If An Employer Would No Longer Have To Pay For Employees Health Insurance Would......

[global1]

the employee have more take home pay each week in their paycheck? Just curious. I thinking that they would - but can't be sure as I am self-employed and have to pay my own health insurance.

I looking for talking points. We hear about increased taxes for healthcare reform - was wondering if the employee would benefit by having more in the weekly paycheck.

As self-employed and paying my own way - if we had a valid 'public option' that created competition with the big private insurers - it seems to me that I would be able to save some premium monies and that money would be spent for other purposes - and hence an - economic stimulus.

I was looking for more of these types of benefits so that I could counteract any negative talk against a 'private option'.

I'm sure there are others - if you have some ideas - please post them here.

Another one - more people having health insurance - the more people being treated - the more drugs that big pharma sells. Even if they would have to drop prices a bit - the difference and then some would be made up on the volume used or prescribed. Right now many people forgo taking their medication because they can't afford it. If things were made more affordable - more people would be compliant - more drugs sold into the system.

Seems to me there would also be an explosion of jobs in the preventative medicine and health & wellness areas.

I'm looking for other ways to turn this into a positive. Any help would be appreciated.

[Turbineguy]

1. More Profit!

Productivity Increases! Bigger bonuses for upper management!

[Stevenmarc]

2. More than likely FICA will increase so it will be a wash

[FiveGoodMen]

3. It would have to work that way.

I'm sure the corporations would fight it, but having them turn over a good share of the health benefit money in cash would be necessary to offset the tax increase.

[izzybeans]

4. I tried to make that point yesterday

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5876547&mesg_id=5876547

To me this should be the biggest selling point to anyone against the public option. It would free businesses to "redeploy capital". Of course they should be made to give at least some % of that capital to employees as wages, though i doubt they'd go for all.

[county worker]

7. Why? Single payer is not free medicare for everyone!

I don't get it. It seems to me that we think single payer is free medical care for all. It isn't free! The money going to insurance companies will have to go to the single payer to make payments to the providers!

All we are doing is replacing insurance companies with the federal government. All the administration costs will be born by the government. All income to pharmaceutical companies will come from the government.

Doctors, hospitals, pharmacies will not work for free! There is a cost to all of this.

Why do you assume the cost will be less and you should get more in wages? I just don't get it!

You will have to pay more taxes. If you don't have insurance now and you get it with single payer you still have to pay for it in taxes.

It isn't free health care for all!

On edit, single payer means more people getting medical insurance and more people getting care. Why is that cheaper than less people getting coverage and less people getting care with the system we now have?

Even the CBO says we can't cover everyone!

[izzybeans]

8. Why what?

[county worker]

9. Why do you thing single payer should me more wages for you?

[izzybeans]

10. Why not? If you are recieving benefits from an organization

and you have taken the liberty of freeing them from that obligation by choosing the public option, then why are you not free to pursue the compensation you have earned through your work? If they no longer have the burden of paying your healthcare, they can afford to pay you more in return-in fact they are already doing so at the moment. You are being very nice in only asking for a small %, because you've earned that compensation and so, it is rightfully yours. And hey, you can afford to say, "you know what, keep a little for yourself. There is no reason why we both can't benefit from this transaction."

That's why.

[county worker]

11. To me the arguments for single payer here are that we will get better and cheaper

medical care than we are getting now and we will have more money in our pockets too.

If it sounds too good to be true it probably is.

[izzybeans]

13. We will be paying higher taxes.

and there is nothing to guarantee good health care based on the manner it is paid for. It just means open access to care.


Quality varies widely by type of care (non-profit vs. for profit, for example) and region (rural vs. urban, as another example). however, if you erase the managed care rules on who can go to what doctor for which reason, then you are likely expanding access to higher quality care, though this is not a guarantee. But at least you, as a consumer of health care, could transfer your care to another provider more easily than you are able to now.

Those are the trade offs. However, if you are an employer it is in your interest to get healthcare off your books.

For instance, If I were an HR manager I'd be making sure that my employees knew exactly what they would be getting if they were thinking about signing up for the public option (assuming it would be a choice) and I would provide them with a financial incentive to do so (e.g. a % of their former benefits are now payable as wages). Now I'm wasting less time negotiating with insurance companies and more time managing my employees and spending less money doing so.

You'd rather we keep our overly complex, expensive, and rationing payer system?

[Ganja Ninja]

5. Auto insurance should also be cheaper.

Since a single payer system would cover your health care needs resulting from accidents auto insurance should become less expensive.

[county worker]

6. If you make contributions to your health insurance and it was no longer required you would get more

take home pay. If you don't pay for any of your insurance nothing would change as far as take home pay.

[haele]

12. I'd take home more, even though my taxes would be higher -

When most companies hire you, the amount of that they negotiate your wages at does not include what they will need to take out for company provided health insurance.

So, I get $370 there-abouts taken out before taxes a paycheck for health, dental, and vision for my family. (this doesn't count the FSA that takes $95 or so a paycheck out for the out of pocket health expenses we'll have to pay this year for the family - that's not a health care cost to me because I get that money back)

Considering that my federal taxes at 17% are within $10 of my current health (non-dental/vision) insurance premium, I doubt that the increased taxes that I would be paying for Medicare for everyone will come close to what I pay health premium. Even if they increased what they currently take out for Medicare to tax it at, say, 7% of my income rather than the current 1.4% from my income and the 2.9% my employer has to pay.
(the 7% is actually higher than what Social Security takes out)

Yes, my income tax will go up as if I got a pay raise of 15%

So,
Decrease my Medical Premiums by, say, $300 a paycheck (keep dental and vision, if they won't be covered by Medicare) That's $7800 a year to be added to income.
Increase my Medicare withholding from $700 a year to $3000 a year.
Increase my income taxes (married/joint) by $1500 because I'm now making $7800 a year more or $2000 (if I were single)
and my take home pay still increases by $100 to $200 a paycheck.
Decrease the amount we pay in co-pays and prescriptions. Another $200 a month on average.

People paying less for their insurance may not see as much of a increase, people paying more for their insurance will see a greater increase. But for me, at least - there's more money going into the economy in more ways (both tax revenue and spending power)
And we might even be able to have enough left over to start kicking $25 - $50 a month to some worthy charities, further taking stress off the community and doing our part to make this a better place.

For me, at least, single payer will take a huge load off me, my family and my community.

Haele