So, if states can have single payer health care, will people "vote with their feet"

[CTyankee]

and move to one of those states?

This idea has begun to evolve in my mind. Here in CT we are losing people; they are moving out of state for a variety of reasons, including lack of jobs and affordable housing. CT might just be one of the states going for SP (if our governor, Mother Rell, would not veto it, or we have a Dem gov. by that time).

Is it possible that our state could get an influx of businesses moving here b/c they would be spared paying health insurance costs of employees? Wouldn't that also happen in other states as well?

I haven't thought this idea through to any conclusion. Just musing about "what ifs" that would go along with having SP health care a state by state option (and one that potentially could lead to the entire country eventually going to SP).

[sharesunited]

1. This would appear to sow the seeds of its own destruction.

An influx like that into single payer states would just add to an unsustainable financial situation for them.

[CTyankee]

2. Yes, I see your point. I am not agreeing that it is a particularly good idea

but if it means that people could get jobs in that state, then more people would be paying taxes into the system and that would be a positive...

[northernlights]

3. Not necessarily -- re-read the OP

Single-payer would lower the cost of doing business for companies that pay health insurance.

The cost of doing business in any given state is *always* a factor when medium and large companies decide where to set up shop.

So states offering single payer would be encouraging businesses to move to their states by lowering their cost to do business, helping them to be more competitive nationally and internationally.

That, in turn, would bring jobs to those states, which then would increase state revenues both through state taxes on business profit and personal income.

So, yes, the ability to offer single-payer provides states with an incentive to do so as an investment.

[CTyankee]

4. Also, we could factor in the ability for people to change jobs w/o fear of losing their health care

insurance. Maybe they would start their own business. CT has a rich history of innovators and tinkerers, people who used to make stuff (New Haven is where the Winchester factory made "the gun that won the west" and Whitney invented his cotton gin here). I believe revolutionary stuff is coming down the pike and not only in so called "green" industry...also innovation and invention in the field of health care...and we have an educated population and great educational institutions (not just Yale...).

[sharesunited]

6. Businesses would surely see it as zero sum or worse.

Employer's share of health insurance premiums gets eliminated as a cost of doing business.

But higher state taxes become necessary to pay for the benefit. After all, the benefit accrues to everybody in the state, regardless of their individual productivity, income level, present condition of their health, etc.

There seems to be a lot of misplaced hope that enough economies can be realized through single payer that taxes will not need to be raised to cover universal care.

Most business people are skeptical of such a claim, and wouldn't want to fall for an apparent relocation incentive as being a potential "roach motel" trap.

[ibegurpard]

7. Of course taxes would have to be raised

what people believe is that the tax increases would be offset by the elimination of insurance premiums.

[sharesunited]

9. Exactly. Zero sum. Or worse. So where is the incentive to relocate?

[CTyankee]

12. A single payer health system has economies of scale that private insurers don't have.

The risk is spread over the entire population. Administrative costs are cheaper (compare Medicare's 2% in admin costs to 16% for private insurance, so that is 14% that is going for paperwork not actual health CARE, a huge waste).

Also, a healthier population costs less than an unhealthy one and is more productive. You have fewer people going to ERs for their health care, saving the system the high cost of providing health care in an urgent care situation (ALWAYS more expensive) rather than preventive care.

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. Riddle me this, exactly how has all the influx

of companies to oh I don't know Ontario, hurt them?

There are days.

SP should be revenue neutral if well designed, and I am sure, from all the studies we've seen, it is.

Now you get companies coming in. That means JOBS, and an increased tax base

I don't know about your world, but in mine this translates to an increased revenue stream for the state.

My math skills are not very good, but this means black not red... just a thought

[RaleighNCDUer]

5. One conclusion:

The red states that reject SP will get redder and poorer, and will stop attracting the businesses that now go to them because of weak labor laws and anti-union policies. A state with SP and strong unions would still be less expensive for a company than a state with no unions, but with business requirements for health insurance.

[DrToast]

8. States with single payer will provide a huge advantage for businesses

If California gets its single payer bill passed, businesses will flood back in. Other states will want to switch just to remain competitive.

[Life Long Dem]

10. More incentive to stay here than to go abroad in the first place.

Idaho or Colorado could be the better investment than overseas.

[stray cat]

11. Holding on to a job is my first vote - so no

[CTyankee]

14. Well, if your job is great then that's fine. I am talking about people

who would want to migrate here to get single payer health care, for a variety of reasons.

One reason I could see is if you were an entrepreneur interested in starting your own business. You could leave your job w/o fear of losing health benefits adn start a company that could attract good job candidates b/c your health care benefits would NOT be a factor in their taking that job.

CT has had its own history of migration from out to state to us because of job opportunities. In the latter part of the 19th and early part of the 20th century New Haven and other cities and towns had vibrant industries making all kinds of things. That brought a lot of people to the state wanting to offer their services and talents. It worked in the past...