC police"), some people can actually be offended by, and take action against A, B *and* C regardless of whether you see it or take note of it.

[KingFlorez]

89. Rappers have been doing it for years and people have been speaking up

It's pretty much an ongoing battle about that, but people do complain. Just because rappers say certain things, does not mean Imus wasn't wrong and it doesn't mean he's not a bigot.

[Bluebear]

91. Rap music /MTV not comparable. That is fictional "entertainment".

These young women are real human beings who were the target of what you call bad comedy.

[Forkboy]

93. One doesn't preclude or excuse the other.

What Imus said does matter.

[mzmolly]

121. I agree.

But I do think we have an opportunity to discuss both on a societal level. And, I hope we will.

Hey FB! :hi:

[Forkboy]

127. Hello back atcha!

:hi:

[omega minimo]

99. You've got the dots. Too bad you can't connect them.

Pointing a finger at "Viacom and work your way down" while pissing on "indignant PC police" is having your :puke: and eating it too.

[Neshanic]

100. How so?

[donco6]

101. That's stupid.

I hate rap music lyrics as well as Imus' on-air racist rantings. All the same to me.

[roguevalley]

102. I call them all out. Just because the spotlight isn't on everyone doesn't

mean one should slip away. I cry bullshit on all of it. And Imus has done this for years. It isn't PC. Its disgust for all of them. One doesn't cancel out the others, or mitigate anything. They all suck and they all need an ass kicking.

[Tom Joad]

104. For most of us, fighting racism is important.

It is not about Imus, in that we agree. It is about fighting racism and bigotry.

[Warren Stupidity]

106. Imus is a hateful old fart.. Celebrate his demise.

He is a rightwing shit and his show is filled with vile rightwing shits and him running the 'its humor' flag up when his vile hatefilled shit smelled too bad for anyone to put up with is just too bad for imus and too lame to bother with. When snoop dog interviews mccain and other mainstream politicians, you might have a point.

[DemBones DemBones]

108. Excellent points, from a poster with a very appropriate user name.

We need a war on stupidity, or more precisely on ignorance and obtuseness, which are behind all the "He apologized, get over it" posts.

:yourock:

[mzmolly]

109. Hear hear! Though I think what he said "matters," I'm glad you mentioned this is a greater issue.

"what Imus said ..., pales in comparison to the women hating visuals/homosexual hate that accompany music that's blasted trough your lovely cable system"

Though, I feel that what Imus said went beyond a "bad joke," it's good to see that someone GETS the fact that the issue doesn't end with him. We have a problem on a societal level that must be addressed. Also, Imus is not influencing our YOUTH like MTV and Joe Francis are thank goodness.

All one can do is hope that the Imus incident will create a necessary dialog that helps change that which you note above.

Added one more recommendation.

Edited for clarification.

[spacelady]

125. It "matters" in a way that hopefully people will turn Imus off and

tune him out as well as people will stop buying crap music with stupid lyrics. It is a freedom of speech issue that has at its heart a slippery slope that firing and FCC stricter rules will not solve.

[lumberjack_jeff]

112. His "humor" is a manifestation of a fucked up culture.

He's not alone.

Jesus Christ, I sound just like my dad.

[Name removed]

117. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[lectrobyte]

131. I've seen people fired from jobs for a whole lot less.