So, a local piece of shit known by my wife and me, molested an 11 year old girl.

[shadowknows69]

He just got sentenced to Two years in prison for it and some probation after. His excuse- I didn't know what I was doing because I was drunk. Well if you know this guy that is on any day that ends with a Y, so he got a lighter sentence because someone is finally going to make him go into alcohol rehab with his two years of "hard" time.

Where is the fucking justice in this country? We lock up pot dealers for ten years but dirt like this walks in two? I should be surprised in a country where we let our war criminals wander free right?

What the fuck could have been the judge's justification for this sentence (except maybe that his family is "respected" round here), one year for each that he molested a CHILD?

Does the judge really think the girl only lost two years of her innocence to this monster? She has a life sentence and so should this scum.

Thanks for letting me vent. It's getting really hard to have any faith in our systems anymore.

[Captain Hilts]

1. The 'I was drunk' excuse used to work. nt

[shadowknows69]

4. Apparently still does pretty well

He's probably eligible for early parole if he completes his in prison rehab (real hard I'm sure due to the gallons of free booze inside), so he'll probably do a year or so. I just hope he chooses to relocate when he's out because it's a pretty small city and I owe this guy an ass kicking anyway. Right into the fuckin river if I could help it.

[votingupstart]

2. there is no excuse for that type of BULL$#!%

who knows maybe he will get "lucky" in prison - i have heard that child molesters don't have a long life span.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

3. I say lock him up forever...no chance of parole

My opinion is free up the jails from people there on drug possession charges and harsher sentences for murder, rape, molestation, and animal abuse.

[shadowknows69]

5. It's almost like the court is assuming he's not an actual pedophile because he's a drunk.

As if the two things are mutually exclusive. Who knows if this is his first victim or just the first one who finally got him caught. I don't know all the details and out of respect for victim and family I'm not even going to speculate further.

[redqueen]

11. I agree.

Life sentence, first offense.

First the story about the 4 year old, and now this.

I can't even read about this stuff.

[TrogL]

6. "his family is 'respected' around here"

That's called nepotism.

[shadowknows69]

9. And our town is overflowing with it.

[shadowknows69]

7. What is even more astounding about this sentence is our city's history

This is where Arthur Shawcross killed his first two victims, both children. He was given a lighter sentence because he led the police to the one body they couldn't find. Then he got out and murdered almost a dozen prostitutes in Rochester.

<http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/arthur+shawcross>

Do we ever fucking learn?

[Berry Cool]

39. I used to live in Rochester. I remember Shawcross.

Yeah, they were real smart with him. When he finished his sentence for killing the kids, they bought him a one-way ticket to wherever he wanted. He picked Rochester.

Lucky Rochester then got to be the place where he proceeded to murder a string of prostitutes.

In other words, this guy is bound, after his short stint is done, to be "trash" that is passed onto another town to suffer from, as its citizens get molested and perhaps killed.

[paulsby]

8. two things

1) i have been in law enforcement over 20 yrs. if a pot dealer gets locked up for "ten years' he either has a metric assload of priors and was dealing serious weight, or there are some other circ's. i am totally against the drug war, but the myth that potheads are routinely put away for long sentences for minor offenses is hogwash. it's rare, to put it mildly.

2) some states (mine included) have laws that do not allow "i was drunk) as an excuse/mitigating factor. iow, as long as you involuntarily intoxicate yourself (iow you weren't forcibly drugged), you cannot use the "i didn't know what i was doing" or diminished capacity defenses.

i agree with you, fwiw. i also don't know exactly what he DID, you just say "molested" , but i am assuming we are talking a high level sexual felony.

[shadowknows69]

12. New York mandatory minimums are harsh

<http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Rockefeller+drug+laws>

Under the Rockefeller drug laws, the penalty for selling two ounces (approximately 56 grams) or more of heroin, morphine, "raw or prepared opium," cocaine, or cannabis, including marijuana (these latter two being included in the statute even though they are not "narcotics" from a chemical standpoint), or possessing four ounces (approximately 128 grams) or more of the same substances, was made the same as that for second-degree murder: a minimum of 15 years to life in prison, and a maximum of 25 years to life in prison


ETA 2 ounces of pot isn't "serious weight"

[paulsby]

16. if that's supported by court records, i'd agree

i have heard the rockefeller laws are insanely harsh, and you are certainly demonstrating that.

what i am saying is that what the law SAYS is a penalty for X, and what people ACTuaLLY get, in my 20 yrs of law enforcement experience, vastly differ.

i once challenged a NORML representative to show me ACTUAL cases where such cases were handed out, and there were startingly few he could come up with that didn't involve TONS of priors or serious weight.

i am willing to concede that NYS laws are unduly harsh. fwiw, i think the drug war in general sucks, i just do not see ACTUAL cases (vs. the law as written) where pot dealers routinely get 10 yrs w/o extenuating circ's

i admit it's possible, but until i see evidence of same, i see it as rare.

[shadowknows69]

19. How about, I know people who have had these sentences given to them.

Not going to provide you news clippings though sorry, so, you'll have to take my word for it. In my last twenty years I've had a tendency to have friends who do things people in law enforcement aren't supposed to like.

[paulsby]

22. that's fair enough

and fwiw, law enforcement doesn't make these stupid laws.
i know TONS of cops who think MJ should be either legal, or at least decriminalized.

rockefeller drug laws in particular, and the war on drugs in general, is solely the fault of legislators, because ONLY they have the power to change the law (well apart from citizen initiative).

i sometimes HAVE to arrest people and/or charge them for stuff i don't even think should be illegal. it's not my fault.

i don't write the law.

[shadowknows69]

23. I know, sorry if put that badly. I meant no offense.

I have nothing but respect for good Cops. I was just trying to say I know some of the sadder stories of the war on drugs through personal experience.

[paulsby]

25. i agree

the war on drugs has plenty of "collateral damage". and i took no offense

it really is amazing how many cops i know (even some DEA agents) who think MJ laws are just plain stupid.

i know a LOT of cops who routinely throw away small amounts of MJ when they find a person in possession.

i know for a fact that MJ does not influence people to be violent (meth certainly does).

i'm not saying it's benign or healthy, but lots of voluntary behavior isn't all healthy and good. we don't criminalize it.

personally, if somebody wants to smoke a joint after a hard day at work, i see that as no different than having a cold beer.

the law doesn't.

[MagickMuffin]

29. Ya know Enforcers could help out a lot if they believe a Law Unjust

They could let people caught with Cannabis go, by taking their pot away from them, or just let them go altogether. That used to happen a lot back in the 70's.

But now a days there is too much incentive to arrest people. A lot of revenue is generated by the War On Drugs. The Police Dept, and Lawyers make out like bandits prosecuting people who like Cannabis.


Cops should "Just Say No" to arresting citizens. Make Thomas Jefferson proud.


We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

[paulsby]

32. it happens all the time

"They could let people caught with Cannabis go, by taking their pot away from them,"

i've seen it.

but we don't have discretion with felonies, and in some agencies, cops don't even have that discretion with misdemeanors.

being a cop necessarily means (if you have a brain and an opinion) you will HAVE to enforce laws you disagree with

[MagickMuffin]

35. Unfortunately, "We the People" have little say in what the DC legislators do

Even when States pass Laws to allow access to Medical Marijuana, the Feds step in and take the States Rights away. I learned in school that if "WE" didn't like a law, "WE" could change it. Well "WE" see how well that has worked out. The Feds will override the "Will of the People" and ignore States Rights.

I think victimless crimes should never be enforced as long as no harm is being committed.

[paulsby]

36. yes, i agree

this is a states rights issue. the (irrational extension) of the commerce clause is the putative justification for federal involvement

regardless, the reality is the VAST majority of mj offenses are state, not federal level.

and any state that decrims or legalizes, like many have done, results in people being generally free to smoke and possess mj w/o fear of anything worse than a minor fine if that.

many states have done so.

[MagickMuffin]

37. I just posted a thread about a US rep (R) wanting to imprison Cannabis users for 25 yrs

U.S. Rep. Mark Kirk will call for legislation Monday that would toughen drug-trafficking laws regarding a highly potent form of marijuana, with penalties of up to 25 years in prison for a first-time offense.

The law would target offenders who sell or distribute marijuana that has a THC content exceeding 15 percent.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5864409&mesg_id=5864409


When will the crazy Reefer Madness end?!?!?

[paulsby]

38. this is also an issue that is bipartisan

there are crazy drug warrior repubs and dems.

there are also sensible dems and repubs.

let's not forget that the nation has supported decrim for decades. and so has national review.

[shadowknows69]

14. In 20 years of law enforcement can you honestly say

That Lady Justice's scales were always in balance in your opinion? Not being snarky. Would like to know a veteran officer's thoughts.

[paulsby]

21. in balance?

i think the system works pretty well. as one wag has said, it's the worst system in the world EXCEPT for all the other systems.

clearly, in some respects it's biased towards prosecution. in some cases, it's biased towards defense.

it is CERTAINLY biased towards the wealthy. that's a given. i disagree that it's institutionally biased vis a vis race (and i realize LOTS of people disagree with me), but DEFINITELY is biased towards the wealthy and powerful. iow, if OJ simpson was a poor white guy, he would have been convicted.

i think , in general, the govt. has too much power. and that includes power to imprison people.

i think the war on drugs, the war on terorrism and the war on domestic violence, have swung the pendulum generally too far in favor of the govt. power over individual citizens.

most prosecutors and defense attorneys i've worked with are good people.

the system will always be flawed because people are flawed, memory is flawed, knowledge is not perfect, people lie, etc.

we will always have despots like nifong, for example, and these people need to be dealt with harshly.

[TahitiNut]

10. "...known by my wife and ME ..."

Otherwise, the sentence becomes self-incriminating. (I.e. "I molested...")

[shadowknows69]

13. Oh shit, thanks. Never was the best at the grammar thing.

editing now. :hi:

[redqueen]

15. Where is the justice, indeed.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5862633#5863174

[Lars39]

20. And the creep has already served 9 months, so they're letting him out in Sept.

:grr:

[murielm99]

17. I doubt that he will fare well in prison.

Other prisoners hate child molesters.

I knew a young lady in my community who was sexually abused by her stepfather for about eight years. Her immediate family knew what was happening. When she was in high school, she told her boyfriend, who told his father. Charges were brought against the stepfather and he was convicted.

He never served a day in jail. Many people sided with the stepfather, even though he admitted his crime. He was prominent in the community. He had a stroke and was left with some disability. I felt that it could not have happened to a nicer guy. He died not long ago. May he burn in hell.

It doesn't always work out badly. Sometimes there is justice, even if it does not come through the courts.

[shadowknows69]

18. Ok I edited a bit because I know more details now

It was about one and a half years and supposedly only two occassions, or at least that's what he pleaded to.

The official plea was:
(name) plead guilty to attempted course of sexual conduct against a child, a second degree E felony.

Police say (name) had sexual contact with a young girl on two or more occassions between September 2007 and May of 2008

[pipi_k]

24. Two years....that's more than the guy who molested my daughter got

It was a BIL. He molested my daughter and two other little girls, one of his own daughters from a previous marriage, and tried to molest a little neighborhood girl. In addition, there would have been more if my sister (his wife) had taken his suggestion and started a day care in their home.

Anyway, what he got...

Four fucking months and two years probation.

Because his lawyer said there were "extenuating circumstances". I already knew that he had been molested himself as a child (by a male relative). Never got the full story, but it appears the judge took that into account. WTF??????

Oh, and his story was...whatever he did to the girls when they were at his house was "misconstrued" by them. And he only entered a plea of "guilty" because (according to him) he didn't want them to have to go through the trauma of a trial. In other words, he was being wrongly persecuted...a fucking martyr. :eyes:


That was during the early 80s.

Since then he's molested two more of his daughters, both when they were six years old or younger. That's his preferred age, apparently.


fucker.

:mad:

[shadowknows69]

26. I'm so sorry. Has your daughter been able to get good help when she needed it?

[LAGC]

27. Whats a BIL? (n/t)

[shadowknows69]

28. Brother in law. I'm just getting all the internet abreviations too. Don't feel bad.

[MrSlayer]

30. If our "justice" system slapped my face like that I would have taken matters into my own hands.

4 months? Shit, that motherfucker would have disappeared off the face of the earth within a year of his release. Sure I'd be the prime suspect but go ahead and try to find the body or any evidence at all. You have far greater restraint than I.

I hope your daughter was able to get by and live as normally and happily as possible. I hate molesters more than anything walking this earth.

[MagickMuffin]

31. Where the Hell is "Think of the Children" congress critters concern about this issue

They ALL jump on the bandwagon when it comes to Cannabis "Think of the Children" they will shout from the tops of their lungs, but when it comes to really being concerned about "the children" and the trauma kids go through from being molested they are no where to be found :shrug:


Remember how the republicons used the drug scare on Democrats by exclaiming "They're soft on Drugs" perhaps we need to use a similar phrase "the republicons are Soft of Child Sex Offenders"

As a sidenote: Randy Dukestir Cunningham was one of the biggest "Soft on Drugs" thugs. Wanted to impose some of the harshest sentences for drug crimes, until his son was arrested with 400 pounds of pot, then Dukestir sang a very different tune. At his son's sentencing hearing, Cunningham fought back tears as he begged the judge for leniency (Todd was sentenced to two and a half years in prison, in part because he tested positive for cocaine three times while on bail).

[emilyg]

34. Some of us just got home.

[shadowknows69]

41. This area is a total Rethuglican stronghold in NY too.

John McHugh's people. Keep saying that to yourself.

[emilyg]

33. I read somewhere today that a man

who raped a 4 yr. old - got a 1yr. sentence.

[Odin2005]

40. If there is any justice he'll be killed in prison.

These fuckers need to be locked up and have their balls cut off.