Probate, lawyers; what's really going on?

[mojowork_n]

This is an open question.

I'm looking for links or referrals that might help to explain the mysterious process that began when my cousin passed away, a little over a year ago.

I know that I was named in his will and that there's a 5 digit payout with my name on it, but after that everything's pretty much a blank.

Why does all this take so long? Does it benefit the attorneys and estate executor/personal-representative to draw out the whole process as long as possible, to keep drawing interest income on the estate portfolio? Do they accumulate more fees by dragging it all out?

I've been unemployed for waaaay too long and have been waiting for some sort of information since last December, when I was told that the whole probate process would be wrapped up by the end of January.

It's been just one big W-T-F ever since....

[TexasObserver]

1. Could be anything.

You have been designated as a recipient of a specific dollar bequest. There may or may not be the money left to pay that bequest when the dust all settles on this probate case. If you can go to the courthouse and ask the clerk to allow you to see the file, that would help you figure out what is going on.

The estate likely has an executor, someone selected by the deceased. They are in charge of the estate, which is a legal entity, and they would hire the attorney representing the estate. The executor often gets some fee for serving. The attorney gets a fee for working. Both therefore have some economic incentive to drag out a case and draw down fees. That doesn't mean they're doing that, but the incentive is there.

The estate has to pay the costs associated with burial and such. It has to pay all the outstanding bills. It was to ascertain where all the assets are, file an inventory, and appraise or have appraised the assets. Ultimately, it has to sell off assets.

The bigger the estate in dollar value, assets and debts, the longer it takes to sort it all out. The only way to really protect your position is to hire your own lawyer to check it out, make sure your interests are covered, and see to it you have the best shot of getting paid.

[elleng]

2. mojo, I'm not a probate lawyer,

so I can't be specific. The size and complexity of the estate will clearly have an effect on length of the process. I suggest that you contect counsel, explain your situation, and ask them for a straightforward answer.

[abumbyanyothername]

3. Well . . .

when I was told

By whom? Have you tried to contact that person again?

If you have taken this obvious step, I would suggest you look up your local (most counties have one) bar association and call them and ask for a referral.

[mojowork_n]

7. Sorry I didn't fill in all the blanks

...the person that told me was my cousin's sister.

She's still waiting to hear something. Neither of us has received a letter, a phone call or anything since he passed away. I did look up the probate file on the county courthouse website. My cousin's sister received a xerox of page 14 of the will (from my cousin's son), that showed the numbers for both of us, but that's been it, except for useless phone calls.

...It's just not clear to me why I should be thinking about hiring another attorney, to represent my interests, in this whole process.

...Does ANYBODY have any useful links that might help to explain the probate process, and what's really going on?

[abumbyanyothername]

8. It is just not possible for any attorney

It is just not possible for any attorney to give you any useful advice over the internet. Many of us have already risked putting ourselves in an accidental attorney/client relationship.

Google the state bar association of your state. Maybe they have a pamphlet on probate. Talk with your cousin's son, or whoever else the executor is.

But above all, if your are concerned about your rights and the possible violation thereof, consult a licensed attorney in your state and county.

The above is for educational purposes only and does not constitute legal advice. No attorney client relationship should be presumed by the posting of this information to a public discussion board. :-D

[A HERETIC I AM]

9. Link to Wisconsin Probate Law

http://www.legis.state.wi.us/rsb/Statutes.html

Scroll down. Probate law section begins at #351.

(I assume Wisconsin is appropriate because you mention WI in your profile. If the decedent is a resident of another state, that states laws and rules will apply)

[mojowork_n]

10. Thanks for the reply.

I really wasn't looking for specific information about my personal situation.

Laws vary by state, and then naturally, there are the particular conditions, circumstances and bequests made in each individual final testament....

I live in Wisconsin, but my cousin passed away while he was a resident of Ramsey County (St. Paul), Minnesota.

Yadda, yadda, yadda. My main question remains. I wrote:

"...Why does all this take so long? Does it benefit the attorneys and estate executor/personal-representative to draw out the whole process as long as possible, to keep drawing interest income on the estate portfolio? Do they accumulate more fees by dragging it all out?

I have been doing some digging around assorted online Minnesota legal guides, but finding any really helpful advice stops with "you may want to consult an attorney..."

Take this useful paragraph that states:

Probate Court provides a cost-effective and efficient process to transfer ownership of assets from one generation to the next. The Minnesota Legislature has properly insisted that the process is efficient and that most of the assets be available for the benefit of the persons designated in the Will.

That would all be wonderfully reassuring if there didn't seem to be a slight disconnect between those two highlighted phrases (font emphasis added) that suggest -- at least to me -- that there could be some latitude given to the people handling the estate, to be a little bit more or a little bit less "cost-effective and efficient," since their responsibility is only to transfer "most" of the assets of the estate.

...Hasn't anyone written a book about any of this? I found ONE that looked helpful, but it was written quite a long time ago (the 60's or 70's). I lost the URL and haven't been able to google it up, again.

I really don't want to go into any more of my own particulars, but I am a little concerned about the amount of time that's already elpased. I'd like to know if we (my cousin's sister, his 3 kids, me, others) will ever get a full, open accounting of what was in the estate at the time of death, and how much was absorbed by fees, lost interest income, delays, or other hidden costs.

[Missy Vixen]

4. Who's the executor/executrix?

You might want to start there.

As others have already said, the amount disbursed will correspond with what's left of the estate after anyone who's filed against it gets paid off.

As others have already said, you'll need to contact counsel to find out what's happening right now in the process.

-MV
executrix of my mother's estate, and hoping nobody asks me to do so again

[A HERETIC I AM]

5. Were you named as a beneficiary on an IRA?

Or are all the assets in taxable accounts? Or both? Or neither?

If you are named as a beneficiary on an IRA, you have to set up an "FBO" IRA which stands for "For the Benefit Of". The account has to be properly titled as well, such as " XYZ Securities Investments, Inc, C/F John Smith IRA (Deceased) FBO Jim Smith." (C/F = "Custodian For")

As Texas Observer stated, the larger and more complex the estate, the longer it will all take. Trusts, updated wills and Non-Probate Transfer On Death agreements on taxable accounts help to make the transfers easier. If the ducks aren't in a row before death, it can be damned difficult to get them in a row afterward.

[mojowork_n]

11. The ducks were all in a row, maybe even lined up too straightly.

There was an update to the will and a trust, intended to take care of my cousin's wife (who required around the clock care), in the event he preceded her. But it didn't turn out that way. She passed away a few months before he did, so most of that complicated trust mechanism -- intended to provide for her -- was completely beside the point.

That was one of my concerns, actually, that following along with all the provisions of the will and trust (set up just to take care of the spouse) may have set up some sort of stumbling block. It may have perfectly fulfilled the letter of the law, but were there extra steps taken as a result, that weren't of any actual benefit to anyone?

...I know, you can't answer, never mind. Not really looking for guidance as much as I am for general information, to try to make this process seem more transparent than what's currently going on. ("Shut up and wait for your check. You'll get it when we're good and ready." In so many words.)

[mojowork_n]

12. PS

In the interests of full disclosure, I have copies of the will and trust. I mentioned upthread that I've been unemployed for quite a while but the good news is that I will be starting a new job in a couple of weeks. Only there will be some necessary expenses (vehicle costs) when I do go back to work full-time, so I might be looking for a short term loan to jump over that hurdle, and I'm honestly not sure what to tell prospective borrowee's.

[LSdemocrat]

6. I wouldn't count on a quick payout

These things can take months even years, especially if someone out there is challenging the will or some other aspect of the estate.

If you have time, you should be able to go down to the courthouse to the probate court and view the court file, including the will and other filings.

If there looks like there has been a challenge filed, by all means get an attorney. Contact your local bar association, explain your personal financial situation, and they should be able to provide you with an attorney who can work with you at a reasonable cost.