A Picture Is Worth...

[WillyT]

CONFIRMED Image of after the riot, for our Calvin Klein friend up top. Posted via email, late.

<snip>

Update 3

Looks like the trap worked, and the majority of the protest leaders have been placed under arrest.

The silencing power of the dictator's police force is at strong display.

Update 4

My final update for tonight, I'm taking a break to sleep. It seems the Ayatollah's own duaghter has been placed under arrest, most interesting.

I've felt at times utter hopelessness and frustration over these events and at others great inspiration. I truly have cried over what this nation is doing to its own people. It has made me physically sick to see some of these pictures. To see how people looking for a little human dignity, a basic right, are being treated by their own countrymen, by their own fellow humans....

<snip>

Link: http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2009/6/14/742253/-Early-Report-Day-Two:-Media-Police-Run,-Protestors-Trapped-by-Police,-Ayatollahs-Daughter-Arrested.

[Catherine Vincent]

1. ...

:kick:

[Billy Burnett]

2. Another pic

Oops. That is Miami.

[Hannah Bell]

9. the one on the upper left was posted on DU & called a picture from iran.

by you...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5847201&mesg_id=5847307

[Billy Burnett]

13. Huh? It is clearly marked as pic of an arrest "Miami style".

Better check your specs.

[Hannah Bell]

32. you're right, my error.

[WillyT]

3. Hmm... I Wonder...

:shrug:

[liteworker101]

4. Check the bracelet. Positive ID. nt

[Skittles]

5. kicking for our Calvin friend

yes INDEED

[WillyT]

6. Kick !!!

:kick:

[mdmc]

7. 5

facebooked

[EFerrari]

8. You know, there's something very staged about all this.

And how do we explain this?

[tekisui]

10. It is hard to tell what is staged and what is real.

From either side. Iran is a hotly divided country, that we can be sure.

[EFerrari]

11. I'm less and less sure of that as more and more information comes in.

Why do all the protesters on camera look like the Gucci protesters in Venezuela? None of them seem to be working people. And the Calvin Klein ad should set off an alarm, all by itself.

[tekisui]

12. I was surprised that everyone took the CK picture

at face value, without mentioning the ad-like feel to it.

[RoyGBiv]

14. I just want to know ...

Why is everything in English?

I can understand some of it, the attempts to "get the word out" so to speak. And English is fairly widely known in Iran, IIRC.

But ... why does it all seem to be in English? Why do so many English signs seem to exist?

I dunno ... I'm not doubting that some massive fuck-up is going on over there, but I don't think any of us over here have the first clue what it really is.

[EFerrari]

15. Why IS everything or so much in English?

[Billy Burnett]

17. Shipped in. In advance.

Just like the "Orange Revolution".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orange_Revolution#Involvement_of_outside_forces

Activists in each of these movements were funded and trained in tactics of political organization and nonviolent resistance by a coalition of Western pollsters and professional consultants funded by a range of Western government and non-government agencies. According to The Guardian, these include the U.S. State Department and USAID along with the National Democratic Institute for International Affairs, the International Republican Institute, the Bilderberg Group, the NGO Freedom House and George Soros's Open Society Institute. The National Endowment for Democracy, a foundation supported by the U.S. government, has supported non-governmental democracy-building efforts in Ukraine since 1988.

[EFerrari]

20. Bingo.

[TornadoTN]

23. Read: Confessions of an Economic Hitman

That book along with The Secret of an American Empire really show just how deep we are in the rest of the worlds politics and how we influence even the most minute details to influence events to our own choosing.

[MicaelS]

19. Because English is the de facto world language

How many people around the world can read Farsi as opposed to English?

[malaise]

22. Don't make me laugh so early this morning

Plueeeeeeeeeeez

[dalaigh lllama]

27. I'd guess many learn English out of practicality, not out of love for America

At this point in history, English is the most practical second language to have, just like Latin used to be millenia ago. The way things are going, it'll probably be Chinese next.

[RoyGBiv]

28. So ...

You're suggesting that all the signs and such in English are an attempt to send a message to the Western world.

[MicaelS]

29. Exactly, but not just the Western World,

The entire world. Think about just how many people can read English. Maybe not speak it, but read it. And if they can't read it, there is always Babelfish. Think about those pictures on CNN. How many people will see that?

[Posteritatis]

44. Uh, it says "police" in English on the *Iranian cops'* uniforms (nt)

[JVS]

47. Even if directed at Iran's immediate neighbors, English is the best choice.

Turkish, Arabic, Farsi, and Urdu are not related languages. English is the way to bridge that gap.

[RoyGBiv]

52. That actually makes sense ...

And I hadn't considered that.

Contrary to what a few people who've simply throw insults at me elsewhere may believe, I am genuinely curious about this.

I don't recall seeing English plastered all over everything during the late 70s, and it doesn't seem typical of other revolutionary-type movements elsewhere. So, I am wondering what is going one, not implying anything.

[Maru Kitteh]

65. The 70's revolutionaries were not dealing with a 24hr worldwide news cycle

It's an uplinked world now.

[RoyGBiv]

67. No, but that doesn't explain everything ...

The 70s Revolutionaries were very much trying to get their message out to the rest of the Muslim world at the same time they were serving notice to the United States and its allies. They had just as much need for communication as exists in the current situation. The lack of the 24 hour news cycle would actually encourage them to be more selective about the language used in the few videos/pictures that did make it out because there's so much less to be seen/heard.

In other words, I don't see that as answering the question.

However, the 70s group did use English signs and slogans in specific context. I did some more digging since posting this after being pointed in the right direction by JVS. I can't tell how extensive it was, and I'm still not understanding the police having English lettering.

[CrownPrinceBandar]

38. Not really the de facto "world" language...........

but it most likely is the de facto language of commerce and trade in the world.

[Kaleko]

42. That's exactly right. Anyone who has traveled a lot knows

that English is the global second language.

Countless millions of Iranian people are trying to reach the global community to support their efforts to join it!

If you don't get that these young people have a genuine and passionate desire to become world-citizens, you're spreading your own ignorance.

In this video, Iranians are shouting, "Down with the Dictator... I will fight, I will Die... I will get my stolen vote back..."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bm7UWhjPBDU&feature=email

[EFerrari]

50. USAID must be recycling. I saw a sign that said "This wasn't an election,

this was a selection"

lol

[Kaleko]

55. You seem to be intent on discrediting the sincerity of hundreds of thousands of Iranians,

who are willing to fight, even die, for a little bit more freedom, by insinuating that all of them are patsies of the CIA. And as evidence you cite prior CIA ops in foreign lands and that you saw a suspicious-looking sign?

What happened? You used to be able to see through the disinformation fog on both sides.

[EFerrari]

57. I haven't impugned the sincerity of those people

but am pointing out, they're probably not alone.

[Kaleko]

58. For your consideration - one of the best reports I've read so far.

The meaning of the Tehran spring
By Pepe Escobar

Page 1: http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/KF16Ak02.html


And cutting to the chase, here's one of the money quotes from page 2:

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/KF16Ak03.html

This has nothing to do with the US-supported color-coded revolutions in Eurasia. This is about Iran. An election was stolen in the United States in 2000 and Americans didn't do a thing about it. Iranians are willing to die to have their votes counted. There is now an opening for a true Iranian people-power movement not specifically to the benefit of Mousavi, but with Mousavi as the catalyst in a wider struggle for real democratic legitimacy. The die is cast; now it's people power against "divine assessment".

[EFerrari]

60. I recognize this as PR because I myself have written many such pieces.

It's well done but it's not a neutral assessment. And that's fine. This piece has a mission that is worthwhile.

In no universe are these people alone against "divine assessment". They are most likely surrounded by agents of other interests and I hope as few as possible pay for it with their lives.

The real value of this piece imo is that it gives a rare view into the upper eschelons of Iranian power, names and all. We don't get that very often.

[Kaleko]

62. PR implies a deliberate effort to push an undisclosed, self-serving agenda.

I'm not convinced that the author is pushing a hidden agenda, and your certainty that this must be so is not proof.

To say it's not a neutral assessment holds no water in my view either, since no perspective taken by a human brain can be entirely neutral or objective.

We look at the same events from different angles with different perceptual filters. That's what makes for interesting discussions and maybe opens up some new vistas occasionally. I've always enjoyed and respected your views.

[EFerrari]

63. No, PR is just promotion. It doesn't have to be illicit or underhanded, really.

This piece has a point of view. And, as I said, that's fine. There's nothing wrong with that. It follows all the machinations of the government. There's nothing wrong with putting that information out there. The very title of the piece tells you this author is offering an interpretation. Again, a worthwhile aim.

But, we shouldn't confuse that with neutrality which is something else. And I bet both of us would have to look long and hard to find anything approaching that at the moment.

[Kaleko]

66. PR is short for 'public relations' -

which implies a public stance different from - and possibly even opposed to - one's private views or intimate reality. There's no evidence that the author is engaged in such two-faced posturing, only your assertion that you've written plenty of articles like that one yourself.

But semantic quibbling aside, what's puzzling me is your continued campaign to discredit the Iranian people's struggle by insinuating it is other-directed, backed by foreign interests, and therefore must be less than grassroots genuine. Yet when this is pointed out to you, you quickly deny the message you send with the bulk of your posts. Less mocking "lols" and a bit more compassion is what I'd expect from an aware being with a big heart. That's all I'm saying, really.

[EFerrari]

68. You are projecting your own meaning onto public relations.

There needn't be a difference at all. What it does mean is a concerted effort to distribute a message.

And I don't know who you'd have to be to believe that there are no foreign interests in Iran right now. To understand that has nothing to do with compassion or a lack of compassion. It's simply politics.

[JVS]

46. Even in 1979 it was done in English.

[RoyGBiv]

54. Do you have any video/pics?

I don't remember it that way.

But then, I was 10-12 at the time.

I've been casually searching for some video/pics from that era, and all the recent happenings have made that more difficult.

[JVS]

59. I remember seeing it in the first episode of the documentary "The Story of English w/Robert MacNeil

They showed demonstrators with English signs, which makes sense for a non-Arabic speaking fundamentalist religious movement hoping to unite the Muslim world (which if north or east of Iraq uses the Arabic language primarily as a liturgical language, and the use of which would be ineffective in a manner similar to if Israelis were to attempt to convey political speech to European and American Jews in Hebrew)

[malaise]

16. Reminds me of that Republican Representative's

Iraq photo from Turkey.

[EFerrari]

18. LOL! You have a good memory!

Yeah, there's somethin' funny about a lot of this material.

[malaise]

21. Being a skeptic has its advantages

M$Greedia, Twitter and facts????? I pass - I'll wait for informed sources.

[EFerrari]

39. Btw, one of the guests on Amy's show noted the high volume

of rumors flying in both direction so it's not our imagination. lol

[camera obscura]

24. Everything has to be a conspiracy for some people, huh?

No one is suggesting that the entire country of Iran voted for Mousavi. Of course some people support Ahmadinejad. Did people rally only for Gore in 2000, for instance?

As for it looking like a commercial... http://riotporn.blogspot.com/ of course photographers pick out the most striking shots. That's why there are blogs dedicted to pictures of riots and clashes, because they make for the most stunning images. It doesn't mean they're staged.

[EFerrari]

35. Oh, save it. There was trashy fake story after rumor after photoshop

here yesterday.

[ColbertWatcher]

26. Hard to tell, but according to a post on the fark thread, there are three groups ...

... http://www.fark.com/cgi/comments.pl?IDLink=4448469

Currently, there are three groups who are suppressing the students on the ground:

1. The Basij
2. Ansar Hizbullah (which I will refer to as Ansar)
3. Lebanese Hizbullah (which I will refer to as Hizbullah)

- The Basij are your regular paramilitary organization. They are the armed hand of the clerics. The Basij are a legal group, officially a student union, and are legally under direct orders of the Revolutionary Guard. Their main raison d'être is to quell dissent. They are the ones who go and crack skulls, force people to participate in pro-regime demonstrations, and generally try to stop any demonstrations from even starting. They are basically located throughout the country, in every mosque, every university, every social club you can think of. They function in a way very similar to the brown shirts.

They were the ones who first started the crackdown after the election but it wasn't enough. While they are violent and repressive, they are still Persian and attacking fellow citizens. A beating is one thing, mass killings another.

- Another group was working with them, who are even more extreme, is Ansar. There is a lot of cross-membership between the Basij and Ansar, though not all members are members of the other group and vice-versa. The vast majority of Ansar are Persians (either Basij or ex-military), though a lot of Arab recruits come from Lebanon and train with them under supervision of the Revolutionary Guard. They are not a legal group, they are considered pretty much a vigilante group, but they pledge loyalty directly to the Supreme Leader and most people believe that they are under his control. They are currently helping the Basij to control the riots, but due to the fact that they are Persians and in lower numbers than the Basij, they are not that active.

- Hizbullah flew in a lot of their members in Iran, most likely a good deal even before the elections in case there were trouble. They are the ones who speak Arabs and are unleashing the biggest level of violence on the Persians so far. Another wave arrived recently and there is chatter that yet another wave of Hizbullah reinforcements are coming in from Lebanon as we speak. The Lebanese Hizbullah is a direct offshoot (and under direct control) of the Iranian Hizbullah (itself under direct control of the Supreme Leader) and cooperates closely with Ansar though Ansar occupies itself only with Iran's domestic policies, while Hizbullah occupies itself only with Iran's foreign policy unless there is a crisis like right now. They are the ones riding motorcycles, beating men women and children indiscriminately and firing live ammunitions at students.

Unless the army decides to intervene in the favor of the Council and to stop the (what now looks like) early beginnings of the new Revolution, Hizbullah members will be the ones doing the brunt of the killing and repression with Ansar as a support, while the Basij hit people with sticks, protect government sites and try to do crowd control (as the police seems to have for the most part disbanded in centers like Tehran, according to most twitter feeds. If the police has no disbanded, they will focus less on protection and crowd control, and more on cracking skulls).

More from the BBC:
* about the post-election crackdown: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8100310.stm
* and about how Iran is ruled: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8051750.stm

Pages for each group from Wikip*dia:
* Basij http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basij
* Ansar Hizbullah http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ansar-e_Hezbollah
* Lebanese Hizbullah http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hezbollah

[dixiegrrrrl]

36. Excellent as always, CW. Links are most appreciated.

[NYC Liberal]

34. Because there are rallies in support of Ahmadinejad,

the ones against him must be staged?

(BTW -- almost ALL rallies are 'staged' ... riots may not be but rallies, anywhere, usually are.)

[EFerrari]

49. You're right. Most rallies are staged. n/t

[NYC Liberal]

53. Right. Staged = planned in advance.

Nothing wrong with that.

[EFerrari]

56. Right, planned in advance, supplied and led.

So, if you are someone who wants to guide people in a particular direction, you are just a campaign worker even if you're funded by USAID or in this case, probably the Saudis. We'll find out eventually.

[Billy Burnett]

61. Didn't Reagan get the Saudi Royals to finance the Contras?

Yes.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Contras+funding+saudis&aq=f&oq=&aqi=

[JuniperLea]

37. They don't look very happy...

For the "winning team"... I guess the lack of women is understandable for this particular group.

[EFerrari]

41. It's sort of wild trying to "read" a culture that is so different, isn't it?

[JuniperLea]

43. Very

I think we tend to project too much.

That said, this is all very troubling. I don't blame the Obama administration for taking a step back.

[EFerrari]

45. Imho, he's doing exactly the right thing. And his attitude will

go a long way toward earning us some good will in the region.

[JuniperLea]

48. I couldn't agree more! eom

[chill_wind]

25. Savvy appeals to the western world media

in some of the more studied and contrived feeling photos don't particularly surprise me, any more than I'm surprised that the demographic we're seeing knows English and the value of some of the English printed messages on posters for the western world's cameras. Or that they like access to some of our music, culture, or over-priced underwear when they can get their hands on it. They are young, urban, better educated than their rural counterparts, and it would appear, more media aware and tech wired. Just my take.

[Kaleko]

51. You'll see this sort of 'Anglophilia' in every part of Asia and ME.

Young people everywhere want to be hip, cool and with-it. That means buying American products that symbolize youth culture, if they can get their hands on them. It doesn't hurt if their underwear logos also enrage a bunch of old Mullahs. In fact, that stuff is highly prized rebel chic!

When you travel in the most oppressive Asian countries, everyone wants you to smuggle genuine 501 Levi's jeans, Hollywood movies and gangsta rap CDs by the boatload, I kid you not.

[chill_wind]

30. Live video coming in now (SkyNews)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5852528

[starroute]

31. If you're alleging US involvement, Otpor is the obvious model

I've been saying repeatedly over the last couple of days that I think Iran lacks many of the hallmarks of an NED intervention -- even though there are admitted similarities to other color revolutions, and even though the NED-funded groups have certainly been trying to promote any Iranian dissidents they can get their hands on -- and that it looks far more like the Iranian government brought this on itself by trying to rig an election.

That said, if this is an NED operation there should be clear signs of it, and we should look to Otpor as the obvious model -- since it was the first big success of the playbook and the one that has been exported elsewhere. Looking at the Wikipedia article quoted below, the biggest similarity I see is in the massive election turnout by previously disaffected young people. The biggest differences are that there's no visible Otpor-like outside group that could be receiving NED funding and no clever PR campaign with catchy logos and slogans in the native language. (The signs in English to me seem to weigh against NED involvement because they're not nearly slick enough.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otpor

Otpor was formed on October 10, 1998 in response to repressive university and media laws introduced earlier that year. In the beginning, Otpor's activities were limited to University of Belgrade.

In the aftermath of the NATO airstrikes against FR Yugoslavia in 1999 regarding the Kosovo War, Otpor began a political campaign against the Yugoslav president Slobodan Milošević. This resulted in nationwide police repression against Otpor activists, during which nearly 2000 were arrested, some beaten. During the presidential campaign of September 2000, Otpor launched its "Gotov je" (He's finished) campaign which would galvanize national discontent with Milošević and eventually result in his defeat. . . .

Otpor became one of the defining symbols of anti-Milošević struggle and his subsequent overthrow. By aiming their activities at the pool of youth abstinents and other disillusioned voters, Otpor contributed to one of the biggest turnouts ever for the September 24, 2000 federal presidential elections. . . .

First signs of backlash and criticism appeared when some of the prominent activists virtually abandoned the movement in pursuit of their own political and diplomatic careers, substituting black washed-out shirts with designer suits. . . . Additionally, information started to appear during this time about substantial outside help, both in funds and logistics, which Otpor received leading up to the revolution. . . . Otpor was also a recipient of substantial funds from U.S. government affiliated organizations such as the National Endowment for Democracy (NED), International Republican Institute (IRI), and US Agency for International Development (USAID). . . .

In a November 2000 article from the New York Times Magazine, American journalist Roger Cohen talked to various officials from the above organizations about the extent of American assistance received by Otpor. Paul B. McCarthy from the Washington-based NED stated that Otpor received the majority of US$3 million spent by NED in Serbia from September 1998 until October 2000. At the same time, McCarthy himself held a series of meetings with Otpor's leaders in Podgorica, as well as Szeged and Budapest.

Just how much of the US$25 million, appropriated in the year 2000 by USAID, for the purposes of bringing down Milošević, went to Otpor is not clear. Donald L. Pressley, the assistant administrator at USAID said that several hundred thousand dollars were given to Otpor directly for "demonstration-support material, like T-shirts and stickers". Otpor leaders intimated they also received a lot of covert aid -- a subject on which there was no comment in Washington.

Of course, Roger Cohen himself has now come under fire from the World Socialist Web Site for promoting claims that the election was stolen, which WSWS calls "sheer propaganda aimed at discrediting the election result." (http://www.wsws.org/articles/2009/jun2009/pers-j15.shtml) I guess that at the present moment, everybody and everything is suspect.

[Billy Burnett]

33. Thanks for the links.

:hi:

[EFerrari]

40. Our buddies at NED. You can always tell when they've sent a gift.

I guess we'll find out eventually.

[WillyT]

64. Cripes... Let Me Delete This Thread...

and forget your names. (not all of you)

:wtf:

Shame on you.