stlsaxman predicts: Michael Jackson Memorial to be THE LAST for a Musical Icon.

[stlsaxman]

It will be the last memorial service of its size and impact for any musician, composer or performer from here on out.

Elvis Presley? check... John Lennon? check... Michael Jackson? check...

I can't honestly think of any other performer/musician who has touched the world as the above three have.

Paul McCartney? nope... Prince? nope... Pete Townsend? nope... Robert Fripp? (heheh i'm kidding- okay???) I will probably go into hiding and weep for a month when any of the above passes away. Though I have a deep and abiding respect for MJ and his works, I haven't felt the need to mourn. Millions have and are. I feel their pain and they have my deepest sympathy. When my musical heroes die their lives won't be celebrated as Elvis, John and Michaels have been- the quantity of mourners won't be as great but the quality of the mourning will be equaled.

Who, if anyone, am I overlooking that will move the world as forcefully upon their deaths?

I do not mean to be so morbid here but it speaks volumes to the legacy of Michael Jackson- The Man, the Singer, the Dancer, the Performer and Composer, the Father and Brother and The Human Being.

[Catherine Vincent]

1. You never know

Maybe 20 or 30 years from now.

[Confusious]

2. ooofffff

I think I threw up in my mouth a little.

[stlsaxman]

4. that's what your heart tastes like.

[Confusious]

7. No, I'm sure it was your post and the burritos for lunch. n/t

[stlsaxman]

18. hehehe i didn't say what caused it. I said your heart's full of bile.

[Confusious]

27. I'm full of bile cause I don't agree with your assessment of Jackson.

OK. Another person so freakish about this whole thing that you'll disparage another person. Whatever.

[stlsaxman]

29. oh- i sowwy- did i huwt youw feewings? so you DO have feelings in there somewhere?

Talk about disparaging- "freakish"? hey pal, i didn't ask you to come onto this thread and make fun of the Opening Post. Please feel free to put me on your ignore list- it would do us BOTH a favor.

oh, and by the way- you misspelled your fuckin' nickname.

[Confusious]

30. No, but I think I touched a nerve

And I didn't misspell the name.

[stlsaxman]

35. if "touching a nerve" is your sole purpose and all you have to offer here...

that's pathetic.

And saying you spelled it correctly speaks volumes.

:rofl:

[roguevalley]

71. I thought the memorial was dignified, tasteful and good. I didn't

expect it. But it was. The children were beautiful and so were the speakers and singers. They did a good job in sending him off. I wish only good things for all concerned now, especially those three kids.

[stlsaxman]

75. Agreed. Agreed 100%... totally surprised me.

Some of the audience screaming "I love you, Michael!!!" was a little embarrassing, but if that was the worst of it- it was a miraculous event.

[WI_DEM]

3. No, somebody else will come along.

[junkiebrewster]

5. I disagree with you on McCartney...

I'm not saying it will happen, but if it does happen again, it will be for Macca.

[stlsaxman]

19. You really think so? yeah he co-wrote some great stuff...

but he also wrote "O-bla-di-o-bla-da".

[muriel_volestrangler]

52. And Jackson wrote "The Girl Is Mine"

which is one of the worst that both of them performed. McCartney managed to keep his name off the writing credits, though, so his judgement could be better at times.

[stlsaxman]

73. Who wrote "Agony And Irony"? er- uh, i mean...

"Ebony And Ivory"... that song's like drinking maple syrup and listening to Kenny G.

sweet enough to throw one into a diabetic coma.

[muriel_volestrangler]

76. That was McCartney, according to Wikipedia

You would expect Stevie Wonder to write better stuff, I guess (though his success in the UK was often in inverse proportion to the quality of the song - "I Just Called To Say I Love You" has been his only sole #1 here, and it's just as dire as Ebony And Ivory).

Wikipedia sums it up well:

"Following the song's massive chart success, it was derided as "saccharine" and was later named as the tenth worst song of all time by Blender magazine.<5> On October 2007 it was named the worst duet in history by BBC 6 Music listeners.<6>

The song listed at #59 on Billboard's Greatest Songs of all time.<1>"

I agree with BBC 6 Music.

[stlsaxman]

83. thanks muriel!

yup- BBC 6 was right!

[robinlynne]

61. I worked for him. he is no great man.

[junkiebrewster]

63. Doesn't matter if he was a great man

He was a Beatle. The cute one, no less. On top of that, he had his hand in writing tons of timeless songs, both as a Beatle and solo.

Once again, I'm not saying it will happen, but if it were to happen again, Macca certainly has the iconic status.

[stlsaxman]

74. I would imagine he could be a real self-centered prick.

John was correct when he wrote- "the only thing you done was 'Yesterday'... and now you're gone you're just 'Another Day'".

[robinlynne]

77. You don't want to know. We (the crew) were fed great food though. And Linda was

really nice. We had to take protocol lessons just like you must do to visit with the Queen of England.

[stlsaxman]

82. oy vey! did you have to kiss his ring?

i can imagine Linda being a genuinely nice and caring person.

sidebar- i think it was Linda who broke up The Beatles when she and Paul wanted her dad to manage them after Eppy died... the other 3 wanted Allen Klein (yeah he was no saint either) but Paul wouldn't have it so he Palin'd on 'em. i get angry every time i see a "Still Pissed At Yoko" sticker...

:spank:

[robinlynne]

91. no kissing. But "do not speak until spoken to". Do not look him in the eyes, things like that.

[lunamagica]

85. Oh, Please. Lot's of people thought Lennon and Jackson weren't "good men

In lennon's case, the list included his own son so who said that as a little kid John yelled at him for laughing, before abandoning hom physically and financially.

The later part of the Beatles career was driven by McCartney.

He was mostly responsible for Sgt Pepper's and Abbey Road.

To think that he wasn't an integral, crucial part of the band, ot that "the only thing he did was yesterday" is both ignorant and absurd.

[junkiebrewster]

90. This is 100% true

Lennon's influence in the band peaked with a Hard Day's Night and Rubber Soul. Revolver was almost an even split between McCartney and Lennon (which is why I think it's their best album). After that, it was pretty much all Paul as far as keeping the band writing and working.

And Lennon, though I love his work, could be a total jack ass. Just ask Cynthia, Julian, Brian Epstein and countless others. He was known to be very cruel and verbally abusive to people, despite his "All you need is love" image.

[stlsaxman]

97. Correct about Lennon, but regarding his "All You Need Is Love" image-

my personal favorite moment of ANY of Lennons works is the very last two words of "All You Need..."-

"guess again". true genius!

[Lost-in-FL]

6. What about Madonna? Bono? etc.

[stlsaxman]

9. Amazing performers, yes- and Bono is a good call for the humane social causes...

who is "etc."?

[Lost-in-FL]

13. I cannot think of any other except for...

Elton John, maybe?

[Xithras]

64. Cher? Bruce Springsteen? Maybe even Ozzy (though that one wouldn't be such a suprise)

There are a few more I'd add to the list, even though I don't like their music all that much. It has to do with becoming part of the culture at a certain point in history, and for better or worse there are a handful of additional singers I'd add to the list. People will mourn them for the same reason they mourned Jackson...because his passing also represented the passing of a large part of their own cultural history.

[Phentex]

32. I think Madonna's would be global...

especially if she were young. But I hope we don't find out!

[whatchamacallit]

8. Why, are Americans finally going to wake up from their hypnotic stupor?

:eyes:

[stlsaxman]

14. I think that the proccess has begun. There's always hope, anyways...

[Ron Green]

10. They schlepped Mozart off to an unmarked grave.

If the music will stand up, it'll stand up. Even without a fan-boy extravaganza.

[stlsaxman]

15. Charlie Parker, too.

[blm]

11. Think again - - Bruce Springsteen. And probably Les Paul.

.

[stlsaxman]

21. Bruce is up there with Elton... Les Paul has lived to see his life celebrated already.

You play guitar, don't you? :hi:

[blm]

40. nah....just a friend of Mr. Paul...Les really could fill a few museums....he'll get an enormous

celebration from just about everybody in music.

[beachmom]

43. You're definitely right about Bruce. But he will live to a ripe old age,

I'm a major U2 fan, but I think it will be in Ireland that the whole country shuts down when Bono dies (YEARS from now, of course).

[otohara]

94. These 3 Were Too Young - Unexpected - Les Paul

and Bruce (unless God forbid something terrible happened) will live long healthy lives.

Jackson and Presley ... had something in common. A love of narcotics. While Lennon did too, he had just reunited with Yoko and Sean was born. Life for him was starting over and it looked promising.

Death for those who live to be old isn't a shock to the system.

[blm]

96. My point is that their passing will have a great impact and their lives celebrated for an extended

period of time, EVEN when they pass of old age.


So will Stevie Wonder and Willie Nelson. David Bowie and Bob Dylan. Neil Diamond and Mick Jagger/Keith Richards.

[brettdale]

12. A few but not on the same level

Bono, Madonna are global icons.

In the USA, Ireland, and Norway there is Garth Brooks.

But globally they dont come near MJ.

[JVS]

16. If you don't think that Elton John is going to get a big send off, you're crazy.

[stlsaxman]

20. Oh he most certainly will get a big send-off...

but he won't make news for two weeks. That's no reflection on the quality of his work, either.

[JVS]

22. Ok, I can kind of see your point about the media, but in this case we should bear in mind that...

MJ's death was unexpected and happened under strange circumstances. If the Jonas brothers have some kind of bizzarre murder suicide thing, it could be big news as well, or if Britney Spears and Hannah Montana die doing speedballs or something.

[stlsaxman]

25. I guess MJ had that rare blend of massive talent AND tabloid appeal...

and it is the latter that he had to suffer through and that, to me, is really, really sad.

MJ hated it, too. Whereas The Jonas Brothers, Britney and Miley Cirus THRIVE on tabloid appeal.

[Laelth]

17. You definitely hit the top three.

Perhaps Paul McCartney will also generate the kind of feeling MJ's death generated.

Here's the link showing the world's greatest-selling musical artists:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_music_artists

Only Elvis and the Beatles have sold more records. Now that MJ has died, I expect he will pass them both.

He was, truly, a colossus ... perhaps the world's first global artist who had an impact on billions of people.

R.I.P. Michael Jackson

:dem:

-Laelth

[stlsaxman]

23. Thanks for the link!

[Laelth]

33. If you liked that link, take a look at this one.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_albums_worldwide

Nothing touches Thriller.

R.I.P. Michael Jackson

:dem:

-Laelth

[blm]

36. I'd take Purple Rain and a bottle of red wine over Thriller and a million dollars.

any night of the week.

[Laelth]

37. "The Artist Formerly Known as Prince" is a great musician, to be sure.

But Michael Jackson sold a lot more records and had a much greater impact on humanity.

:dem:

-Laelth

[blm]

38. nah...album sales doesn't translate to impact on humanity.

Pink Floyd was the straw that broke the USSR and East Germany's back. Those young people realized they weren't ALLOWED to see the band play or buy levis or get their MTV.

Jackson benefited BECAUSE bricks in the wall were being taken down.

Even Iron Maiden was filmed for a docuconcert 'Iron Maiden Behind the Iron Curtain' that predated Thriller.

[Laelth]

39. Album sales don't translate into impact on humanity?

We shall have to agree to disagree about that.

:dem:

-Laelth

[blm]

41. Thriller didn't tear down walls of 2 of the most powerful countries, Laelth.

You are welcome to explain your view of real life human impact, of course.

Thriller was FUN.

[Laelth]

46. Perhaps another time.

Have a beer on me. :toast:

:dem:

-Laelth

[blm]

70. Perhaps another subject.

.

[babythunder]

80. Umm I wouldn't say any songs

torn down the walls call me crazy but the Soviet Union going broke might have had a thing or two to do with the fall of the USSR?

[blm]

87. Songs didn't....ATTITUDE CHANGE of the young people in those countries DID

more than news media noted. I KNEW (very well) the director of the Iron Maiden Behind the Iron Curtain film. He emphasized repeatedly that the streets told a more real tale than you heard from government officials - from BOTH sides.

You must not understand how the young people of those nations drove the overall attitude at that time. Pink Floyd was a bigger deal there than you ever heard about here - the censorship of the band really fueled the we're not going to take it anymore attitude. Young adults were going thru THEIR 60s revolution in the late 70s and early 80s. They were going thru their Vietnam with Afghanistan, too.

All of that predated THRILLER.

[nutsnberries]

24. Bob Dylan

c'mon... how could no one mention Dylan yet? :wow: can't believe it.

[stlsaxman]

26. oh... my... GOD! That's who I was missing!

a pox upon me for a fool!

:spank:

Jesus- that's a good call.... but still i wonder... :hide:

[jefferson_dem]

28. More than any other...ever.

IMHO.

[stlsaxman]

31. i have to whole-heartedly agree, jeffdem...

though seeing him live these days (and i have) takes the glimmer off his glorious past.

[barbtries]

56. i thought of Dylan

but he's already quite a bit older than MJ. he'll be remembered of course but it's not going to be the same. i agree with the OP.

[EFerrari]

34. We won't see this again in our lifetimes. Agreed. n/t

[yawnmaster]

42. Not the last...I'm sure there will be ANOTHER MJ memorial eom

[-..__...]

44. What about the "Wyld Stallyns"?

Fuck all those other lamers and posers!!!

Not only were the Stallyns musical geniuses, their influence and philosophy reshaped the world and society as we know it. Their legacy and contributions are undeniable and will remain forever unrivaled.



:headbang:

[Texasgal]

45. John Lennons death

inspired memorial services all over the world.

I remember being right here in Austin the day he was shot and going down to the zilker tree with atleast a thousand or more grieving fans burning candles and singing "give peace a chance".

:shrug:

[lunamagica]

66. I remember that.

I was just a kid, and cried for days. And they all happened spontaneously, except for Yoko's call for everyone to get together and mourn the Sunday after his death at 1 PM. But that was pretty informal

[Forkboy]

47. Hope springs eternal.

[Generator]

48. Oh bullpucky

Someone is being born right now whose music you will never understand/like and in 50 years when you are in the old folks home/six feet under and that memorial won't be on your ipod anyway because he's not of your time.

Time didn't end with MJ nor did music.

[stlsaxman]

49. I'll be dead in a lot fewer than 50 years so i get your point. But MJ wasn't "of my time", either..

the only hope of someone being "born right now" that i will never understand is that i won't be around to hear it.

But back to the point- who are today's MJ's? Last "generation" had Curt Cobain (who i understood/loved, btw) and his untimely death fueled the same emotions but hardly touched on the social impact that Elvis, Lennon and Michael did.

All i can see today is Hannah Montana and... who else?

[blm]

79. Jerry Garcia's passing was huge....

.

[DatManFromNawlins]

92. The only thing huge about him was his waistline

Because it sure as hell wasn't his music or his influence.

[blm]

95. You're wrong about that - he influenced millions, and was a greatly beloved figure

to them and to those in the music world.

I am not a Deadhead at all, but, I recognize the depth of emotion and loyalty that Garcia generated....and STILL does.

[AngryOldDem]

50. What about Mick Jagger?

There was just a one-of-a-kind quality to Jackson that we'll probably never see again. But I don't think that precludes similar tributes when another musical giant goes.

[calico1]

51. I think a lot has to do with age.

Elivs, Lennon and now MJ...all young..all gone before their time.

I think that makes a difference.

There are a lot of good artists around but I think it has a different effect on people when an artist dies at say..80. You feel sad but you feel that they lived a full life. I felt that way about Paul Newman, and more recently Karl Malden who was a great character actor.

The deaths of MJ and Farrah Fawcett just sadden me more because I feel both were taken before their time. I know Farrah was 62 but that is young these days and she so wanted to live. That broke my heart.

[Xithras]

62. Exactly. I'd bet that even Mariah Carey would have a huge sendoff if she died tomorrow.

If she didn't release another record and lived until 2045, however, she probably won't get much more than a few dozen weeping fans and a mention in the evening news.

I do have to agree with some posters above though...Madonna, Bono, and a few other big names rise above this rule and will probably have huge memorials even if they live to be 100. They're certainly the exception though.

[blm]

69. Exactly right....but, I expect Stevie Wonder, Bruce Springsteen, Neil Diamond will get huge sendoffs

even if they live another 20-30yrs.

Go anywhere around the world and look at the jukeboxes......

[blm]

72. and, it's safe to add Willie Nelson to that list. When Willie passes, entire music world will mourn

that passing for REAL.

[noamnety]

53. Truly, he was the greatest man who ever lived.

?

[barbtries]

54. yeah

watching yesterday, someone said he's the biggest star in the world, and it's true. it was a jam-packed 50 years.

i can't answer your question. i hope all the present icons live to be very old.

[muriel_volestrangler]

55. It depends on how long McCartney lives

McCartney, as with Lennon, symbolised an era, and a change in direction, far more than Jackson did. Jackson was very good at writing and performing in an existing style. The Beatles brought in a whole new fashion (while I'll acknowledge they borrowed from, and depended on, all kinds of musicians before them).

If he dies while nearly all of his original fans are still alive (as Jackson has done), then it will be comparable (probably not as big, because he was never as publicity hungry as Jackson had been, and the same goes for their families).

If Mccartney starts outliving his early fans (or if non of them have any influence in the Enterainment industry, including the media, by then), then it will be a much smaller hoo-hah when he finally goes.

In 100 years time, Lennon and McCartney will be better known than Jackson, because they wrote fundamentally more interesting music and words.

[lunamagica]

65. Funny, there's an old interview where Paul talks about that

He says that he'd rather die quietly a very old man than "go out with a bang" at a youger age.

I agree that he and his family don't crave attention the way the Jacksons do, so it'd be private, and not so hyped up -especially if he dies quietly without controversy.

But that doesn't matter. The the legacy of the music, not the hype of the death of a singer is what should stand

BTW, I came of age in the '80s, but I'm a Beatle fan all the way.

As for global impact, take a look at this. The fact that they had this reach before MTV, Cable and the Internet is mind-blowing (Funny that one of the articles about Mongolia talk about youngster wanting to learn English to understand the lyrics. That's what happened to me growing up in Central America.)

Beatles Honored in Mongolia

...Listening to their songs made us aware of the dictatorship society we lived in. The Beatles had a large role in bringing democracy to Mongolia.' said a '40 Myangat' resident, one of Mongolian democracy's golden swallows, MP E.Bat-Uul, at the inauguration ceremony.


The legendary 'Beatles' group carrying a message of freedom, not only to Mongolia's youth, but to the whole world, has been widely 'welcomed' by Mongolians. On October 9, 2008, a monument to the famous Liverpool stars was inaugurated on the square fronting the State Department Store.


The monument's image of a young Mongolian man playing a guitar represents all Mongolian youth from the 1960-1970s, imitating the Beatles and singing their songs. Young Mongolians from this residential district, known as '40 Myangat', swapped Beatles' records, tasted freedom, learning much from the legendary four, and adopted what the Beatles espoused even in their closed society.


In the 60s and 70s of the last century, the Beatles'

'Yesterday' and 'Hey Jude' sounded in remote African villages, the Sahara Desert and even Mongolia broke its ideological ties that seemed to conquer the whole world.

Even so, only a few countries erected monuments to the Beatles. By inaugurating the Ulaanbaatar monument on John Lennon's birthday, Mongolians showed themselves to be true Beatles fans, setting an example for Asian youth.

More.... http://www.legendtour.ru/eng/mongolia/ulaanbaatar/beatles_monument.shtml

And this is a monument to them in Russia

Better link:

http://visualrian.com/images/item/396565

[opihimoimoi]

57. Pop music is only a few years old...who knows what is coming down the Pike in the next 600 years?

[Evoman]

58. Britney Spears...ain't ever gonna hear the last of that one, especially if she dies early.

In terms of worlwide, though...madonna is loved in almost every country I've been in.

[Marr]

59. You cannot be serious. Is your view really so constricted by

your own tiny window? Of course there will be other musicians who have as big an impact.

If your argument was that the music industry is now a corporate operation, and real artists are often locked out-- I might agree-- at least temporarily.

But Michael Jackson was the ultimate establishment "artist". I mean c'mon-- it was bubblegum pop music. He found a very broad appeal, but so did McDonalds.

[Kalyke]

60. I think you're wrong about Paul McCartney.

And, for me, I'd much more mourn Pete Townshend than Michael Jackson.

(and it's spelled Townshend - with the "h").

[stlsaxman]

78. like i said in the OP- i'll lock myself away for a month and weep when Pete passes.

and Fripp... MCCartney not so much. When Keith Moon died i painted ROCK IS DEAD- 9/7/78 on my black leather jacket... when Entwhistle died i put Who's Next in my cars cd player, filled the tank and drove I-270 around my city playing it full blast repeating until i ran out of gas (300 miles approx).

The Who died w/ Keith, IMHO- but having Zach Starkey take over on drums made them live again. Then they died again w/ John. John is irreplaceable.

The Beatles died w/ John. Any chance of a comeback died as well. McCartney can play Beatle songs but it's never the same. George Harrison's death was tragic to so many because he was George. He just happened to be a Beatle. His work (even his Beatle songs) stood on it's own.

God- i have no idea what i will do when Pete dies. Thanks for the correction- spell-check didn't/wouldn't catch it.

[HarvardMed]

67. maybe Madonna.. and you forgot Britney Spears n/t

[stlsaxman]

81. Madonna is a classy, hard-working producer, songwriter and performer...

Britney Spears is a lost little prefabricated child(porn) star with nothing of social significance to offer.

Flame away!

[Orsino]

68. Corporate music doesn't WANT another monarch of pop.

Corporate music wants a steady stream of disposable Next Big Things.

[stlsaxman]

84. BINGO!

[Joe Fields]

86. you place Michael Jackson above Paul McCartney? lol

[stlsaxman]

88. wait- the rumors were TRUE?!?!?!

I thought it was just a twisted scheme of Johns to fuck with the fans and the press!

"I buried Paul"

"Paul is dead man, i miss him i miss him"

"28 IF"

I guess Paul was done a huge disservice by not getting as big a memorial when he died in the late '60's?

[alarimer]

89. It's the death of monoculture.

Now that music is more available from more sources, we no longer have to rely on radio shoving whatever mass market crap they have down our throats. We have satellite radio, internet radio and artists have their own websites so you can buy directly from them. Maybe they won't sell as many CDs or whatever but who cares?

I would say the OP has a point and it is a good thing actually.

[Horse with no Name]

93. Elton John?

Now there is someone I could shed some tears at the loss of.